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Tony Vandervell's F3 500cc Cooper Norton


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#1 fw07c

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Posted 06 January 2015 - 14:34

Tony Vandervell had an idea to install a works double knocker Manx Norton in a Cooper 500 chassis. It was raced by Eric Brandon on

7th April 1953 in Earl of March Trophy at Goodwood where it came 5th. Does anybody know its chassus number?


Edited by fw07c, 07 January 2015 - 12:17.


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#2 fw07c

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 16:50

How many Cooper VII were made?



#3 fw07c

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Posted 18 January 2015 - 11:42

Eric Brandon results

 

Goodwood 7th April 1953 Earl of March Trophy

1st Alan Brown - Cooper, 2nd Reg Bicknell - Staride, 3rd Stirling Moss - Cooper, 4th Bob Gerard - Cooper, 5th Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII, 6th Les Leston - Leston Special  8th Rex McCandless - McCandless            DNF: Ken Tyrrell - Cooper, Bill Nicholson - Kieft


 


 

Silverstone 9th May 1953 International Trophy Meeting

1st Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 2nd Reg Bicknell - Staride, 3rd Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VIIa, 4th Don Truman - Cooper Mk VII, 5th Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VI, 6th Charlie Headland - Kieft CK51, 7th Ninian Sanderson - Cooper Mk VI, 8th George Wicken - Cooper Mk VI, 9th Arthur Gill - Mackson, 10th Jack Moor - Wasp, 11th Lewis Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk V, 12th David Clarke - Beart Cooper, 13th Frank Bacon - Cooper Mk V, 14th Hon Edward Greenall - Cooper Mk VI, 15th Allan Moore - JBS, 16th Bill Grose - Grose II, 17th Clive Lones - Tiger Kitten III             DNF: Alex McGlashan - Cooper Mk VI, Alan Brown - Cooper, Jim Burgoyne - Cooper Mk III, David Swan - Cooper, Tom Clarke - CBP II, André Loens - Kieft CK52, Les Leston - Leston Special, Austin Nurse - Cooper, Ken Smith - Smith-Buckler        DNS: Stirling Moss - Cooper


 

Crystal Palace 25th May 1953 Opening Meeting

1st Stirling Moss - Cooper, 2nd Reg Bicknell - Staride, 3rd Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VI, 4th George Wicken - Cooper Mk VI, 5th Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 6th Jimmy Brown - Martin, 7th Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII        DNF: Les Leston - Cooper, Don Truman - Cooper Mk VII, Alan Brown - Cooper Mk VIIa, Dennis Taylor - Martin, Reg Owen - Hill


 


 

Snetterton 25th July 1953

1st Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 2nd Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII, 3rd Bob Gerard - Cooper, 4th Les Leston - Leston Special, 5th Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VI          DNF: RD Biss - Cooper Mk VI, Gerald Smith - Kent-Smith, Alan Cowley - Cooper, John Higham - Cooper Mk VI, Bill Nicholson - Kieft, Ivor Bueb - Arnott, Dennis Taylor - Martin


 

Davidstow 1st August 1953

Heat 1

1st Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 2nd Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VIIa, 3rd Les Leston - Cooper, 4th Ken Tyrrell - Cooper      DNF: Jack Westcott - Kieft CK52, George Brown - JP

Heat 2

1st Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII, 2nd Don Truman - Cooper Mk VII, 3rd Noel Berrow-Johnson - Martin, 4th Adrian Butler - Cooper, 5th Arthur Mallock - CRM

Final

1st Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII, 2nd Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 3rd Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VIIa, 4th Les Leston - Leston Special, 5th Don Truman - Cooper Mk VII, 6th Ken Tyrrell - Cooper        DNF: Bertie Bradnack - Cooper Mk VII, Noel Berrow-Johnson - Martin


 

Charterhall 15th August 1953

1st Stirling Moss - Cooper Mk VII, 2nd Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 3rd Les Leston - Leston Special, 4th Charlie Headland - Martin, 5th Ninian Sanderson - Staride         DNF: David Blane - JP, Bob Gerard - Cooper, Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VI, Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII


 


 

Crystal Palace 19th September 1953 Redex Trophy

Redex Trophy Heat 1

1st Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 2nd John Brise - Arnott, 3rd Ivor Bueb - Arnott, 4th Eric Fenning - Staride, 5th Don Truman - Cooper Mk VII

Redex Trophy Heat 2

1st Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VIIa, 2nd Stirling Moss - Cooper, 3rd George Wicken - Cooper Mk VI, 4th Reg Bicknell - Staride, 5th Jim Russell - Cooper Mk VI

Redex Trophy Heat 3

1st Les Leston - Leston Special, 2nd Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII, 3rd Bob Gerard - Cooper, 4th Don Gray - Kieft, 5th Rod Nuckey - Cooper

Redex Trophy Final

1st Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk VIIa, 2nd Don Parker - Kieft CK52, 3rd Les Leston - Leston Special, 4th George Wicken - Cooper Mk VI, 5th Eric Brandon - Cooper Mk VII, 6th Reg Bicknell - Staride        DNF: Stirling Moss - Cooper

Consolation Race

1st Jack Westcott - Kieft CK52, 2nd Alan Cowley - Cooper, 3rd Noel Berrow-Johnson - Martin, 4th Lewis Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk V, 5th Harold Daniell - Emeryson


 

Agen 27th September 1953

Heat 1

1st Lewis Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk V, 2nd Hansjorg Gilomen - Cooper, 3rd Lex Beels - Cooper       DNF: Bertie Bradnack - Cooper Mk VII, John Brise - Arnott

Heat 2

1st Eric Brandon - Cooper, 2nd Cliff Davis - Cooper, 3rd Heiniger - Cooper

Heat 3

1st André Loens - Kieft, 2nd Ivor Bueb - Arnott, 3rd George Chazalet - Volpini       DNF: Stuart Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk V

Final

1st Eric Brandon - Cooper, 2nd Lewis Lewis-Evans - Cooper Mk V, 3rd Hansjorg Gilomen - Cooper, 4th George Chazalet - Volpini 5th Paul Audibert - Audibert, 6th Cliff Davis - Cooper             DNF: André Loens - Kieft, Ivor Bueb - Arnott


 


 



#4 D-Type

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Posted 18 January 2015 - 15:32

Tony Vandervell had an idea to install a works double knocker Manx Norton in a Cooper 500 chassis. It was raced by Eric Brandon on
7th April 1953 in Earl of March Trophy at Goodwood where it came 5th. Does anybody know its chassus number?

This doesn't ring true.
People had been putting Norton engines into Coopers from 1949. While Vandervell was still involved with BRM he had been involved with a project for Norton to build a 4-cylinder engine using BRM technology. But when he left BRM he had then gone on to race the Ferrari-based Thinwall Specials in Formula 1 and Formule Libre before producing the first Vanwall in 1953-54.
Admittedly, the Vanwall engine was designed by Leo Kuzmicki who had worked at Norton and the chassis of the Vanwall car was designed by Cooper, but I can see no value to the Vandervell organisation in running a Cooper-Norton in a minor formula like Formula 3.

#5 Tim Murray

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Posted 18 January 2015 - 16:12

The point here was that GAV wanted something better than the Norton engines others were using. Norton engines were not available off the shelf; to get one it was necessary to buy a production ‘Manx’ Norton, extract the engine and somehow dispose of the rest of the bike. Vandervell wanted a proper racing engine as used in the works racers, and due to his connections with Norton he was provided with a 1952-spec racing engine by Joe Craig of Norton.

This engine was not a success, however. It needed major mods to fit it into the Cooper frame, as all the mountings and details differed from the production version. Then the engine was found to have a very narrow power band, too narrow for the four-speed gearbox. After its Goodwood race with Brandon the engine subsequently dropped a valve during a test session. By this time GAV had lost interest, the engine went back to Nortons and the empty chassis was sold to Brandon.

(Source: Vanwall by Jenkinson and Posthumus)



#6 D-Type

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Posted 18 January 2015 - 18:53

I must get a copy of that book!  I have the ones by Ian Bamsey and Ed McDonough.  I think GAV was a director of Norton so would have been able to get whatever engine he wanted.

Did the engineless 'Featherbed' frames form the basis of hybrids cuch as the 'Norvin' with Vincent engine or the Triumph-engined equivalents?



#7 fw07c

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 13:37

A brief history of Norton development

1932 for customer road versions – available with a range of mods to give performance between road and full works race spec.

External hairpin valve springs available early, mainly for easy replacement on race engines.

1937: Norton Manx released
At this stage, a single-cam development of the International, by Joe Craig.  
Production halted for the War.
Re-introduced in 1947 as a road-race engine and bike (effectively an uprated Norton International)
SOHC,
long stroke (79.62x100mm, or 3.135x3.9”), 499cc, c.47bhp
Fitted with a choice of Amal carburettors

1949: Manx engine revised to DOHC – the classic “double-knocker”
Head redesigned to DOHC.
August 1951:
Engine gains sodium-filled exhaust valve

1953: Manx Short-stroke motor developed:
86.0x85.6mm (3.39x3.37”), 499cc
Short stroke increases rev limit from c.6,500 to 7,200rpm,
increasing power to c.54bhp in race trim.

The basic of Tony Vandervell's first 2 litre engine  contained the above features.



#8 Dutchy

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Posted 13 February 2015 - 16:23

.

Did the engineless 'Featherbed' frames form the basis of hybrids cuch as the 'Norvin' with Vincent engine or the Triumph-engined equivalents?

It is generally believed that the 'Triton' was created using a Manx Norton rolling chassis. Whether that is actual fact or not I cannot say



#9 Doug Nye

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Posted 01 March 2015 - 17:40

Vandervell was one of the directors of Norton and also one of the early trustees of the British Motor Racing Research Trust which was responsible for the BRM V16 project. He had some of the V16 design team working with the equally reluctant and distinctly uncooperative Joe Craig at Norton on a potential new 500cc power unit that could be useable in cars. The project fizzled out in parallel with Vandervell's patience where the BMRT and the BRM V16 were concerned...

 

DCN