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Minor contact to no longer be automatically investigated


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#1 balmybaldwin

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:00

At last a sensible suggestion. I know safety is important, but this sounds like a good compromise:

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/114528

Now we just need them to rescind the rediculous new contact rules in the btcc

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#2 Disgrace

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:07

Excellent news! Penalties have long been discredited as any form of deterrent.



#3 spacekid

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:19

At last a sensible proposal. I'm sick of seeing investigations basically caused by stupidly wide front wings being clipped that none of the drivers can see anyway.

Let them race, accept that racing incidents occur, punish stupidity/lack of appropriate skill/malicious behaviour.

#4 JacnGille

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:32

The definition of "minor" is...???????????????



#5 lbennie

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:35

hallelujah



#6 RonnyRonny

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:46

If someone was to touch someone elses rear tyre (causing a puncture) and lets say break their own front wing, would that be minor contact?



#7 Fastcake

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:47

I think it's a mistake actually. By referring every incident to the stewards (apparently, as the messages don't always come up on-screen), it does add an element of openness that we know the stewards have looked at every incident, and are not arbitrarily choosing which drivers to investigate during the race. The moment they do not choose to investigate something, chances are the aggrieved party will be filling the airwaves with claims, and this time they can't be shut up by pointing to the stewards report. It's already bad enough now with the cries to Charlie mid-race, imagine how much angry radio we're going to get if they don't take a look.

 

Having a clear rule that states any contact will be investigated just makes life easier for everyone. And before someone pops up complaining about investigations discourages people from racing or whatnot, please remember that the majority of the time no action is taken.



#8 Garagiste

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Posted 19 June 2014 - 23:58

I absolutely agree Fastcake, very nicely put. There will indeed be endless crying over this, especially over the arbitary nature of "minor contact". I guess they'll draw some kind of line like "both cars still running after the inident", but what if the contact leads ultimately to a retirement that wouldn't have otherwise happened? Too many variables for my liking.



#9 Kingshark

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 00:47

Minor contact to no longer be automatically investigated

 

2a3sd5.jpg

 

The definition of "minor" is...???????????????

 

tumblr_m8swuklCFr1re08byo1_1280.jpg


Edited by Kingshark, 20 June 2014 - 00:49.


#10 turssi

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 01:14

Could benefit aggressive drivers like Lewis, Pérez and the likes of Maldonado. But of course all will start defending harder and we will see more Massa-Perez kinds of contact.

What will be the procedure to start an investigation. Can't leave it to Bernie or there will be hell tô pay.

#11 Disgrace

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 01:29

Could benefit aggressive drivers like Lewis, Pérez and the likes of Maldonado. But of course all will start defending harder and we will see more Massa-Perez kinds of contact.

What will be the procedure to start an investigation. Can't leave it to Bernie or there will be hell tô pay.

 

It will have no impact on the racing itself whatsoever. During the period in which all clashes were investigated, Maldonado escaped deliberately using his car as a battering ram with malicious intent. Is Maldonado about to be truly unleashed because of some invisible force that states he won't be under investigation in a true racing incident? Idiots will be idiots, and humans will make mistakes. Penalties don't have any effect on universal truths.


Edited by Disgrace, 20 June 2014 - 01:29.


#12 Ricciardo2014

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 01:36

I can't see this changing anything really.

 

Someone, will have to investigate it to decide whether it needs investigating  :rotfl:



#13 pokerkid

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 02:35

So the morons have finally caught on to what everyone else had been saying for years, that treating all contact like common traffic violations only discourages racing. I guess it's better late than never. This system was incredibly stupid to begin with. Just let them race and punish extreme of deliberate violations.



#14 Brother Fox

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:00

I'd imagine Lotus is happy with this

#15 lbennie

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:06

Thank goodness.

 

The kamakazi dive was almost a forgotten art.



#16 RacingDuck

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 07:16

Of course Maldanado is excited by this...

#17 PayasYouRace

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 07:36

It's one step forward two steps back with F1 at the moment. At least this is a good one. Not every contact needs investigating.



#18 ExFlagMan

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 07:43

Until some 'harder b*****d' comes along and does it to him....



#19 SR388

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 10:53

Could benefit aggressive drivers like Lewis, Pérez and the likes of Maldonado. But of course all will start defending harder and we will see more Massa-Perez kinds of contact.

What will be the procedure to start an investigation. Can't leave it to Bernie or there will be hell tô pay.


Those 3 aren't in the same universe.

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#20 johnmhinds

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 11:24

You'd still have to do some sort of investigating to decide whether it is a minor incident, so I don't see what this changes.



#21 midgrid

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 12:17

I think it's a mistake actually. By referring every incident to the stewards (apparently, as the messages don't always come up on-screen), it does add an element of openness that we know the stewards have looked at every incident, and are not arbitrarily choosing which drivers to investigate during the race. The moment they do not choose to investigate something, chances are the aggrieved party will be filling the airwaves with claims, and this time they can't be shut up by pointing to the stewards report. It's already bad enough now with the cries to Charlie mid-race, imagine how much angry radio we're going to get if they don't take a look.

Having a clear rule that states any contact will be investigated just makes life easier for everyone. And before someone pops up complaining about investigations discourages people from racing or whatnot, please remember that the majority of the time no action is taken.


But it won't be arbitrary, as the teams involved can still lodge a formal complaint which will force the stewards to investigate even if they initially choose not to.

#22 Jimisgod

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 16:18

The definition of "minor" is...???????????????


Contact not done by Maldonado, usually.

#23 Disgrace

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 17:31

But it won't be arbitrary, as the teams involved can still lodge a formal complaint which will force the stewards to investigate even if they initially choose not to.

 

For a fee of course. If anything, the stewards are now laughably charging for their services. Understandable really given Force India's pathetic last ditch attempt to save some face by appealing the Canada decision against Perez.


Edited by Disgrace, 20 June 2014 - 17:33.


#24 turssi

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 19:50

For added fun the pilot and the RE should request and pay for investigations :-)

#25 Kenstate

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 20:10

I don't understand how the rules deterred them from racing in the first place. It's not like now they're not going to be investigated for minor contact the drivers are going to have fun losing FWs and tires all the live long day. :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  What, unless you think drivers actually wanted to lose bits of their cars racing with other people?



#26 Sheepmachine

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 20:36

In principle I think it's a good idea it may encourage people to have a go and not worry about a small rub being penalised. What I don't understand is why change suddenly mid season? How are they are going to be consistent with penalties when for the first part they were strict and now they are being lenient? I don't envy the stewards job that's for sure.

#27 Eff One 2002

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 02:50

Good to see that finally some COMMON SENSE is prevailing.



#28 midgrid

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 18:06

So apparently Vettel would have received a penalty for his contact with Gutiérrez under the old system, but escaped one due to the greater leniency now on show.  I think it would have been ludicrous to penalise Vettel, considering that the contact was clearly not deliberate, did not affect Gutiérrez in any way, and that Vettel already lost time with his front wing replacement, so it's so far so good as far as I'm concerned.



#29 Henrik B

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Posted 22 June 2014 - 18:52

So apparently Vettel would have received a penalty for his contact with Gutiérrez under the old system, but escaped one due to the greater leniency now on show.  I think it would have been ludicrous to penalise Vettel, considering that the contact was clearly not deliberate, did not affect Gutiérrez in any way, and that Vettel already lost time with his front wing replacement, so it's so far so good as far as I'm concerned.


Very very few incidents in F1 are "deliberate". They are the result of one or more drivers cocking up - neither Massa nor Perez wanted to make contact in Canada just to name the latest example. The penalty system is there to act as a deterrent for stupid behaviour and to nullify any gain.

Vettel hitting Guiterrez' rear at least tick the "stupid behaviour" box.