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How to improve racing in Formula-1?


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Poll: How could racing be improved in F1? (114 member(s) have cast votes)

How could racing be improved in F1?

  1. More durable tyres (31 votes [10.51%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.51%

  2. More degrading tyres (10 votes [3.39%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.39%

  3. Reintroduction of refuelling during race (26 votes [8.81%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.81%

  4. More tests during the season (39 votes [13.22%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.22%

  5. Simplification of aerodynamics (63 votes [21.36%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.36%

  6. More room for engineers in terms of designing (51 votes [17.29%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.29%

  7. More engines in a season (44 votes [14.92%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.92%

  8. Another idea (31 votes [10.51%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.51%

Should a minimum time for pitstop set?

  1. Yes (16 votes [14.04%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.04%

  2. No (98 votes [85.96%])

    Percentage of vote: 85.96%

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#51 phoenix101

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 20:27

It's not very long. This is what you said about engine: "Free up the engine regulations. Max fuel flow and max fuel tank capacity are fine. Fuel flow per rpm is dumb. Spec V6 engine is dumb." And then, in reply to someone else, "The noise is a function of rpm, firing order, and exhaust design. Furthermore, the teams wouldn't be required to use turbocharging."

 

The composite of those posts caused you to inquire as to whether or not I support big-block engines in F1?



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#52 ClubmanGT

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 21:21

We've already got narrower track cars. Thats one of the reasons its an aero formula. If anything we need wider track. All we'll get is more understeer with narrower front track, nobody will be able to get round the corners. The teams will pile even more elements and cascade wings on looking for front downforce. 

 

OK, allow me to elaborate - wider rear tracks, narrower fronts and less downforce. The less downforce thing is a bit of a given really. 



#53 PlatenGlass

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 21:49

How do you slide an F1 car and not lose time ? That's utterly impossible.

On the sliding thing, there have been times in F1 when drivers have slid the cars around. I don't know if these are the best examples, but here's a couple of videos:


Rosberg was often sliding around in his Williams in the early 80s apparently not losing time. You might argue that it wasn't the quickest way, but there wasn't much in it certainly, and it was a competitive way of driving the car. No-one could do anything like that with today's cars. So yes, I would prefer cars that were more like that.

#54 Fastcake

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 22:26

On the sliding thing, there have been times in F1 when drivers have slid the cars around. I don't know if these are the best examples, but here's a couple of videos:

Rosberg was often sliding around in his Williams in the early 80s apparently not losing time. You might argue that it wasn't the quickest way, but there wasn't much in it certainly, and it was a competitive way of driving the car. No-one could do anything like that with today's cars. So yes, I would prefer cars that were more like that.

 

It may be more spectacular when F1 cars slide around, but it certainly is not the quickest way - which is to pile on so much downforce to take Eau Rouge flat. The F1 cars in those videos were only sliding because they did not have the aerodynamic grip that allows modern cars to go much quicker around a circuit. If you want them to slide again, you'll end up slowing down the cars.

 

Of course, if we were to greatly reduce downforce and accept slower cars it will most likely lead to better racing. But then we'll have to deal with all those who freak out when they look at the 2004 lap times, completely ignoring the fact that the racing was diabolically ****.



#55 PlatenGlass

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 22:41

It may be more spectacular when F1 cars slide around, but it certainly is not the quickest way - which is to pile on so much downforce to take Eau Rouge flat. The F1 cars in those videos were only sliding because they did not have the aerodynamic grip that allows modern cars to go much quicker around a circuit. If you want them to slide again, you'll end up slowing down the cars.
 
Of course, if we were to greatly reduce downforce and accept slower cars it will most likely lead to better racing. But then we'll have to deal with all those who freak out when they look at the 2004 lap times, completely ignoring the fact that the racing was diabolically ****.

I would say let these people freak out. The fact is that the F1 regulations could easily be made so that cars were too fast for the drivers to handle the g-forces, and this has been the case for years, so cars have always been held back speed-wise. The speed of F1 cars is as much determined by regulations as it is by the development of technology, so there's no reason to expect that they should just get faster and faster from year to year.

So I say reduce aerodynamic grip, and let them slide even if they are slower.

By the way, I wonder what would happen if another formula of racing with much less money in it decided to regulate in a way that meant the cars were faster than F1 cars? Would those in F1 feel compelled to change the technical regulations so that they were the fastest again? Should they do that, or should they just do their own thing? I suppose Indycars are faster in top speed, but I imagine not over a lap of an F1 circuit. (Sorry if this is too off topic.)

#56 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 08:05

The composite of those posts caused you to inquire as to whether or not I support big-block engines in F1?

 

Do I really have to repeat the whole thread? When you wrote about turbos not being required, I replied along the lines of "will not be required but used anyway", and you then mentioned not to assume displacement restriction. Which led me to believe you were expecting large-displacement engines to be preferred over or at at least to be competitive with small turbos. Is that so far out, following your replies? Maybe I am misunderstanding.



#57 sabjit

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 08:30

I have been in love with F1 since I was a small kid. I am probably the last person to criticize F1, but this year I think racing is really at a level where it cannot really be enjoyed. Without the technical issues Mercedes had we would have hardly seen any racing at the front, every time Mercedes run properly, they lock up the front by a country mile. The last three races were saved by Fernando ALonso who fought his heart out in his duells with Ricciardo and Vettel in Silvesrtone, Hockenheim and Budapest. My question is not concentrated on the current pecking order though.

 

In general how do you think racing could be improved?

 

This year’s German and Hungarian GP confirmed my belief again that the most important tool for providing exciting races in motorsport are the tyres.  You should forget trimming aerodinamical downforce because that is just a waste of time. You would never reach to a point where it is easy to get close enough to the car in front. Even in other series where downforce plays a part overtaking is hugely though task. This year FIA Formula-3 produced three dissapoitingly boring races on the Hungariing due to the lack of overtaking. Drivers in World Series by Renault also find it hard to overtaking rivals, but GP3 also suffer from on-track action. GP2 works well because of heavily degrading tyres and DTM found also a way to spice things up with an interesting tyre allocation of two compounds which show massive difference in grip level. Pirelli should reinvent their approach to racing with tyres which are still safe, but have a fairly high degradiation and thus allowing juicy strategies.

 

 

You can vote for more options, any ideas are warmly appreciated.  :wave:

 

A secondary question regarding safety: unsafe releases could be easily put aside if a minimum stationary time had been set. Let's say 5 seconds, if it were more than that teams would be forced even more to do less stops.

 

How dare you.

 

We have been treated to great race after great race this season.

 

Bahrain, Austria, Canada, Silverstone, Hockenheim and Hungary.

 

I thought we were past this myth that this season was boring and you come out and say this tripe?

 

Pathetic.



#58 Nonesuch

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 09:05

Remove the engine limiter and allow engine development

 

Allow a 2nd Tyre manufacturer to join, thus no cheese tyres as they will always be competing to produce the best they can.

 

I don't care much for old shifters, but more freedom seems like a great way to go. :up:

 

I still don't understand who thought it'd be a good idea to forbid development of the new engines during their first year... it seems everybody had deluded themselves into thinking they would have the best engine, and was hoping to get an advantage locked in.



#59 Kraken

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 09:31

Put them all in 1970's FF1600's and see who is actually the best driver.

All that would prove who is the best driver in a 1970 FF 1600. Not who is the best driver.



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#60 Boing 2

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 10:13

All that would prove who is the best driver in a 1970 FF 1600. Not who is the best driver.

 

Technically, all any season proves is who is the best driver in that seasons cars, as Vettel is showing this year, form isn't universally consistent.



#61 dweller23

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 10:28

I have been in love with F1 since I was a small kid. I am probably the last person to criticize F1, but this year I think racing is really at a level where it cannot really be enjoyed. Without the technical issues Mercedes had we would have hardly seen any racing at the front, every time Mercedes run properly, they lock up the front by a country mile. The last three races were saved by Fernando ALonso who fought his heart out in his duells with Ricciardo and Vettel in Silvesrtone, Hockenheim and Budapest. My question is not concentrated on the current pecking order though.

 

In general how do you think racing could be improved?

 

This year’s German and Hungarian GP confirmed my belief again that the most important tool for providing exciting races in motorsport are the tyres.  You should forget trimming aerodinamical downforce because that is just a waste of time. You would never reach to a point where it is easy to get close enough to the car in front. Even in other series where downforce plays a part overtaking is hugely though task. This year FIA Formula-3 produced three dissapoitingly boring races on the Hungariing due to the lack of overtaking. Drivers in World Series by Renault also find it hard to overtaking rivals, but GP3 also suffer from on-track action. GP2 works well because of heavily degrading tyres and DTM found also a way to spice things up with an interesting tyre allocation of two compounds which show massive difference in grip level. Pirelli should reinvent their approach to racing with tyres which are still safe, but have a fairly high degradiation and thus allowing juicy strategies.

 

 

You can vote for more options, any ideas are warmly appreciated.  :wave:

 

A secondary question regarding safety: unsafe releases could be easily put aside if a minimum stationary time had been set. Let's say 5 seconds, if it were more than that teams would be forced even more to do less stops.

FOM pls go.



#62 JHSingo

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 11:27

Where is the "I don't think any changes need to be made" option?

 

We've had some excellent races this year that I think things are fine as they are. If it wasn't for Mercedes being so dominant, the championship would be even more exciting.



#63 PlatenGlass

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 12:47

Technically, all any season proves is who is the best driver in that seasons cars, as Vettel is showing this year, form isn't universally consistent.

I suppose what you could do is have something like four completely different sets of technical specifications, so teams have to make four different types of car and have a quarter of the races in each. So one might be like an F1 car, another more like a touring car, another like a 1970s FF1600 etc. Then we would see who the versatile drivers were.*

*I'm not actually advocating this.

#64 phoenix101

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 13:32

Do I really have to repeat the whole thread? When you wrote about turbos not being required, I replied along the lines of "will not be required but used anyway", and you then mentioned not to assume displacement restriction. Which led me to believe you were expecting large-displacement engines to be preferred over or at at least to be competitive with small turbos. Is that so far out, following your replies? Maybe I am misunderstanding.

 

So when you think about a 2.4L V8 or a 3.0L V12, you think of a thundering big-block engine?



#65 Cyanide

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 13:34

Leave it alone. There's been too many changes recently, F1 needs stability of rules and the ones they have now are fine. Once Ferrari and Red Bull catch up to Merc, it'll be even better. 



#66 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 14:08

So when you think about a 2.4L V8 or a 3.0L V12, you think of a thundering big-block engine?

 

I thought the sarcasm was obvious, maybe I should have put a :cat:

So yeah, I don't think a 2.4L V8 or 3L V12 would be chosen over a small turbo. Not by teams who want to win, anyway.



#67 Seanspeed

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 14:32

FIA need to be more thoughtful of the DRS zone placement and length.

Other than that, I think in terms of the ability for the cars to race each other, things are quite good at the moment.

Edited by Seanspeed, 02 August 2014 - 14:32.


#68 Tsarwash

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 14:50

On the sliding thing, there have been times in F1 when drivers have slid the cars around. I don't know if these are the best examples, but here's a couple of videos:

Rosberg was often sliding around in his Williams in the early 80s apparently not losing time. You might argue that it wasn't the quickest way, but there wasn't much in it certainly, and it was a competitive way of driving the car. No-one could do anything like that with today's cars. So yes, I would prefer cars that were more like that.

I would love to see cars power sliding out of some corners, but in F1 it would never be the quickest way to go. Even if the tyres could cope with it, sliding means that you are getting less traction than a car that isn't sliding.

I think the racing in general is great this year, but the over regulation of the sport is slowly suffocating it. Charlie has done a great job, but it might be time for him to think about a younger, less cautious replacement. Remove Ferrari's veto if they still have it, treat ALL the teams the same, no matter what heritage they have, and make the sport affordable and accessible for the fans again. The sight of empty seats in Germany with a German Mercedes driver leading the championship was just shocking for me. But off topic of course.

#69 Kraken

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 16:27

I would love to see cars power sliding out of some corners, but in F1 it would never be the quickest way to go. Even if the tyres could cope with it, sliding means that you are getting less traction than a car that isn't sliding.

I think the racing in general is great this year, but the over regulation of the sport is slowly suffocating it. Charlie has done a great job, but it might be time for him to think about a younger, less cautious replacement. Remove Ferrari's veto if they still have it, treat ALL the teams the same, no matter what heritage they have, and make the sport affordable and accessible for the fans again. The sight of empty seats in Germany with a German Mercedes driver leading the championship was just shocking for me. But off topic of course.

It's more than Ferrari that is the problem. ALL the teams only look after themselves and constantly block anything that isn't their favour (FRIC, drivers weights, and many more over the years).

 

Until the teams start thinking about the long term good of the sport and less about short term gains for themselves there is always going to be conflicts and issues.

 

Also given how much people in motorsport cheat even when there is little at stake I can't see the regulations ever being relaxed. Give them an inch and they take a hundred miles even when they know it's wrong.



#70 RealRacing

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 17:07

Keep the same set of rules for the medium to long term, only refining certain things to make steps forward in the quality of racing. 

I'd like less dependence on technology, gadgets and fads: break-by-wire, DRS, complex energy recovery systems that reduce the direct car-driver connection; more go-cart, less Prius...

Either 2 or three well-differentiated tyre compounds that can be pushed hard for the duration of their window or only one type of tyre (with or without changes). Of course only one brand and no mandatory use of compounds (this should go without saying).

Refine aero at least to the point of reaching the original goals set for 2009.

Enough fuel to allow drivers to push as much as possible for a race duration.

No parc-ferme rules, excessive tyre limits, et. al > goal should be to let everyone qualify and race in the best conditions possible in order to maximize the probability of drivers racing on-track under as similar conditions as possible (mainly tyre and weight-wise).

Let drivers race, no TOs unless no mathematical possibility of WDC for second driver.

Less intervention by stewards if grass and gravel are brought back.

Allow smaller teams to be more competitive...



#71 Gyno

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 17:43

Start with the steering wheel.

Remove 90% of all the buttons switches on it.

 

DRS and these cheese tires needs to go.

Rear wing as it used to be low and wide front wing narrow and higher up.

Bring back Ground force and reduce downforce by 50%.

Wider tires and basicly anything that ads mechanical grip should be allowed.

 

Proper engines that rev high with no rev limiter, that only needs to last for 1 race weekend.

Proper tires that can be pushed hard on for more than 2 laps.

No fuel flow limits or any fuel limits.

Refueling allowed.

Proper 1 hour qualy session no lap limit.

 

All tracks that have tarmac run off needs to remove the tarmac and bring back gravel traps.

 

Fire Charlie Whiting and Bernie should go to jail where he belongs.



#72 demet06

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 17:52

The old H gate gear selector will never make a return as a missed manual change nearly always ended up with a blown engine due to over-revving. The modern gear changes are automatic apart from when the driver chooses to change gear and unless something goes seriously wrong with the mechanism or electronics, its a perfect gear change every time. With only 5 engines for a season and thousands and thousands of gear changes, its never coming back.

As for sliding in the corners, Michael Schumacher's technique was quite unique at the time. He always had a strong front end and let the rear rotate around the corner in full control. I believe Lewis has a similar technique. Keke Rosberg pretty much just went sideways round every corner he could, much to Patrick Heads dismay. He couldn't do it at McLaren with an understeering car built for Alain Prost and suffered for it.



#73 sabjit

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 18:11

No parc-ferme rules

 

It upsets me a forum with fans this dedicated STILL do not understand how important this rule is.

 

It is as though people want only 4 teams on the grid.



#74 Stickyrubber

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 18:41

Dare I suggest *slightly tongue in cheek* reverse grids from the previous race winner downwards? Look at the last two races with hamilton right at the back, albeit in a very fast race car, but what belters they have been!



#75 blub

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 19:28

I never thought I would say this but the big problem with F1 is one of its core values, advanced technology. I’m not that into the drivers I much prefer to see how the teams are working and how the different managers do their thing. MB is transcendent with the new technology, but they simply don’t know what they are doing on the management side, which is its own kind of fun, I will admit.

Teams have become high technology enterprises by default, this is not where a fun racing series is found. The minutia of aero and fuel flow and now conversion of engine braking into latent power might as well be happening on Mars, we get little from it. The end result of this refocused F1 is a lesser racing series. Teams and the FIA have lost the point of it all, the audience and a competitive race. Now, with F1 playing this political game of carbon relevance, with the fuel saving engine, F1 has transitioned into a social conscience racing series and away from a racing racing series. I want my entertainments to be separate from the rest of the world, I want them purely about entertainment on the same terms that have worked for 100 years. We have had great racing this year but people, for better or worse, look to the leader of a race and want to see the race there, for the most part it has not been there for years, Ferrari early 2000’s Red Bull in the last four years and now MB. There are some great races within a race, but it is important for that the ultimate race, the race for the win, have a greater competition.

Cut the technology development across the board and lets see what happens.
Another suggestion might be to not pay any teams from the money FOM gets, the only source of money (fuel for technology development) would come from team sponsorship or investment. Then FOM could offer shares to the public and all that money would be like a massive dividend (taxed lower) paid each year. Smart teams would just buy as much FOM stock as they could and get, this would be how they get their money, putting the profits in their pockets with no incentives to spend it on the team. This would also allow FOM to charge less to the promoters and tickets etc, enlarging the fan base, and in turn making more money.

The second thing I would do is pass a regulation which mandated that each team submit all their technological developments to a public forum on the FIA web site every six months. There would be much less incentive to spend crazy money on technology just to go one tenth faster if your competitors could use both their developments AND every other teams developments for free, twice a year.

I love the whole technology side of F1 and Sailing, but it has gone too far on several fronts and they seem so deep in they cant see that its taking away from the broader competition side of the total series.



#76 Radion

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 20:16

I think saftey cars can make races quite interesting as we saw in hungary.

There has got to be a way to get them deployed more often.

 

Maybe Flavio will have a good idea on that matter?



#77 RealRacing

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 02:26

It upsets me a forum with fans this dedicated STILL do not understand how important this rule is.

 

It is as though people want only 4 teams on the grid.

Is there an argument in your post? Something to, you know, contribute to the discussion?



#78 sabjit

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 10:42

Is there an argument in your post? Something to, you know, contribute to the discussion?

 

If you do not have Parc Ferme, you end up with teams bringing separate qualifying cars and race cars. This sends costs sky high. Parc Ferme is the most effective cost control rule we have. We literally cannot afford to get rid of it unless you want only 4 teams left on the grid.



#79 RealRacing

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 15:59

If you do not have Parc Ferme, you end up with teams bringing separate qualifying cars and race cars. This sends costs sky high. Parc Ferme is the most effective cost control rule we have. We literally cannot afford to get rid of it unless you want only 4 teams left on the grid.

No parc-ferme rules dos not mean allowing the use of different cars. It simply means that cars that start in front should not, artificially, be made less-competitive. In other words, let all the cars adjust settings so that they are ideal for qualifying and then the race.



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#80 Kraken

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 07:45

Bin DRS,ERS,KERS,Fuel Limits and other pathetic gimmicks.

 

Remove the engine limiter and allow engine development

 

Allow a 2nd Tyre manufacturer to join, thus no cheese tyres as they will always be competing to produce the best they can.

 

Ban paddle-shift seamless gearboxes, return to manual H pattern gearboxes.  (more exciting to watch, plus it challenges the driver, someone can miss a gear which will give the following car an advantage.

So what happens when several other open wheel formulas then return faster lap times than F1?

 

H pattern gearboxes are hopelessly outdated. Even touring cars use sequential levers. Shall we go back to shirt sleeves and leather helmets as well?

 

The lack of a 2nd tyre manufacturer is more to do with no company wanting to be involved that way more than anything else. When there are two the only publicity that either gets is negative when a driver says he lost the race because his tyres weren't as good as the other guys.

 

Opening up engine development is going to cause a massive amount of spending.



#81 kraduk

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 14:12

I voted "other".....remove pits - car radios. That way the drivers are on their own without the teams telling them what to do...conserve fuel / tyres, alter settings, issue team orders etc.  OK, they could revert back to pit boards and be limited to what they can "tell" the drivers each lap but they won't be able to have a conversation....if the driver feels something wrong with his car, he'll have to pit then tell his race engineer / mechanics...... 

 

along my line on thinking. Ban all two way telemetry, output fine as it can be useful for tv, but dont let the engineers have it. Allow only safety related radois chatter and thats it. Pit boards ok



#82 sabjit

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 15:10

No parc-ferme rules dos not mean allowing the use of different cars. It simply means that cars that start in front should not, artificially, be made less-competitive. In other words, let all the cars adjust settings so that they are ideal for qualifying and then the race.

 

You continue to fail to realize how astronomically expensive that is.

 

Seriously, just think about the implications of what you are saying.



#83 MikeV1987

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 15:16

drs isn't going anywhere, i would like to see 3 car teams though.

 

having the extra driver in the merc, rb, williams, ferrari, etc would make the fight for the front end a little more interesting. i certainly wouldn't mind seeing 3 mercs challenging for the win this season.


Edited by MikeV1987, 04 August 2014 - 15:17.


#84 pizzalover

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 15:37

Reverse order grids based on WDC positions.



#85 RealRacing

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 17:16

You continue to fail to realize how astronomically expensive that is.

 

Seriously, just think about the implications of what you are saying.

Seriously, back up your stuff...



#86 MAMBA

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 18:10

Personally, This season has been very exciting and I feel no need to improve the Formula. Once other teams catch up to the Mercs we will have one hell of a season.

 

But on topic, I was wondering if ground effect will not improve racing for those who feel it needs improving. Ground effect would give the cars lots of down force by using the cars underside so the designers would not have to design very complex wings to get the needed down force for the cars. The wings will thus be used to steer the air around the car rather than down force and air steering. Do not get me wrong, the wings will still be designed to provide down force but the cars will have a much cleaner wake of air than they do now since the wings will not play such a crucial part in the total down force of the car as they do now.

 

This brings me to a second point. Give the designers more freedom. We will much more close up racing if teams are allowed to improve their cars. Now they can only do some tweaks, not some serious designing so the pecking order does not change radically, if at all

 

I would like to see tyres that last a bit longer in giving their top performance but the current tyres do not bother me in any way really.

 

The racing is good but these are my ideas as to building better cars to do the racing.

 

MAMBA



#87 F1 Mike

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 21:03

enough has been done. no more meddling.



#88 Atreiu

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Posted 04 August 2014 - 21:42

If you do not have Parc Ferme, you end up with teams bringing separate qualifying cars and race cars. This sends costs sky high. Parc Ferme is the most effective cost control rule we have. We literally cannot afford to get rid of it unless you want only 4 teams left on the grid.

 

I'd argue that what best prevents teams from building qualifying specials isn't parc ferme, but limiting the number of engines/gearboxes/parts they use a season. For example, even if parc ferme were eliminated but teams limited to 5 PUs, nobody would show up at Monza with a qualifying rocket if they were forced to race it and also had to manage PUs for another 7 GPs.

 

OTOH, perhaps parc ferme's greatest virtue (with a helping hand from the imposed curfews) is simply allowing mechanics a decent night of sleep saturday to sunday.



#89 George Costanza

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 00:40

Go back to the 1997 regulations. The 1997 cars were lovely; they weren't narrow like we see today.


Edited by George Costanza, 05 August 2014 - 00:45.


#90 travbrad

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 01:30

Go back to the 1997 regulations. The 1997 cars were lovely; they weren't narrow like we see today.

 

I agree the cars looked better then (although 1997 is far from the height of F1 aesthetics), but the racing was boring compared to this season (I've even watched a couple 1997 snoozers fairly recently)



#91 George Costanza

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 02:39

I agree the cars looked better then (although 1997 is far from the height of F1 aesthetics), but the racing was boring compared to this season (I've even watched a couple 1997 snoozers fairly recently)

 

it was a different type of F1.

My ideal F1 season would be 2000. Racing was excellent that season.

 

This season is largely because of MGP drivers battle, and among RBR drivers battle too; but the cars can't compare, IMO. It has been a fairly fun season to watch, but just wish the cars are better in power and looks.


Edited by George Costanza, 05 August 2014 - 02:41.


#92 Bleu

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 09:02

If Adrian Newey (or any other top designer) was asked to build a car that fits the rules used in "year x" I'm sure it would be much faster than what they were back then.



#93 Hans V

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 09:56

I agree totally in banning DRS etc. Most of all they should reduce downforce and aerodynamic dependence a lot - also to save big money. I'd do the following:

 

- Full Width cars (2000 mm) as pre 1996 for looks.

- Lower noses for better crash protection and simpler aero.

- Narrower and smaller single element front wings, less sensitive for the car in front and a lot cheaper.

- Single or twin-element rear wing, for less aero depence and lower cots.

- Allow for some underbody venturi-effect, to have more downforce in center of car that cannot be interrupted by the car in front. Think nineties Champ-cars. 

- Narrower front tyres - forces harder rubber and higher slip-angel.

- Wider rear tyres, for increased mechanical grip - and more drag.

- Standard steel suspension, to save costs.

- No telemetry.

- No driver to pit communication.

 

Actually most of these suggestions aren't mine but Gordon Murrays. So I'd suggest he makes the tech-regulations and they hire Zac Brown as Commercial Director.  



#94 bobellsmore

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Posted 23 August 2014 - 20:09

I have been in love with F1 since I was a small kid. I am probably the last person to criticize F1, but this year I think racing is really at a level where it cannot really be enjoyed. Without the technical issues Mercedes had we would have hardly seen any racing at the front, every time Mercedes run properly, they lock up the front by a country mile. The last three races were saved by Fernando ALonso who fought his heart out in his duells with Ricciardo and Vettel in Silvesrtone, Hockenheim and Budapest. My question is not concentrated on the current pecking order though.

 

In general how do you think racing could be improved?

 

I fell in love with F1 when I was a not-so-small kid and Graham Hill was driving the stack pipe BRM. Having stayed with F1 all that time I feel reasonably qualified to argue that the current state of F1 racing is about as good as its ever been. I don't accept that, this year, we have hardly seen any racing at the front except when Mercedes have had problems. Lewis and Nico have had some pretty intense battles when both Mercs have run properly.

We have had some pretty good battles this year -- either because of drivers qualifying wildly out of position or two or three battling over the minor places. It has been noticeable over the last few years that the TV director is no longer afraid to ignore a run-away leader in favour of showing what actual RACING is going on. The coverage of the German GP was a particularly example of this.

One thing, head and shoulders above all else, that gets me jumping up and down and shouting at the box in excitement is classy overtaking. I don't care whether it's for 1st place or 21st place - good classy overtaking is what I watch F1 for.

As Ed Straw makes clear this week, and Lewis has proved (too many times) this year, mixed up grids make for good racing.

I would love to see F1 races started in reverse order of current WDC standing. It would still be important (essential?) to have an excellent car but the WDC could only be won by a proper RACING driver. Clearly some details would have to be fleshed out. I would suggest for example that the previous year's finishing order be used for the first three races of the season, with the rookies starting right at the back - I don't think it fair on anyone that Max Verstappen starts the Australian GP from pole!
 



#95 ardbeg

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Posted 24 August 2014 - 02:46

Racing this season is better than it has been for a long, long time. The only problem is that Merc has something the others has not, whatever it is, that makes them superior. But the racing itself, is one ignore who is winning, has been superior.

 

If anything needs to be changed it is the engine freeze, it is stupid to make completely new regs for the power unit and then freeze development on the before the first race has been run since whatever advantage, and disadvantage, someone has at the start of the season will be kept for years.



#96 MAMBA

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Posted 25 August 2014 - 19:28

Following the VERY exiting Spa race Sunday some people have gone mad and tried to do away with front wings just because of a little bit of contact. I do however not want to comment on the "ban front wings" forum because my ideas are much better represented here.

  1. Do not do away with front wings keep them. reduce their width however to 1400-1500mm. The wings MUST however only consist of two "tiers" and all other bits of aero on the wing is banned.
  2. track width of the wheels are increased to 2000mm and wheel with increased to 365mm and 390mm for the front and rear wheels respectively. The wider wheelbase combined with the narrower front wing will greatly reduce the possibility of designers from using the wings to direct air around the wheels like they do now. Wider wheels also give better mechanical grip but they are not that much more wider than current ones though.
  3. Bodywork between front and rear wheels width increased to 1600mm and step plane lowered from 50mm to 30mm. The teams will thus be able to be slightly more creative with the bottom of the cars. Diffuser regulations kept except they are increased in with to say 1200mm.
  4. Rear wing width also increased to 1100mm. We increase their width to compensate for less overall down force in front of the care. Lots of down force sucking the car down in all corners which equals faster lap times. Strait line speed will be dealt with as the Hybrid engines development advances.

These changes should be much cheaper to implement and do not require some serious modification to the current regulations. The teams will stop spending money on the wings for down force but could make up for the loss by being more creative with the bottom of the cars... :cool: The essence of formula one is racing and technological advance. Keep the core but tweak some finer details.

 

MAMBA


Edited by MAMBA, 25 August 2014 - 19:29.