35 replies to this topic

[karlth]

I was watching a documentary on the Battle of Britain recently and it struck me how similar to Formula 1 the war seemed to be - friendlier and less deadly certainly but similar nevertheless.  Both sides in the war were frantically trying to out design and manufacture the other with newer and better equipment while battles consisted of tactical decisions being made under tremendous pressure.

 

Anyone have any thoughts on the matter?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Brother Fox]

F1 has better merch

[kraduk]

well a lot of the ex aerospace staff laid off in the 60's did goto f1 so its not a surprise.

[karlth]

 

 

[Nonesuch]

There are obvious similarities, but they also extend to many other areas. In that sense the similarity is not between F1 and WW2 but between all forms of technological research, competition, large organisations etc.

 

Airplanes are a nice case where similarities pop up here and there, mainly because of the importance of aerodynamics, but when it comes to amphibious troop transports there is not much overlap to be found.

[sopa]

I have long thought Formula 1 is a microcosm of a society - it has politics, high-speed technological innovation/development, different kind of managers or strategists (generals in army   ), different teams/visions and their followers/fans (i.e political-economic-religious ideologies  ) and so on.

 

But who are the star drivers in army? They can't be just random soldiers, they have to be something more special.

[Diablobb81]

Also always blame zee Germans: Michael- Seb- Nico.

Edited by Diablobb81, 10 October 2014 - 11:32.

[sopa]

Also always blame zee Germans: Michael- Seb- Nico.

 

Also teams with Germanic ownership are ruling the business. Since 2010 Red Bull Racing (Austria) and now Mercedes GP (Germany).

[hittheapex]

I could be wrong on this but I vaguely recall watching a documentary that suggested German engineers took the lessons learned from developing technologies and engineering solutions in their racecars after WW1 and subsequently applied them to military aircraft.

 

As for what you wrote about war, I would venture that is true of most wars and in both F1 and war, superior tactics can overturn technological inferiority.

[as65p]

Also teams with Germanic ownership are ruling the business. Since 2010 Red Bull Racing (Austria) and now Mercedes GP (Germany).

 

Not only that, for the dirty work they mostly use british war prisoners.

[Amphicar]

I have long thought Formula 1 is a microcosm of a society - it has politics, high-speed technological innovation/development, different kind of managers or strategists (generals in army   ), different teams/visions and their followers/fans (i.e political-economic-religious ideologies  ) and so on.
 
But who are the star drivers in army? They can't be just random soldiers, they have to be something more special.

Look to the air forces rather than the armies. During WWII fighter aces on both sides were household names with star status comparable to top F1 drivers today.

[Taxi]

F1 has better germans. 

[Huambo81a]

Unfortunately, War brings out the very best in us. You can thank war for Jet Engines, Rockets, Computers, Nuclear power and RADAR, and that's just off the top of my head. There is something about the neccessity for a solution that makes us amazing. Unfortunately.

[HeadFirst]

Unfortunately, War brings out the very best in us. You can thank war for Jet Engines, Rockets, Computers, Nuclear power and RADAR, and that's just off the top of my head. There is something about the neccessity for a solution that makes us amazing. Unfortunately.

 

Yes, war has led to some amazing advances in technology ..... even in the field of medicine (ex. the Guinea Pigs). Unfortunately it has also given us poison gas, and both nuclear and biological weapons.

[Talisman]

I was watching a documentary on the Battle of Britain recently and it struck me how similar to Formula 1 the war seemed to be - friendlier and less deadly certainly but similar nevertheless.  Both sides in the war were frantically trying to out design and manufacture the other with newer and better equipment while battles consisted of tactical decisions being made under tremendous pressure.

 

Anyone have any thoughts on the matter?

 

From an engineering mentality POV I would have thought they were very similar.  Continual development, one-off setups for leftfield conditions such as Monza or Monaco in F1 or desert/jungle conditions for aircraft, a philosophical commitment to getting new developments on the frontline machines ASAP rather than testing them to destruction and perfecting them before deployment which is what commercial engineering has to do.  Reacting to unexpected developments quickly and engaging in a development race with your opposition too.  The development of an F1 car over a season is rather similar to the development of a fighter plane like the Spitfire over its lifetime.  The final model barely shares any components with the original.

 

A friend of mine considered going into F1 precisely because he thought it was the closest way to getting into that kind of mentality.

[Risil]

Unfortunately, War brings out the very best in us. You can thank war for Jet Engines, Rockets, Computers, Nuclear power and RADAR, and that's just off the top of my head. There is something about the neccessity for a solution that makes us amazing. Unfortunately.

 

When you redesignate capitalism as profiteering, it's amazing what you can get done.

[jonpollak]

Mummy, tell me that Alfred Neubauer story again please

[Option1]

When is Bernie sending the people to the ovens?

 

Seriously, F1 is as much like WWII as Katie Perry is to brain surgery.  Stupidest analogy in a very very long while.

 

Neil

[Guizotia]

Similarity is between the companies on opposite sides designing competing products in WW2 rather than with the actual war itself.

[Guizotia]

Ones obvious difference is that if your vehicle in the war failed to be competitive you would likely die.

If your vehicle in F1 faills to be competitive you lose points.

So a comparison on that angle would be offensive.

[Option1]

Companies compete with each other in business constantly, war or no war.  Companies design competitive products constantly, war or no war.  Big difference is that in only one situation (Bhopal, Chernobyl, etc, notwithstanding) does millions of people die.

 

The analogy remains stupidly offensive.

 

Neil

[InSearchOfThe]

Dubya dubya one.

 

http://en.wikipedia....ie_Rickenbacker

[tomjol]

Companies compete with each other in business constantly, war or no war.  Companies design competitive products constantly, war or no war.  Big difference is that in only one situation (Bhopal, Chernobyl, etc, notwithstanding) does millions of people die.

 

The analogy remains stupidly offensive.

 

Neil

 

Is it not accurate? Are there not many similarities?

 

It's clumsily worded, but the analogy is valid. Considering it offensive is a reflection of you, not it.

[Clatter]

Unfortunately, War brings out the very best in us. You can thank war for Jet Engines, Rockets, Computers, Nuclear power and RADAR, and that's just off the top of my head. There is something about the neccessity for a solution that makes us amazing. Unfortunately.

All of those things were being worked on before the war, but war did accelerate their development.

[Option1]

Is it not accurate? Are there not many similarities?

 

It's clumsily worded, but the analogy is valid. Considering it offensive is a reflection of you, not it.

If the fact I find offensive an overly monied entertainment being compared to something where millions died is a reflection of me, then I think I have at least some reason to be proud of my values.

 

Rather silly statement on your part really.

 

Neil

[Garagiste]

Yes, war has led to some amazing advances in technology ..... even in the field of medicine (ex. the Guinea Pigs). Unfortunately it has also given us poison gas, and both nuclear and biological weapons.

 

Spooky - I used the term in an email earlier which set me thinking about the club, with a slight pang of homesickness:

http://en.wikipedia....Guinea_Pig_Club

 

And there was of course this:

 

[jonpollak]

Ok fine.... I'll tell it to myself then. Thanks fer nuthin' mummy...

http://www.motorspor...lfred-neubauer/

 

Jp

Edited by jonpollak, 10 October 2014 - 21:42.

[Hayden1]

dumbest thread for a long time

[Mila]

Come to think of it, Bernie does have Joel Grey's physique and Liza Minnelli's haircut.

[jonpollak]

Which reminds me...

 

Willkommen- Bienvenue- Welcome....

 

 

Jp

Edited by jonpollak, 10 October 2014 - 21:47.

[Slartibartfast]

When is Bernie sending the people to the ovens?

Seriously, F1 is as much like WWII as Katie Perry is to brain surgery. Stupidest analogy in a very very long while.

Neil

I did mention it once, but I think I got away with it.

[LORDBYRON]

I was watching a documentary on the Battle of Britain recently and it struck me how similar to Formula 1 the war seemed to be - friendlier and less deadly certainly but similar nevertheless.  Both sides in the war were frantically trying to out design and manufacture the other with newer and better equipment while battles consisted of tactical decisions being made under tremendous pressure.

 

Anyone have any thoughts on the matter?

 

 

 I am surprised its not locked or moved 

Edited by iii, 10 October 2014 - 22:03.

[NoSanityClause]

Allianz was a major sponsor for both. 

 

That's all the analogy I can find.

[skid solo]

Bring back the Merlin engine!

[HoldenRT]

I grew up with a dad who cared a lot about WW2 (more than the average person) and grew up watching pretty much every WW2 movie in existence.  Combined with watching every doco I could get my hands on over many years.  It's a very interesting time in human history.  One that shaped our world in many ways, a defining moment that shaped the modern world we live in.

 

Yes, there are a lot of similarities.  I remember years ago talking about this on here and the replies were along the lines of "I don't know what you are talking about".

 

F1 is very similar in terms of the sporting aspect.  Especially in terms of dogfighting or tank warfare.  Man vs machine.  Man vs man.  And how back then, the pilot made more difference and now it's more like computer vs computer with the pilot makes less of a difference.  That's just one example.  There are especially parallels during the more dangerous times of F1, but even now there are still similarities.  The battle in terms of using your instincts and skills in a highly developed machine, developing and improving it (in a race against time) and putting your life on the line each time you step into it.  The politics controlling and shaping it all being out of the control of the pilots etc.  Those WW2 ace fighter pilots were a step above F1 drivers, but the basic underlying elements were/are the same.

 

Sports like F1 take the (rare) positive aspects of a war, and turn it into pure sport, where it can be celebrated and bring people together.. without the dark side and (hopefully) people being hurt.  Saw Rush last night, and there was an interesting quote of.. "the closer you are to death, the more alive you feel".

 

If all you see when you think of WW2 is German officers in uniforms, I feel sorry for you.  It was a WORLD war.  The biggest in history of man.  And just to name one example, the sound of a flyby with F4U corsairs, or Spitfires or Mustangs is up there with the classic F1 cars/engines. 

[NocturnalTendencies]

I'm just glad it's all over with.