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Spanish GP Build-up


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#1 Markn93

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 20:09

Right, it's been long enough, time to look ahead to the opening of the European leg of the calendar. It's upgrades galore this weekend, so for all with a keen eye for 'spot the difference' this is your time to shine.

 

Will the Merc dominance continue?

Will Ferrari or Red Bull get any closer?

Will Mclaren turn their fortunes around?

How will the engines compare after the next round of reliability and integration/software updates?

 

Then there's all that driver stuff, but who wants to go get into that, eh?   ;)



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#2 Lotus53B

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 20:22

Yes
A bit
No

The last question - there's the rub. I'm still hoping for a BSOD to appear on a screen in the middle of a race...

#3 Markn93

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 20:33

Yes
A bit
No

The last question - there's the rub. I'm still hoping for a BSOD to appear on a screen in the middle of a race...

Well that's that. See you guys again for Monaco.  :p



#4 GAZF1nut

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 22:08

I think Red Bull will be closer to Merc due to the high speed corners, but their top speed will be their Achilles heel. Mclaren keep saying that they are bound to improve anytime soon, but this is a constant thing with them and most of the time it doesn't happen, and I think this will continue. For the last question, impossible to guess.



#5 HoldenRT

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 23:18

McLaren said they'd gain 0.5 secs going into Malaysia and have gone backwards ever since?



#6 GAZF1nut

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 23:22

McLaren said they'd gain 0.5 secs going into Malaysia and have gone backwards ever since?

Exactly my point, you have to take what comes out of Mclaren with a pinch of salt.


Edited by GAZF1nut, 04 May 2014 - 23:22.


#7 Afterburner

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Posted 04 May 2014 - 23:26

Exactly my point, you have to take what comes out of Mclaren with a pinch of salt.

Or just wait 'til they say they won't think they'll improve, at which point they'll leap forward 0.5 seconds. :p

#8 TomNokoe

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 00:10

Dry weekend please. Super excited to see all the new developments and for the FPs to have us guessing at the new pecking order. Also to see how far off pole they are on fully aero track.

Edited by TomNokoe, 05 May 2014 - 00:11.


#9 2014wdc

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 00:14

Ferrari will shock everyone



#10 Obi Offiah

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 00:34

Ferrari will shock everyone

In a positive or negative way?



#11 TomNokoe

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 00:41

FerrariAlonso will shock everyone


;-)

#12 turssi

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 00:42

Which Spanish speaking pilot will win this year?

#13 HeadFirst

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 02:19

Which Spanish speaking pilot will win this year?

Rosberg.



#14 Xeriks

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 02:40

Ferrari and Red Bull will look a lot closer to Mercedes on Friday and just like the previous GP weekends, come Qualy that gap will increase again.

 

I can't see any team stopping Mercedes from winning anytime soon, I expect Rosberg to take the win.



#15 Lotus53B

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 06:33

Wunderground is predicting a dry and mostly sunny weekend, around 22 celsius, rain probability 5% or so.

#16 GoldenColt

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 07:02

Can't remember the last time it was raining on raceday in Catalunya. Must've been 1996 lol.


Edited by GoldenColt, 05 May 2014 - 07:02.


#17 F1ultimate

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 08:56

Can't remember the last time it was raining on raceday in Catalunya. Must've been 1996 lol.


Good point. Although I have only been watching F1 since 2005/2006 I can't recall a wet race in Barcelona.

#18 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 08:59

It's rare for there to even be rain on the Friday or Saturday at the track, let alone raceday.



#19 Brend

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 09:33

Right, it's been long enough, time to look ahead to the opening of the European leg of the calendar. It's upgrades galore this weekend, so for all with a keen eye for 'spot the difference' this is your time to shine.

 

Will the Merc dominance continue?

Will Ferrari or Red Bull get any closer?

Will Mclaren turn their fortunes around?

How will the engines compare after the next round of reliability and integration/software updates?

 

Then there's all that driver stuff, but who wants to go get into that, eh?   ;)

Yes! for a while longer, they have the ((finance)) and invested into recruiting the right team and started preparing the hybrid in 2013 with great reserves.

Yes! of course they will adapt now what Mercedes done along time ago, whether this will change from catch-up, to challenging before 2014 ends I don't think so.

Yes! only in the constructors, Button is the dark horse in F1 at the moment, gaining points when ever he can, good loyal headed driver, (watch) where he ends at the end of the tournament.

The teams have basically ironed out the hybrids problems from the start of the 2014 f1 GP, alot of them cried about issues but that was expected on such a new racing machine.

www.f1worldtour.com



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#20 Jon83

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 09:33

Ferrari will shock everyone

 

To do that they'd need to beat one or both Mercedes cars without bad luck affecting the Merc guys.

 

Anything other than that scenario can hardly be described as a shock (and I include beating RBR in that)


Edited by Jon83, 05 May 2014 - 10:24.


#21 kenkip

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 09:53

As Horner said,if mercedes stuffs everyone once again,then everybody might as well shift to 2015..I have a feeling Redbull will have a good weekend



#22 undersquare

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 09:54

It would not surprise me if Toto has wised up and the Mercs will hide their advantage a bit more this time, lest too much pressure builds up against their dominance.

 

I hope Lewis leaves with the wdc lead, Kimi beats Nando this time, Dan beats Sebi, podium= Lewis, Valtteri and Kev :)



#23 Markn93

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 10:01

As Horner said,if mercedes stuffs everyone once again,then everybody might as well shift to 2015..I have a feeling Redbull will have a good weekend

'15 rules are practically the same as '14, so no-one will switch focus like teams did at the end of the 2013 season.



#24 Jon83

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 10:26

Yes! for a while longer, they have the ((finance)) and invested into recruiting the right team and started preparing the hybrid in 2013 with great reserves.

Yes! of course they will adapt now what Mercedes done along time ago, whether this will change from catch-up, to challenging before 2014 ends I don't think so.

Yes! only in the constructors, Button is the dark horse in F1 at the moment, gaining points when ever he can, good loyal headed driver, (watch) where he ends at the end of the tournament.

The teams have basically ironed out the hybrids problems from the start of the 2014 f1 GP, alot of them cried about issues but that was expected on such a new racing machine.

www.f1worldtour.com

 

Button will end up in mid-table - and anyway he is hardly a 'dark horse'



#25 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 10:48

Fifth race of the season already and only the second one which looks to be dry all weekend. This race is always the make or break race for the teams, bringing major updates. Though I don't expect massive changes in the pecking order. Perhaps McLaren can come back a bit and get ahead of Force India and Williams.



#26 Goron3

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 11:53

As Horner said,if mercedes stuffs everyone once again,then everybody might as well shift to 2015..I have a feeling Redbull will have a good weekend

The rules aren't changing next year so everyone will just keep developing this years car. 2015 cars will be an evolution of the cars we see at the end of this season.



#27 undersquare

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 12:32

'15 rules are practically the same as '14, so no-one will switch focus like teams did at the end of the 2013 season.

I can't help wondering if Renault and Ferrari will be allowed to split their turbos for next year.  If so that would cause quite a shift I'd think - more design/modelling work to do and making this year's car redundant earlier.

 

And the Barca result will play a part in both decisions, I suspect.



#28 metz

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 14:15

Of course you can't believe anything McLaren says.

McLaren is the new Lotus... :well:



#29 RubalSher

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 14:39

McLaren is the new Lotus... :well:

 

I thought McLaren was the new Williams.



#30 eronrules

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 14:51

Of course you can't believe anything McLaren says.

McLaren is the new Lotus Caterham ... :well:

corrected ... atleast they still can make cars with decent DF without having to use 'matrix' system , if renault engines weren't crap, they'd be beating mclaren into pulps



#31 TomNokoe

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 18:09

I can't help wondering if Renault and Ferrari will be allowed to split their turbos for next year. If so that would cause quite a shift I'd think - more design/modelling work to do and making this year's car redundant earlier.

And the Barca result will play a part in both decisions, I suspect.


allowed? Isn't engine development only banned in-season? The off season through until '15, it is game on once again I thought?

#32 Obi Offiah

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 18:14

Yes! for a while longer, they have the ((finance)) and invested into recruiting the right team and started preparing the hybrid in 2013 with great reserves.

Yes! of course they will adapt now what Mercedes done along time ago, whether this will change from catch-up, to challenging before 2014 ends I don't think so.

Yes! only in the constructors, Button is the dark horse in F1 at the moment, gaining points when ever he can, good loyal headed driver, (watch) where he ends at the end of the tournament.

The teams have basically ironed out the hybrids problems from the start of the 2014 f1 GP, alot of them cried about issues but that was expected on such a new racing machine.

www.f1worldtour.com

Welcome to the forum Brend. :wave:



#33 CHIUNDA

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 18:30

I can't help wondering if Renault and Ferrari will be allowed to split their turbos for next year. If so that would cause quite a shift I'd think - more design/modelling work to do and making this year's car redundant earlier.

And the Barca result will play a part in both decisions, I suspect.

Mercedes have really enhanced their aero side of the business so when RBR and Ferrari catch up Mercedes should ideally have caught up with the aero and it will come down to the team and the drivers. As Vettel said , that is when we know who rules when the pants are pulled down (or something like that :-) )

Edited by CHIUNDA, 05 May 2014 - 18:35.


#34 BillBald

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 18:34

Button will end up in mid-table - and anyway he is hardly a 'dark horse'

 

Jenson is a dark horse, because he's continually underrated.

 

Without a good car, he could end up in mid-table. But if McLaren can improve the car, he will make good use of it.

 

IMO he's driving better than ever.


Edited by BillBald, 05 May 2014 - 18:34.


#35 George Costanza

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 18:35

Can't remember the last time it was raining on raceday in Catalunya. Must've been 1996 lol.

Schumacher's finest wet win.

The 1991 Spanish GP was also wet, and Schu didn't do that bad there either.


Edited by George Costanza, 05 May 2014 - 18:36.


#36 CHIUNDA

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 18:52

Jenson is a dark horse, because he's continually underrated.
 
Without a good car, he could end up in mid-table. But if McLaren can improve the car, he will make good use of it.
 
IMO he's driving better than ever.


Let me argue that Button drove better 2011 and even 2009.

#37 Lazy

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 19:02

Let me argue that Button drove better 2011 and even 2009.

Go on then.



#38 CHIUNDA

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 19:24

Go on then.


Already did. Anyway 2012 he beat Lewis and 2009 he won the WDC.

#39 sabjit

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 19:32

Already did. Anyway 2012 he beat Lewis and 2009 he won the WDC.

 

No he didn't.

 

(Typo?)



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#40 Zava

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 19:38

No he didn't.

 

(Typo?)

well, as CHIUNDA was talking about 2009 and '11 beforehand, you don't have to be a Nico Rosberg to conclude that it is, indeed, a typo.



#41 CHIUNDA

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:00

No he didn't.
 
(Typo?)


You guessed right, I am typing from a phone

#42 undersquare

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:06

allowed? Isn't engine development only banned in-season? The off season through until '15, it is game on once again I thought?

I'm not clear on the rules (if anyone is).  The engine homologation is in stages though isn't it, year by year, so afaik they can introduce some changes for next year.  Whatever the original deal was, IMO things will be allowed as necessary to prevent a second year of massive Merc domination.  So if the split turbo really is a vital part of that then I reckon they'll all have it next year.

 

So if Merc are still miles ahead in Barca, the other teams will be starting to move resources that much sooner to design for it.  Just guessing of course.  But Merc might be a bit more subtle about their speed this weekend, I wouldn't be surprised.



#43 undersquare

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:08

Mercedes have really enhanced their aero side of the business so when RBR and Ferrari catch up Mercedes should ideally have caught up with the aero and it will come down to the team and the drivers. As Vettel said , that is when we know who rules when the pants are pulled down (or something like that :-) )

Yes I agree.  Things could be very close once the engines are equalised.



#44 Rybo

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:19

I'm not clear on the rules (if anyone is).  The engine homologation is in stages though isn't it, year by year, so afaik they can introduce some changes for next year.  Whatever the original deal was, IMO things will be allowed as necessary to prevent a second year of massive Merc domination.  So if the split turbo really is a vital part of that then I reckon they'll all have it next year.

 

So if Merc are still miles ahead in Barca, the other teams will be starting to move resources that much sooner to design for it.  Just guessing of course.  But Merc might be a bit more subtle about their speed this weekend, I wouldn't be surprised.

 

The teams introduce "reliability" upgrades that just so happen to improve performance. Similar to what Renault did with their V8's.



#45 Lotus53B

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:27

I think Merc will do what RBR did - scamper away and get a lead of about 20 seconds, if they can, and then turn the wick down.

If they get the pole, I expect the gap from the Mercs to the nearest car to be 1.5 seconds at the end of the first lap, and they'll get very little screen time

I think that there will be enough action down the grid though, and possibly a distinct variety of pit stop strategies.

For me, FP1 and 2 could be the most interesting part, seeing what directions the factory teams have taken at home whilst the race teams have be half a globe away, but, as I've said, I don't think it will make much difference

#46 PayasYouRace

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:34

I'm going to be bold and predict a non-Mercedes win.



#47 CHIUNDA

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Posted 05 May 2014 - 20:43

I'm not clear on the rules (if anyone is). The engine homologation is in stages though isn't it, year by year, so afaik they can introduce some changes for next year. Whatever the original deal was, IMO things will be allowed as necessary to prevent a second year of massive Merc domination. So if the split turbo really is a vital part of that then I reckon they'll all have it next year.

So if Merc are still miles ahead in Barca, the other teams will be starting to move resources that much sooner to design for it. Just guessing of course. But Merc might be a bit more subtle about their speed this weekend, I wouldn't be surprised.


I think Mercedes have already been turning their wick down .. re: Hamilton's superior fuel consumption. That Mercedes still has some reserve speed yet.

#48 BillBald

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Posted 06 May 2014 - 00:40

Let me argue that Button drove better 2011 and even 2009.

 

In those years he had better cars.

 

To me, it's impressive how he's staying focussed even though he's now had bad cars for 2 years running. Quite a contrast with 2007 and 2008, when he was in a similar situation.

 

Towards the end of last year, I thought maybe he was starting to lose that focus, but this year he's back up there. And because he's generally outracing Kevin Magnussen, I think many people are assuming it's a poor performance from Kevin rather than an outstanding performance from Jenson.

 

Maybe McLaren can bring that major update to Spain, and we will see what Jenson can do with it.



#49 Markn93

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Posted 06 May 2014 - 00:50

In those years he had better cars.

 

To me, it's impressive how he's staying focussed even though he's now had bad cars for 2 years running. Quite a contrast with 2007 and 2008, when he was in a similar situation.

 

Towards the end of last year, I thought maybe he was starting to lose that focus, but this year he's back up there. And because he's generally outracing Kevin Magnussen, I think many people are assuming it's a poor performance from Kevin rather than an outstanding performance from Jenson.

 

Maybe McLaren can bring that major update to Spain, and we will see what Jenson can do with it.

Amazing what a WDC will do for you. I think winning it has had a calming effect on JB and that manifested itself in his 2 best driving years, '10/'11 , and he's been pretty at peace since, driving for a great team, regardless of recent cars, and pocketing a nice salary. 



#50 teejay

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Posted 06 May 2014 - 01:59

Jenson outscored Lewis, he never beat Lewis in 2011.