122 replies to this topic

[SCUDmissile]

For current rules, keep DRS.

 

If we go back to more ground effects, ban it as it won't be needed.

 

This basically. Ground effects or fan cars keep the downforce under the car rather than above it. The original rules for 2013/14 sounded so good...

 

It makes more sense now because the argument about if the car goes off track the break of seal and loss of downforce which previously would be dangerous may not be now because of the run-off. At least not to the same extent surely?

[johnmhinds]

Ditch it ASAP. DRS killed off all defensive driving in F1.

 

While it has created more passing it hasn't created more interesting racing, it just allows the cars to quickly filter into order of the cars performance each weekend.

 

I'd much rather have someone get stuck behind a slower driver for a few laps with them battling for the position and watching them outbreak themselves to get an advantage instead of watching a bunch of boring uncontested passes half way down the main straight.

 

Sometimes the guy behind wont get past, but so what? We still got to watch them racing together.

 

These days everyone is 10-20+ seconds down the road from each other unless we get a safety car to close up the pack.

Edited by johnmhinds, 23 April 2015 - 23:15.

[Menace]

 

 

I'd much rather have someone get stuck behind a slower driver for a few laps with them battling for the position and watching them outbreak themselves to get an advantage instead of watching a bunch of boring uncontested passes half way down the main straight.

 

Sometimes the guy behind wont get past, but so what? We still got to watch them racing together.

 

 

You mean just like what happened between Bottas and Vettel?

[fridge46]

I somewhat like DRS, but as already outlined numerous times, its implementation is serioues flawed - either placed where it was already possible to overtake (Spa, Monza already mentioned), or in a position where the overtaker subsequently can be overtaken during the next straight (ie Malaysia).

 

How I would deal with DRS:

 

- a driver can use DRS at any time during the race when over a second behind the car a position ahead. This allows cars to be closer to each other (if they want!) and not have huge gaps half way through a race.

- when under a second behind (or if leading), drivers have limited use of DRS (ie can be used X times, or X seconds, during a race). This allows the leader to defend when attacked or to extend their lead at an appropriate part of the race (before pit stops, on fresh tyres, or if key opponent is stuck behind another car). It also allows following cars to attempt an overtake at any point they see fit!

 

For those that dont want overtakes done via DRS, maybe allow drivers to increase their fuel rate (for X seconds over a race) when within a certain distance behind car ahead (or to defend) instead.

[sergey1308]

When you say they've tried to fix it, what exactly have they done? They certainly talked about it a lot, but there was never any change that made people remotely optimistic that it was a change that would help overtaking. People have always said things like - reduce the reliance on aero grip v mechanical grip, and go back to ground effect. Have they made any significant move in this direction in the last 20 years? I don't think so.

I haven't seen formula 1 in that time yet. I mean when ground effect was allowed. Do ground effect can help to increase number of overtakes and make close battle possible?

[SenorSjon]

I liked the WSR version of it where you had xxx seconds/race DRS. No zones or other fancy stuff. You could save it up for later or spend it at the first laps to gain position. 

[PlatenGlass]

I haven't seen formula 1 in that time yet. I mean when ground effect was allowed. Do ground effect can help to increase number of overtakes and make close battle possible?

Well they had it in the early 80s. But cars were generally able to follow each other better around that time anyway so the fact that they could isn't proof. The main point is that this, and generally reducing reliance on aero grip have been talked about as potential solutions for years, but nothing has ever been done. They haven't tried anything, and yet they still thought it was acceptable to go to the "last resort" of DRS.

[noikeee]

Well they had it in the early 80s. But cars were generally able to follow each other better around that time anyway so the fact that they could isn't proof. The main point is that this, and generally reducing reliance on aero grip have been talked about as potential solutions for years, but nothing has ever been done. They haven't tried anything, and yet they still thought it was acceptable to go to the "last resort" of DRS.

 

The massive, highly expensive 2009 regulation changes were all about fixing the aero. Winglets were banned, the dimensions of cars and wings were changed dramatically, etc. It didn't work at all.

[Sanzx81]

Quite frankly I'm amazed how close the poll is, I totally expected it to be 90%+ for banning it.

Guess I know nothing.. Wow

[johnmhinds]

The massive, highly expensive 2009 regulation changes were all about fixing the aero. Winglets were banned, the dimensions of cars and wings were changed dramatically, etc. It didn't work at all.

 

Because making bigger front wings and smaller rear wings was never the correct solution.

 

If the whole issue is cars losing front grip when following close behind another car, then how was making the cars more reliant on bigger front wings for their grip meant to fix that?!?!? 

[Atreiu]

Quite frankly I'm amazed how close the poll is, I totally expected it to be 90%+ for banning it.

Guess I know nothing.. Wow

 

People bitch and moan, but in the end they get used to anything.

[wrcva]

Quite frankly I'm amazed how close the poll is, I totally expected it to be 90%+ for banning it.

Guess I know nothing.. Wow

 

Yes, pretty surprising...   My guess is how you feel about DRS is correlated with how long you have been following F1.  Shorter length -->  more positive...

[Menace]

Yes, pretty surprising...   My guess is how you feel about DRS is correlated with how long you have been following F1.  Shorter length -->  more positive...

 

I have been following since 1993.  I prefer DRS with the current cars.  

[RealRacing]

Because making bigger front wings and smaller rear wings was never the correct solution.

 

If the whole issue is cars losing front grip when following close behind another car, then how was making the cars more reliant on bigger front wings for their grip meant to fix that?!?!? 

I think the problem has more to do with the turbulence created by the car in front as a whole (what is the main culprit, front or back wing or floor or diffuser or other I don't know). Imagine if the very complicated front wing, which, AFAIU, helps to increase front grip, is not enough to compensate, how a simpler wing may fare? But yeah, the solution should aim at reducing the turbulence created by the leading car, not trying to increase grip with a huge, ridiculous, costly, ugly, easy-to-break so not racing friendly, front wing. It shouldn't be surprising though, as we already know that F1's bosses are the kings of the patch solution. DRS may be the best example. 

[RealRacing]

Yes, pretty surprising...   My guess is how you feel about DRS is correlated with how long you have been following F1.  Shorter length -->  more positive...

Not necessarily how long you've been watching, but how well you understand racing.

[HeadFirst]

get rid of DRS and wings and all the overblown aerostuff .... back to groundeffect!

Replace the overblown aerostuff with the underblown aerostuff.

[HeadFirst]

Quite frankly I'm amazed how close the poll is, I totally expected it to be 90%+ for banning it.

Guess I know nothing.. Wow

Some people see that despite the negatives regarding DRS, it does limit the likelihood of a faster car being held up behind a mid-packer.

[Sanzx81]

Some people see that despite the negatives regarding DRS, it does limit the likelihood of a faster car being held up behind a mid-packer.

True but I found that amusing at times, I have to embarrassingly admit I was howling with laughter when DC was stuck behind an arrows for 44 laps at Monaco.

[johnmhinds]

People have been saying that DC getting stuck behind a slower Arrows is an example of something that DRS "fixed".

 

But is that incident really an example of bad racing, or bad entertainment for the fans? It was still fun to watch wasn't it?

 

We still remember it all these years later, unlike every DRS pass that has been forgotten before the race is over.

Edited by johnmhinds, 24 April 2015 - 18:50.

[PlatenGlass]

The massive, highly expensive 2009 regulation changes were all about fixing the aero. Winglets were banned, the dimensions of cars and wings were changed dramatically, etc. It didn't work at all.

They may have said that was the reason. But I don't recall anyone being optimistic. I don't recall at any point anyone implementing changes that anyone thought might actually work. Then they just threw their hands up and introduced DRS.

[Frank Tuesday]

DRS is one of the reasons I quit watching F1. I watched every race for 25 years, so I haven't broken free completely.  I still read the news and the board hoping that F1 will start doing right things and get me watching again. 

Edited by Frank Tuesday, 25 April 2015 - 01:22.

[BRK]

Didn't want it when it was introduced, don't want it now.

 

Edit: voted the wrong choice by mistake. 

Edited by BRK, 25 April 2015 - 02:07.

[REDalert]

Didn't want it at first place, but now I'm not completely against it anymore. Just reduce the affect to half what it is and it would give some extra spice without making things too easy.