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Talking Heads Killing F1 Television Viewersship


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#1 nicholasaint

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 02:19

Bernie, Luca, et al complain about the lack of sound from this crop of F1 cars???? They could be running 24,000 RPM V-16s and it wouldn't make a hoot of difference. The announcers just love to hear themselves talk; usually inane nonsense, faulty assumptions, blah blah blah. The video is great, but these idiots rattle on incessantly and we never get to hear the drivers making music with their engines and gearboxes. 

 

If any communication ought to be banned, it's this stream of b.s. we are subjected to in lieu of the sound of the racing machines being played by the drivers. 

 

The USA has to be the worst in this regard, and it's been the same for years... different networks, same crew. Ugh.

 



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#2 loki

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 02:28

That's too bad, i love the Talking Heads.  Didn't know they were into F1...

 

 



#3 bourbon

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 02:33

Bernie, Luca, et al complain about the lack of sound from this crop of F1 cars???? They could be running 24,000 RPM V-16s and it wouldn't make a hoot of difference. The announcers just love to hear themselves talk; usually inane nonsense, faulty assumptions, blah blah blah. The video is great, but these idiots rattle on incessantly and we never get to hear the drivers making music with their engines and gearboxes. 

 

If any communication ought to be banned, it's this stream of b.s. we are subjected to in lieu of the sound of the racing machines being played by the drivers. 

 

The USA has to be the worst in this regard, and it's been the same for years... different networks, same crew. Ugh.

 

If you get the USA feed (which I agree is terrible now) you can at least have just the sweet sound of engines for P1 and P3 if you watch it on NBC LiveExtra (on your PC or any device if you have cable).

 

I agree though, they need to allow a little more time for engine noise - and also try to be relevant rather than gossipy.  It really does get old.  Those dudes on NBC are all Brits and can't help their natural bias.  It is very annoying.  I usually turn them down and listen to the Brits on the App feed because at least I know what I am in for.


Edited by bourbon, 20 September 2014 - 02:33.


#4 loki

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 02:38

If you get the USA feed (which I agree is terrible now) you can at least have just the sweet sound of engines for P1 and P3 if you watch it on NBC LiveExtra (on your PC or any device if you have cable).

 

I agree though, they need to allow a little more time for engine noise - and also try to be relevant rather than gossipy.  It really does get old.  Those dudes on NBC are all Brits and can't help their natural bias.  It is very annoying.  I usually turn them down and listen to the Brits on the App feed because at least I know what I am in for.

Someone better tell Diffey... :drunk:   He's from Brisbane.



#5 jonpollak

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 03:35

So then....

I was doing a David Byrne tour a few years ago and he asked me if I could plan a tour GoKart race!!

"Sure David...." I said and off we went to F1Boston.  Surprise Surprise... he's a tremendous racer.

Kicked everyone to the curb with his P1 qualifying and walked the race with no challenge to him whatsoever.

 

For the next week we all were given racer names. The hotels would freak out when they read the rooming list.

One hotel in NJ called their press officer in to interview Jackie Stewart and Danica Patrick!!!

 

Alas, it was only the rock band staying under bogus names.

 

Jp



#6 bourbon

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 03:46

Someone better tell Diffey... :drunk:   He's from Brisbane.

 

True, my bad.  But the point still applies since they tend to share the same biases. 


Edited by bourbon, 20 September 2014 - 03:47.


#7 HoldenRT

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 04:50

I guess that means I should like Diffey but never have, hard to tolerate.  The only time I liked him for a brief moment was when Russell Ingall once called the "Difster", but that was more a funny moment/nickname than the guy himself.

 

OP had an interesting point.  And they need to shut up and enjoy it while they can because every few years the sound gets worse and maybe one day, there won't be any sound at all.  And it'll be like Formula E.

 

Needs more onboards.  Needs less talking.



#8 blub

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 05:04

Its so easy to get sucked into being distracted by the announcers, in fact its almost impossible not to, the folk that do the broadcast really should consider this. I think we should first recognize that these folks are being encouraged to behave the way they behave, so in their world they are doing a good job, the fact that they can be so immune from what the audience feels is kind of shocking, but its true.

There are two general rules to understand when considering the whole announcer mess, 1) they are part of the media (I work in the media) which means they look at the audience as dumb,  2) (this is critical) sport and news broadcasting come from the same general background, radio. Folks, radio is THE fundamental reason why the announcers talk incessantly. The rule in radio was, NEVER EVER let there be dead air, ALWAYS talk NO MATTER WHAT! Clear your voice, mumble, ruffle papers and make noise on the desk,  if there is silence you will be fired. In TV the rule is NEVER have a black screen and never have silence, have a bad shot, a moving camera anything but a blank screen and silence. The radio rules have been killing TV for years and it actually seems like it wont end soon.

The broadcast executives have constructed a view of how a show works with one announcer providing this another one providing that etc, one of these guys is the designated talker, they make sure there is NEVER any dead air, (an engine sound would count as dead are because, the audience is dumb and needs to have their hand held throughout) For SKY its Crofty, for BBC it was Walker and for NBC its Diffey. I detest all three in large part because I hear them saying I am stupid and need their help. F off guys. If we were to talk to these guys, including the sports executives they would see we     know the game and don’t need the talk, but they would just say to us, but your the exception, we have to reach everyone and most of them are dumb, so, sorry but we are going to do it exactly the way they did it 80 years ago in radio. I guess you wont get fired if you do things the way the last guy did the same thing, so here we are, post radio and they wont stop.

There is one other important invisible issue, the announcers get paid well, the executives want them to earn their pay, and talk, drive the emotional level of the audience, force the audience to be more engaged etc. We are so screwed when we want to hear the race.



#9 Nonesuch

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 07:06

2) (this is critical) sport and news broadcasting come from the same general background, radio. Folks, radio is THE fundamental reason why the announcers talk incessantly. The rule in radio was, NEVER EVER let there be dead air, ALWAYS talk NO MATTER WHAT!

 

Excellent point. :up: A lot of the commentators shouting inane things about the events that are clearly visible on the screen seem to have convinced themselves that they are still on the radio.

 

While I can see how some would consider the German RTL crew to be somewhat boring, I tend to only leave it during commercials, as I can't bear watching the BBC broadcast for an entire race. The English have actually saw fit to divide the commentary into 'expert' and 'flavour' roles, with the latter being a different word for frequent cringe worthy screaming.

 

Commentary across all sports could be immensely improved by following a simple rule: if it's on the screen, don't tell us. Whether that's a mistake, a spin, a fastest lap graphic, a pitstop time, or anything else.


Edited by Nonesuch, 20 September 2014 - 07:07.


#10 nicholasaint

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Posted 20 September 2014 - 10:42

If you get the USA feed (which I agree is terrible now) you can at least have just the sweet sound of engines for P1 and P3 if you watch it on NBC LiveExtra (on your PC or any device if you have cable).

 

I agree though, they need to allow a little more time for engine noise - and also try to be relevant rather than gossipy.  It really does get old.  Those dudes on NBC are all Brits and can't help their natural bias.  It is very annoying.  I usually turn them down and listen to the Brits on the App feed because at least I know what I am in for.

Thank you for the heads up re P1 and P3. Loving it.



#11 Lotus72b

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 11:28

I remember when I started watching Formula 1. When the cars were lining up on the grid. Bob Varsha used to say turn the volume up and let's get ready for the standing start. That was sweet. Another race I remember was 1986 Detroit when the cars lining up on the grid. Ken Squier said something and everybody went quiet and the engines do the talking. Now just talking before the lights go out. I'll be yelling to tv screen to shutup. I don't know, at least the older annoucers know when to be quiet at certain times.



#12 noikeee

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 11:49

F1 is an inherently complicated sport, but I do often wish the commentators would shut up for a while, stop mentioning every single tiny minor detail and try to bring most of the attention to the main story of the race. Often feels like "who's gonna win" gets buried way deep below "which tyres Marcus Ericsson is on", "are the Toro Rossos on a 3-stop strategy", "is car #19 under investigation for speeding in the pits", "do the rule changes regarding radio communications include brake temps warnings", "will Hulkenberg undercut Magnussen for P7", "is Grosjean running out of ICE advanced power units allocations or EBDs or PTSDs" etc etc etc. Yeah that's all vaguely interesting for a guy like me who's followed the sport for 20 years, but the guy casually switching channels is gonna be bored out of his mind.



#13 Option1

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 18:11

"Killing F1 Television Viewershipsship" (sic).  Really?  Over-reaction much?

 

:rotfl:

 

Neil



#14 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 18:14

I remember when I started watching Formula 1. When the cars were lining up on the grid. Bob Varsha used to say turn the volume up and let's get ready for the standing start. That was sweet. Another race I remember was 1986 Detroit when the cars lining up on the grid. Ken Squier said something and everybody went quiet and the engines do the talking. Now just talking before the lights go out. I'll be yelling to tv screen to shutup. I don't know, at least the older annoucers know when to be quiet at certain times.

 

Well back then things actualy happened during a standing start. Now there's more variety in the launches when they leave for the formation lap...



#15 Nemo1965

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 20:49

I have been playing to promote this idea: The Sport Shut Up Clock.

4e8HFcS.jpg

 

It works like this: every time there is actual footage of the sport in question on screen (cars driving, balls being hit over the net, players plucking their strings, whatever, sport is sport), the director of the sports-broadcast presses the button 'Sport'.  The clock starts ticking then. When there is not sport on screen (because there is an interview with someone or a commercial or a view of a drivers girlfriend in the pits), the 'Sport' button is pressed 'off' again. Time stops ticking.

 

The 'Talk' button is the same. Every time any of the commentators start talking, the 'Talk' clock starts ticking. Any time there is no talk, the 'Talk' clock stops ticking.

 

And here is the rub: never should the time of the Talk-clock be higher than that of the Sport-Clock. Otherwise, automatically, the microphones of the pundits is switched off.

 

So... who wants to invest?



#16 sabjit

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 21:01

I have been playing to promote this idea: The Sport Shut Up Clock.

4e8HFcS.jpg

 

It works like this: every time there is actual footage of the sport in question on screen (cars driving, balls being hit over the net, players plucking their strings, whatever, sport is sport), the director of the sports-broadcast presses the button 'Sport'.  The clock starts ticking then. When there is not sport on screen (because there is an interview with someone or a commercial or a view of a drivers girlfriend in the pits), the 'Sport' button is pressed 'off' again. Time stops ticking.

 

The 'Talk' button is the same. Every time any of the commentators start talking, the 'Talk' clock starts ticking. Any time there is no talk, the 'Talk' clock stops ticking.

 

And here is the rub: never should the time of the Talk-clock be higher than that of the Sport-Clock. Otherwise, automatically, the microphones of the pundits is switched off.

 

So... who wants to invest?

 

Give_that_man_a_cookie.png



#17 InfectedPsy

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 21:05

Crofty needs to go, seriously feel like punching this guy in the face.

 

Seriously, there's too much NLP, fear mongering and bias, he's a Lewis fan, nothing wrong with that, but the crap he talks about other teams and driver's is a joke. He also sticks it to your face in a subtle way, he'll talk about a hotel, then tell you how expensive it is, in other words he lets you know that you can't afford and that he is a superstar.

 

Bring back Murray Walker.



#18 DanardiF1

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 23:11

I thought it was Bernie's big (law)suit that was damaging F1's image, not David Byrne's?



#19 goingthedistance

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Posted 23 September 2014 - 23:36

I made a conscious decision last race to just watch the onboards as much as I could all weekend. What a joy! Less Croft = much more pleasurable experience.

Ben Edwards is no better, he shouts incessantly and speaks even faster. I agree with the OP, less talking please. Instead of talking non stop I wish they'd take a breath and think about what's going on strategically, as well as getting the simple things right like which driver is doing what.

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#20 tomjol

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 00:12



Crofty needs to go, seriously feel like punching this guy in the face.

 

Seriously, there's too much NLP, fear mongering and bias, he's a Lewis fan, nothing wrong with that, but the crap he talks about other teams and driver's is a joke. He also sticks it to your face in a subtle way, he'll talk about a hotel, then tell you how expensive it is, in other words he lets you know that you can't afford and that he is a superstar.

 

Bring back Murray Walker.

 

I'm generally fairly tolerant of Crofty, in part due to memories of the horror that was Legard, and in part due to the only alternative in the form of Ben Edwards (had to watch Monza on the Beeb, by the end of the first lap I wanted to throw things).

 

However, he really did my head in on Sunday. He doesn't need to fill all of the time with endless hypotheses which are so ridiculous that Brundle no longer deigns even to acknowledge them.



#21 InSearchOfThe

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 01:31

Hobbs slurping on Hamilton week after week has gotten tiresome. And I like Hobbs...and Hamilton!

 

Ken Squier could do it all.



#22 Dan333SP

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 02:16

I like Will Buxton a lot, I will say that. Same for Matchett. They need to take a page out of the tennis commentator rule book where they generally let the play speak for itself.

#23 TimTams

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Posted 24 September 2014 - 03:38

 

I'm generally fairly tolerant of Crofty, in part due to memories of the horror that was Legard, and in part due to the only alternative in the form of Ben Edwards (had to watch Monza on the Beeb, by the end of the first lap I wanted to throw things).

 

However, he really did my head in on Sunday. He doesn't need to fill all of the time with endless hypotheses which are so ridiculous that Brundle no longer deigns even to acknowledge them.

I used to like Crofty a lot, and was a part of the bandwagon of people who wanted him to take over from Legard when he was working for 5live, but I honestly think his head has perhaps gotten a bit too big, and it's all just 'fun' for him. Sure, that's completely acceptable and I'm not telling him that he shouldn't enjoy his job, but when a large portion of the F1 viewership have to endure listening to him commentate about things that aren't F1, then that becomes annoying (for me). The constant references to football, stories of what he does in his spare time, and little giggles with Ted which often involve very childish jokes lessen my view of the commentary broadcast as a whole, which isn't good because I love Brundle as a commentator.

Something tells me that the great relationship that all the on-screen folks at Sky share has something to do with it and creates a more friendly environment for Croft, a family man who fathers four children, but for me at times, it's just not motor racing. His shouts for a Hamilton pole or victory at twice the decibals of another driver probably doesn't need to be divulged on, though it is prevalent as well. :lol:

(all opinion, mind you)



#24 nonobaddog

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 17:24

Leigh Diffey is the absolute pits.  I can't stand the twirpy little motor mouth.  He is "well and truly" the most irritating person on TV.  NBC must go out of there way to find irritating people, they have Bob Costass too.



#25 Jon83

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 17:27

I cannot stand David Croft and I think Sky need to think about whether he is the best they can get given their resources but I doubt he and other poor commentators can be blamed for poorer TV figures. 



#26 thesham01

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 17:27

True, my bad. But the point still applies since they tend to share the same biases.


Wrong.

#27 thesham01

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Posted 05 October 2014 - 17:29

I'm generally fairly tolerant of Crofty, in part due to memories of the horror that was Legard, and in part due to the only alternative in the form of Ben Edwards (had to watch Monza on the Beeb, by the end of the first lap I wanted to throw things).

However, he really did my head in on Sunday. He doesn't need to fill all of the time with endless hypotheses which are so ridiculous that Brundle no longer deigns even to acknowledge them.


Croft makes so many basic errors it's ridiculous. And his smug voice is really annoying to me.

It is obviously a hard job to do, but I loved Coulthard and Brundle together personally - both know their stuff and they weren't annoying loud mouths.

Edited by thesham01, 05 October 2014 - 17:31.