42 replies to this topic

[Wiggy]

As discussed in the FP1 session on sky;

If the drivers currently in F1 swapped places with the GP2 drivers... Which series would you follow?

GP2 cars driven by the current F1 drivers

F1 cars driven by the current GP2 drivers

[PayasYouRace]

Where's the option for "Indycar"?

[Nemo1965]

In ye old days, F1 drivers drove F2 races (in other weekends), 'clubraces' (in other weekends) and BMW M1's (Procar, same weekend). It was fantastic, in my eyes, because F1 stars would compete in equal machinery and there would be upcoming young drivers (or even F1 rejects) showing they had what it took. Jochen Rindt and Niki Lauda, out of the top of my head, largely drove themselves into F1 because they would sometimes beat F1 drivers in Formula 2.

 

Sadly, it would never happen. But a Gp2 race with F1 drivers on friday-evening... jummie. (Watch out for the flying carbon, though... I think the F1 boys would lose all decorum if they would have to race with stuff that is not theirs...)

Edited by Nemo1965, 20 June 2014 - 09:22.

[Exb]

For the sake of your question F1 - drivers come and go, in 10 years the F1 grid will mainly be made up of those GP2 drivers anyway... However at the moment the GP2 drivers probably don't have enough experience and a lot will just not be good enough for F1, so the quality of the racing will suffer, there will be more stupid incidents (and things like the Massa/Perez crash) so I think F1 would struggle to call itself the premier series anymore. The thing that makes F1 special is the best cars, with the best designers and engineers and the best drivers (in the main), in my opinion the more of this we lose the less special F1 becomes. The LMP1 cars in WEC are already creeping up on them, and that is a series I really love now and a few years ago I never would have thought I'd say that.

[Exb]

In ye old days, F1 drivers drove F2 races (in other weekends), 'clubraces' (in other weekends) and BMW M1's (Procar, same weekend). It was fantastic, in my eyes, because F1 stars would compete in equal machinery and there would be upcoming young drivers (or even F1 rejects) showing they had what it took. Jochen Rindt and Niki Lauda, out of the top of my head, largely drove themselves into F1 because they would sometimes beat F1 drivers in Formula 2.
 
Sadly, it would never happen. But a Gp2 race with F1 drivers on friday-evening... jummie. (Watch out for the flying carbon, though... I think the F1 boys would lose all decorum if they would have to race with stuff that is not theirs...)

This - when they were on about cutting down practice, one of the stupid things about it is the paying public want to see more of the drivers - not less, it would actually be great to see an extra race run with drivers in the same spec cars (or karts?) Maybe they could get points that go towards the drivers championship to give those a chance to shine that have a poor F1 car??? Well its as stupid a suggestion as standing starts after safety cars, double points and everything else coming from the strategy group

Edited by Exb, 20 June 2014 - 09:32.

[Jon83]

F1.

 

Things must be dull this morning if Sky have resorted to these kinds of daft discussions (I haven't seen any of FP1) on a Friday morning.

[ollebompa]

WEC

[Buttoneer]

F1, definitely.

[discover23]

I always ponder this idea to have f1 drivers compete in a separate championship and race on Saturdays where the two series overlap. This will certainly be of great value to the fans.

[Ross Stonefeld]

F1, definitely.

 

I dont think F1 cars are interesting/exciting enough to overhaul what would be completely uninteresting drivers.

 

But Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso, etc all going at it in the same car? Totally watch that. 

[DS27]

Absolutely I would be more interested in watching GP2 with F1 drivers - would answer a lot of questions.

 

F1 should be the pinnacle, I get that, but to most people, certainly casual fans, it is the pinnacle because of the drivers more than the technology.

[kraduk]

id actually like both, f1 driver to gp2 so we can see how good they really are, and gp2 drivers to f1 for pure carnage fun

[Dispenser89]

F1 drivers in GP2 cars. That would be great to watch.

[Jimisgod]

There should be an F1 team that constantly rotates promising drivers, say each driver gets 2 races in the year, which fits in with their other schedule.

It seems only 2 or 3 GP2 drivers ever got a real shot in the last few years.

[OSX]

Current F1 drivers in GP2 cars, naturally.

[Kingshark]

F1 drivers in GP2 cars would be fascinating.

[Anderis]

For me, F1 has always been more about the teams than the drivers, so I definetely would watch F1 no matter who are the drivers.

[Option1]

I dont think F1 cars are interesting/exciting enough to overhaul what would be completely uninteresting drivers.

 

But Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso, etc all going at it in the same car? Totally watch that. 

I must admit I thought the OP was a very silly question, but also had no real idea how I'd answer.  Ross's point convinced me; he's right. 

 

I still think it's a silly question though.

 

Neil

[Buttoneer]

I dont think F1 cars are interesting/exciting enough to overhaul what would be completely uninteresting drivers.

 

But Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso, etc all going at it in the same car? Totally watch that. 

There will be new Hamilton's and Vettel's and Alonso's all going it at it in interesting McLaren's and Ferrari's.

[sopa]

I voted GP2 drivers in F1, believing that fundamentally F1 with all its innovation, technology and teams has more long-term viability. As someone mentioned, all current drivers were once in feeder series.

 

But now after some imagination I feel I am not sure and may consider to change my vote.

Familiar drivers in different series can certainly attract some attention. I believe both Kimi and Kubica brought a fair amount of fans to WRC. Now imagine all those famous drivers together with their fanbases change discipline. It is bound to create some excitement. Even if short-term. But it would create quite a story - what can those famous drivers do in a different race!

 

However, F1... we are already debating, whether we are still interested following it. Mercedes has a huge advantage, big gaps between teams. And then put Jolyon Palmer and somebody else into this dominant car. Spread the rest of the relative no-names between the rest of the field,,, and the effect is rather underwhelming. It may be top-notch technology, but ...

 

Though I have to say WEC is pretty good. Even if many of those drivers are such, who we may not think are/were important. Just recently in a thread it was asked, who are those Treluyer, Lotterer and Fässler, who are doing the winning. But they are/were your typical feeder series drivers, who you may have forgotten if they don't make to F1. Now imagine you don't have all those drivers in WEC, but in F1. Relatively unknown guys, but it is still top-notch series with top-notch cars.

 

I think the immediate "wow" effect would definitely be on GP2. But F1 would have the long-term depth.

[KnucklesAgain]

Both, obviously

[Option1]

I operated on the assumption this would be a one-off thing.

 

Neil

[sopa]

One possibility of taking this question.

How many watch Race of Champions?

 

Not only have we had there F1 champions, but also Rally, Moto GP champions and competitors from other motorsport disciplines.

 

For sure an interesting fun event, but does it really outweigh other series? So when the year is over, you still remember the boring domination of an "undeserving" average driver winning F1 rather than Race of Champions, where one great champion beat another.

[Ross Stonefeld]

There will be new Hamilton's and Vettel's and Alonso's all going it at it in interesting McLaren's and Ferrari's.

 

I don't think there would be. You'd end up with a CART IRL thing most likely, with one series having the names but one having the reputation. 

 

Talent tends to accumulate in F1 so any given season is very deep. It's transitional in the junior ranks and it's been very thin everywhere the past few years. Naturally grids are only truly measured in hindsight (there's more "wow, that guy" in the 2005 GP2 grid than this year's) but even looking at them as stand-alones there are very few guys in this year's GP2 you could see in F1, or be interested in seeing in F1, if every team was fully funded and signing whomever they wanted for 2015.

 

You could accomplish much the same thing by giving out points at the Young Driver Test 

[jjcale]

When I saw this thread I thought the question would be

 

Given at some circuits GP2 cars are not too far off F1 cars,,, if the F1 drivers swapped cars with the GP2 drivers and they all raced on the same track at the same time, who would win? 

[ANF]

Both.

[Ross Stonefeld]

I'd think Hamilton, with Alonso and maybe Vettel close behind. You might get someone random like Button up there if the car needed a particularly clean style.

[sopa]

You'd end up with a CART IRL thing most likely, with one series having the names but one having the reputation. 

 

Possibly. How about the CART/IRL cars though? Because in current discussion F1 would have more advanced cars and technology with an on-going development war going on plus manufacturers.

 

In CART/IRL the main differentiator was participants (drivers/teams) plus also the tracks (more variety in CART), so naturally CARTwas more popular particularly in 96-01. In 2002 the "names" (both drivers, teams and also manufacturers like Honda and Toyota) started switching to IRL, so the balance somewhat changed.

 

But if there was a significant difference in cars (F1/GP2), how would that affect? We would also have to keep in mind that in current discussion the manufacturer interest would still be with F1, because this is where they can showcase their technology. It may be Palmer vs Vandoorne vs Cecotto Jr, but it is Mercedes v Ferrari v Renault. And those big car icons also attract interest and certain fanbases. F1 would (at least) temporarily change a bit in terms of fanbases though. Less discussion about drivers and more interest in cars and technology. Like WEC. I haven't heard much fanboy-bickering about drivers, but the people, who follow the series, are very much interested in the cars and team-work.

[Ross Stonefeld]

In this scenario the Indy 500 is replaced by the cars. The 'weaker' series has the headline-grabbing ingredient. The other series has the higher rated drivers. 

[Seanspeed]

GP2, honestly. I'm not a driver fan sort of person, but I do want to see the best drivers going at it. F1 full of mediocre sorts would be depressing.

Would really miss DRS though, and reversed grid races would be hilarious with all the driver fans going nuts trying to justify/discredit reverse race grid results.

EDIT: And no IndyCar please. The tracks they use are mostly unsuitable for the size and speed of the cars, which ruins the racing.

Edited by Seanspeed, 20 June 2014 - 21:05.

[Imateria]

GP2 with F1 drivers. It's been a few years since the GP2 field was really strong with most of the drivers now being average journeymen and a couple of promising rookies. A Formula Renault 3.5 swap would be far more interesting.

Edited by Imateria, 20 June 2014 - 21:18.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Indycar tracks usually make for the racing. Their street courses are more 'real', the F1 urban tracks are better than the natural road courses a lot of series use 

[Seanspeed]

Indycar tracks usually make for the racing. Their street courses are more 'real', the F1 urban tracks are better than the natural road courses a lot of series use 

IndyCar's street tracks just make for desperate overtakes and lots of caution periods.

I do like street tracks in general, but they make up too much of the IndyCar calendar and the ones they use seem ill-suited for big, high HP open-wheelers apart from a few exceptions.

[Ross Stonefeld]

No the rules and style of American safety make for caution periods, though I accept Indycar street races have more incidents. 

 

I think Indycar street circuits are great because they do exactly what they're supposed to: show you how crazy a high downforce high power race car is outside a normal race track. 

 

F1 cries if there are bumps on the track. 

[Seanspeed]

So F1 doesn't run old, dilapidated street circuits. That's not a negative.

Wouldn't you rather see an animal in its natural habitat and not a circus act?

[bourbon]

Totally both.  If you have fav drivers among the F1 drivers and love F1 then it is a no brainer.

 

Are they back to the GP2 is less spec and gimmicky than F1 these days? 

[MattPete]

Meh, I've been through that.  I'd watch Indycar instead (and soak up the irony).

[sopa]

and reversed grid races would be hilarious with all the driver fans going nuts trying to justify/discredit reverse race grid results.

 

Good lord. That's a good point.

 

For a while it could be interesting to watch F1 drivers race there, but soon it would lose all its magic with all these artificial rules like reverse grids. And reverse grid results will contribute significantly to the outcome of the championship overall. So if you finish consistently 8th on Saturdays, you may fight for the championship! Might suit a consistent upper midfield driver and a good driver off the start line.

[Bawdy]

I dont think F1 cars are interesting/exciting enough to overhaul what would be completely uninteresting drivers.

But Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso, etc all going at it in the same car? Totally watch that.

This. Would be awesome to see them all duke it out with more equal cars.

[Lee Nicolle]

So F1 doesn't run old, dilapidated street circuits. That's not a negative.

Wouldn't you rather see an animal in its natural habitat and not a circus act?

Lets face it, they could not run some of those circuits. They would grind themselves to bits.

At times there has been quite talented drivers in many 'lower' classes but lack of money or pull in the right places means they stay there. The top 1/2 dozen F1 drivers SHOULD be the best. But really the rest probably are no better than many other elite drivers. GP2, Indy cars, Lemans type cars etc.

And even then horses for courses, some drivers revel on high speed circuits, some do ok on gokart tracks such as Monaco and I suspect that many GP drivers may struggle on some of those rough Indy car tracks. 

[dreamer]

Both as I do now.

[LORDBYRON]

F1.

 

Things must be dull this morning if Sky have resorted to these kinds of daft discussions (I haven't seen any of FP1) on a Friday morning.

Yes its absolutely absurd for a start the sponsors would not go for it 

[Ross Stonefeld]

So F1 doesn't run old, dilapidated street circuits. That's not a negative.

Wouldn't you rather see an animal in its natural habitat and not a circus act?

 

I don't think constantly ironing and repaving race tracks is their natural state. They go in for botox the minute they develop any character.