37 replies to this topic

[SophieB]

Adam Cooper: Lotus could be set to switch from Renault to Mercedes power in 2015, well placed sources have confirmed.

 

While the two parties have an ongoing contract inevitably there has been some tension between Lotus and Renault this year. Lotus has been late with payments to the French manufacturer over the past couple of seasons, while the reliability and performance problems associated with the power unit have proved frustrating to the team.

 

 

 

[Jejking]

Thereby, the Merc PU doesn't only seem better and more reliable, it also was cheaper I believe?

[Risil]

Joe Saward's sources tell him so.

 

Interesting times. Renault could be down to just the Red Bull duo in 2015. Just in time for them to produce a world-beating second iteration of their engine.

Edited by Risil, 25 June 2014 - 08:57.

[Brother Fox]

I assume Merc's Credit department will be insisting on cash up front?

[teejay]

As long as the cheque isn't from an investment group that has almost certainly done the deal, I would say so

[Kenstate]

While the two parties have an ongoing contract inevitably there has been some tension between Lotus and Renault this year. Lotus has been late with payments to the French manufacturer over the past couple of seasons, while the reliability and performance problems associated with the power unit have proved frustrating to the team.

 

 

     weren't lotus the ones who insisted that they weren't the ones who were late with payments and pretended to be all offended when renault basically outed them?

[krapmeister]

This doesn't make sense from Mercedes POV tbh...

[Jon83]

Just call it Formula Mercedes. 

[Slackbladder]

This doesn't make sense from Mercedes POV tbh...

 

Why doesn't it? As long as they get paid, it's basically money in the bank, as long as they serve 4 teams (as they are losing McLaren next year).

 

More to the point, it leaves RB with no where to go...

[krapmeister]

I should've said from a financial POV - they might not get paid...

Edited by krapmeister, 25 June 2014 - 10:36.

[FullThrottleF1]

So FRR could be gettting Renault engines after all?

[taran]

Why doesn't it? As long as they get paid, it's basically money in the bank, as long as they serve 4 teams (as they are losing McLaren next year).

 

More to the point, it leaves RB with no where to go...

 

Because manufacturers need opponents too. Mercedes needs other teams/engines to beat. And ideally they need teams which can do well but not truly upset their own team. Force India and Williams simply lack the means of competing for the titles against Mercedes. Enstone would be different (if Genii pours in money again) and thus a threat. McLaren was a legacy issue and atm couldn't threaten the top teams.

 

Thus it would make more sense for Mercedes to sign up with a Sauber or Caterham. They get paid (up front?), can pawn off some technology and are not threatened themselves.

 

Meanwhile, Lotus is not compatible with Mercedes. Lotus as flimsy, sharp, agile cars. Mercedes are heavy, solid, dependable. They don't share any core values.

 

Same with Red Bull. RB is all about anti-establishment, rebelling, doing your own thing. Mercedes is establishment, orderly, by the book.

[Massa_f1]

Bad news for Alonso and Seb, Ferrari, and Red Bull. I have no doubt the Lotus will jump up to near the front of the field next year with Mercedes engines.

 

Formula Mercedes indeed. Unless Honda is near, or on par with Mercedes engines next year, others simply wont stand a chance.

[Anja]

Meanwhile, Lotus is not compatible with Mercedes. Lotus as flimsy, sharp, agile cars. Mercedes are heavy, solid, dependable. They don't share any core values.

 

They could ditch the Lotus name as there's nothing really behind it right now.

[John Player]

They could ditch the Lotus name as there's nothing really behind it right now.

 

Team Enstone Mercedes

[KWSN - DSM]

They could ditch the Lotus name as there's nothing really behind it right now.

 

There never was.

 

[skyfolker]

So this turned out not to be true:Lotus agree Renault engine deal until 2018

[taran]

So this turned out not to be true:Lotus agree Renault engine deal until 2018

 

I don't think that has much relevance. There will be performance clauses and such which would allow either partner to dissolve the agreement. In the end, a contract is worth very little in F1. Even sainted Ron broke his Peugeot contract back in 1994, despite him 'being a man of his word'. And Lopez' word is worth even less.......

[Lamag]

Thats interesting, according to Saward´s latest article the entire Renault package could cost more then 40 millions a year.

 

On the other hand the Mercedes package cost just 26 millions a year.

 

http://joesaward.wor...-of-f1-engines/

[lustigson]

If Team Lotus team up with Mercedes, Daimler should buy Lotus Group/Lotus Cars as well.

[Cyanide]

Considering their current form, they really need Mercedes. 

 

Renault are toast. 

[MikeV1987]

Ditch the Lotus name too

[Fastcake]

 

Thats interesting, according to Saward´s latest article the entire Renault package could cost more then 40 millions a year.

 

On the other hand the Mercedes package cost just 26 millions a year.

 

http://joesaward.wor...-of-f1-engines/

 

 

I was quite surprised when I read that this morning. I know France can be difficult, but a $14 million difference? With their current engine and financial constraints, it would be stupid for Lotus to remain a Renault customer. I'm sure Renault will bridge the gap to Mercedes eventually, but in the mean time their customers are spending far more for a worse product.

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

There is a limit on how many teams an engine supplier is allowed to supply.

 

Mercedes works team

 

Mclaren Mercedes (2015 Honda comes in)

 

Williams Mercedes

 

Force India

 

Someone with more financial stability could get the nod over Lotus.

[bourbon]

This isn't surprising at all.   Renault's product is not up to par.  F1 is a fast paste sport, there is no time for good will while they work to get it right.  They gained a lot of customers when successful, but like any company, you lose them again once you are not.  Loyalty is a house of cards.

[P123]

Just call it Formula Mercedes.

Because......?

Mercedes replacing McLaren with a new customer.

[Atreiu]

Just call it Formula Mercedes. 

 

Better that than Formula One Single Aerodynamic Department to rule them all.

[seahawk]

I hope Sauber gets the Merc engine.

[Option1]

As long as the cheque isn't from an investment group that has almost certainly done the deal, I would say so

And isn't from an American pizza joint.

 

Neil

[Timstr11]

 

Thats interesting, according to Saward´s latest article the entire Renault package could cost more then 40 millions a year.

 

On the other hand the Mercedes package cost just 26 millions a year.

 

http://joesaward.wor...-of-f1-engines/

 

 

If these figures are correct it may be that Mercedes- AMG is subsidizing the F1 engine program to a larger extent than Renault is willing to do. Because surely you'd expect the actual cost of the Mercedes engine to be higher than that of Renault given that they've invested a great deal more compared to Renault.  

 

Or, it's also possible that the design and production in Brixworth is cheaper because Brixworth also works for the Mercedes-AMG road car business. The synergies help to reduce R&D and production costs.

 

I think Viry only provides services to F1,

[tkulla]

I hope Sauber gets the Merc engine.

Paint them black with "powered by Mercedes" on the side and hire HHF and Wendlinger to drive!

[MortenF1]

Paint them black with "powered by Mercedes" on the side and hire HHF and Wendlinger to drive!

Exactly! My thoughts as well. Ever since Group C and Sauber's first F1 car I've thought they "belong" with Mercedes much more than with Ferrari.

I would imagine that both Sauber and Lotus want the Mercedes PU. Can't remember any rumours around the length of the deal between Sauber and Ferrari.... ??

[emmanuelrubi]

I'll believe it when Mercedes announce it, i personally don't think is going to happen.

[Andrew Hope]

It would be a waste of two excellent power units to go through all the trouble of building them just to shove them in the back of the Sauber.

 

Give them to Lotus and watch Grosjean/Maldonado 1-2 all day all night .

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

The Lotus looks like a decent chassis and Grosjean has scored points with it and qualified well - even Q3 IIRC. A more stable platform should seem them into Q3 consistently at the very least.

[Option1]

It would be a waste of two excellent power units to go through all the trouble of building them just to shove them in the back of the Sauber.

 

Give them to Lotus and watch Grosjean/Maldonado 1-2 all day all night .

You've been indulging again, haven't you?  And not sharing! 

Neil

[Afterburner]

I misread the title as 'Mercedes to switch to Lotus engines', which is arguably a far more intriguing prospect.

[MortenF1]

Done!

 

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/114818