Sauber might be facing yet another lawsuit case, this time against Sutil at Spanish GP.
http://thisisf1.com/...against-sauber/
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:11
Sauber might be facing yet another lawsuit case, this time against Sutil at Spanish GP.
http://thisisf1.com/...against-sauber/
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:14
You reap what you sew.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:20
Maybe the fact that they "settled" with GVDG has given Sutil's legal team hope that they might do the same, and with Bottas now back to full fitness he isn't going to get much seat time.......
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:26
Bring on the popcorn!
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:30
These guys need to stop breaking contracts, or start only signing late short term contracts. How much money did they gain by taking Nasr over Van der Garde, and having paid VdG €15m, was that still a profitable transaction?
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:35
Bring on the popcorn!
I think it will be less enjoyable than the Van der Garde-saga, because VdG only pursued matters in Australia (far away from Europe and Switzerland), because he really wanted to drive. Sutil, I think, will have accepted that he won't drive, knew he was going for a financial settlement and then it was a better idea, IMHO, to wait for the European season. It is, for example, much easier, to seize Saubers assets in Europe...
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:35
These guys need to stop breaking contracts, or start only signing late short term contracts. How much money did they gain by taking Nasr over Van der Garde, and having paid VdG €15m, was that still a profitable transaction?
Nasr already got points, while vdg is pretty useless. Those WDC points are probably enough to swing it in Nasr's favor. They also probably didn't expect to have to pay vdg back so much.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:42
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:46
It's interesting how much money does he demand. Can it lead to Sauber bankruptcy? Also maybe someone else has a contract with Sauber, who knows.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:57
Oh yeah. Sauber shenanigans round #2.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 10:58
It's interesting how much money does he demand. Can it lead to Sauber bankruptcy? Also maybe someone else has a contract with Sauber, who knows.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 11:06
You reap what you sew.
A knitted jumper?
Been expecting to see some news on the Sutil/Sauber situation for a while. Let's face, once they were forced into paying out for GvdG it was only a matter of time before the Sutil situation came to a head.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 11:26
It should be easy for Sauber to afford to pay all the signed drivers, they just need to get four or five title sponsors.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 11:30
Posted 27 April 2015 - 11:54
I rarely side with management, but I hope sauber defends this successfully. Sutil is a THUG plain and simple.
He's a thug for trying to obtain what is legally his?
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:04
He's a thug for trying to obtain what is legally his?
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:05
I rarely side with management, but I hope sauber defends this successfully. Sutil is a THUG plain and simple.
Whist he does seem to be a bit of an abrasive chap sometimes , the fact is, if his situation vis-a-vis a contract to drive for Sauber proves to be the same as GvdD, he needs to win. If only to make Sauber and and the other teams more aware that ripping of Drivers has to stop. If he does win then I think there is no option for management to stay the same in the team.
Anyone details of court a appearance etc?
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:26
No, he's a thug for stabbing a guy.
Are we all being judged forever by the one single worst thing we've done in our lives then?
I'm certainly a cock (and worse) by that measure. You?
Edited by trogggy, 27 April 2015 - 12:28.
Advertisement
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:26
this should have been done AGES ago not during the seasson going on as we speak
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:27
this should have been done AGES ago not during the seasson going on as we speak
Who are you blaming for that?
Sutil?
Sauber?
Lawyers?
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:40
Maybe the fact that they "settled" with GVDG has given Sutil's legal team hope that they might do the same, and with Bottas now back to full fitness he isn't going to get much seat time.......
Posted 27 April 2015 - 12:56
I was thinking that. You would have thought if Sutil had a case it would have been brought up earlier in the year. Perhaps he's just a little opportunistic.
An opportunistic F1 driver? Stop the press.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 13:19
Not a big fan of Sutil as a driver and not a big fan of him as a person after the stabbing incident but IF he has a legally binding contract just as VDG had he has my full support!
Posted 27 April 2015 - 13:35
Who are you blaming for that?
Sutil?
Sauber?
Lawyers?
Posted 27 April 2015 - 13:58
this should have been done AGES ago not during the seasson going on as we speak
From memory, Sutil's been pursuing this for a while. He's in a similar position to what vdG was: he's been seeking what's rightfully his and doing what he can through the legal system before the season started, but Sauber have been stonewalling. One of the key hold ups that both drivers faced is that technically Sauber weren't in breach of contracts with Sutil and vdG until they actually put drivers in the car at Australia. So the serious legal work couldn't start until the season had started.
The key difference between vdG and Sutil is that Sutil has taken the approach of seeking compensation right from the start, so in his case there's not as much urgency and his case won't be rushed into court. Because vdG was hoping to have his contract enforced and actually drive the car, he needed urgent injunctions and got the court time as a result.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 14:00
I was thinking that. You would have thought if Sutil had a case it would have been brought up earlier in the year. Perhaps he's just a little opportunistic.
It's not opportunistic if you wanted to get compensated for what was legally yours.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 14:16
As long as the settlement has 'can never return to F1' written into it ill be happy.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 14:22
I am amazed he had as long a career as he did.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 14:34
this should have been done AGES ago not during the seasson going on as we speak
Posted 27 April 2015 - 14:57
From memory, Sutil's been pursuing this for a while. He's in a similar position to what vdG was: he's been seeking what's rightfully his and doing what he can through the legal system before the season started, but Sauber have been stonewalling. One of the key hold ups that both drivers faced is that technically Sauber weren't in breach of contracts with Sutil and vdG until they actually put drivers in the car at Australia. So the serious legal work couldn't start until the season had started.
The key difference between vdG and Sutil is that Sutil has taken the approach of seeking compensation right from the start, so in his case there's not as much urgency and his case won't be rushed into court. Because vdG was hoping to have his contract enforced and actually drive the car, he needed urgent injunctions and got the court time as a result.
So if I understand this correctly, its going to be harder to get an injunction for Sutil , as so far Sauber are just not really negotiating , just ignoring him, there is no binding arbitration in place, so unless Sutil can force it into court then it could be a long drawn out process.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 14:59
Normally, these sorts of things are one-offs, but it's getting to the point that Sauber will face a class action.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:00
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:00
This isn't actually a new story and Sutil seizing the opportunity. Almost immediately after Sauber announced their 2015 plans, he publicly announced he had what he felt was a binding contract and he would be seeking legal advice/taking action. He's just been more patient and restrained than VDG until now.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:01
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:05
Answer to that is presumably that the CRB recognises that he is not a Sauber driver this year. And if so, what is he on about here ?
The CRB recognises that the fact of the situation is that Sauber and Sutil no longer have a valid contract and that Sutil has, as a result, obtained a contract with another team. They're not particularly concerned (rightly or wrongly) about the facts of how the contract with Sauber became void. The CRB is *not* a factor in whether or not Sauber breached their contract with Sutil, nor whether Sutil is entitled to damages as a result of a breach. That is a matter for legal courts.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:05
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:09
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:21
I rarely side with management, but I hope sauber defends this successfully. Sutil is a THUG plain and simple.
yes hes sooo thug
Advertisement
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:35
yes hes sooo thug
https://www.youtube....h?v=0VkRgUcP_rM
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:43
Clear that Sauber is badly managed, but who can weep for Sutil ? He had his time in F1 - and committed GBH in the meantime. We cannot have drivers who literally stab people; verbally stabbing people is quite bad enough.
And yes, committing a criminal act should follow you throughout your life.
There is a tremendous amount of false reasoning going in this thread - already, like in the other Sauber-saga. Van der Garde has no right to pursue his rights, because he is a bad driver. Sutil has no right to pursue his rights because he is a thug/criminal/convict of assault. Van der Garde has no right to pursue his rights, because he waited until the beginning of the season (not true). Sutil has no right to pursue to pursue his rights because he waited for so long. Sutil has no right to pursue to pursue his rights because was 'meh' during his career.
When are people going to get it in their thick skulls that laws are not subject to anyone's opinion or even conviction (by law) about the person pursuing that right. Even a pedophile (to mention the one person who everybody would like to deny his individual rights) has the right, for example, to sue the prison he is imprisoned in if that prison is denying him rights that are given to his fellow inmates.
Sutils past, Sutils career, Sutils walk, Sutils helmet, Sutils hair, Sutils stabbing someone in the throat have NOTHING to do with the fact whether he has a valid contract with Sauber - or not. I am not a mean person, but posters who keep posting stuff that flout this basic truth, well, I wish in some magic way they will one day be a Josef K. themselves. See how that feels.
Edited by Nemo1965, 27 April 2015 - 16:30.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:47
What does a thug look like to you?
Anyway. How many more legal actions can sauber manage this season.
My point was he's no thug by any means.
No, he's a thug for stabbing a guy.
He didn't "stab" anybody. stabbing and glassing are two different things
Edited by MikeV1987, 27 April 2015 - 15:49.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:53
Can we leave Sutil's history other than relating to this potential legal action out from this thread, please? I opened it for the reason to follow and discuss how this saga between Sauber and Sutil will develop and would like not to see it been closed down due to arguing about Sutil's personality and other actions.
Thanks for your co-operation.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 15:55
... well, I wish in some magic way they will one day be a Josef K themselves. See how that feels.
Congratulations on single handedly raising the cultural and literary standards of this forum with that reference!
Posted 27 April 2015 - 16:12
Good, I assume he has a strong case with his 2015 contract. Hopefully Sauber now knows, and F1 in general, that contracts need to be respected and that signing 4 or 5 drivers just to get cash upfront is never appropriate. Even though I don't really like Sutil, I've already lost all my respect for Sauber in how they handled the GvdG case..
Posted 27 April 2015 - 16:21
The story in Turun Sanomat, that was referenced in the OP story suggested that Sauber also had / has a contract with Jules Bianchi.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 16:23
Has Sauber F1 commented on this in the press over the last week or so? They must see this as a potential train wreck and surely need to deal with this before it gets real exposure, I would think some of there present sponsors must be getting a little uncomfortable with the possibility of a lot more pooh flying around.
Peter Sauber had such a good rep before all this , if this blows up he must try and deal with KL and her 30%, If it was me I would sell and let KL go down, unless they have another 15 mil to pay Sutil that is.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 16:24
Can we leave Sutil's history other than relating to this potential legal action out from this thread, please? I opened it for the reason to follow and discuss how this saga between Sauber and Sutil will develop and would like not to see it been closed down due to arguing about Sutil's personality and other actions.
Thanks for your co-operation.
Please do respect this request, folks.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 16:59
This was one of KL Quotes last year relating to Sutil's and other contracts.
"Not only that, Kaltenborn -- referring at the time to the sport generally -- reportedly said in Austin early this month that "contracts in F1 are worth nothing."
I think the last nothing Sauber contract paid 15 mil and maybe the same for Sutil's contract.
Posted 27 April 2015 - 17:00
As with Giedo, I'm no fan of Adrian, but if this is what it takes to make teams deal honestly with the drivers, then it has to be done.
I know that that teams are on the brink of survival, but screwing drivers is not the answer - obtaining equitable distribution of the commercial revenues of the sport should be enough to ensure that the sport is funded for survival.