18 replies to this topic

[mdaclarke]

If Alonso races in Malaysia then there will be 9 Grand Prix winners on the grid.  Is this a record?  If not what is the record?

[mdaclarke]

No worries.  I done a bit of research.  It was Belgian and Spanish Grand Prix 1978 both with 15.  Guess 9 isn't even close.  

Edited by mdaclarke, 20 March 2015 - 21:02.

[TheSnowman]

No worries.  I done a bit of research.  It was Belgian and Spanish Grand Prix 1978 both with 15.  Guess 9 isn't even close.  

78 had one of the strongest fields in F1 history. When you look at the great drivers that was racing that season it's amazing. Hunt, Fittipaldi and Lauda were already champions, Andretti became a champion and there were future champions like Rosberg, Piquet, Jones and a few more. Added to that there were the likes of Villeneuve and Peterson. I remember reading an F1 Racing article about the Austrian Grand in 1978, and there was something like 20 drivers that had won, or would win races on the grid

 

Some people say we have a great bunch at the present with all the champions, but 1978 takes some beating.

Edited by TheSnowman, 20 March 2015 - 21:27.

[pathogen]

No worries.  I done a bit of research.  It was Belgian and Spanish Grand Prix 1978 both with 15.  Guess 9 isn't even close.  

Let's see: Andretti, Peterson, Scheckter, (Depailler wins Mónaco 78), Reutemann, (Villeneuve wins Canada 78), Laffite, Hunt, Nilsson, Jones, Fittipaldi, Watson, Mass, Lauda, Regazzoni, Ickx. did I loose someone? The Golden 70's

[pathogen]

and in terms of Teams... Ferrari, Lotus, Brabham, McLaren, Shadow, Ligier, March, Tyrrell, Hesketh, Wolf. 10 teams with one victory at least.

[jjcale]

78 had one of the strongest fields in F1 history. When you look at the great drivers that was racing that season it's amazing. Hunt, Fittipaldi and Lauda were already champions, Andretti became a champion and there were future champions like Rosberg, Piquet, Jones and a few more. Added to that there were the likes of Villeneuve and Peterson. I remember reading an F1 Racing article about the Austrian Grand in 1978, and there was something like 20 drivers that had won, or would win races on the grid

 

Some people say we have a great bunch at the present with all the champions, but 1978 takes some beating.

 

Stronger field or more equal cars .... if cars were more equal today I could see NH, VB, SP all being race winners

[pathogen]

Stronger field or more equal cars .... if cars were more equal today I could see NH, VB, SP all being race winners

I can see your point. I think both... a very high standar in drivers quality and equal cars with the Cosworth + Ferrari + Alfa Romeo cast in terms of motorist. The point is that Jones has his chance in a Shadow in Austria 77 and Scheckter won Argentina GP in the very first race of Walter Wolf Team. Some kind of balance of power on the grid.

[RubberKubrick]

Let's see: Andretti, Peterson, Scheckter, (Depailler wins Mónaco 78), Reutemann, (Villeneuve wins Canada 78), Laffite, Hunt, Nilsson, Jones, Fittipaldi, Watson, Mass, Lauda, Regazzoni, Ickx. did I loose someone? The Golden 70's

 

Impressive list.

 

But I think that the absolutely best of the 80's (Senna, Prost, Piquet, Mansell) were overall (maybe easily) better than the absolutely best of the 70's (Stewart, Lauda, Fittipaldi), though. And they drove against each other as teammates (Senna/Prost, Mansell/Piquet, Mansell/Prost) whereas in the 70's? Not even once for only one season, we saw Stewart/Lauda or Stewart/Fittipaldi or Lauda/Fittipaldi as teammates. For me, that's kinda less fascinating.

 

On the other hand, what makes the 70's look great again, is, if you add those drivers to the champ drivers' list who were considered great but didn't become champs (e.g. 70's Peterson, Reutemann, Villeneuve vs. 80's Berger, Patrese). Then the 70's list becomes overall more impressive again than that of the 80's or than the lists of other decades.

Edited by RubberKubrick, 20 March 2015 - 22:44.

[pathogen]

Impressive list.

 

But I think that the absolutely best of the 80's (Senna, Prost, Piquet, Mansell) were overall (maybe easily) better than the absolutely best of the 70's (Stewart, Lauda, Fittipaldi), though. And they drove against each other as teammates (Senna/Prost, Mansell/Piquet, Mansell/Prost) whereas in the 70's? Not even once for only one season, we saw Stewart/Lauda or Stewart/Fittipaldi or Lauda/Fittipaldi as teammates. For me, that's kinda less fascinating.

 

On the other hand, what makes the 70's look great again, is, if you add those drivers to the champ drivers' list who were considered great but didn't become champs (e.g. 70's Peterson, Reutemann, Villeneuve vs. 80's Berger, Patrese). Then the 70's list becomes overall more impressive again than that of the 80's or than the lists of other decades.

 

I see. My problem with the ‘best of the 80's is that the group was always incomplete. I always imagined to be able to see the Prost, Senna, Piquet, Mansell, racing against Villeneuve, Pironi, De Angelis and the same Sheckter, who retired at age 30. IMO, the 80's stars group was always a incomplete generation. And personally I never really felt the interest on interim battles.

[mdaclarke]

The teams seemed more equal back then.  i would love to have been around in 1978 to have seen the races as they were more competitive. Although that would mean I would be in my 40s or 50s now       

[Risil]

Stronger field or more equal cars .... if cars were more equal today I could see NH, VB, SP all being race winners

 

Romain Grosjean too. He was the man in the second half of 2013.

[DampMongoose]

The last few races of 82 must have had a number of race winners present given 11 different drivers won races that year.

[Scuderia312]

Romain Grosjean too. He was the man in the second half of 2013.

Despite paydrivers etc I doubt there was a more competitive field of drivers than today. The difference between first and 15th in terms of driving is not one of light years.

[Baddoer]

Quite interesting, 78 Spanish grand prix finishing order top 10 all were race winners. Also record?

[Myrvold]

The last few races of 82 must have had a number of race winners present given 11 different drivers won races that year.

 

But never more than 12 in the same race. Actually, Alboreto won the last race of the season (his first), so it was never more than 11 drivers with a win starting any of the races in 82.

[DampMongoose]

But never more than 12 in the same race. Actually, Alboreto won the last race of the season (his first), so it was never more than 11 drivers with a win starting any of the races in 82.

Agreed, I think by the end of the year 16 former winners had taken part and mansell a future winner. I think reutemann retired early and a few others didn't run all races.

[Risil]

And the death and injury of the two Ferrari drivers midseason. A great year for F1, if at the time you weren't following it.

Edited by Risil, 21 March 2015 - 13:28.

[DampMongoose]

1982 was crap at the time. The cars back with legalised ground effects after years of illegal 'when running ' cars, Villeneuve and Palletti, Arnouxs lucky one at the dutch gp, and Mass luckily not injuring anyone when his car ended up amongst the spectators at Paul Ricard. Pironi at Hockenheim and cars generally awful to drive according to the drivers. On top of the races that weren't races etc... Not good at the time really.

[sopa]

The good side of 1970s and early 1980s was that even if teams weren't performing close on track (Renault dominating on fast turbo-circuits, Lotus in 1978, etc), the fluctuations across seasons were huge. Lotus may have been dominating in 1978, but they were nowhere in 1979 and even more so in 1980. Ferrari won in 1979, but was nowhere in 1980, etc. Even teams like Wolf or Penske could rise to become race-winning teams for a season or two.

 

This also enabled lots of drivers to win races, because even if one year your car was uncompetitive, you could hope next year was different. It is sort of like if we had 2012-kind of seasons each year, and Saubers, Toro Rossos and Force Indias of this world would win races.

 

But reality is that nowadays we have very clear "classes" of teams, which remain stagnant over a long period of time. Red Bull won the title for 4 consecutive years. Now Mercedes is dominating for multiple seasons with no-one else getting a look in.

 

As somebody said, if team performances and also unreliability were fluctuating as they did in 70s/early 80s, Bottas, Hulkenberg, Perez, Grosjean would certainly be among race winners.