170 replies to this topic

[wonk123]

The first test for V8 Supercar for 2014 is underway, unfortunately it is raining, but no complaints as we need it.

 

 

How will the volvos go?

[krapmeister]

Waits for Lee Nicolle in 3, 2, 1...

[Wuzak]

The first test for V8 Supercar for 2014 is underway, unfortunately it is raining, but no complaints as we need it.
 

 
How will the volvos go?

Hopefully as good as it looks.

Would like to see GRM get some success.

[V8 Fireworks]

Yay!  40 cars -> 32 cars -> 28 cars -> 25 cars.

 

Somebody rooted the category well.  Great job.    

 

But least there are five different makes right?

 

 

Good to see Garry managed to get Valvoline onboard (well being Valvoline sponsorship manager) in place of no sponsorship, love the Polestar blue!  I am very skeptical as to how a stroked out (?) little Yamaha/Volvo V8 is going to compete with American small blocks though.  

Edited by V8 Fireworks, 15 February 2014 - 02:11.

[wonk123]

http://racing.natsof...40.90U/Result?1

results from first practice

 

It must have stopped raining at the end of the session, as they were running high 1 min 40's

 

The Volvo of Scott Mcloughlin is only 1.3 seconds off the pace. Lee will be stoked

[V8 Fireworks]

http://www.speedcafe...otorsport-park/

 

Is it just me or have the liveries taken a step backwards?  There just seem to be a whole bunch of random stripes!!  

 

The only team that seems to have a "styled" livery is HRT.    The others looks like they took some offcuts of vinyl and plastered it randomly over the cars to make any old stripey patterns, seems to lack the professionalism that there used to be in the series....

[teejay]

I think that Volvo looks amazingly good. 

[V8 Fireworks]

http://v8central.com...?TOPIC_ID=39165

 

Not convinced on many of these liveries.  They are not a great bunch.

 

To think that all these liveries were selected from dozens of concepts by professional graphic designers!!  

 

Seto's efforts were he would wheel his race car into the paintshop, chuck down some tape and make up some ideas on the spot were MUCH better....  

 

http://www.reocities...-ftr-1-00-2.jpg

 

 

http://members.westn...Mark2003Car.jpg

 

http://media.speedca...con-344x233.jpg

 

..Slick.

 

Such slick "styling" seems to have made way for random stripes that don't even line up!  

 

What's happened to the snazzy high standard of v8 supercar liveries?  Formerly such that some swedish championship teams were in fact copying v8 supercar liveries!  Most of them look like BTCC privateer efforts now... 

Edited by V8 Fireworks, 15 February 2014 - 12:01.

[Wuzak]

Volvo's V8

http://www.v8superca...supercar-engine

[stobiesaur]

Not only does the Volvo look good but that engine sounds great.  I agree on the averageness of some of the liveries, in particular the red bull doesn't look half as good as last years version

[HaydenFan]

Is there a rule change for the rear wings? They look higher and further back on the decklid. 

[TDN]

New cars running around Sydney Motorsport Park. New Volvo sounds good!

[Nutella76]

I think i see a LIVE tv coverage in Europe for opening race at Adelaide

 

on Motors TV http://www.motorstv.com/car/touring/v8

[krapmeister]

Yep the Volvo looks pretty good - certainly better than the Nissans and Mercs IMO

 

I quite like the HRT livery too

Edited by krapmeister, 16 February 2014 - 09:37.

[Jimisgod]

I like the Volvo. Pity Abbott is leading us to another recession and car numbers are dwindling back to what they were in the early 90s. 25 cars vs. the 40 car grids that were regular in 1999.

[V8 Fireworks]

Pity Abbott is leading us to another recession 

Doesn't help, but the lack of the $800,000 per season REC income per car seems a bigger issue.  It was much more equitable than the F1 system, and help propped up the lower end teams...

[krapmeister]

Only 6 races broadcast live on free-to-air tv in 2015
 

It is expected that Ten will have live rights to only the Adelaide, Darwin, Townsville, Bathurst, Gold Coast and Sydney races; five of which are expected to include twilight races. The remainder of the season would likely be shown by Ten on a delayed basis.

[HaydenFan]

Will those not shown live on free-to-air, at least be shown on a mainstream pay channel (like one everyone gets)? 

 

Plus, on a weekend mid-day, what does 7 have that is of greater importance and money making potential as V8SC? 

[krapmeister]

Yeah the other races will be shown on Foxtel, a pay tv network. Of course that means if you don't have it then you need to fork out $100 a month if you want to watch the rest of the races live.

And Channel 7 has AFL football...

[Lee Nicolle]

Volvo's V8

http://www.v8superca...supercar-engine

I hope the red hot pipe problem is solved before they go racing! Especially on E85. A hell of a lot of standoff too from the intakes.

[Lee Nicolle]

Only 6 races broadcast live on free-to-air tv in 2015
 

Ah yes, the success story of V8 Supercars. Lost to Foxtel. The teams can halve their expected sponsorship deals.

If they give the cars a minor rebuild they can go play with the Sports Sedans. Their coverage is even worse! Though the good ones go as fast for what is currently Supercar lunch money.

[Jimisgod]

Yeah the other races will be shown on Foxtel, a pay tv network. Of course that means if you don't have it then you need to fork out $100 a month if you want to watch the rest of the races live.

And Channel 7 has AFL football...

 

Don't worry, FTA will get a 1 hour highlights show. 

 

TBH non-live racing is not really a loss. They didn't broadcast sprint rounds live until about 2002 or later. You'd get a 2 hour show that showed full races, though.

Edited by Jimisgod, 18 February 2014 - 12:36.

[chumma]

This sport is gonna turn into champ car, dead. No FTA is going to put the final nail in the coffin. Will every race be shoqn Live on Speed or only the races not being shown by 7?

[Ian G]

My Niece is a Journo.,as i posted a while back 7 was looking to get out as the money they were forking out was not corresponding to Ad. revenues due to the perceived demographic watching.Nissan & Merc. were supposed to breathe new life into the series but when a rerun of an old movie on another channel outrates the Supercars you know there is a problem. 

[Lee Nicolle]

As I have said for some time. Irrelevant way too expensive cars that every one is sick of seeing crashing. And the FTA rounds are the crash fests!

[Jimisgod]

My Niece is a Journo.,as i posted a while back 7 was looking to get out as the money they were forking out was not corresponding to Ad. revenues due to the perceived demographic watching.Nissan & Merc. were supposed to breathe new life into the series but when a rerun of an old movie on another channel outrates the Supercars you know there is a problem. 

 

Not when Holden and Ford refuse to let the new teams win. Twin cam engines vs. the push rod ones that the rules favor. GM refuses to change to a more modern production engine that would be similar to Merc, Nissan & Volvo.

 

It's still Commodore Cup with 1 or 2 Fords in with a chance.

[Lee Nicolle]

Not when Holden and Ford refuse to let the new teams win. Twin cam engines vs. the push rod ones that the rules favor. GM refuses to change to a more modern production engine that would be similar to Merc, Nissan & Volvo.

 

It's still Commodore Cup with 1 or 2 Fords in with a chance.

What the? The so called dinosaur engines seem to be more powerfull and economical than the hi tec blow ins. None of which have much resemblance to any production engine. The Fords are the closest, a modern [1969] Boss 302. The pushrod engines are production bore and strike,, 4x3"

[mouserat159]

Make the most of this year's V8 Supercars Championship being on channel 7/ 7mate, because the new Ch 10/ Speed deal looks very bad for people who don't have pay TV. Chanel 10 are only going to televise 6 live events on
free to air TV the rest on pay TV. The V8 Supercars never had it so bad. I found this Facebook site trying to keep the championship on free to air
https://www.facebook...015?ref=profile

[klyster]

Not when Holden and Ford refuse to let the new teams win. Twin cam engines vs. the push rod ones that the rules favor. GM refuses to change to a more modern production engine that would be similar to Merc, Nissan & Volvo.

 

It's still Commodore Cup with 1 or 2 Fords in with a chance.

 

 

Give it a year or three, there won't be any more Aussie production cars left to defend, then maybe we'll see some good unadulterated racing.

The Bathurst 12 Hour was awesome, bring on more of that!!

[klyster]

What the? The so called dinosaur engines seem to be more powerfull and economical than the hi tec blow ins. None of which have much resemblance to any production engine. The Fords are the closest, a modern [1969] Boss 302. The pushrod engines are production bore and strike,, 4x3"

 

 

But the twincams are forced to run at a compression rate which favours the pushrod  engines (10:1), so the fuel economy is not their true fuel economy, and the twincam teams aren't allowed to run a modified fuel, instead have to run a fuel which also favours pushrod  engines.

 

It's not as simple as "The so called dinosaur engines seem to be more powerfull and economical than the hi tec blow ins"

 

Not that it bothers me now it's not free to air, I won't be watching it on Sky....

Edited by klyster, 24 February 2014 - 06:00.

[V8 Fireworks]

fuel which also favours OHC engines.

 

 

 Same "pump-style" fuel for everybody, isn't it?

 

Besides the pushrods could also rev to 9000rpm if allowed, so how would they do then?

[klyster]

Dang, you get e85 from the pump?

[krapmeister]

Yeah I don't get the 'fuel favours the OHC engines' bit either - fuel is fuel no?

[wonk123]

Dang, you get e85 from the pump?

Yep, It's not everywhere yet, but enough places that we are building a lot of blown e85 engines

[klyster]

Yeah I don't get the 'fuel favours the OHC engines' bit either - fuel is fuel no?

 

E85 seems to be more economical in the pushrod motors.

 

Reducing the ethanol amount seems to give the DOHC..

 

"“E70 is what we are looking for to be on parity with the Ford and Holden engines or the two-valve push-rod engines,” said Stuart. “For us the only solution going into the endurance races to have parity is to run E70 on all three cars. It’s the only solution that allows us to take advantage of the fuel windows that the two-valve engines can do and also the refuelling time.”

“All we can do is to supply them (V8 Supercars) with as much information as we can and work with them in the process to try to achieve an outcome that is suitable to us and the category,” conceded Stewart after revealing that the engines of his three AMG Mercedes entries consume as much as seven percent more fuel per lap as compared to their Holden and Ford rivals."

 

http://www.touringca...ill-unresolved/

 

Just to state, I'm in no way an expert on fuel or V8 supercars, I'm only going buy what I've read.

If the DOHC's have to run a different compression to which they were designed to run, and use a fuel which isn't great consumption wise (compared to the pushrod  V8's), would that not be non-parity?

If fuel is fuel, why can't the twincams use e70?

If the two Nissans running e70 got a one/two at Winton last year (one of the Merc's was also using it but came nowhere near the front, go figure?), but had no HP increase, wouldn't you think there's a chance the DOHC's were at a disadvantage?

I guess in a few years it won't matter as there won't be production Ford and Holden V8's, well, not Australian cars anyway... pretty sad really..

Edited by klyster, 24 February 2014 - 05:59.

[klyster]

Yep, It's not everywhere yet, but enough places that we are building a lot of blown e85 engines

 

Yeah, we don't have it at the pumps here in Christchurch,NZ as far as I know. You can buy it in a drum though.

 

As far as I can tell, if Joe Bloggs goes and fills their car up, they risk damaging their motor or fuel components. 

 

I don't really know but you sound like you are dealing with the repercussions of E85.

[klyster]

 Same "pump-style" fuel for everybody, isn't it?

 

Besides the pushrods could also rev to 9000rpm if allowed, so how would they do then?

 

I don't know, why don't they let them and we can find out?

Hell, let the DOHC's run the compression they want at the same time too!

[Brother Fox]

Make the most of this year's V8 Supercars Championship being on channel 7/ 7mate, because the new Ch 10/ Speed deal looks very bad for people who don't have pay TV. Chanel 10 are only going to televise 6 live events on
free to air TV the rest on pay TV. The V8 Supercars never had it so bad. I found this Facebook site trying to keep the championship on free to air
https://www.facebook...015?ref=profile

 

Ive claimed before that F1 would suffer massively in Aus if it were to go to pay tv, an I think the V8's will too. Pay TV is Aus is a killer for a lot of sport, even the AFL and League would be suidal to do it IMHO. They still have pretty good free to air coverage (league anyway, i dont follow AFL).

It works for AFL/NRL as youre still getting involved each weekend, even if its not your favourite team. With the V8's youd go long stretches with nothing but highlights and im not sure that would work.

Super Rugby is the obvious exception, but I wonder how it would have fared if it had more widespread coverage - even better perhaps?

 

I think a fox deal is short term gain for a sport, with a big long term downside.

[wonk123]

I would like to know how this all works, as I was sure the V8's were part of the original anti-siphoning laws, from memory it was every round of the championship plus Bathurst. It must be Tony Abbott's fault lol

[wonk123]

I don't know, why don't they let them and we can find out?

Hell, let the DOHC's run the compression they want at the same time too!

 I reckon with their Nascar background, raising comp and rev limit may play even more into the hands of ford and holden.

 

I will ask some guys at work why the OHC engines would have a worse BSFC (energy used per horspower) it must  be related to combustion chamber shape, or maybe lower airspeed? Airspeed should really be higher on a 4 valve, but as the ports start off very small and are machined to size on the NASCAR derived heads it may be lower.

[Sardukar]

Ive claimed before that F1 would suffer massively in Aus if it were to go to pay tv, an I think the V8's will too. Pay TV is Aus is a killer for a lot of sport, even the AFL and League would be suidal to do it IMHO. They still have pretty good free to air coverage (league anyway, i dont follow AFL).

It works for AFL/NRL as youre still getting involved each weekend, even if its not your favourite team. With the V8's youd go long stretches with nothing but highlights and im not sure that would work.

Super Rugby is the obvious exception, but I wonder how it would have fared if it had more widespread coverage - even better perhaps?

 

I think a fox deal is short term gain for a sport, with a big long term downside.

 

I used to think this aswell, but now i'm not so sure. The A-League has been slowly growing for 8 years now and for that entire time people wanted it to be on FTA. So now its on SBS and it rates worse than what it does on foxsports. The a-league doesn't need FTA to be sustainable, enough people have paytv in australia to make it commercially viable even if the viewer numbers are small, they still come ahead with subs. NRL and AFL still pull in tv figures of over 300k+ per game on foxsports, thats not bad at all with a-league games around the 60k mark. People will sub to foxsports for v8 supercars, It will have a small but dedicated fanbase on paytv that will easilly sustain the series and have a small increase in numbers year to year.

[krapmeister]

Yep, It's not everywhere yet, but enough places that we are building a lot of blown e85 engines

 

Yeah, we don't have it at the pumps here in Christchurch,NZ as far as I know. You can buy it in a drum though.
 
As far as I can tell, if Joe Bloggs goes and fills their car up, they risk damaging their motor or fuel components. 
 
I don't really know but you sound like you are dealing with the repercussions of E85.

I may be wrong but I think when wonk says 'that we are building a lot of blown e85 engines' he means building a lot of supercharged engines, not rebuilding ones that have blown up from running e85

But you are right, you can't just run it in any car - the engine needs to be designed to run on it.

Edited by krapmeister, 24 February 2014 - 12:14.

[krapmeister]

E85 seems to be more economical in the pushrod motors.
 
Reducing the ethanol amount seems to give the DOHC..
 
"“E70 is what we are looking for to be on parity with the Ford and Holden engines or the two-valve push-rod engines,” said Stuart. “For us the only solution going into the endurance races to have parity is to run E70 on all three cars. It’s the only solution that allows us to take advantage of the fuel windows that the two-valve engines can do and also the refuelling time.”[/size]
“All we can do is to supply them (V8 Supercars) with as much information as we can and work with them in the process to try to achieve an outcome that is suitable to us and the category,” conceded Stewart after revealing that the engines of his three AMG Mercedes entries consume as much as seven percent more fuel per lap as compared to their Holden and Ford rivals."
 
http://www.touringca...ill-unresolved/
 
Just to state, I'm in no way an expert on fuel or V8 supercars, I'm only going buy what I've read.
If the DOHC's have to run a different compression to which they were designed to run, and use a fuel which isn't great consumption wise (compared to the pushrod  V8's), would that not be non-parity?
If fuel is fuel, why can't the twincams use e70?
If the two Nissans running e70 got a one/two at Winton last year (one of the Merc's was also using it but came nowhere near the front, go figure?), but had no HP increase, wouldn't you think there's a chance the DOHC's were at a disadvantage?
I guess in a few years it won't matter as there won't be production Ford and Holden V8's, well, not Australian cars anyway... pretty sad really..

Well it sounds like the problem for the DOHC isn't the use of e85 as such but they aren't running optimum compression But this is one of the issues in trying to achieve 'performance parity' between different spec motors. Playing devils advocate here, I imagine V8 Supercars have been a bit cautious and wanted to have the ability to tweak the DOHC specs to increase their performance rather than have them be too successful straight away and need to reign them in. They would also want to give them some time to do some development at those current specs as well and see how the performance levels play out. If the DOHC's then plateau out a bit, I am sure they will be more amenable to levelling things up between the various makes. Using 2 different types of fuel though just sounds a bit - I dunno... messy. Probably the cheapest way to do it though...

[klyster]

 

I may be wrong but I think when wonk says 'that we are building a lot of blown e85 engines' he means building a lot of supercharged engines, not rebuilding ones that have blown up from running e85

But you are right, you can't just run it in any car - the engine needs to be designed to run on it.

 

Doh! Yeah, I guess that's what he meant. 

[klyster]

Well it sounds like the problem for the DOHC isn't the use of e85 as such but they aren't running optimum compression But this is one of the issues in trying to achieve 'performance parity' between different spec motors. Playing devils advocate here, I imagine V8 Supercars have been a bit cautious and wanted to have the ability to tweak the DOHC specs to increase their performance rather than have them be too successful straight away and need to reign them in. They would also want to give them some time to do some development at those current specs as well and see how the performance levels play out. If the DOHC's then plateau out a bit, I am sure they will be more amenable to levelling things up between the various makes. Using 2 different types of fuel though just sounds a bit - I dunno... messy. Probably the cheapest way to do it though...

 

Funny you say that as I was recently reading about Nismo working on the engine towards an midseason upgrade. 

[Option1]

I read it a little differently.  I imagine V8 Supercars wanted the new manufacturers to join but set the bar to make sure they can't beat the two dinosaurs.

 

Neil

[krapmeister]

Well I am sure they didn't want them coming in and beating Holden/Ford straight away! I do think though it's more a case of slowly getting the parity right between the makes, but as I said before being on the cautious side ie. seeing how the development curve plays out. If that means it takes time for the other makes to catchup then I think they are fine with that - means they can maintain control over the performance parity issue and gives the fans time to get used to other manufacturers racing against Holden/Ford and eventually beating them. Also gives the other makes time to build up a fan base, because lets face it V8 Supercars have been Holden/Ford and the majority of fans are still going to align that way...

[V8 Fireworks]

 

Problem is Kelly Racing (Nismo) was not a race winning team in Holdens.  Mid pack at best.  So it is very difficult to separate team performance from manufacturer performance.

 

And it is unfair to call Ford a dinosaur.  Their road v8 is a DOHC all-alloy. =)

Edited by V8 Fireworks, 25 February 2014 - 01:40.

[Wuzak]

The Adelaide 500 is on this weekend.

 

And Volvo has secured a front row start for one of Saturday's races. 

[krapmeister]

The Adelaide 500 is on this weekend.
 
And Volvo has secured a front row start for one of Saturday's races.

E85, E70 or Nitromethane in the tank?