106 replies to this topic

[kosmos]

The "Fernando Alonso vs Jenson Button 2015 topic" will be open when McLaren announce the race of Alonso's return. If needed, the above chart will be expanded.

Please be respectful with both drivers and their respective supporters.

Edited by kosmos, 15 March 2015 - 06:36.

[DRSwing]

Nice one, good job

Good luck to both drivers this week. Hope both of them finish the race!

[ninetyzero]

I have a feeling that Jenson will beat Kevin over the course of the season, just a hunch though...

[RockBrocaine]

Shouldn't the title of this thread be "Kevin Magnussen and Jenson Button Melbourne 2015" ?

[kosmos]

Shouldn't the title of this thread be "Kevin Magnussen and Jenson Button Melbourne 2015" ?

 

How do you know that Kevin will not race more than one GP?. Moderators are free to change it if they want anyway.

Edited by kosmos, 11 March 2015 - 16:39.

[BillBald]

Unless they suddenly produce a car which is at least fairly reliable, I don't think it will be possible to conclude anything about the drivers' perfomance from the upcoming race.

[scumbarma]

I think Jenson will have the upper hand as his water leak will allow him to get back to the pits, but Kmag will stop on track due to the oil seal. both on Lap 1. TBH I just hope both make it to the end of the race.

[ANF]

This had better be a short thread.

[pusko]

Nice one, good job

Good luck to both drivers this week. Hope both of them finish the race!

One way or another they will finish the race...don't worry. ;-)

[pusko]

I'm kind of sad that this thread even exist. Oh well...

[Dolph]

Nice chart. But "wins"?

[NoSanityClause]

Great idea! I think that Jenson might...too late, both DNF.

[sopa]

Great idea! I think that Jenson might...too late, both DNF.

 

One of them DNF on lap 42, the other one on lap 44. So in the final list the one, who retired later, is ranked ahead. And people will argue all year whether this guy "won" the team-mate battle.;)

[NoSanityClause]

One of them DNF on lap 42, the other one on lap 44. So in the final list the one, who retired later, is ranked ahead. And people will argue all year whether this guy "won" the team-mate battle.;)

Indeed.

 

Seriously, I think/hope/pray Jenson will bring the car home in 4th place. Things will get worse for him and Alonso/Kevin in the next races before they get better again.

 

Of course, that was a mathematically sound prediction by means of a complex formula which includes the number of monkeys coming out from my behind.

[DRSwing]

Indeed.
 
Seriously, I think/hope/pray Jenson will bring the car home in 4th place. Things will get worse for him and Alonso/Kevin in the next races before they get better again.
 
Of course, that was a mathematically sound prediction by means of a complex formula which includes the number of monkeys coming out from my behind.

Nah, more like from recent years of watching the Ferrari saga...keep calm, keep calm

[sabjit]

If K-Mag only gets one race, it's entirely possible that this "battle" will be settled by whose car breaks down last in Melbourne.

[RockBrocaine]

How do you know that Kevin will not race more than one GP?. Moderators are free to change it if they want anyway.

You're right, I'm going to make a Geido Van DeGarde vs err.... 2015 thread.

[LeClerc]

With the state of the McHonda, the only race our boys will be in, is the on about who will hit the showers first when the car expires.

[nosecone]

Shouldn't the title of this thread be "Kevin Magnussen and Jenson Button Melbourne 2015" ?

 

Or "Kevin Magnussen's vs Jenson Button's 5 laps in the Australian GP"

[Button4life]

I expect Button to quali ahead of Magnussen and being 4 tenths a lap faster avarage in the race, but Magnussen will probably have a problem in quali and that's why I'll give the win to Magnussen. Although Button finished a place ahead of him.

[Morgan00]

For once a danish F1 journalist has actually brought up an interesting point. The following is a part of the article translated via google:

 

 

That the McLaren-management already know that they can be missing engines is obviously a bad sign. And perhaps most for Kevin Magnussen. For why let a successor, who is likely to run only one race (and therefore can not make an impact in the World Cup-position) straining one of the costly engines 'unnecessary'?

 

From a McLaren-view would be prudent to make sure that the first driver Fernando Alonso has enough engines for the entire season.

 

There are undoubtedly many ways, McLaren and Honda can ensure that Magnussen not causing unnecessary wear on the engine, Alonso will take over. You can turn down the revs, thus reducing both power and wear. You can also limit Magnussen laps during practice, and you can ultimately let him be removed early from the race. All to ensure Alonso the best possible basis for the rest of the season.

Edited by Morgan00, 12 March 2015 - 09:08.

[micktosin]

For once a danish F1 journalist has actually brought up an interesting point. The following is a part of the article translated via google:

Doesn't make sense to preserve the engine for Alonso, it's not like he will be in contention for WDC this year. The data they will get by running both cars is way more valuable than preserving the engine. 

[TheFish]

Their helmets are pretty much identical? 

[NoSanityClause]

For once a danish F1 journalist has actually brought up an interesting point. The following is a part of the article translated via google:

Oh for petessake, I wonder why conspirationists keep watching a sport in which everything is rigged. Go watch WWE.

 

No, that journalist (not even a source to know where that idiotic piece of crap came from?) is a bitter, fearful, chauvinistic imbecile that is already lookin for an explanation for Kev-Mag's failure without even giving the guy the possibility to show if he will deliver or not in Melbourne. That argument is toxic, because it gratuitously cast a shadow of doubt over everybody and everything, without further consequences for Mr.Idiotic Danish Journalist and his completely baseless accusations of manipulation.

 

That kind of "journalism" which is nothing but weak, coward, bitter, sore loser fanboyism really sickens me.

[Rhardrks]

This first race will be very  interesting considering Button was chosen over kmag for 2015.

If both cars are trouble free in Australia, it could get embarrassing for Jenson if KMag outqualifies and out races him. Especially if this is a one off and Alonso comes back for Malaysia.

[BARHonda006]

This first race will be very  interesting considering Button was chosen over kmag for 2015.

If both cars are trouble free in Australia, it could get embarrassing for Jenson if KMag outqualifies and out races him. Especially if this is a one off and Alonso comes back for Malaysia.

And that happened an awful lot in 2014.......

[Kvothe]

For once a danish F1 journalist has actually brought up an interesting point. The following is a part of the article translated via google:

It doesn't matter if Magnussen is in contention for the championship, any points he accrues will still count towards the constructors championships which is still the main objective for all teams. Unless you think McLaren will have such an advantage once they sort their engine reliability out (including penalties) that they could frankly throw away what might be there best chance of a freak lottery result barring any wet races, than dismiss it for the rubbish that it most certainly is.

[Morgan00]

Oh for petessake, I wonder why conspirationists keep watching a sport in which everything is rigged. Go watch WWE.

 

No, that journalist (not even a source to know where that idiotic piece of crap came from?) is a bitter, fearful, chauvinistic imbecile that is already lookin for an explanation for Kev-Mag's failure without even giving the guy the possibility to show if he will deliver or not in Melbourne. That argument is toxic, because it gratuitously cast a shadow of doubt over everybody and everything, without further consequences for Mr.Idiotic Danish Journalist and his completely baseless accusations of manipulation.

 

That kind of "journalism" which is nothing but weak, coward, bitter, sore loser fanboyism really sickens me.

 

Overreact much...? Jesus...    Personally I don't think that the idea is outlandish at all. From Mclaren's point of view it could make sense not to risk an engine on a guy who will probably only get one race. Especially when the race in question is the first one, and they in all likelihood won't be competing at the front anyway. Also keep in mind that Boullier himself has stated that it will be a problem for them during the season, because of the troubles they have had with reliability. 

Edited by Morgan00, 12 March 2015 - 12:30.

[Morgan00]

It doesn't matter if Magnussen is in contention for the championship, any points he accrues will still count towards the constructors championships which is still the main objective for all teams. Unless you think McLaren will have such an advantage once they sort their engine reliability out (including penalties) that they could frankly throw away what might be there best chance of a freak lottery result barring any wet races, than dismiss it for the rubbish that it most certainly is.

 

I'm aware that the points will count, thank you:) Do you honestly think that this race might be their best chance of a freak result? I think they are treating this as another test tbh, the latest comments from Jenson and Kevin points in this direction imo. 

[Kvothe]

I'm aware that the points will count, thank you:) Do you honestly think that this race might be their best chance of a freak result? I think they are treating this as another test tbh, the latest comments from Jenson and Kevin points in this direction imo. 

I would argue the first race of the season is always a lottery, in terms of point results or podiums. The fastest driver in the fastest car without any problems will generally waltz it to the finishing line first, but when you have brand new cars being driven in angst for the first time, there's usually a major qualifying shock or mistake, cars that break down, race incidents and crashes due to rustiness, overeager rookies eager to make their mark with absolutely no f1 racing experience,  and not forgetting scandals and shocks which can affect race results posthumously (liegate, fuel flow), that all contribute into making the first race a lottery. 2008 with only 7 cars (off the top of my head) finishing the first race is a good example, 2009 with Lewis nearly getting the silver donkey on the podium or even last year with both McLarens on the podium which they never achieved again. I think for any team to throw awary a potential bird in the hand for a bird in the bush which isn't even the one they're really after would be ludicrous. 

Edited by Kvothe, 12 March 2015 - 12:42.

[Morgan00]

I would argue the first race of the season is always a lottery, in terms of point results or podiums. The fastest driver in the fastest car without any problems will generally waltz it to the finishing line first, but when you have brand new cars being driven in angst for the first time, there's usually a major qualifying shock or mistake, cars that break down, race incidents and crashes due to rustiness, overeager rookies eager to make their mark with absolutely no f1 racing experience,  and not forgetting scandals and shocks which can affect race results posthumously (liegate, fuel flow), that all contribute into making the first race a lottery. 2008 with only 7 cars (off the top of my head) finishing the first race is a good example, 2009 with Lewis nearly getting the silver donkey on the podium or even last year with both McLarens on the podium which they never achieved again. I think for any team to throw awary a potential bird in the hand for a bird in the bush which isn't even the one they're really after would be ludicrous. 

 

I understand your point, which is a good one. However, even though I am hoping for the best, I just don't think the team will be anywhere near the top spots. I think the team knows this, and are therefore treating this race as a glorified test. And because of this one could argue that they won't go all in (both cars running on full power). I'm not sure I believe it is the case. But to write off the idea as ridiculous is wrong imo.

 

From Sky: 

 

Button, a three-time Melbourne winner, admits that it’s the longer-term targets which are the main focus at McLaren on the eve of race one.

“We want to win races and scraping into the points here doesn’t interest us whatsoever."

Edited by Morgan00, 12 March 2015 - 13:19.

[Jimisgod]

At least Kev is still on the radar.

I'm betting he'll out qualify Button.

[Kvothe]

I understand your point, which is a good one. However, even though I am hoping for the best, I just don't think the team will be anywhere near the top spots. I think the team knows this, and are therefore treating this race as a glorified test. And because of this one could argue that they won't go all in (both cars running on full power). I'm not sure I believe it is the case. But to write off the idea as ridiculous is wrong imo.

 

From Sky: 

That's a nice quote, but it makes no reference as to what time frame they are talking about, Their long term objective is to score wins, but their medium term objective might be to achieve a satisfactory position in the constructors, to ensure a solid foundation for next year. Plus I like to think scoring good points does come in between wins, and scrapping into the points which are the two extremes JB mentions.

 

I also think that if the team were to treat it as a test session surely it makes sense to run the engines to full power? They'll never get a real hold of the engine's potential or reliability limits if they run it on lower settings, especially if they believe they are going to retire anyway.

 

 

 

I

[MinT]

I don't think competition is on Buttons mind this weekend. He wants mileage and to rapidly improve the car.  For him the season will start when Alonso is back. KM has an unexpected chance in the limelight again so will want to impress potential employers.

[Clatter]

I don't think competition is on Buttons mind this weekend. He wants mileage and to rapidly improve the car.  For him the season will start when Alonso is back. KM has an unexpected chance in the limelight again so will want to impress potential employers.

Disagree there. The season will start for him, and whoever is in the other seat, when they have the PU running reliably and at full power.

[MinT]

Oh dear - not a great start for the lad.

 

Consolation is the car is so crap noone will probably notice

[Morgan00]

I don't think competition is on Buttons mind this weekend. He wants mileage and to rapidly improve the car.  For him the season will start when Alonso is back. KM has an unexpected chance in the limelight again so will want to impress potential employers.

 

Perhaps he tried too hard   Anyway, a bad time for a mistake like that. 

[kosmos]

If both drivers DNF in the race, what should I do?, give the point to the one that lasted more laps?.

[Morgan00]

If both drivers DNF in the race, what should I do?, give the point to the one that lasted more laps?.

 

At the moment it looks like it's a question of when and not if     

[KongKurs]

Kevin needs to stop taking the blame for everything and go more "What's wrong with this car?!" just like eeeeevery other driver does.

He's a too humble and nice guy, hope they appreciate it.

[MinT]

more like point to the driver that actually manages to start the race

[sopa]

At least Kevin and Jenson have a great memory of finishing 2nd and 3rd in this race a year ago. So while they have nothing else to do this weekend, while sitting on the sidelines after car problems, at least they can recall good things from the past.

[kraduk]

The only good thing to come out of macca's woes at the moment is that at least the OP graphic will never have to be updated 

[kosmos]

 

 

 

Congrats to Jenson, sadly there is nothing to be happy.

[ButtonForEver]

Apart from the "qualifying and race" all others will remain at zero..

[MinT]

Magnussen must be very relieved he didn't get the race seat....

[topical]

Magnussen must be very relieved he didn't get the race seat....

 

He shouldn't count his chickens yet....Alonso might decide that his concussion is a lot worse than it seemed...

[Stallknecht]

In a post Q interview with danish tv Kevin said that PU problems what the reason he didn't beat button. AND that the team knows this.

[MinT]

"The team knows this" - sounds a bit desparate. Newsflash - the team already made its decision.....

[trogggy]

In a post Q interview with danish tv Kevin said that PU problems what the reason he didn't beat button. AND that the team knows this.

Kev:

Things were going well on my first run in Q1. Then, on my second run, I had a slight problem with the engine – it didn’t really matter, as we’d have needed a bit of luck to get into Q2.