121 replies to this topic

[Atreiu]

I've already said it, introduce spec steering wheels with a set and strict ammount of functions available.

 

The drivers could recieve and give all information they wanted, but solving their problems would be much more complicated than turning and pressing buttons on a dial until they reached a delta. And it could have the added bonus of heavily limiting their start procedure options and giving us back the less controlled and more chaotic starts.

 

What better way is there to shuffle the racing order without making any contrieved and arbitrary rule changes?

[superden]

I take it you disagree!?

I'm fine with how it was in the last part of the 2014 season. Now they've just made it an official regulation.
What's the problem?

It seems you missed my point. It was a response to the use of the expression 'adds spice to the show'. The use of which, along with that other verbal annoyance, 'for sure', should result in the offender getting a boot square in the sweets.

As far as radio comms go, it should be the bare minimum, only to advise of dangers on track or a potentially catastrophic vehicle failure.

Edited by superden, 14 February 2015 - 15:56.

[Timstr11]

It seems you missed my point. It was a response to the use of the expression 'adds spice to the show' ... use of which, along with 'for sure' should lead to a day in the stocks.

As far as radio comms go, it should be the bare minimum, only to advise of dangers on track or a potentially catastrophic vehicle failure.

 

It might be an overused expression but very applicable to radio communications in my opinion.

 

I'd find it quite silly to ban it all. No telling the driver where to brake or where to shift:Great! But I do want to hear other conversations. I don't see why anyone would have trouble listening to that.

Edited by Timstr11, 14 February 2015 - 16:02.

[Fastcake]

I think this was overlooked, with all the brouhaha over the Sauber merry-go-round.

 

FIA abandons plans to further restrict Formula 1 radio information.

[Clatter]

FIA showing once again how useless they are when it comes to running the sport.

[redreni]

Really, unless a message is specifically mentioned in one of Whiting's technical directives as being considered incompatible with Article 20.1 SR, I don't see how they can impose a penalty. In the last part of last season, the teams started off playing things cautiously, then started pushing their luck in the last few races. There were no penalties.

 

Personally I think this needs a regulation change, because I don't like the notion that Whiting can effectively fire off an email and that's suddenly an entirely new rule. Technical Directives are supposed to clarify what is unclear regarding rule interpretation, to let the teams know how the FIA intends to monitor compliance, etc. But the fact that verbal advice or instruction to drivers over pit-to-car radio was not considered to be aiding the driver for the purposes of the "drive the car alone and unaided" rule was such a well established interpretation, which had been universally applied and accepted without question by everyone for over 30 years prior to Monza 2014, that it cannot in my view be right for it to be changed without a proper regulation change. There is no coherent and consistent interpretation of the regulations as written that agrees with the interpretation laid out in the relevant technical directive, so the technical directive effectively contradicts the regulations.

 

If you're not going to change the regulations for a fundamental thing like this, why should the FIA ever bother with regulation changes? If you can have a technical directive that contradicts and takes precedence over a regulation, there's no need to ever change a regulation through the proper channels again. We're getting pretty close to that now.

 

Anyway, I expect the teams to keep pushing the boundaries of what they can get away with until either somebody cops a penalty, or the team radio clampdown is simply rendered moribund.

[Paincake]

I truly despise how some of the coaching can go to such extent making the drivers look incompetent, rather then skilled racing hero's. As Lewis Hamilton once said ''Shut up and let me drive!''. 

[midgrid]

 

 

08:43 "Turn 1 OK?" asks Hamilton. He's told that he can't be informed about that, so instead he asks about the weather and is told it "looks good." Subtle!

[Jerem]

So how do these regulations work exactly now?

 

The list of the do/don't must be quite subtle, since it is allowed to tell a driver to do L&C for X meters, but not how his fuel consumption fares with respect to the others.

[Exb]

So how do these regulations work exactly now?

 

The list of the do/don't must be quite subtle, since it is allowed to tell a driver to do L&C for X meters, but not how his fuel consumption fares with respect to the others.

I did think Mercedes were pushing what was allowed - for example McLaren were telling there drivers this is fuel 3, we need fuel 7 (which meant more lift and coast was required judging by Jensons reply of you wouldn't believe how early I'm lifting off already). Also at 1 stage I'm sure Nico was told the other car was worse on fuel consuption but better on brakes, and then later had a message that he couldn't be told how the other car was doing on fuel, that really confused me as it seemed contradictory to what he had been told earlier. Seems to me like the FIA just turn a blind eye unless its something really obvious, its a daft rule as it can't really be regulated properly.

[andrewf1]

I did think Mercedes were pushing what was allowed - for example McLaren were telling there drivers this is fuel 3, we need fuel 7 (which meant more lift and coast was required judging by Jensons reply of you wouldn't believe how early I'm lifting off already). Also at 1 stage I'm sure Nico was told the other car was worse on fuel consuption but better on brakes, and then later had a message that he couldn't be told how the other car was doing on fuel, that really confused me as it seemed contradictory to what he had been told earlier. Seems to me like the FIA just turn a blind eye unless its something really obvious, its a daft rule as it can't really be regulated properly.

Not sure what or when exactly you heard that, Rosberg wasn't given any information on Hamilton's brakes or fuel. His RE encouraged him for the job he was doing on brake cooling while still running close, bu I don't recall him saying anything about Lewis.

[CountDooku]

I did think Mercedes were pushing what was allowed - for example McLaren were telling there drivers this is fuel 3, we need fuel 7 (which meant more lift and coast was required judging by Jensons reply of you wouldn't believe how early I'm lifting off already). Also at 1 stage I'm sure Nico was told the other car was worse on fuel consuption but better on brakes, and then later had a message that he couldn't be told how the other car was doing on fuel, that really confused me as it seemed contradictory to what he had been told earlier. Seems to me like the FIA just turn a blind eye unless its something really obvious, its a daft rule as it can't really be regulated properly.

 

Yeah I think Merc pushed the boundaries massively this weekend. They also told Lewis about needing 50 metres of lift 'n coast. Definitely over the edge and they should have been warned by race control.

[Exb]

Not sure what or when exactly you heard that, Rosberg wasn't given any information on Hamilton's brakes or fuel. His RE encouraged him for the job he was doing on brake cooling while still running close, bu I don't recall him saying anything about Lewis.

Don't know - will have to go back and check.

Just for the record my post wasn't accusing Merc of wrong doing (it comes across a bit like that re-reading it) just that my understanding of the restrictions is obviously wrong (as in I thought that would be banned).

Edited by Exb, 08 June 2015 - 09:55.

[pdac]

If they

Get rid of radio comms (except for genuine safety reasons)

Get rid of blue flags

 

They will

Get back to proper racing

[SenorSjon]

No, this is a result in restricted everything. Therefore everything needs to be managed like an airliner.

[Henrik B]

Don't know - will have to go back and check.

Just for the record my post wasn't accusing Merc of wrong doing (it comes across a bit like that re-reading it) just that my understanding of the restrictions is obviously wrong (as in I thought that would be banned).

 

I recall Lewis getting information that the other car was good on fuel, worse on brakes. Then when Rosberg got the message that they couldn't tell him how Lewis was doing on fuel, I was surprised. I wasn't interested enough to go back and double-check though.

[Crossmax]

I want to see a team fine of €50 000 for each time "Fuel saving" (or similar) is uttered over the radio.

[ANF]

I recall Lewis getting information that the other car was good on fuel, worse on brakes. Then when Rosberg got the message that they couldn't tell him how Lewis was doing on fuel, I was surprised. I wasn't interested enough to go back and double-check though.

No need to double check. That's exactly what happened.

[Exb]

I recall Lewis getting information that the other car was good on fuel, worse on brakes. Then when Rosberg got the message that they couldn't tell him how Lewis was doing on fuel, I was surprised. I wasn't interested enough to go back and double-check though.

That could have been it  - maybe I wasn't paying full attention    (I just remember thinking when Rosbergs RE told him he couldn't have the info it was odd as he had shared it earlier, but it is very possible that it could have been the other Merc - which raises the suggestion that the different RE have different understanding of what is allowed or not?)

[TimRTC]

If they

Get rid of radio comms (except for genuine safety reasons)

Get rid of blue flags

 

They will

Get back to proper racing

 

So proper racing for you is seeing drivers being held up by back markers for lap after lap? I suppose at least Manor/Marussia would get some good TV time...

[pdac]

So proper racing for you is seeing drivers being held up by back markers for lap after lap? I suppose at least Manor/Marussia would get some good TV time...

 

No - the point is that the cars will evolve to be able to overtake backmarkers (or others) if they have to. If you have blue flags then other design criteria will take priority.

[Myrvold]

So proper racing for you is seeing drivers being held up by back markers for lap after lap? I suppose at least Manor/Marussia would get some good TV time...

If they cannot pass backmarkers how did they get so far in front.

 

But ban all team radio. And make the only radio messages, from Race Control to drivers.