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Ferrari F14 T - Part III


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#3901 Enzoluis

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 19:41

Lots of people here are blaming Marchionne for the departure of Fernando, when it sounds to me it's likely that Alonso himself is behind the decision to leave. It appears that he's lost all confidence in the team to build a car capable of winning the Championship, and it's hard to blame him.

I'm not sure this is Ferrari's doing, it seems that it's all his.

 

Wellcome to reality Crucial! What allowed you to see the team ashe is? The fact that we reached the bottom of the barrel? This situation is the result of Domenicali lack of leadership and was evidnt since 2010. Will see how long takes Ferrari to revert the situation where

they are.



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#3902 Ferrari2183

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 19:46

No clue more like.

On what basis?

#3903 falalalalaland

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 19:50

I doubt Alonso would simply wake up one morning and just decide he's had enough and changed his mind about driving for Ferrari beyond 2016. When the rumours first surfaced strongly, the reasoning was that Alonso was negotiating an extension with Montzemelo beyond 2016 but would include clauses that allowed him to leave at the end of each year if the car was not sufficiently competitive ie. to avoid a repeat of more failed promises. Montzemelo was apparently in favour of this, and understandably so. He would have had pride in this team being able to provide one of the very best drivers with one of the very best cars. It's what he believed every year.

 

Just nit-picking here... this would mean he could still drive for Ferrari till 2016 and still have the option to leave in 2015 no?

So it would suggest that Alonso tried to re-negotiate his contract (more pay, or insert your own reason), new bosses said no, and Alonso more or less thought: "Fxxx you all, I'm better than this" and decided to leave.



#3904 thechin

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 19:53

On what basis?

Couldn't even string a sentence together for Ted. 

 

Red Bull made him look like an idiot by announcing his driver for next year.

 

Trying to show he is the big man by forcing out their biggest asset. 

 

OK, it's early days but I am not impressed so far.



#3905 RedRabbit

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 19:59

I honestly don't understand how somebody could dislike Vettel *that* much. I think a lot of people let his domination color their 'like/dislike' of him big-time.

Anyways, goodbye. I cant respect the decision to drop the support over a driver, though. That's not a real team fan, sorry.

 

I'll never understand why people say this. At some point in our lives, there was something that attracted us into supporting a particular team. it doesn't matter what it was, for each person it will be different, but does that mean that we are all now bound to blindly support that particular team till the day we die or else be labelled as "not a real fan"?

 

In South Africa we have a massive problem because of this kind of attitude with politics. Our government is failing miserably, yet the majority of the people keep voting the same party in because that is who they support, not because they believe it's the best one for the job.

 

For the record, I consider myself a supporter, not a fan. Fan seems too fickle, and my heart has been bleeding Ferrari since the turmoil of Senna's death in 1994 turned F1 upside down for me. 20 years I have stood behind this team, believing in the same passion that drove the people within it, it's leaders.

 

The events of the last few months have thrown some difficult questions at me. I think it began with naming the car F14T rather than F166 Turbo, dispensing with a long held Ferrari tradition, and culminating with the firing of Luca di Montzemelo. For me, he was a proper don like figure, exactly the type of man that should be leading Ferrari. He had presence and commanded respect. He was also fairly intimidating and you could tell the team were on edge when he was around, as it should be when the Big Boss arrives. He kept the legend of Enzo alive.

 

So while I haven't made my final decision as yet, I too, am facing the possibility of turning my back on the team I have loved for so long, because I feel that they have become an unrecognisable group of strangers that I no longer have faith in nor believe that they have the passion of Ferrari in their blood. From next year, it'll be no more than another manufacturer backed team, no different to Mercedes. :cry:



#3906 RedRabbit

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 20:06

Just nit-picking here... this would mean he could still drive for Ferrari till 2016 and still have the option to leave in 2015 no?

So it would suggest that Alonso tried to re-negotiate his contract (more pay, or insert your own reason), new bosses said no, and Alonso more or less thought: "Fxxx you all, I'm better than this" and decided to leave.

 

That's exactly what he was negotiating for, and I can't blame him. Big promises were made about the 2011/12/13/14 car. Remember Domenicali after winter testing this year? Paraphrased but along the lines of "we're behind Mercedes but not so much". The reality is, without Alonso's points (which have now taken a hit with 2 DNF's), Ferrari would be behind Force India, "but not so much".



#3907 OneAndOnly

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 20:12

Ah... the smell of fresh hope.

Hope is all I have now :D .

 

I doubt anyone pushed Alonso out. He's all what one team can look for in a driver.  Simply it's realistic to expect that Ferrari's recovery will take few years. Alonso doesn't have few years to wait. As much as I want him to stay I can't resent him for leaving. He always gave 100% for Ferrari, and as Ferrari fan all I can is thank him for that.

p.s. Given how lucky Vettel was in some races I wouldn't be surprised Ferrari will make rocket the moment Vettel steps into factory :) .



#3908 DrF

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 20:40

.

I doubt anyone pushed Alonso out. He's all what one team can look for in a driver. .

First and foremost, they want an employee. Not someone who rules the team from within.

#3909 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 20:59

First and foremost, they want an employee. Not someone who rules the team from within.

 

They got the right guy then :lol:



#3910 sopa

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 21:09

I also think Ferrari have the potential to be much improved next season. Their chassis has been competitive since Hungary and they will hopefully fix their PU issues by next year.

 

 

I think Ferrari may have hit its low in 2014, because starting a new regs era is always difficult and hurts some teams more. Ferrari had a bad 2009, but subsequent seasons were better. I am not sure about the "much-improved" next year. Obviously Ferrari/Fiat has seen problems and done some major re-structuring, but it seems there is still a long way to go to properly start bearing fruit... IF it bears fruit.

 

Do I think Ferrari could beat/match Mercedes next year? No. Though they may not be far off Red Bull, and still beat McLaren-Honda, and finally get the better of Williams too or at least match them. So Vettel, or dare I say even Raikkonen, could indeed compete for positions in lower top 6. Perhaps it would not be "much-improved", but a little at least!



#3911 Menace

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 20:09

This sounds pretty encouraging, from "thejudge13":

 

We reported last Thursday that Riccardo Adami had left Faenza and is moving in the direction of Emilia-Romagna. He has most recently been running the Red Bull simulator programme but is perhaps best known as Sebastien Vettel’s engineer at Toro Rosso where he won his first Grand Prix.

Wolf Zimmerman is arriving from the board of Mercedes AMG to help Mattia Binotto reorganise the power unit department and further engineers have arrived from Audi’s uber successful motorsport programme.

Daniel Casanova will be teaming up again with James Allison who he worked with previously at Lotus. After a career that included spells at Renault, Toyota and Red Bull Racing, he joined Lotus in September 2010 as Head of Performance at Enstone and Giacomo Tortora returns to Ferrari after eight years with Mclaren and will run the simulation department – which after comments from Pedro De La Rosa suggesting that Mclaren’s unit was some years ahead of the Italian counterpart – would appear to be quite a coup.

For all the Tifosi, it is encouraging to hear of the recruitment of people to what had seemed for years like a rudderless ship. In a little over six months the team principal has made his presence felt and is marching in time to the beat of the impressive saviour of FIAT, the incoming Ferrari president, Sergio Marchionne.

http://thejudge13.com/



#3912 quasi C

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Posted 07 October 2014 - 22:49

It's originally from omnicorse.it posted 2 pages back.



#3913 camberley

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 02:29

Im hearing that its most likely going to be Alonso and Vettel next year.

Guess the opportunity to race and beat Vettel in equal machinery was the tipping point for Alonso

Edited by camberley, 08 October 2014 - 02:39.


#3914 f1RacingForever

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 02:45

He should sign a pre contact with Mercedes for 2016 then race for Lotus for next year. Mclaren probably won't accept a one year deal and sitting out isn't a good idea imo. Maybe even stay at Ferrari for next year if it's still possible at this point.

Edited by f1RacingForever, 08 October 2014 - 02:46.


#3915 currupipi

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 03:17

Im hearing that its most likely going to be Alonso and Vettel next year.
Guess the opportunity to race and beat Vettel in equal machinery was the tipping point for Alonso


That would really be a surprise, we have read so many things these last days that anything seems possible but this would really surprise me

#3916 warp

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 03:30

Sorry folks... but there are at least 2 threads dicussing Alonso's options for 2015 and on.

 

Can we talk about the car on this one, please?



#3917 pusko

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 04:25

@warp...car is crap. It represents it's name quite good. I'm afraid that there is little chance that next year we will be close to Merc or RB. Poor Kimi and Fernando. I believe Sochi is quite a "powerful" track, so there will be problems. Poor Kimi and Nando.

#3918 fisssssi

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 05:01

To be more precise, the chassis is pretty decent, it's the engine that is crap. But we already knew that.

 

One thing that I have seen continually re-affirmed is that the car is pretty quick but it needs track position. Once it slips behind a few cars (e.g. Alonso in Spa and Monza, Raikkonen pretty much everywhere) it is almost impossible to get back ahead. Fred had the pace to easily be on the podium in Singapore, but once he had to give back the position to Vettel and lost out to Ricciardo with the safety car his race was run, even with fresher tyres.

 

Kimi himself said the car is unable to follow other cars properly, and I have to agree with that. But is this because of the chassis, aerodynamics or purely the engine? The Red Bull seems to be a lot more "racey" despite their own engine disadvantage.

 

It's a shame because the car itself is pretty quick, and seems to now be capable of qualifying at most tracks around 3rd to 5th.



#3919 warp

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 06:40

But is this because of the chassis, aerodynamics or purely the engine?

 

Interesting question... I think it is that the aero is somehow too sensitive to changes of flow somehow?

Maybe the turbulent air from the car in front messes with the incoming air into the engine?

 

The car eats tyres too... is it because of pure aero or chassis balance or the power delivery is too aggressive?



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#3920 pusko

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 06:44

Ferrari (in normal circumstances) is at best 5th on the grid. Merc, RB and Williams are in front or thereabouts.

#3921 Oho

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 07:28

Interesting question... I think it is that the aero is somehow too sensitive to changes of flow somehow?

 

 

If, as speculated, the front end is marginal to begin with its gonna be right out window in the wake of a car in front.

 

Not that I know anything, but this appears to have been the death of Kimi Räikkönen this season. To get any feel for the front they need to sacrifice a ton of rear down force or stiffen it up way too much which will chew through his rear tires being short on traction to begin with.


Edited by Oho, 08 October 2014 - 07:33.


#3922 Seanspeed

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 08:07

I'll never understand why people say this. At some point in our lives, there was something that attracted us into supporting a particular team. it doesn't matter what it was, for each person it will be different, but does that mean that we are all now bound to blindly support that particular team till the day we die or else be labelled as "not a real fan"?
 
In South Africa we have a massive problem because of this kind of attitude with politics. Our government is failing miserably, yet the majority of the people keep voting the same party in because that is who they support, not because they believe it's the best one for the job.
 
For the record, I consider myself a supporter, not a fan. Fan seems too fickle, and my heart has been bleeding Ferrari since the turmoil of Senna's death in 1994 turned F1 upside down for me. 20 years I have stood behind this team, believing in the same passion that drove the people within it, it's leaders.
 
The events of the last few months have thrown some difficult questions at me. I think it began with naming the car F14T rather than F166 Turbo, dispensing with a long held Ferrari tradition, and culminating with the firing of Luca di Montzemelo. For me, he was a proper don like figure, exactly the type of man that should be leading Ferrari. He had presence and commanded respect. He was also fairly intimidating and you could tell the team were on edge when he was around, as it should be when the Big Boss arrives. He kept the legend of Enzo alive.
 
So while I haven't made my final decision as yet, I too, am facing the possibility of turning my back on the team I have loved for so long, because I feel that they have become an unrecognisable group of strangers that I no longer have faith in nor believe that they have the passion of Ferrari in their blood. From next year, it'll be no more than another manufacturer backed team, no different to Mercedes. :cry:

Well we're not talking about politics here. Its possible to support different things in different ways and its obviously pretty stupid to have loyalty to a political party.

Anyways, leaving because of the firing of Luca is half understandable. Leaving because the general personnel of the team is 'a group of strangers' is half understandable. Leaving because they brought Vettel on is......not really understandable for me.

I also think you're worrying a bit too much. Teams all change personnel all the time. Ferrari's most successful period was when it was run by a Frenchman and an Englishman, neither of these guys necessarily synonymous with 'Italian passion', but both simply very good at what their job was.

And these changes we're seeing are probably quite necessary. Whatever they've been doing the past few years obviously isn't working.

#3923 JeePee

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 10:36

Medium and Soft for Austin.

Medium and Hard for Brazil.

Soft and Super Soft for Abu Dhabi < Maybe a late podium for Ferrari?



#3924 DrF

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 10:52

http://www.f1fanatic...ds-final-races/

 

 

Pirelli has picked a softer mix of tyre compounds for two of the final three rounds of 2014.

Although it will continue to use the hardest tyres from its range for the Brazilian Grand Prix at Interlagos, softer compounds have been chosen for the races at the Circuit of the Americas and Yas Marina.

The soft tyre will be used for the United States Grand Prix for the first time, along with the medium tyre compound. The previous two races at the Circuit of the Americas were run on the medium and hard tyres.

For the season finale in Abi Dhabi Pirelli will bring the softest tyres in its range – the super-soft and soft compounds – which it describes as “the most suitable choice”.

 

How does this affect Ferrari?



#3925 Gorma

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 12:31

Soft and Super Soft for Abu Dhabi < Maybe a late podium for Ferrari?

I'd bet Kimi for the win.



#3926 Ferrari2183

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 15:54

Thought I'd post this here.

http://m.youtube.com...eature=youtu.be

Farewell Montezemolo.

#3927 camberley

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 16:00

In other news ..

 

Kimi Raikkonen says set-up problems are back on his Ferrari F1 car

 

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/116219

 

 

Kimi Raikkonen suspects "something isn't right" with his Ferrari Formula 1 car, after struggling for speed throughout the Japanese Grand Prix weekend.

 

"The whole weekend we struggled with the front like crazy. Dry, wet. It's just completely different than before," explained Raikkonen, who said he "couldn't understand" this given the specification of the car had not changed since Singapore.

 

"Hopefully we will find something that will explain what was going on.

 

"In the dry in the first part of the lap with the new tyres it [the car] was just pushing, pushing [into understeer]. Very odd.

 

"For two laps intermediates worked and then just grained and I had no front end. Then again [it's the] same story.

 

"For me something isn't right, but until we see what's the issue I don't have an explanation.


Edited by camberley, 08 October 2014 - 16:01.


#3928 Disgrace

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Posted 08 October 2014 - 17:58

Part IV.