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Perez: Force India equal to Mclaren in Engineering


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#1 eronrules

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 17:34

ouch ... Ron Dennis won't be pleased,  Matrix Revolution  :lol:

 

F1: Perez says Force India equal to McLaren

 

Perez reckons the quality of staff at Siverstone-based Force India is a match for its Woking rival, despite a relative lack of infrastructure and resources.

 

 

"All of the engineers are top class – the same level as McLaren, and McLaren is rated as having probably the best engineers in the sport."

 

Perez thinks Force India's lack of resources can sometimes help the team by forcing it to focus on the basics of racing, rather than getting wrapped up in complex data and engineering.

 

"In a way, things are a lot more simple," Perez added. "They focus purely on performance and everyone is [always] trying to maximize everything."

 

 

in a way, i agree with Checo P. Mclaren along with Williams have always prided themselves as the pioneers of technological innovations in F1. but seeing Mclarens forrays into development 'Cul De Sac' for last couple of years chasing WT numbers and simulations and going nowhere reminds me of Williams BMW era from 00-04. they had the engine to challenge ferrari and macca then, but the chasis was a let down. i remember the walrus nose too, same with octopus exhaust of mclaren.



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#2 pacificquay

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 17:42

He doesn't really mean what the headline suggests and what people will interpret from it

#3 Risil

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 18:00

He doesn't really mean what the headline suggests and what people will interpret from it

 

Even if he does it's a sensible comment. Given the team's results it shouldn't be a surprise that Force India has very talented engineers. Pound for pound, if that concept applies to F1, Force India's management is getting more out of them. Like Perez implies, more resources can quickly see diminishing returns if you don't direct your engineers' efforts effectively.

 

File this one under "he would say that, wouldn't he", but Pat Symonds was illuminating on this point in Motor Sport magazine's last podcast. He pointed out, totally accurately, that the same engineers built this year's Williams car and last year's disaster on wheels. The difference (along with the Mercedes engine) came down to hard-to-quantify management skills like making sure everyone was focused on the overall car and not doing their own thing chasing optimal numbers on their own section of their car. Or something. When a team employs 50+ aerodynamicists it's easy to see how mind-boggling amounts of money could be thrown to the wind(tunnel).


Edited by Risil, 08 August 2014 - 18:01.


#4 KavB

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 18:50

Force India are actually better at the moment if you compare the difference in resources. 



#5 LuckyStrike1

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 18:53

Force India 98 points

McLaren 97 points

 

So they are at least better than McLaren at something in F1 right now. 



#6 bogi

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 18:59

I was always wondering why any big team didnt poach Andy Green (Force India Technical director).

 



#7 Atreiu

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 19:26

Great. Now shut up and drive. Beat your teammate. Etc.



#8 f1RacingForever

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 20:27

Seems like sour grapes from getting canned. Still think it was harsh for him to be let go by Mclaren. Magnussen is doing no better.



#9 oetzi

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 21:23

Not sure why anyone's giving him the hand-off on this.

 

Over the past couple of years, what's to say he's wrong?



#10 warp

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 21:33

Seems like sour grapes from getting canned. Still think it was harsh for him to be let go by Mclaren. Magnussen is doing no better.

 

Or just a pat in the back to his engineers... 

 

The interview does not quote the context or why he said these. Was any need to mention McLaren, was it asked like that or he simply used them as benchmark to put his engineers on a high?

 

However, it goes on on a few opinions that are quite frank, taking the blame for his bonehead moves and praising the team. I think he is speaking the truth, though.

 

But hey, I'm Mexican so, whatever.  :lol:



#11 spacekid

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 21:36

F1 driver praises current team in press.

Bears also shit in woods.

Whatever next?

#12 RedRabbit

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 21:54

F1 driver praises current team in press.

Bears also shit in woods.

Whatever next?

Yip. gotta ask yourself, would he have said something similar if FI weren't beating McLaren this year? Or of McLaren in 2012. Just the usual old PR tosh.



#13 f1RacingForever

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 23:39

Or just a pat in the back to his engineers... 

 

The interview does not quote the context or why he said these. Was any need to mention McLaren, was it asked like that or he simply used them as benchmark to put his engineers on a high?

 

However, it goes on on a few opinions that are quite frank, taking the blame for his bonehead moves and praising the team. I think he is speaking the truth, though.

 

But hey, I'm Mexican so, whatever.  :lol:

Yeah it think you are right. I still sense some resentment though



#14 warp

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 01:01

Yeah it think you are right. I still sense some resentment though

 

I can see where you are getting to and I can only say that I would not be as elegant as Checo when mentioning McLaren but that's probably why I'm behind a desk and not at the wheel of an F1 :lol:



#15 turssi

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 01:29

Good level headed quotes from Sérgio. Force India is a good team.

#16 sopa

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 08:25

File this one under "he would say that, wouldn't he", but Pat Symonds was illuminating on this point in Motor Sport magazine's last podcast. He pointed out, totally accurately, that the same engineers built this year's Williams car and last year's disaster on wheels. The difference (along with the Mercedes engine) came down to hard-to-quantify management skills like making sure everyone was focused on the overall car and not doing their own thing chasing optimal numbers on their own section of their car. Or something. When a team employs 50+ aerodynamicists it's easy to see how mind-boggling amounts of money could be thrown to the wind(tunnel).

 

That's a pretty good insight. As the saying goes "you need to work as a team". Easier said than done though, especially with such a colossal amount of workforce in F1 teams. I suspect it is the case with both current Ferrari and McLaren - very big teams with lots of personnel, but lack a bit of ability/skill/wisdom to maximize the talents of all those people properly.



#17 MikeV1987

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 08:53

F1 driver praises current team in press.

Bears also shit in woods.

Whatever next?

LOL

 

sums it up for me as well.



#18 spacekid

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 09:28

Good level headed quotes from Sérgio. Force India is a good team.


I won't argue with that, I've always had a quiet admiration for the Northamptonshire team going back to their Jordan days. They're doing a good job.

#19 Jon83

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 15:18

Non-story. 



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#20 Risil

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 15:55

Non-story. 

 

It's up for dispute whether what Sergio Perez says is important or not, but the fact that Force India (and Williams, for that matter) have built a better car than Mclaren is definitely a story.


Edited by Risil, 09 August 2014 - 15:55.


#21 pathogen

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 17:04

it is curious, a lot people has been wrote tons of words in Mc Laren threads regard the low profile on technical department. Nevertheless, Perez think both teams has equal level... confused for me.



#22 Jon83

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 17:26

It's up for dispute whether what Sergio Perez says is important or not, but the fact that Force India (and Williams, for that matter) have built a better car than Mclaren is definitely a story.

 

That's another matter though. 



#23 givemeabettercar

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Posted 09 August 2014 - 17:47

He is probably right and is also a way better driver than Magnussen IMO.


Edited by givemeabettercar, 09 August 2014 - 17:47.


#24 Paco

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 14:52

F1 driver praises current team in press.

Bears also shit in woods.

Whatever next?


I don't see it that way at all. Plus, he's in a much better to comment then yourself..

He simply is stating that even though McLaren are often seen as having the best engineers and best facilities etc... Other teams have equally as good engineers.. Except that with limited resources are not lost in mindless amounts of data and competing viewpoints of so many engineers and simply get on with fundamentals of racing and the results show how you can achieve the same result without all the complications as proof in that they are evenly matched and probably ahead of mclaren.

Of course I'd praise my team too.. Probably half the budget and employee and equal result... Damn good.

#25 BRG

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 20:01

Magnussen is doing no better.

 

 

He is probably right and is also a way better driver than Magnussen IMO.

Hmmm, Magnussen, a rookie is on 37 points after only 11 races in F1, whilst Perez, in his third year in F1 could only manage 49 points over the whole 19 races of the  2013 season.  I'd say Kevin shows a lot more potential than Sergio - and probably isn't alienating McLaren in the way Sergio is said to have done.



#26 warp

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 21:57

Hmmm, Magnussen, a rookie is on 37 points after only 11 races in F1, whilst Perez, in his third year in F1 could only manage 49 points over the whole 19 races of the  2013 season.  I'd say Kevin shows a lot more potential than Sergio - and probably isn't alienating McLaren in the way Sergio is said to have done.

 

 

Sergio has to learn how to finish ALL races and let go a position or two, and that law of physics that indicate that two mass bodies can not occupy the same space.

He is quick, he can really take care of his car/tyres but he is boneheaded at times. Still, fun to watch and he is a true racing driver that always go for a gap even if the gap is not big enough.  :lol:



#27 givemeabettercar

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 23:32

Hmmm, Magnussen, a rookie is on 37 points after only 11 races in F1, whilst Perez, in his third year in F1 could only manage 49 points over the whole 19 races of the  2013 season.  I'd say Kevin shows a lot more potential than Sergio - and probably isn't alienating McLaren in the way Sergio is said to have done.

 

Magnussen IMO is benefiting from attrition(he hasn't been impressive outside of Australia and maybe Silvestone), that is a thing that basically was none of it last year, and if you take in consideration that Mclaren was crap and Checo couldn't have done much.



#28 taran

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 12:03

Hmmm, Magnussen, a rookie is on 37 points after only 11 races in F1, whilst Perez, in his third year in F1 could only manage 49 points over the whole 19 races of the  2013 season.  I'd say Kevin shows a lot more potential than Sergio - and probably isn't alienating McLaren in the way Sergio is said to have done.

 

Oh, come on BRG. You know better than to compare seasons like that. Circumstances and seasonal competitiveness change, what matters is how well a driver does considering....

 

I'd say Perez needed half a season to get his bearings at McLaren and then started matching and/or beating Button.

Magnussen is more or less doing the same. He certainly hasn't shown himself to be an instant Button-killer. So McLaren haven't gained anything except a driver for the long term and Perez could also have provided that....



#29 Kraken

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 13:42

The staff might be as good but it doesn't mean anything if you don't have access to the technology and resources to utilise that talent.



#30 Mauseri

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Posted 17 August 2014 - 21:34

The staff might be as good but it doesn't mean anything if you don't have access to the technology and resources to utilise that talent.

Yes but if you have too much technology you can get lost with it and I think that was his point about McLaren and their lack of form.



#31 OvDrone

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Posted 17 August 2014 - 21:49

Better go and ask Jo Ramirez.