30 replies to this topic

[Clrnc]

I have seen so many threads and debates about the quality of a driver as compared to another one. I'm interested to know the general consensus about which tier a driver belong to. Just reply to the thread in this format and I will compile the final result. All these is taken into account the qualifying pace, general race pace and racecraft you think a driver have. Feel free to give some reasons why you think someone belong to the lower tier instead of the top. 

 

Here's mine.

 

Tier 1 (Best of the lot)

Hamilton, Vettel, Alonso

 

Tier 2 (A fast driver on his day, just shy of the very top)

Button, Ricciardo, Raikkonen, Rosberg, Bottas, Hulkenberg, Bianchi

 

Tier 3 (Fast enough to be in f1, but still too many flaws in certain aspect/too early to call)

Perez, Massa, Nasr, Grosjean, Verstappen, Sainz, Kvyat, Maldonado, Magnussen, Stevens

 

Tier 4 (Out of his depth, totally don't belong to f1)

Ericsson, Merhi

Edited by Clrnc, 10 May 2015 - 15:11.

[redraven9]

Tier 1
The champions (except Keke Rosberg and J. Villeneuve)

 

Tier 2

The rest
 

Edited by redraven9, 09 May 2015 - 17:22.

[sennafan24]

Of the drivers I have observed in my lifetime.

 

Tier 1:  Senna, Alonso, Prost, Lewis, Schumi (maybe in that order, I find it hard to rank 2-4)

 

Tier 2:  Mansell, Button, Seb, Kimi, Mika, Hill, Piquet (probably not in that order)

 

Tier 3: J.V, Rosberg, Berger JPM, Kubica, Hulk, Alesi, Frentzen, D.C, Massa, Brundle, Webber, Rubens (maybe in that order, give or take)

 

D.R still needs a few years. If he retired today, I would put him top of tier 3, or maybe towards the back-end of tier 2. 

 

Edit: I left a few names out who probably deserve a mention.

Edited by sennafan24, 09 May 2015 - 17:44.

[BlackCat]

Tier 1

The champions (except Button and Schumacher)

Tier 2

GP winners

Tier 3

The rest

[hittheapex]

I broadly agree with your list, Clrnc. Tier 1 for drivers that were the best or equal best of their generation. I wouldn't put Hakkinen in there though. He made too many mistakes, but he was still very good indeed.

 

Tier 2-I'd put another tier in between yours for champions who though excellent were arguably probably not the best on the grid. Hakkinen, Damon Hill, Button etc.

 

So I'd make your Tier 2 my Tier 3. For drivers who were very good, won races and could have or did compete for championships when the cards were right or with a little bit of luck. Coulthard, Montoya, Webber, Berger etc.

 

Tier 4-Consistent drivers bringing good points for the team, occasional podiums. Such as Brundle, Heidfeld, Johansson, Kovalainen

 

Tier 5-Drivers who probably can't or didn't have a full career in F1. Either not quick enough to stay around for more than a few years/in and out, or drivers with a turn of pace but too erratic or crash prone.  I'm thinking of those such as Pedro Diniz, Kazuki Nakajima,

 

Tier 6-Those who proved so uncompetitive they were shown the door almost immediately-Ide, Nissany, etc.

Edited by hittheapex, 09 May 2015 - 17:31.

[Collombin]

All time tiers are necessarily at a higher level than tiers of a particular era. Different people will respond differently. End results: messy.

[Bob Riebe]

Tier 1

A.J, Foyt, Jim Clark,  Unser brothers, Parnelli Jones, J. Rutherford, Mario Andretti, Dave Pearson....

 

Tier 2

Who gives a damn.

[Jackmancer]

Tier 1
The champions (except Keke Rosberg and J. Villeneuve)

 

Tier 2

The rest
 

 

Stirling Moss????

[RSNS]

Of those I saw racing, the one that stood furthest amongts the rest was Schumacher; and, next to him, Stewart.
I understand both Fangio and Clark were simililarly above the rest.

In terms of admiration, Fangio (big accident in Monza, came back and won repeatedly) and, above all, Lauda, that came back still bleeding, come topmost.

Senna doesn't really feature in my book. He was fast in qualifying, but defensive in races (except under rain).

Villeneuve and Peterson were impressive.

So, in terms of 'tiers':
Fangio, Clark, Stewart, Schumacher.

[sennafan24]

Senna doesn't really feature in my book. He was fast in qualifying, but defensive in races (except under rain).

Still effective though.

 

You don't beat Prost 14-6 when both finish without being something special. A lot of the "defensiveness" you speak of, was Senna nursing wounded cars home, something he was exceptional at. Senna was also excellent at controlling races, and ensuring he finished ahead.

 

If Senna had a flaw in race trim, it was getting mixed up in occasional silly incidents. In those scenarios, he should have been more calculated. The same applies for Monaco 1988 and Italy 1988, where Prost played him like a piano.

[PlatenGlass]

Since I've been watching (approximately chronological within the tiers - I'm not checking exact starting dates):

Tier 1: Senna, Schumacher, Alonso, Hamilton
Tier 2: Piquet, Rosberg, Prost, Mansell, Hakkinen, Button, Raikkonen, Vettel

I think that's enough for now.

As for Prost - I don't think he'd realistically live with the tier 1 drivers with good reliability all round. Yes it was one title all with Senna, but then Lauda beat him in 1984 despite not being in the same league. It happens. And Rosberg - I think he was pretty good before he went to McLaren.

And something similar to what sennafan24 said about Riccardo. I'm not sticking him in based on perceived potential. And all this comes with the caveat that F1 and motor racing is not remotely a meritocracy and it's impossible to really judge drivers properly.

[MastaKink]

Of the drivers I have observed in my lifetime.

 

Tier 1:  Senna, Alonso, Prost, Lewis, Schumi (maybe in that order, I find it hard to rank 2-4)

 

Tier 2:  Mansell, Button, Seb, Kimi, Mika, Hill, Piquet (probably not in that order)

 

Tier 3: J.V, Rosberg, Berger JPM, Kubica, Hulk, Alesi, Frentzen, D.C, Massa, Brundle, Webber, Rubens (maybe in that order, give or take)

 

D.R still needs a few years. If he retired today, I would put him top of tier 3, or maybe towards the back-end of tier 2. 

 

Edit: I left a few names out who probably deserve a mention.

 

This looks pretty much what i would come up with.  I'd probably add Kubica to that floating tier with DR.  I've got nothing to prove it but i just feel they are a step above those in Tier 3 but lack the resume of the Tier 2 guys and above.

[Clrnc]

Surprised so many people puts Mika in the 2nd tier. I think at his best he is unbeatable. 

 

Seb in tier 2 is surprising as well given his achievements. No way should Rosberg and Vettel be in the same tier. 

[Nemo1965]

I find lists like these hard to make, because many of the older drivers - Clark, Stewart, Fangio, Moss - were either dead or seriously injured when they made a grave mistake. In the seventies it was still bad but slowly drivers starting to survive accidents in which a predecessor of a couple of years would have perished. A big difference was made after the rule-changes for safety in the early nineties.

 

So for me: Clark was the best ever. Schumacher, Senna, Prost, Vettel or Hamilton do not get close because they can survive stupid mistakes, of themselves of others, and also mechanical mishap (although in the end that was what 'got' Clark...)

[brr]

Is it already the "I'll create an arbitrary driver ranking and sneak my favourite driver in the top tier" time of the year?

[velgajski1]

Tier 1: My favorite drivers

Tier 2: Everyone else

[taziosenna881]

Kimi deserves to be in tier 1. When he is on it he is faster than Alonso than Hamilton. Much faster. It is flawed to logic that because of setup he cannot be in that group. We all saw his horrifying speed at McLaren. Tier 1 driver, regardless of the nonsense going on right now. 

Tier 1: Nuvolari, Senna, G Villeneuve, Clark, Peterson, Stewart, Raikkonen, Prost, Fangio, Moss, Alonso, M. Schumacher. 

 

I remember listening to JPM say that when Jackie Stewart tested an f3000 car he was 2 tenths faster than anyone on the day. He was utterly shocked.

[KTownDevil]

Tier 1: Schumacher, Senna, Fangio, Clark, Moss, G. Villeneuve, Prost, Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel, Bellof

 

The rest. 

[McLaren]

We have had so many of these threads recently... doesn't really need another so soon after the last.

[DrivenF1]

Kimi deserves to be in tier 1. When he is on it he is faster than Alonso than Hamilton. Much faster. It is flawed to logic that because of setup he cannot be in that group. We all saw his horrifying speed at McLaren. Tier 1 driver, regardless of the nonsense going on right now. 

Tier 1: Nuvolari, Senna, G Villeneuve, Clark, Peterson, Stewart, Raikkonen, Prost, Fangio, Moss, Alonso, M. Schumacher. 

 

I remember listening to JPM say that when Jackie Stewart tested an f3000 car he was 2 tenths faster than anyone on the day. He was utterly shocked.

 

Because of setup...? Seems like a catch-all excuse especially as everything can be blamed on set-up issues.

 

Raikkonen is good in the races but there's no evidence he's better than Alonso or Hamilton, especially in qualifying. In fact quite the opposite.

 

In fact, there is plenty of evidence that Raikkonen just isn't that fast in qualifying. He was slower than Nick Heidfeld over a season (7-10), Massa over their three seasons together (16-28), also Alonso (3-16). He was faster than Juan Pablo Montoya but Montoya was slower than R. Schumacher (28-32) and he hated the McLaren 2005 and 2006 cars. I think Kimi is a great driver but let's not flatter him based on little...

 

The best drivers I've seen live are Schumacher, Alonso and Hamilton. You can also add Fangio, Moss, Clark, Stewart, Senna and Prost to the list.

[DevilsCry]

Tier 1: Posters on other threads

Tier 2: Posters who took part in other driver tier threads

Tier 3: Posters who posted in this thread

[DrivenF1]

Tier 1: Posters on other threads

Tier 2: Posters who took part in other driver tier threads

Tier 3: Posters who posted in this thread

 

You forgot

 

Tier 4: Posters who only posted in this thread to complain about this thread existing in the first place.

 

If you don't like the thread, just do yourself a favour and do something else with your life  

Edited by Cult, 10 May 2015 - 11:25.

[DutchQuicksilver]

It's foolish to rate drivers of different era's into same tiers. Different era's, different cars, different circumstances, different fitness levels required etc. So I'll just post the drivers from the current season.

 

Tier 1 - Drivers with that bit of extra talent which makes them do something special which other drivers can't

Alonso, Hamilton, Raikkonen, Vettel

 

Raikkonen still belongs here. His speciality is his supreme race skill and tyre management as shown in 2012 and 2013, as well as Bahrain this year.

 

Tier 2 - Ideal second drivers to the tier 1 drivers, fast when they are on it, solid points scorers when not

Bottas, Button, Hulkenberg, Massa, Ricciardo, Rosberg

 

If Ricciardo can perform like he's doing now with that dog of a car, he's heading into tier 1 soon.

 

Tier 3 - Midfield drivers with occasional high's, but also occasional low's. These drivers are there to fill the grid

Grosjean, Kvyat, Maldonado, Pérez

 

Grosjean and Pérez still have the potential to grow into tier 2. Maldonado is in danger of falling into tier 4.

 

Tier 4 - Drivers who shouldn't be in F1 (anymore).

Ericsson, Merhi

 

Unknowns - drivers who just entered F1 and can't be judged yet

For newbies Nasr, Sainz, Stevens and Verstappen it's too soon to judge them. Nasr, Sainz and Verstappen all have potential for at least tier 3 and perhaps tier 2 as well. Stevens is a big question mark.

[Gorma]

Perhaps I should start a thread where drivers are ranked in to tiers, but instead of using number I'll use alphabets from A to D. I think it's what the forum is missing at the moment.

[DrivenF1]

Perhaps I should start a thread where drivers are ranked in to tiers, but instead of using number I'll use alphabets from A to D. I think it's what the forum is missing at the moment.

 

Tier D: Posters who only posted in this thread to complain about this thread existing in the first place.

 

It's foolish to rate drivers of different era's into same tiers. Different era's, different cars, different circumstances, different fitness levels required etc. So I'll just post the drivers from the current season.

 

Tier 1 - Drivers with that bit of extra talent which makes them do something special which other drivers can't

Alonso, Hamilton, Raikkonen, Vettel

 

Raikkonen still belongs here. His speciality is his supreme race skill and tyre management as shown in 2012 and 2013, as well as Bahrain this year.

 

Tier 2 - Ideal second drivers to the tier 1 drivers, fast when they are on it, solid points scorers when not

Bottas, Button, Hulkenberg, Massa, Ricciardo, Rosberg

 

If Ricciardo can perform like he's doing now with that dog of a car, he's heading into tier 1 soon.

 

Tier 3 - Midfield drivers with occasional high's, but also occasional low's. These drivers are there to fill the grid

Grosjean, Kvyat, Maldonado, Pérez

 

Grosjean and Pérez still have the potential to grow into tier 2. Maldonado is in danger of falling into tier 4.

 

Tier 4 - Drivers who shouldn't be in F1 (anymore).

Ericsson, Merhi

 

Unknowns - drivers who just entered F1 and can't be judged yet

For newbies Nasr, Sainz, Stevens and Verstappen it's too soon to judge them. Nasr, Sainz and Verstappen all have potential for at least tier 3 and perhaps tier 2 as well. Stevens is a big question mark.

 

I agree. Sainz and Verstappen have been impressive, could easily see one of them being tier 1/2 at some point.

[Collombin]

We have had so many of these threads recently... doesn't really need another so soon after the last.

I want a similar thread about circuits, just so that we can call it Tiers of my Tracks.

I'll get my coat.

[Clrnc]

It's foolish to rate drivers of different era's into same tiers. Different era's, different cars, different circumstances, different fitness levels required etc. So I'll just post the drivers from the current season.

 

Tier 1 - Drivers with that bit of extra talent which makes them do something special which other drivers can't

Alonso, Hamilton, Raikkonen, Vettel

 

Raikkonen still belongs here. His speciality is his supreme race skill and tyre management as shown in 2012 and 2013, as well as Bahrain this year.

 

Tier 2 - Ideal second drivers to the tier 1 drivers, fast when they are on it, solid points scorers when not

Bottas, Button, Hulkenberg, Massa, Ricciardo, Rosberg

 

If Ricciardo can perform like he's doing now with that dog of a car, he's heading into tier 1 soon.

 

Tier 3 - Midfield drivers with occasional high's, but also occasional low's. These drivers are there to fill the grid

Grosjean, Kvyat, Maldonado, Pérez

 

Grosjean and Pérez still have the potential to grow into tier 2. Maldonado is in danger of falling into tier 4.

 

Tier 4 - Drivers who shouldn't be in F1 (anymore).

Ericsson, Merhi

 

Unknowns - drivers who just entered F1 and can't be judged yet

For newbies Nasr, Sainz, Stevens and Verstappen it's too soon to judge them. Nasr, Sainz and Verstappen all have potential for at least tier 3 and perhaps tier 2 as well. Stevens is a big question mark.

I sort of agree with you actually, especially your tiers but Kimi  is really too subjective. It divides so much opinions.

 

Also agree with the historic drivers being too hard to rate. Changed it to only this season's grid

[aramos]

Kimi deserves to be in tier 1. When he is on it he is faster than Alonso than Hamilton. Much faster.

[emmanuelrubi]

Tier 1
The champions (except Button and Schumacher)
Tier 2
GP winners
Tier 3
The rest

Yes because Maldonado is on the same level as Ricciardo

[HoldenRT]

WTF is this trainwreck of a thread.

[SophieB]

I sort of agree with you actually, especially your tiers but Kimi  is really too subjective. It divides so much opinions.

 

Also agree with the historic drivers being too hard to rate. Changed it to only this season's grid

 

No, sorry, we just did that. http://forums.autosp...er#entry7153297