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4 Power Units (engines) only in 2015 - Good luck McLaren Honda


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#51 Szoelloe

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Posted 11 July 2014 - 15:12

Each unit to now last on average a quarter of the season, 5 races.... So far removed from the early 00's with engines lasting one race and qualifying engines being used...

Honda have a real challenge on their hands with these regs...

 

 

uhmm, why?? What is new that Honda haven't known about since last year?


Edited by Szoelloe, 11 July 2014 - 15:13.


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#52 rodlamas

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Posted 11 July 2014 - 22:45

Could you explain that? If true, I fail to see why the number of power units per season should be limited any way then.

Sorry for the late reply.

 

Basically the fact that you are not going to give up performance in order to meet the target. So you are going to spend tons of money on researching specific materials, lubricants and etc so that the performance of a 3,000 kms engine is the same as one of 600.

 

The first thing you have to bear in mind that given that batteries are still too heavy and MGU-K generation is physically limited AND Internal Combustion Engines are limited by the Carnot Cycle and the 100kgs/hr flow limit, basically you are just spending money researching all the way through.

 

If you could have 600kms engines (one per weekend) on the overall you would spend less money.



#53 HaydenFan

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Posted 11 July 2014 - 23:45

How much is it to actually build a single motor. Not the "Power Unit", just the internal combustion engine? 

 

To me it seems, like other have pointed out, that the research is where the costs actually lies. 



#54 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 00:55

HAHAHA! But it's true.

 

I'm all for modern technology and such, but F1 didn't needed to have such small, quiet engines. Nor does it need to "save" tyres & fuel and so on, nor to use less and less engines, become GREANER (god I hate this term!) etc. It's RACING for god sake! It should be about powerful, loud(er) engines, about drivers pushing to the limit! Not eco driving.

But think of the children!!



#55 chrcol

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 04:35

I think common sense needs applying.

 

enforce the rule to limit engine changes that are not due to breakdowns.

 

So e.g. if a team changes an engine before an event it counts as a change.

 

If a car stops on track during the race due to engine failure, its waived.


Edited by chrcol, 12 July 2014 - 04:36.


#56 Gorma

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 13:11

I wonder with the more strict rules at what point is it better to make a lighter and more powerful engine, change it for every race and take penalty. Look at Mercedes. They could win every race even with a grid penalty. 



#57 HoldenRT

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 13:31

Honda have always been famous for "lunching engines"..



#58 VolvoT5

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 13:53

That is a good point you make :up:

 

It just concerns me what will happen when grid penalties for extra units start getting dished out - maybe it won't be as bad as I imagine?

Can you imagine... last race of the championship and the points are all level.     All the contenders qualify close together but then one of the drivers gets a  10 place penalty because their engine need changing, something which is completely beyond their control. 

What a great way to spoil a championship climax. 

 

As someone else said in jest..... by 2020 they will get a season ban if they have to change an engine at all.    

 

I thought F1 was about racing not relevance to road cars.  I think it is crazy really, these new engines cost a fortune at a time when smaller teams in F1 have major money problems.  IMO they should have changed the aero regs and stuck with the V8 engines.   But instead of seeing the lunacy of their ways they are going further down the wrong path by continuing with this 4 engine rule. 


Edited by VolvoT5, 12 July 2014 - 13:54.


#59 Tombstone

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 14:45

Honda have always been famous for "lunching engines"..


No more so than Mercedes, Renault, etc. etc.

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#60 Clatter

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 16:58

I wonder with the more strict rules at what point is it better to make a lighter and more powerful engine, change it for every race and take penalty. Look at Mercedes. They could win every race even with a grid penalty. 

They can't just change engines in that manner, they also have to demonstrate that the engine etc. is actually damaged. 



#61 onewingedangel

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 18:54

Honda were burned on the V8 homologation by choosing an older proven design rather than a less reliable iteration that was more powerful and less thirsty. I'd imagine they are looking to take full advantage of 'reliability' updates to get around the freeze as much as possible.



#62 RedRabbit

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 19:37

How much is it to actually build a single motor. Not the "Power Unit", just the internal combustion engine? 

 

To me it seems, like other have pointed out, that the research is where the costs actually lies. 

 

This is it - the engines cost the same per year now as they did in the early 00's. The cost is not so much the engine itself, but the R&D to get there. This thing of the FIA to limit the number of engines per year would only be a cost saver if they keep the EXACT design for several seasons. It was only in the last couple seasons of the V8's that they started becoming cost effective. That took only 7 years to achieve :well:



#63 Watkins74

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 19:44

Engine that lasts 5 races. Around 20 hours then. 4 hours less than Le Mans. What's the problem?

 

What do you think they use for Practice and Qualifying? Their feet?



#64 Clatter

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Posted 12 July 2014 - 20:13

What do you think they use for Practice and Qualifying? Their feet?

How many hours do you think the engine is running for over a race weekend then?