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Should Nico insist on releasing Q3 Telemetry?


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#1 Seano

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:35

Given that Saturday’s Q3 was highly controversial, should Nico win the 2014 WDC, he runs the risk of being remembered as a devalued/tarnished Champion. Would it be better to clear this up once and for all now.

 

There’s no circuit that's really equivalent, so I don’t see that Mercedes would be giving too much away to their competitors.

 

Say give us that sector for Nico’s 3 fastest laps in that session and the controversial one.

 

I suspect there’s a lot of people who could do a far better considered analysis than Derek Warwick and co.

 

Nothing can change this weekend's outcome but Nico might be able to restore his battered reputation.

 

Or not!

 

Seano



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#2 meddo

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:36

Why would he. We all know what happened :mad:



#3 Asterion

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:36

Nobody will care soon enough. Schumi got away with worse and has millions of fans to this day.

#4 ollebompa

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:36

Let it go.

#5 Cyanide

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:37

He doesn't owe an explanation to anybody. The stewards clarified there was nothing to see. 

 

People should move on and stop bitching. 



#6 motorhead

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:39

Alonso and crashgate, what would have happened if he admitted he knew...



#7 Vesuvius

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:43

People should just let it go, Nico was better of the two this weekend and deserved the pole and victory. FIA/ stewards already watched his telemetry (and like mika salo said as he has been steward many times, they have access to everything so they can easily see if cheated) so Nico is clean.

#8 Seano

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:49

You are right, he doesn’t  owe anyone anything, but it’s not about that.

 

Around ½ the fans think some something fishy happened. It can easily be resolved in an open and transparent way – whatever the outcome.

 

Its not like the Stewards don't get things wrong sometimes.

 

Seano


Edited by Seano, 25 May 2014 - 19:50.


#9 LeMans86

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:54

You are right, he doesn’t  owe anyone anything, but it’s not about that.
 
Around ½ the fans think some something fishy happened. It can easily be resolved in an open and transparent way – whatever the outcome.
 
Its not like the Stewards don't get things wrong sometimes.
 
Seano

I'm pretty sure around 80% of the F1 fans/watchers doesn't have a clue something happened in qualy yesterday (apart from hearing a commentator mention something) and don't care.

#10 uzsjgb

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 19:56

Given that Saturday’s Q3 was highly controversial, should Nico win the 2014 WDC, he runs the risk of being remembered as a devalued/tarnished Champion.

 

 

Vettel only won 4 championships, because Red Bull always cheats and the team continously sabotaged Webber's car.

 

Ferrari only ever wins, because they have the FIA in their pockets.

 

And so on and so forth.

 

Rosberg is in good company.



#11 Risil

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:03

Normally I'd say he doesn't have to answer to anyone, but Hamilton keeps dropping hints and spreading rumours so I think this needs to come out.

 

"We've sat down and cleared whatever air was needed to be cleared. We've been through the data and seen what needed to be seen - and I wish you guys could see it. Otherwise, we're good.


Edited by Risil, 25 May 2014 - 20:03.


#12 ebc

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:03

He won't be a tarnished champion, the only people who care are Hamilton fans.

#13 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:05

I believe he did it on purpose. I also believe it was brilliant and executed well. 

Tough luck, it happens in every sport. There are ways to play around the rules. 

 

And btw, he set this up perfectly. - he was fastest on first attempt. Lewis knows he failed there and Nico did the job.



#14 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:19

Why should he release the telemetry into public view just because some people suspect something? What planet are you on even suggesting it? Can you ACTUALLY imagine any driver on the planet releasing telemetry into public view just because some people suspect something? No? Me neither. The stewards said he did nothing wrong, and 1 comment from Hamilton means nothing.



#15 SpartanChas

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:22

Given that Saturday’s Q3 was highly controversial, should Nico win the 2014 WDC, he runs the risk of being remembered as a devalued/tarnished Champion. Would it be better to clear this up once and for all now.

 

There’s no circuit that's really equivalent, so I don’t see that Mercedes would be giving too much away to their competitors.

 

Say give us that sector for Nico’s 3 fastest laps in that session and the controversial one.

 

I suspect there’s a lot of people who could do a far better considered analysis than Derek Warwick and co.

 

Nothing can change this weekend's outcome but Nico might be able to restore his battered reputation.

 

Or not!

 

Seano

 

Oh I can't wait for that thread on here.



#16 Seano

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:22

Its strange how the Nico fans don't want clarity and resolution on this episode. At least the question mark on his reputation would be removed once and for all.

 

Seano



#17 Vesuvius

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:23

I believe he did it on purpose. I also believe it was brilliant and executed well. 
Tough luck, it happens in every sport. There are ways to play around the rules. 
 
And btw, he set this up perfectly. - he was fastest on first attempt. Lewis knows he failed there and Nico did the job.


No matter what we believe, stewards cleared him and that's how it is. Some could also believe there was nothing wrong with Lewis left eye but he just wasnt fast enough against nico, some things just are suspicious and we will never know for sure what happened.

#18 uzsjgb

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:25

I believe he did it on purpose. I also believe it was brilliant and executed well.

 

Not only brilliant, but super-human. I think on that Saturday we saw the greatest display of what a human is capable of - ever.

 

Not only did Rosberg know, after the first split time, that he would not achieve a faster lap - a feat, which can only be explained through some measure of foresight into the future - no, he was even aware of Hamilton's first split time and the danger that posed to his pole position - only fractions of a second after Hamilton achieved this time. And then, within a few meters, Rosberg managed to pull off a manouver, which not only fooled many experts watching, but also the stewards, which had access to his telemetry.

 

And Rosberg chose to pull this off, instead of just taking the easy way out and driving faster than Hamilton, which he had been doing all week-end anyway.

 

I think Rosberg should be awarded the world championship for this astounding display of race-craft alone. This is far superior to Red Bull's cheating, which has earned them the title in the past years.


Edited by uzsjgb, 25 May 2014 - 20:27.


#19 Vesuvius

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:25

Its strange how the Nico fans don't want clarity and resolution on this episode. At least the question mark on his reputation would be removed once and for all.
 
Seano


Nico was clarified by FIA/Stewards and thats all that is needed. Nico won the race on his own merit, so there is no question marks anywhere except on the mind of Hamilton fans and Lewis himself.

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#20 Vesuvius

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:27

Not only brilliant, but super-human. I think on that Saturday we saw the greatest display of what a human is capable of - ever.
 
Not only did Rosberg know, after the first split time, that he would not achieve a faster lap - a feat, which can only be explained through some measure of foresight into the future - no, he was even aware of Hamilton's first split time and the danger that posed to his pole position - only fractions of a second after Hamilton achieved this time. And then, within a few meters, Rosberg managed to pull off a manouver, which not only fooled many experts watched, but also the stewards, which had access to his telemetry.
 
And Rosberg choose to pull this off, instead of just taking the easy way out and driving faster than Hamilton, which he had been doing all week-end anyway.
 
I think Rosberg should be awarded the world championship for this astounding display of race-craft alone. This is far superior to Red Bull's cheating, which has earned them the title in the past years.


Lolz fantastic post, gave me a good laugh after horrible day, thanks :D

#21 Buttoneer

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:27

Stop referring to 'Nico fans' or 'Hamilton fans' it's very tedious when you continue to generalise because the forum community comprises individuals with their own nuanced views.

Regarding the substantive point, I can' tree why they would need to release it to us. They had to release it to the stewards, at least one of whom would know how to read it, and they considered it was OK.

#22 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:28

Its strange how the Nico fans don't want clarity and resolution on this episode. At least the question mark on his reputation would be removed once and for all.

Seano


So because people are saying it's a stupid idea you're saying they're Nico fans?. I'm not a Nico fan but you've yet to give any sort of half decent reason for Rosberg releasing the telemtry into public view. Why should he? If people want to think he did something wrong, that's their problem, why should it be on him to prove otherwise to the public?

#23 slmk

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:30

He doesn't owe an explanation to anybody. The stewards clarified there was nothing to see. 

 

People should move on and stop bitching. 

 

Except that that's not what the stewards reviewed, but whatever "people should move on and stop bitching" (unless it concerns your driver).

 

For the record, I also don't think that it should be released. At this point, the team doesn't owe it to anyone. Nico will have to live with whatever he did.


Edited by slmk, 25 May 2014 - 20:31.


#24 Longtimefan

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:32

You are right, he doesn’t  owe anyone anything, but it’s not about that.

 

Around ½ the fans think some something fishy happened. It can easily be resolved in an open and transparent way – whatever the outcome.

 

Its not like the Stewards don't get things wrong sometimes.

 

Seano

 

You could provide all the telemetry in the world, hell you could get god to come down and say its true (if such a person existed) but some fans will still not believe it.   Nothing will ever change their minds.  its best to just forget it and move on.



#25 DarthWillie

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:33

You are right, he doesn’t owe anyone anything, but it’s not about that.

Around ½ the fans think some something fishy happened. It can easily be resolved in an open and transparent way – whatever the outcome.

Its not like the Stewards don't get things wrong sometimes.

Seano


Those fans will not believe they are given the right telemetry.
There is a group who have condemned Nico and will not let reason or facts change there opinion.
Stewards checking telemetry should be enough, if not nobody should bother trying to convince people who don't want to change there opinion, waste of time

#26 TurboF1

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:34

Dumbest thread I've seen on here for a while, and that's from a Hamilton supporter. :rolleyes: It'll never happen bro.

#27 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:34

Except that that's not what the stewards reviewed, but whatever "people should move on and stop bitching" (unless it concerns your driver).

 

For the record, I also don't think that it should be released. At this point, the team doesn't owe it to anyone. Nico will have to live with whatever he did.

 

That's IF he did anything wrong in the first place..........



#28 Seano

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:36

Could I please remind people that this isn't the right thread for discussing the incident or the Stewards judgement or even today's race - its about whether Nico should insist that his reputation is restored by the releasing the evidence.

 

Nor is the right place for childish, personal insults.

 

Seano



#29 Vesuvius

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:39

Could I please remind people that this isn't the right thread for discussing the incident or the Stewards judgement or even today's race - its about whether Nico should insist that his reputation is restored by the releasing the evidence.
 
Nor is the right place for childish, personal insults.
 
Seano


Didnt Hamilton got on trouble few years ago when he published telemetry files in public...why should Nico do it? I'm sure he isnt allowed and he is cleared by the stewards.

#30 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:42

Says you, going on as though it's Rosberg fans saying he shouldn't release it, when that's not the case...........his reputation hasn't been tarnished except in the eyes of those who refuse to accept that he was found not guilty of doing anything wrong. Why should he release the telemetry just because some people want to believe he did it deliberately? Nobody has ANY proof that he did, so why should he release the telemetry to back up what he and the stewards have already decided? If you're saying he shoud because of what Hamilton said, that's stupid, Lewis will say what he likes if he thinks it might turn people against Rosberg and get them on his side or if he thinks it might destabilise Rosberg mentally etc. He says he did nothing wrong, the stewards say he did nothing wrong, why should he try to satisfy some people who want to believe otherwise? If he felt he'd done nothing wrong but the stewards said he had, then you MIGHT have a point. However, he says he did nothing wrong, the stewards say he did nothing wrong, therefore that's the end of it. He has absolutely no reason to back up what he and the stewards said.


Edited by HuddersfieldTerrier1986, 25 May 2014 - 20:43.


#31 LeMans86

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:43

Its strange how the Nico fans don't want clarity and resolution on this episode. At least the question mark on his reputation would be removed once and for all.
 
Seano

How?

Telemetry will show that both drivers braked later (at all/most corners) every qualifying single lap as they gained confidence and tried to find more laptime. It will show that Nico braked noticeably later at that corner in that lap as well, the car got unsettled, and he couldn't make the corner. It doesn't clear up/proof anything at all, 'cause the question is whether Nico braked too late to make the corner
1. on purpose to not make that corner (Hamilton's view)
2. on purpose to try and find laptime since he was 1-tenth down that lap (Rosberg's statement)
3. or just made a real mistake by accidentally braking to late.
Only Nico knows and all we can do is believe him.
What speaks for him is China: he saw he was down on laptime in his last Q-lap, so he tried that little bit extra to make up for it. Same this time around in Monaco imo.

Hamilton might just have had an Alonso flashback, missing the chance of a last Q-lap..

Edited by LeMans86, 25 May 2014 - 20:46.


#32 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:43

Didnt Hamilton got on trouble few years ago when he published telemetry files in public...why should Nico do it? I'm sure he isnt allowed and he is cleared by the stewards.

 

Totally different situations. http://www.bbc.co.uk...rmula1/19474565

 

Rosberg releasing the telemetry would be like Tiger Woods saying to the press  a few years ago "Hey, I got the numbers for those hookers I've been with!"  

Why would a cheater want to implicate himself?



#33 Seano

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:45

I believe it would be in both Mercedes and Nico's interest to do so - what ever the outcome.

 

Whether some people choose to believe the facts when their mind is already made up - well that's up to them, I'm open to persuasion.

 

Seano



#34 jestaudio

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:46

I'm pretty sure around 80% of the F1 fans/watchers doesn't have a clue something happened in qualy yesterday (apart from hearing a commentator mention something) and don't care.

I think your short changing fans, most of the F1 fans i know are pretty clued up and certainly do care



#35 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:49

Why would it be in anybodies interests to release telemetry to back up what the driver, and more importantly, the stewards said? Why should he release it? There's no proof that he did anything wrong, therefore why should he satisfy those who refuse to believe that he did nothing wrong, either because they're Lewis fans or because they don't like Germans or because of this or that? The ONLY people that matter in this situation are the driver and the stewards. Both say he did nothing wrong. That's the end of it. No reason for him to come out and say "I said I did nothing wrong, the stewards said the same, here's the proof". Fact of the matter is the only people that matter said he did nothing wrong. It's not for him to prove in public that the stewards decision was right. It's for everyone else to prove the stewards decision was wrong. Why should Rosberg assist those who believe he did something wrong when he and the stewards both say he did nothing wrong?


Edited by ForeverF1, 19 June 2014 - 13:10.


#36 Riverside

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:50

Not only brilliant, but super-human. I think on that Saturday we saw the greatest display of what a human is capable of - ever.

 

Not only did Rosberg know, after the first split time, that he would not achieve a faster lap - a feat, which can only be explained through some measure of foresight into the future - no, he was even aware of Hamilton's first split time and the danger that posed to his pole position - only fractions of a second after Hamilton achieved this time. And then, within a few meters, Rosberg managed to pull off a manouver, which not only fooled many experts watching, but also the stewards, which had access to his telemetry.

 

And Rosberg chose to pull this off, instead of just taking the easy way out and driving faster than Hamilton, which he had been doing all week-end anyway.

 

I think Rosberg should be awarded the world championship for this astounding display of race-craft alone. This is far superior to Red Bull's cheating, which has earned them the title in the past years.

 

 

  Hhahaha yes exactly !  I posted a very similar opinion in the "Rosberg Parked it"  thread  ......   

 

 

 

Yes,  Nico is a master that can look at his delta time , realise he is F' ked ... brake and create lock up and masterfully remove himself from the track without contact

and guarantee a yellow.   Meanwhile so masterful that he would fool the stewards.  All this of course ,  would have been aborted if he had improved his 19.82 and therefore he would have continued and trounced Lewis.   I think you give him way too much credit to be honest.

 

 

 

 



#37 chrcol

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:52

What would have happened if nico left his car parked at the bottom? instead of reversing out which obviously extended the yellow flag as well as been dangerous.



#38 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:53

Reversing did NOT extend the yellow flag. The yellow flag would've stayed out had he not reversed out. By reversing out, the yellow flags were able to be removed from use.



#39 uzsjgb

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 20:53

  Hhahaha yes exactly !  I posted a very similar opinion in the "Rosberg Parked it"  thread  ......   

 

It's the only way to answer such threads  :rotfl:



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#40 king_crud

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:04

the internet has brought us some wonderful things over the years and improved the world in so many ways. And to counter that there's some threads in the RC section of Autosport......



#41 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:11

the internet has brought us some wonderful things over the years and improved the world in so many ways. And to counter that there's some threads in the RC section of Autosport......

 

Eh, there's worse out there that I can think of 4chan, youtube video comments and 2girls1cup... The list goes on.  Autosport is pretty tame



#42 Peter Perfect

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:15

Releasing telemetry?

 

1. No team in their right mind would sanction it for pretty obvious reasons.

2. Even if it were released it just becomes something else to argue about as people will see in the data whatever they want to. What percentage of fans are actually qualified and experienced enough to interpret it? It'd just end up creating more confusion and noise.



#43 ExFlagMan

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:17

the internet has brought us some wonderful things over the years and improved the world in so many ways. And to counter that there's some most threads in the RC section of Autosport......



#44 r4mses

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:18

[...]

 

People should move on and stop bitching. 

 

Indeed.



#45 Lazy

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:18

If he did this, people would be demanding telemetry for every little incident. There's no way they can set that precedent.



#46 SR388

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:21

Given that Saturday’s Q3 was highly controversial, should Nico win the 2014 WDC, he runs the risk of being remembered as a devalued/tarnished Champion. Would it be better to clear this up once and for all now.

There’s no circuit that's really equivalent, so I don’t see that Mercedes would be giving too much away to their competitors.

Say give us that sector for Nico’s 3 fastest laps in that session and the controversial one.

I suspect there’s a lot of people who could do a far better considered analysis than Derek Warwick and co.

Nothing can change this weekend's outcome but Nico might be able to restore his battered reputation.

Or not!

Seano


I'm leaning towards no. If Lewis loses the championship on May the 24th alone, then Lewis has no right winning this championship.

I've got my calendar already marked with Canada, Britain, Hungary, AMERICA, Singapore, Belgium, Italy, Abu Dhabi, and 3 others ticked off as wins.

#47 jstrains

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:24

Another Nico bashing thread. Why should he publish it? Noone will care at the end of this season anyway (both will win a significant number of GPs or some will win the most)



#48 Cyanide

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:24

Except that that's not what the stewards reviewed, but whatever "people should move on and stop bitching" (unless it concerns your driver).

 

Even if it concerns your driver, it's ludicrous to expect a team to release telemetry data to the public. That's making valuable info available to your rivals. 

 

I don't see the big deal, Mercedes answered to the stewards, Wolff clarified to the fans the move was not deliberate. They really have no one else to answer to. 



#49 PayasYouRace

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:33

Why would Nico insist on it? He was cleared. If anything Lewis would be insisting on it.



#50 P123

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 21:37

People will always have suspicions. Releasing telemetry won't change that. Telemetry doesn't show intent, only Nico himself knows for certain if it was a genuine screw up or a bit of play acting. Time to move on.