27 replies to this topic

[tkulla]

In the JB vs KM thread and the "who will drive for McLaren" thread there's been a lot of talk about whether the McLaren junior drivers Kevin Magnussen and Stoffel Vandoorne should be considered ready for a McLaren seat alongside Alonso or Button of whomever should Honda deliver a great engine and the team is ready to compete for a championship. 

 

On merit the team would surely prefer a Alonso/Button pairing as this would give them the best chance to win the WCC in 2015, a prize that has long eluded them. But what to do with the youngsters? They could pay to put them in Force India or Sauber type rides as substantial cost. Ot...

 

They could start or take over an Indycar team! Honda is already here, so McLaren Honda would exist on both sides of the pond, and assuming they have a big-time sponsor lined up for the Honda return that sponsor may want to tie in with the Indycar effort too. It's a good time. Indy is on the rebound, and aero kits are set to come back soon so the team could lead that effort. 

 

So why not? The US is a big market for McLaren Automotive too, so more name exposure surely can't hurt. And the whole thing would cost less than what they'll be paying Alonso next year.

 

If they wanted they could even set up a Mike Conway deal where the "kids" would only drive on road and street circuits and a more experienced oval racer could take on the ovals. 

 

 

 

http://www.mclaren.c...iver-programme/

 

http://hpd.honda.com/indycar/

 

 

[ch103]

I have often thought that the Indy 500 would be immensely more interesting and popular if they allowed McLaren and Ferrari to make one off cars suited to the regulations.  I think your idea about McLaren creating aero kits would allow them to fulfill their desire to engineer their own equipment, which is import because they are the same time sacrificing that by being forced to run a Dallara chassis.  I think not being allowed to build the entire car would be the only true barrier to entry for McLaren because as you say, the entire cost would be less than Alonso's rumored salary, lol.

[aguri]

I think we will either see Super Aguri returning to cater for Mclarens young drivers or a solution like this.

 

It goes unsaid a lot but McLarens young driver program is nearly on par with Red Bulls in terms of developing talent. Magnussen is properly quick and Vandoorne is the most promising driver in GP2 by a country mile. 

[Nustang70]

I'd like to see this happen.

[Ricardo F1]

Dilution of resources into a crappy series?  Cost of relocation to N.A.?

McLaren Automotive sell every car they build already, they're not building a sedan for Honda people.  The F1 prestige is worth a lot more than anything Indy can offer.

Edited by Ricardo F1, 14 October 2014 - 00:07.

[Radoye]

The Honda that McLaren has a deal with is not the same Honda that supplies engines to IndyCars, they are two distinct corporate entities. There will be only two IndyCar body kits in the forseeable future (well, three if we count the desperately outclassed standard Dallara kit) - a HPD one for Honda engined teams and a Chevy one for Chevy engined teams; contrary to the popular belief, individual teams will not be designing their own body kits. Unless Honda decides to let McLaren design their kit (which will then be shared by all Honda-engined teams) there really is not much room for creativity from the McLaren side.

 

The benefits of running a McLaren sponsored Dallara-Honda IndyCar are dubious at best - just ask Lotus Cars and their venture with KVRT; they might as well run a NASCAR team for all that matters.

[DanardiF1]

McLaren are already involved in NASCAR and Indycar... they provide ECU's and electronics for both series.

 

Edited by DanardiF1, 14 October 2014 - 00:19.

[teejay]

Crappy series?

 

Indycar has been awesome last couple of years.

[Wes350]

Crappy series?

 

Indycar has been awesome last couple of years.

 

The racing has been good.

 

 

That being said the prestige of the series is just not what it once was.

 

And the Indy 500 is around more due to sheer inertia and nostalgia at this point as much as anything else.

 

The series ratings are so low that if it the Verizon Indycar series was a regular cable Tv show; it would have been canceled and not renewed for next season.

 

How the series stays a float is an interesting question.

 

 

It is an open wheel racing fan guilty pleasure...

Edited by Wes350, 14 October 2014 - 01:58.

[teejay]

This year viewing numbers have surged, as have spectator numbers.

 

Can only hope it keeps building to something close to the mid 90's.

 

It was an amazing period of open wheel racing.

[SPBHM]

with aero kits being a thing, I can see it being a good (they have the expertise, the investment vs results would probably be quite good) match for an F1 team to get some involvement, specially with Mclaren trying to sell some cars in the US, winning the 500 with a Mclaren (well, some aero parts on a Dallara-Honda) could be good, but it's probably not going to happen.

Edited by SPBHM, 14 October 2014 - 02:02.

[whitewaterMkII]

Could happen, but not for awhile. 

For one thing, Dallara has a lock on chassis, and IndyCar wants no part of getting into aero for 4 different scenarios. CART went that route and it turned real expensive, real quick. They want one thing and one thing only. A speed limited car that runs once a year and at one track. The rest of their schedule be damned. You will not see a 240 mph car at Indy, and McLaren and Mercedes could punch one of those out while half awake.

The rest of the series really is a blast though. 

Edited by whitewaterMkII, 14 October 2014 - 02:09.

[Disgrace]

This year viewing numbers have surged, as have spectator numbers.

 

May I kindly request a source?

[whitewaterMkII]

May I kindly request a source?

Me too.

Fontana was anemic, I think it got a whopping 20K in the seats and an .02 Nielsen.

For the closing race.

Yikes.

[917k]

This year viewing numbers have surged, as have spectator numbers.

 

Can only hope it keeps building to something close to the mid 90's.

 

It was an amazing period of open wheel racing.

 

 

 

That's Gold Jerry - GOLD!

Edited by 917k, 14 October 2014 - 03:09.

[Wes350]

This year viewing numbers have surged, as have spectator numbers.

 

Can only hope it keeps building to something close to the mid 90's.

 

It was an amazing period of open wheel racing.

 

Surged!?

 

If by surged you mean a few more viewers than last year then.... OK, whatever...

 

Looking at the actual ratings: It would still be cancelled in a year if it was a regular show on a cable network like Syfy, WB, TNT, or USA.

 

On a national network? - It wouldn't have made it through the first season with the numbers it pulled down this year.

 

 

The actual racing is still good and worth watching.

 

But the series has been in decline for a long time now, and a slight bump in one year is no guarantee of a upward trend.

 

I think "Indycars" can grow to be much more than it is.

 

But I don't feel that they will get there following the current direction that they are going.

[HoldenRT]

McLaren isn't aiming to win the WCC in 2015, unless you think miracles can happen.  They are aiming to build for the future.  With a steady upward curve as time goes on.  Long term a deal with Honda can work, because they will have a works engine that's been designed to work with their car.  In the short term, Honda are trying to catch up as they are 12-18 months behind in engine development.  Even if the engine is great out of the box, it's a return to F1, only one car to test on during the winter.. and likely suffering the same teething problems that Merc and Renault have suffered during this season.  These are extremely complex engines.

 

In the short term it's a step back because Mercedes is the strongest engine, but it'd always be hard to beat Merc with their own engines.  See Monza with a Williams trying to overtake a Merc with engine modes etc.  With a dedicated works engine, they don't have to play second fiddle to anyone.  That's the upside down the road.  An Alonso/Button pairing could help more in terms of development.. to develop the car faster due to the experience but has nothing to do with wanting to win WCC's.  Or to put it another way.. it's highly highly unlikely because Honda would need an engine that's even better than Merc's this year and that'd be something.

[KingTiger]

Indycar will be never be popular with those eye sore cars. 

[SonJR]

Indycar will be never be popular with those eye sore cars. 

Although pretty in comparison to most 2014 Formula 1 machines.

Let's just hope 2015 brings proper change and the end of the phallic nose.

[Henri Greuter]

 You will not see a 240 mph car at Indy, and McLaren and Mercedes could punch one of those out while half awake.

 

 

My reply is off topic but a comment you make make mer want to react anyway.

 

Good chance you're gonna see 240+ been reached in 2016 at Indy in practice.

 

There is a lot of talk about making the cars faster for qualifying so that the all time speed record (standing since 1996) is finally broken at last and there are people who believe that there will be more interest and attendance in the grandstands during qualifying if they know that there well be new track records again.

 

If that's gonna happen, then i don't want to sit on the outside of the track watching it. A crash with a 240+ projectile slamming into the fencing in front of me?

No thanks.....

I hpe the reality sank in in time enough after the Aleshin job at Fontana and make rul makers see that cars practising at 240 on Fast Friday or in free practice on pole day may be a recipe for disaster.

 

Henri

[Buttoneer]

I suppose 'McLaren to Indycar' is a little more novel than 'Button to Indycar'.

[AustinF1]

In the JB vs KM thread and the "who will drive for McLaren" thread there's been a lot of talk about whether the McLaren junior drivers Kevin Magnussen and Stoffel Vandoorne should be considered ready for a McLaren seat alongside Alonso or Button of whomever should Honda deliver a great engine and the team is ready to compete for a championship. 

 

On merit the team would surely prefer a Alonso/Button pairing as this would give them the best chance to win the WCC in 2015, a prize that has long eluded them. But what to do with the youngsters? They could pay to put them in Force India or Sauber type rides as substantial cost. Ot...

 

They could start or take over an Indycar team! Honda is already here, so McLaren Honda would exist on both sides of the pond, and assuming they have a big-time sponsor lined up for the Honda return that sponsor may want to tie in with the Indycar effort too. It's a good time. Indy is on the rebound, and aero kits are set to come back soon so the team could lead that effort. 

 

So why not? The US is a big market for McLaren Automotive too, so more name exposure surely can't hurt. And the whole thing would cost less than what they'll be paying Alonso next year.

 

If they wanted they could even set up a Mike Conway deal where the "kids" would only drive on road and street circuits and a more experienced oval racer could take on the ovals. 

 

 

 

http://www.mclaren.c...iver-programme/

 

http://hpd.honda.com/indycar/

If they want to do IndyCar, that's there for them to do, but why would they not then put proven drivers with oval racing experience in those cars? Surely that would be the best course of action if they want to make a positive impression.

[tkulla]

I suppose 'McLaren to Indycar' is a little more novel than 'Button to Indycar'.

I can't see Jenson in Indycar. I think he'd enjoy the friendly atmosphere but the danger of the ovals will keep him away.

[AustinF1]

My reply is off topic but a comment you make make mer want to react anyway.

 

Good chance you're gonna see 240+ been reached in 2016 at Indy in practice.

 

There is a lot of talk about making the cars faster for qualifying so that the all time speed record (standing since 1996) is finally broken at last and there are people who believe that there will be more interest and attendance in the grandstands during qualifying if they know that there well be new track records again.

 

If that's gonna happen, then i don't want to sit on the outside of the track watching it. A crash with a 240+ projectile slamming into the fencing in front of me?

No thanks.....

 

Oof. I hope they don't actually do something this stupid.

[ForeverF1]

If they want to do IndyCar, that's there for them to do, but why would they not then put proven drivers with oval racing experience in those cars? Surely that would be the best course of action if they want to make a positive impression.

"Our Nige" didn't do too bad without oval racing experience.

[AustinF1]

"Our Nige" didn't do too bad without oval racing experience.

Yes, but he was certainly no rookie driver. The op talks about putting KM & SVD in the cars, but he does add that maybe Conway would be a good idea.

[ForeverF1]

Yes, but he was certainly no rookie driver. The op talks about putting KM & SVD in the cars, but he does add that maybe Conway would be a good idea.

He was a 'rookie' driver in the CART/Indycar series, just the same as KM and SVD are rookies in F1 but they are not 'rookie' drivers.

[AustinF1]

He was a 'rookie' driver in the CART/Indycar series, just the same as KM and SVD are rookies in F1 but they are not 'rookie' drivers.

OK. Splitting hairs. Mansell was vastly more experienced than SVD or KM, and (while I'm far from an oval racing fan) success on ovals is often hard to come by for those new to the discipline, just as it is for any other discipline.