52 replies to this topic

[andrewf1]

Williams, who had planned to concentrate on setup work and race simulations have been frustrated my the myriad of red flags on the final day of testing, which kept interrupting their long-runs.

 

“All these interruptions have been hindering our progress and are the reason that we couldn’t quite finish all that we had planned,” testing engineer Rod Nelson is quoted by Motorsport Total. “There were so many red flags, it was almost as if Ralf Schumacher was back.”

 

Nelson offered no explanation for this nasty dig at their former driver, but in the end he expressed his satisfaction with what the squad had achieved during the second week of testing.

 

 

I stumbled upon this article on thejudge13.com (http://thejudge13.co...-february-2015/)

I know that site isn't always the best source, but this wasn't a speculation, just a report on this interview which appeared on motorsport-total:  http://www.motorspor...k-15022221.html

 

During their time at Williams together, I always favored JPM over Ralf, but this comment seems a bit of an unnecessary cheap shot. Do any of you know what Rod Nelson is talking about? Was Ralf known to cause red flags during testing? Because if that's not the case, the alternative is worrying.

 

Ralf had some pretty bad accidents during his career with Williams which resulted in red flags, such as Australia 2002, Monza 2003 and Indianapolis 2004, but those were very serious and resulted in injuries, so to joke about that is quite disgraceful . 

[maverick69]

 

 

I stumbled upon this article on thejudge13.com (http://thejudge13.co...-february-2015/)

I know that site isn't always the best source, but this wasn't a speculation, just a report on this interview which appeared on motorsport-total:  http://www.motorspor...k-15022221.html

 

During their time at Williams together, I always favored JPM over Ralf, but this comment seems a bit of an unnecessary cheap shot. Do any of you know what Rod Nelson is talking about? Was Ralf known to cause red flags during testing? Because if that's not the case, the alternative is worrying.

 

Ralf had some pretty bad accidents during his career with Williams which resulted in red flags, such as Australia 2002, Monza 2003 and Indianapolis 2004, but those were very serious and resulted in injuries, so to joke about that is quite disgraceful . 

 

 

Ralf's got pretty thick skin - and I'd imagine that Rod is only taking the piss.

 

I can assure you that much, much worse is said in the paddock..........

[AndyPerry]

I can assure you that much, much worse is said in the paddock..........

 

You mean about other drivers? I always wanted to know what "insiders" said about drivers, what the paddock opinion was, without all the media/corporate speak ...

 

Can you share a few of those opinions, without naming sources, of course

[V8 Fireworks]

williams?

 

test engineer mocks ralf, more like.  just a humble ribbing I think. 

[Vitesse2]

During his time at Williams, Schumacher Minor had a reputation for - let's say - petulance. Mike Lawrence's article only hints at some of his behaviour at Goodwood in 2002. He lost a lot of friends and goodwill that weekend. So much so that the Williams mechanics were having to apologise for some of his behaviour. Mechanics are like elephants - they never forget. They hold grudges too ...

 

This is a thread from the time: http://forums.autosp...ms-at-goodwood/

[Jon83]

Non-story.

[Nonesuch]

This just seems like a dumb joke. It happens everywhere, all the time. This just happens to be a place of work where there are an untold number of self-styled reporters running around, repeating and publishing everything that gets said.

 

Mechanics are like elephants - they never forget. They hold grudges too ...

 
Which makes it all the more silly, as this Nelson character apparently only joined Williams after Ralf Schumacher had left Williams, from the 2007 season onwards.

 

In any case, Williams should consider itself lucky to see the days of Ralf Schumacher again. Their recent track record is rather paltry in comparison.

Edited by Nonesuch, 23 February 2015 - 13:36.

[RubberKubrick]

Not a fan of RSC, but wasn't he the guy who once achieved, errm, all championship points (or almost all of them?) of the team in an entire season (1999)?

[Spillage]

Not a fan of RSC, but wasn't he the guy who once achieved, errm, all championship points (or almost all of them?) of the team in an entire season (1999)?

Yup. In 1999 he had three podiums and 35 points. Zanardi, a CART champion, didn't have any.

 

1999 was probably Ralf's best season. He was desperately unlucky not to win at the Nurburgring, and few would have begrudged him his victory if he had. Sadly thereafter he turned into a bit of a Mansell-minus-the-results kind of guy; by all accounts very difficult to work with, but unlike Mansell, never WDC material. That's probably why he's the subject of a bit of humour at Williams nowadays.

Edited by Spillage, 23 February 2015 - 14:55.

[RubberKubrick]

Yup. In 1999 he had three podiums and 35 points. Zanardi, a CART champion, didn't have any.

1999 was probably Ralf's best season. [...]

Yeah, the WCC standings in 1999 were kinda:

1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Jordan
4. Stewart
5. RSchumacher
6. Benetton
7. Prost
8. Sauber
9. Arrows
10. Minardi

Edited by RubberKubrick, 23 February 2015 - 15:09.

[noikeee]

 

 

I stumbled upon this article on thejudge13.com (http://thejudge13.co...-february-2015/)

I know that site isn't always the best source, but this wasn't a speculation, just a report on this interview which appeared on motorsport-total:  http://www.motorspor...k-15022221.html

 

During their time at Williams together, I always favored JPM over Ralf, but this comment seems a bit of an unnecessary cheap shot. Do any of you know what Rod Nelson is talking about? Was Ralf known to cause red flags during testing? Because if that's not the case, the alternative is worrying.

 

Ralf had some pretty bad accidents during his career with Williams which resulted in red flags, such as Australia 2002, Monza 2003 and Indianapolis 2004, but those were very serious and resulted in injuries, so to joke about that is quite disgraceful . 

 

 

You're going way out there to feel offended man.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Maybe Ralf just caused a lot of red flags in testing, regardless of which team he was with.

[milestone 11]

During his time at Williams, Schumacher Minor had a reputation for - let's say - petulance. Mike Lawrence's article only hints at some of his behaviour at Goodwood in 2002. He lost a lot of friends and goodwill that weekend. So much so that the Williams mechanics were having to apologise for some of his behaviour. Mechanics are like elephants - they never forget. They hold grudges too ...

This is a thread from the time: http://forums.autosp...ms-at-goodwood/

That's the funniest thread that I've read in weeks. Wasn't entirely sure who was going to come off worse, Schumacher or Lawrence until I saw Doug Nye's contribution. Even Zmeej got involved.

Edited by milestone 11, 23 February 2015 - 17:02.

[Myrvold]

Yeah, the WCC standings in 1999 were kinda:
1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Jordan
4. Stewart
5. RSchumacher
6. Benetton
7. Prost
8. Sauber
9. Arrows
10. Minardi

As well as 3rd in the constructor was basically Frentzen

[BRK]

LOL. I've no right to but I will laugh along with anyone poking fun at a) JV, b) RSC.

[Elba]

Ralf's got pretty thick skin - and I'd imagine that Rod is only taking the piss.

 

I can assure you that much, much worse is said in the paddock..........

You bet Ralf the guy everybody loved to hate back then 

 

He didn't have a bad run in F1 though (certainly not financially) so a bit of a ribbin' by Rod Nelson he would likely just shrug off

[SanDiegoGo]

You mean about other drivers? I always wanted to know what "insiders" said about drivers, what the paddock opinion was, without all the media/corporate speak ...

 

Can you share a few of those opinions, without naming sources, of course

 

well, as you asked.

 

http://www.motorspor...in-the-paddock/

Edited by SanDiegoGo, 23 February 2015 - 18:48.

[maverick69]

You bet Ralf the guy everybody loved to hate back then 

 

He didn't have a bad run in F1 though (certainly not financially) so a bit of a ribbin' by Rod Nelson he would likely just shrug off

 

Lol.

 

To be fair - he was a bit of a monumental bellend. Which is saying something when he's compared to Monty, a young JB, JV et, al.

 

But.......... For all Ralf's faults - he was a very, very good F1 driver. Very, very underrated IMHO.

 

If he'd had unlimited access to Fiorano and 5k a corner tyers - he would have racked up the WDCs too.

 

Also had a classy driving style - not unlike The Hammer.......

 

Hi Ralf......     

Edited by maverick69, 23 February 2015 - 20:26.

[ninetyzero]

Hey I have a funny Ralf Schumacher joke:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

His DTM career! Haha!

[Radion]

Is that an insider? I don't remember Ralf having caused much red flags? Also, he wasn't more error prone that others 

[Elba]

Lol.

 

To be fair - he was a bit of a monumental bellend. Which is saying something when he's compared to Monty, a young JB, JV et, al.

True he was grumpy Schu 

 

OTOH wouldn't have been easy to live in the shadow of such as successful brother.

Still won quite a few races, pocketed some 100 million (of which he recently had to give 6 to Cora in the divorce) and has done what he loved doing ie racing. 

 

We need a Ralf 2.0 really, which current driver/champion has an unsympathetic brother to fill that gap 

[GoldenColt]

Lol.

 

If he'd had unlimited access to Fiorano and 5k a corner tyers - he would have racked up the WDCs too.

 

 

He should've beaten his teammates more often to give me that impression.

[HP]

RSC probably raised more red flags during social activities than in testing.

[Jimisgod]

LOL. I've no right to but I will laugh along with anyone poking fun at a) JV, b) RSC.

Add JPM and you have a trio of easy to mock drivers from the same time period. Maybe their lack of success vs. Schumacher Major makes them easy targets?

[TF110]

Never felt Toyota made the right choice in him. I felt JPM should've been picked up since his history with them.

[CoolBreeze]

Ralf was probably their most consistent driver in recent times. He has some bad attitude, but i doubt he causes 10-15 red flags, IMO. All his crashes were pretty serious. That Indy crash, twice, destroyed his career, IMO. 

 

Silly things to say, IMO. 

[Nobody]

A homophobic slur?

[Tsarwash]

Yeah, the WCC standings in 1999 were kinda:

1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Jordan
4. Stewart
5. RSchumacher
6. Benetton
7. Prost
8. Sauber
9. Arrows
10. Minardi

I didn't realise that Ralf designed, built and financed that Williams car that year. 

[Knot]

Ralf was probably their most consistent driver in recent times. He has some bad attitude, but i doubt he causes 10-15 red flags, IMO. All his crashes were pretty serious. That Indy crash, twice, destroyed his career, IMO. 

 

Silly things to say, IMO. 

 

I can't remember where he got his first concussion, but the first one almost completely removed any competitive fire he had, and the second one was a career ender. I read an interview with him where he stated that he had a really hard time with life in general for 6 months after his last concussion.

[Knot]

Add JPM and you have a trio of easy to mock drivers from the same time period. Maybe their lack of success vs. Schumacher Major makes them easy targets?

 

Not so much that MSC was so much better (though he was), but RSC and Monty could reliably produce fireworks resulting from driving faster than their wits allowed them to.

[Knot]

Captain Ralf:

 

http://www.f1fanatic...e_2002_1024.jpg

[dweller23]

 

 

I stumbled upon this article on thejudge13.com (http://thejudge13.co...-february-2015/)

I know that site isn't always the best source, but this wasn't a speculation, just a report on this interview which appeared on motorsport-total:  http://www.motorspor...k-15022221.html

 

During their time at Williams together, I always favored JPM over Ralf, but this comment seems a bit of an unnecessary cheap shot. Do any of you know what Rod Nelson is talking about? Was Ralf known to cause red flags during testing? Because if that's not the case, the alternative is worrying.

 

Ralf had some pretty bad accidents during his career with Williams which resulted in red flags, such as Australia 2002, Monza 2003 and Indianapolis 2004, but those were very serious and resulted in injuries, so to joke about that is quite disgraceful . 

 

I always wonder about life of a person who spends time to find such information and then say it is disgraceful or so. 

[tifosiMac]

Ralf had some pretty bad accidents during his career with Williams which resulted in red flags, such as Australia 2002, Monza 2003 and Indianapolis 2004, but those were very serious and resulted in injuries, so to joke about that is quite disgraceful . 

 

Ralf has always had a sense of humour much like his brother so it is in no way a disgraceful comment from a guy who knows him well.

 

A funny quote and one I am sure Ralf will chuckle about.

[Rob]

Ralf did have a period later on in his career where he seemed a bit crash prone. I wouldn't read too much into it, it was probably said in jest.

[Leprechau]

He should've beaten his teammates more often to give me that impression.

 

I didn't track/follow his career that closely, but(iirc) he have a positive/tie head-to-head against JPM. Then, it all depends how you rate JPM.... Imho, both are no worse than Nico Rosberg, for instance.

 

 

I would understand this joke about a Maldonado-like driver, but I just don't remember Ralf being that kind of driver.   Anyway, I don't think this is offensive. At worst, just a bad/unfunny joke

 

[Dolph]

Come on guys, enough with the pettiness.

[Risil]

Never felt Toyota made the right choice in him. I felt JPM should've been picked up since his history with them.

 

If Toyota had approached him, I'm certain that JPM would've considered McLaren the better option for 2005.

Edited by Risil, 24 February 2015 - 18:32.

[superden]

I doubt Ralf cares.

Nor do I.

[sopa]

From practical point of view it is unlikely specifically Ralf Schumacher was the cause of many red flags during testing,

so two other options remain: a) causing a red flag like Ralf Schumacher is an expression, which has some other meaning, but it is an inside joke, which we do not get exactly;

b) there is a bit bad blood between Rod and Ralf.

[sopa]

Never felt Toyota made the right choice in him. I felt JPM should've been picked up since his history with them.

 

It is slightly mystifying that Toyota signed contract with Ralf back in 2004 for a very big salary. It was at the time in which Ralf was clearly on decline already, and this must have been visible to all observers. While I do not think Montoya or other top drivers at the time would have joined Toyota, because the team was still pretty rubbish in 2004, Toyota would have easily got another quality driver for peanuts. For example Heidfeld was available at that time.

[kevinracefan]

I doubt Ralf cares.

Nor do I.

this... Ralf made millions doing what any of us would love to do...

#sticksandstones

[TF110]

It is slightly mystifying that Toyota signed contract with Ralf back in 2004 for a very big salary. It was at the time in which Ralf was clearly on decline already, and this must have been visible to all observers. While I do not think Montoya or other top drivers at the time would have joined Toyota, because the team was still pretty rubbish in 2004, Toyota would have easily got another quality driver for peanuts. For example Heidfeld was available at that time.

2005 was their best season. Trulli joined a little before then and they were always just a little short. The Gascoyne guy running Toyota then wasnt good. Trulli wasnt that good, Ralf wasnt that good. They never had a Kimi, Alonso, Michael, Hamilton guy that could get those results. Its almost cruel to look back at their time in f1 and the people they had. I remember Ralf doing a good job in Suzuka '05 but falling like a stone after his first stop.

[blackhand2010]

I think I remember reading that Toyota both wanted a "name", and at that time he was the best available, as well as some in Toyota Japan being impresed with what he delivered in his time in F Nippon (despite him driving with Mugen engines behind him).

 

I've always thought Ralf got a bad rap. No, he was never going to match Michael; yes, he could be a bit of a tool; and yes he took Toyota's cash and cruised to retirement.

However, Eddie Irvine did similar, and he's celebrated for having "character"...

[superden]

Yes, but whilst Eddie Irvine actually has a personality (though whether you like it is another matter entirely), Ralf really doesn't. He was the original beige man. Not offensive, but instantly forgettable. In fact until this thread popped up I had, indeed, forgotten him.

Edited by superden, 24 February 2015 - 22:26.

[blackhand2010]

Y'see I don't see much of a difference.

I remember when Irvine pronounced that he was the second best driver after Michael, the press just said it was Eddie being his usual wacky self.

When Ralf said he was almost as good as Michael, the knives came out.

 

I had/have little time for either, but Ralf does tend to cop flack that others don't. 

[JohnH]

Claire Williams' grimace during her q and a w F1 Racing Mag when Ralf came up pretty much sums it up.

[sopa]

Y'see I don't see much of a difference.

I remember when Irvine pronounced that he was the second best driver after Michael, the press just said it was Eddie being his usual wacky self.

When Ralf said he was almost as good as Michael, the knives came out.

 

I had/have little time for either, but Ralf does tend to cop flack that others don't. 

 

Well yeah, that's true that different people get a different reaction for the same things. That has always been so.

 

I don't get though why should people bash and take knives out for a person allegedly with "no personality". Why should "lack of personality" make people angry and turn into attacking mode? IMO, if someone has "no personality", it is something we should actually feel for.

[sopa]

2005 was their best season. Trulli joined a little before then and they were always just a little short. The Gascoyne guy running Toyota then wasnt good. Trulli wasnt that good, Ralf wasnt that good. They never had a Kimi, Alonso, Michael, Hamilton guy that could get those results. Its almost cruel to look back at their time in f1 and the people they had. I remember Ralf doing a good job in Suzuka '05 but falling like a stone after his first stop.

 

I remember Toyota's strategies were pretty bad too. In Belgium they were both running well, but were given wrong tyres. And Suzuka - well, Ralf qualified light, and to add to the problem, there was a safety car period early in the race, so he had no chance of gaining an advantage from light fuel load.

[tifosiMac]

Ralf probably needs a laugh anyway. He has just divorced his wife Cora in the last few days and his split apparently had domestic violence as a factor. It doesn't say who was the aggressor though. 

[The Kanisteri]

Should these jokes be at Nostalgia forum...