327 replies to this topic

[Bleu]

Making the gravel traps slightly uphill might make it less likely that cars will bounce over it.

I recall Eddie Irvine mentioning that after Schumacher's Silverstone accident. But I'm not sure how much angle would be needed. 

[Marklar]

http://www.bbc.com/s...rmula1/33104596

 

Andrew Benson with some thoughts on fuel and tyre saving and if the drivers ever drive flat out.

[ardbeg]

So far more speed has led to wider tracks and bigger runoffs, which in turn leads to further distance to reference points which means that the speed becomes almost invisible on TV. Look at Formula E, those cars are are hardly faster than a F1 safety car but the tracks and the camera positions make them appear rather quick. The proposals to make the cars quicker will do nothing unless combined with better images and camera angles. A tiny car in a asphalt desert is not sexy.

[P123]

So far more speed has led to wider tracks and bigger runoffs, which in turn leads to further distance to reference points which means that the speed becomes almost invisible on TV. Look at Formula E, those cars are are hardly faster than a F1 safety car but the tracks and the camera positions make them appear rather quick. The proposals to make the cars quicker will do nothing unless combined with better images and camera angles. A tiny car in a asphalt desert is not sexy.

Got to remember though, we need those wide angles to get that all important "Bernie says" ego trip message, because he's so well respected and presents a positive image for F1..... not.

The footage from Le Mans was great. We got a real impression of the speed of the cars. Unfortunately FOMs main purpose is to get the trackside advertising in, the cars are a secondary consideration.

[ANF]

The footage from Le Mans was great. We got a real impression of the speed of the cars. Unfortunately FOMs main purpose is to get the trackside advertising in, the cars are a secondary consideration.

One reason for that may have been that they didn't run on Pirelli's F1 tyres.

[tmekt]

http://www.bbc.com/s...rmula1/33104596

 

Andrew Benson with some thoughts on fuel and tyre saving and if the drivers ever drive flat out.

Haven't read the whole thread so not sure whether someone has quoted Hamilton's comments before. Interesting nevertheless (from the article):
 

 

Britain's reigning world champion Lewis Hamilton is the driver who seems closest in F1 to the image of the 'flat-out racer', so might therefore be expected to be most against fuel saving. But he is not.

 

"It doesn't annoy me at all," he says. "It is the name of the game. When I hear it, I try to do it better than everyone else behind me. Simple as."

 

Does he understand the fans' frustrations?

 

"I don't," he says. "I would imagine people don't understand. We are still pushing flat out but we have to use this technique of lift and coast and optimise it. It is just a different style of driving.

 

"If you do it wrong, you can lose too much time and lock up. It is actually easier for me to drive hot laps."

Edited by tmekt, 15 June 2015 - 18:53.

[KnucklesAgain]

Hamilton.

http://adamcooperf1....lame-something/

 

“It’s different definitely from the years where you had fuel pit stop and you had tyres which you could perhaps push further,” he said today. “But it’s the new way of F1, apparently. It’s not easy to be accurate with the different driving techniques we have to use nowadays.

 

“Naturally when you’re behind people you want to be pushing to get past, but you’ve also got to watch your fuel, and watch your tyres, because otherwise you won’t make your stop. There’s so many things which you have to have in the back of your mind when you make those decisions.”

 

Lewis insisted that drivers need to have information from their engineers.

 

“For us drivers with the way these tyres are, [for] the optimum way to get to the end of the race, we don’t have all the information in front of us. You can’t feel how much fuel you are using. You are driving as fast as you can the majority of the time, so you need some guidance with that.

 

“What do you think’s going to happen if they don’t tell me about tyres? I’m still going to drive the same. And if they don’t tell me about fuel, then maybe more cars won’t finish. If that’s more exciting, we can do that!”

 

Elaborating on the lift and coast issue he said: “You have no guidance to know how much fuel you’re using. There is an indicator that you can have, but it’s not very accurate. You’re just driving your race, and you know you have 100kgs to use. It’s not like you have a figure that shows you how much money you are using in your bank account and you can see it going down as you make your payments.

 

“A lap is payment and you don’t know how much fuel you used than any other lap. You could just use one lower gear and you lose than than the one before, or you can be a little bit more aggressive on power and you use a little bit more fuel than on the previous lap, but you can’t see that. So that’s where you get the guidance.

 

“A couple of years ago there was more information, so I’m not really sure, I think people are looking to blame something because they’re unhappy about something.”

 

[PlatenGlass]

I think one of the big problems is that the racing seems much more prescribed than it used to. In the past there was much more the impression that the driver went into the race, and largely acted alone (apart from pitstops) and anything that they needed to do was decided on the fly, whereas now the team and the FIA prescribe a lot of what needs to be done.

I know there's always been tyre saving and fuel saving, but in the past it used to be largely up to the driver. The teams did not have enough information to say "you need to lift and coast for the next 3 laps and then you should be OK to race". Yes, drivers sometimes ran out of fuel, but they didn't normally and it came across better to viewers.

In the past, they didn't have to use both sets of tyres (chosen arbitrarily and unilaterally by a jumped up tyre company before each race). They just started the race on whatever tyres they wanted out of those available, and stopped if they needed to as and when.

There weren't all these grid penalties for infractions at previous races that could simply have been dealt with at the event in question. Nowadays, if a driver causes a collision, they'll get a penalty in that race, but if they retire, then as well as having the retirement they have to have a penalty at the next race. It would be far more sensible to just leave it and make some argument about "natural justice". There's no deterrent advantage in having these penalties that carry over. There's also all these penalties for engine changes. It would be nice if each race weekend came across as a self-contained event.

Also penalties for going wide are just ridiculous. Why not have track that cost you time for going wide?

Basically, it used to come across much more that a race basically "ran itself". The visors go down and the flag drops, and the world just watches. Nowadays it's anything but. I'm not saying that there should be no radio communication or that all changes have been bad, but interference into races has gone way too far.

Edited by PlatenGlass, 20 June 2015 - 18:49.

[Szoelloe]

Hamilton.

http://adamcooperf1....lame-something/

 

How surprising

[Marklar]

How surprising

I think he isn't so wrong, isn't he?

[Kao18]

http://www.formula1....verstappen.html

 

Interesting conversation between Verstappen and Ecclestone. Max basically saying the opposite from Lewis stating the drivers are receiving to much information in the cockpit and him sometimes switching his display off just to be able to rely on his gut feeling.

[Brazzers]

Drivers should complain about the 2 week break between races. 

 

Really don't like the current breaks between races, really kills the mood and any sort of excitement or interest. 

[Clatter]

Haven't read the whole thread so not sure whether someone has quoted Hamilton's comments before. Interesting nevertheless (from the article):
 

Hamilton has expressed dis-satisfaction in the past as well.

 

http://www.mirror.co...formula-4080647

“Personally, I'm not a huge admirer of the direction that everything's going in, in the sense that the cars get slower every year so physically it's easier for me in the car,” said Hamilton.

[superden]

Interesting comments from Verstappen, now let's see what they do about it. I'm not holding my breath though, every regulation change in the last 20 years has been a complete mess. Bernie hit the nail on the head too ...

Today everything goes too fast, is too superficial. Technical innovations play too big a part in our daily life. Before, a word was a word – today you have contracts with hundreds of pages. Overregulation is the name of the game – in life as well as in Formula One.

Rarely a truer word spoken.

[kopek]

Hamilton is being a little simplistic in his requirement for 'Radio Information' on tyres and fuel.

 

We frequently hear drivers saying that their tyres are going off or that the new set are not working well, so they are aware of the state of their rubber. An accurate fuel gauge is not beyond the wit F1 teams, although I suppose, plus and minus guides of the ideal fuel use would be inevitable.

 

Make the drivers responsible for their own race. If we wish to avoid last few laps conk outs and gravel trips, put morer fuel in the cars and better rubber to last longer.

 

Then it would be... Best Man wins.

[Jon83]

Drivers should complain about the 2 week break between races. 

 

Really don't like the current breaks between races, really kills the mood and any sort of excitement or interest. 

 

I think two weeks is a fair balance. Gives the whole team a chance to go home for a few days instead of packing up after one weekend and having to go straight into another.

[Jon83]

Hamilton is being a little simplistic in his requirement for 'Radio Information' on tyres and fuel.

 

We frequently hear drivers saying that their tyres are going off or that the new set are not working well, so they are aware of the state of their rubber. An accurate fuel gauge is not beyond the wit F1 teams, although I suppose, plus and minus guides of the ideal fuel use would be inevitable.

 

Make the drivers responsible for their own race. If we wish to avoid last few laps conk outs and gravel trips, put morer fuel in the cars and better rubber to last longer.

 

Then it would be... Best Man wins.

 

 

Not much danger of that on most of the current tracks.

[Tourgott]

Add Kubica to the list:

 

http://www.motorspor...iger-attraktiv/

 

"F1 too slow and not exciting anymore"

[CurbPainter]

Hamilton shows good self reflection...

 

https://translate.go...t-text=&act=url

 

...if he himself looks like someone from a boy band.

Edited by CurbPainter, 02 July 2015 - 13:04.

[R Soul]

Another one from Alonso:

http://www.espn.co.u...fernando-alonso

 

F1 has always had talented drivers lumbered with poor cars, but that was because their team lacked the funding or expertise to improve it. Since 2009 we've had teams with enough money and expertise that just aren't allowed to use what they have. Oh, it's for cost cutting is it? It's not cutting costs for McLaren, and it's depriving us of having a really good driver where he belongs.

[Nonesuch]

Hamilton.
http://adamcooperf1....lame-something/

 
How does Hamilton not know how much fuel he uses? They couldn't fit that somewhere on the giant LCDs on the wheel?

 

He says the 'indicator' is not very accurate; which makes one wonder where the FOM gets the numbers for its fancy Fuel Usage graphics.
 
Anyway, his observation that "I think people are looking to blame something because they’re unhappy about something" is very astute.
 
This definitely wasn't one of Hamilton's better days; he's normally quite open and interesting to listen to when he is talking about the actual driving and technical aspects of the cars.
 

http://www.formula1....verstappen.html
 
Interesting conversation between Verstappen and Ecclestone.

 
That's a nice little chat. It can be a bit hard here in the Netherlands to see through all the ridiculous Verstappen-hype, but the boy definitely seems like he knows what he's doing.

Edited by Nonesuch, 09 July 2015 - 15:42.

[Jimisgod]

Hamilton shows good self reflection...

 

https://translate.go...t-text=&act=url

 

...if he himself looks like someone from a boy band.

 

I'm going to piss everyone off and say modern F1 drivers are a lot like modern F1 cars; kind of dull and nerdy and reliant on gimmicks to make up for inadequacies. They live the embodiment of a cool lifestyle and yet most of them have such a bland media image and the rare attempts at personality by the top drivers are so nakedly PR cultivated it's annoying - Kimi's "cool" attitude, Lewis' "gangsta" style, Vettel's "real talk/funny German" act, Alonso's whatever...

 

Not that Schumacher and his horrific style sense or Prost and his bent nose were particularly cool, but throughout the fields there was a depth of interesting personalities there aren't today now that racing kids are media-savvy from age 12 and come through about 3 young driver programs that are exactly the same. It's like the younger drivers these days haven't actually experienced life beyond their little racing academy and are basically interchangeable because they've lived the same lives from age 10.

[superden]

I'm going to piss everyone off and say modern F1 drivers are a lot like modern F1 cars; kind of dull and nerdy and reliant on gimmicks to make up for inadequacies. They live the embodiment of a cool lifestyle and yet most of them have such a bland media image and the rare attempts at personality by the top drivers are so nakedly PR cultivated it's annoying - Kimi's "cool" attitude, Lewis' "gangsta" style, Vettel's "real talk/funny German" act, Alonso's whatever...

Not that Schumacher and his horrific style sense or Prost and his bent nose were particularly cool, but throughout the fields there was a depth of interesting personalities there aren't today now that racing kids are media-savvy from age 12 and come through about 3 young driver programs that are exactly the same. It's like the younger drivers these days haven't actually experienced life beyond their little racing academy and are basically interchangeable because they've lived the same lives from age 10.

That didn't p*ss me off. Well said.

[Lotus53B]

I'm going to piss everyone off and say modern F1 drivers are a lot like modern F1 cars; kind of dull and nerdy and reliant on gimmicks to make up for inadequacies. They live the embodiment of a cool lifestyle and yet most of them have such a bland media image and the rare attempts at personality by the top drivers are so nakedly PR cultivated it's annoying - Kimi's "cool" attitude, Lewis' "gangsta" style, Vettel's "real talk/funny German" act, Alonso's whatever...

 

Not that Schumacher and his horrific style sense or Prost and his bent nose were particularly cool, but throughout the fields there was a depth of interesting personalities there aren't today now that racing kids are media-savvy from age 12 and come through about 3 young driver programs that are exactly the same. It's like the younger drivers these days haven't actually experienced life beyond their little racing academy and are basically interchangeable because they've lived the same lives from age 10.

QFT, basically.

 

Everything is sanitised for the media, when interviews are given you always see the team PR droid stuffing a dictaphone in the face of the driver so his words can be analysed later, and anything negative defused, which means that anything that they say in those interviews - mandated by the FIA in the regulations - is a such a filtered and homogenised bunch of anodyne platitudes that the post race interviews are as much fun as watching your father try to dance to modern music.

[ANF]

Another one from Alonso:

http://www.espn.co.u...fernando-alonso

 

F1 has always had talented drivers lumbered with poor cars, but that was because their team lacked the funding or expertise to improve it. Since 2009 we've had teams with enough money and expertise that just aren't allowed to use what they have. Oh, it's for cost cutting is it? It's not cutting costs for McLaren, and it's depriving us of having a really good driver where he belongs.

f1-very-boring-we-are-struggling-i-am-moaning-fernando-alonso

[TheUltimateWorrier]

This is like that 'First World Problems' meme.

 

When your criticisms of Formula 1 is that "oooh, I have to save tyres" or "oh noes! I have to conserve fuel!", then it's pretty damn good imo.  At least your not campaigning and protesting for more stringent safety procedures and equipment like their previous generations had to.  Quit your bitchin' and get back to racing, dammit!!!

[PlatenGlass]

I'm going to piss everyone off and say modern F1 drivers are a lot like modern F1 cars; kind of dull and nerdy and reliant on gimmicks to make up for inadequacies. They live the embodiment of a cool lifestyle and yet most of them have such a bland media image and the rare attempts at personality by the top drivers are so nakedly PR cultivated it's annoying - Kimi's "cool" attitude, Lewis' "gangsta" style, Vettel's "real talk/funny German" act, Alonso's whatever...
 
Not that Schumacher and his horrific style sense or Prost and his bent nose were particularly cool, but throughout the fields there was a depth of interesting personalities there aren't today now that racing kids are media-savvy from age 12 and come through about 3 young driver programs that are exactly the same. It's like the younger drivers these days haven't actually experienced life beyond their little racing academy and are basically interchangeable because they've lived the same lives from age 10.

Maybe you're right, but people have said this about whoever have been the current drivers for years. Schumacher, Hakkinen, Hill etc. were boring compared to Prost, Senna, Piquet, Mansell etc. And that lot were boring compared to the showmen such as Hunt and Graham Hill.

[SenorSjon]

Another one from Alonso:

http://www.espn.co.u...fernando-alonso

 

F1 has always had talented drivers lumbered with poor cars, but that was because their team lacked the funding or expertise to improve it. Since 2009 we've had teams with enough money and expertise that just aren't allowed to use what they have. Oh, it's for cost cutting is it? It's not cutting costs for McLaren, and it's depriving us of having a really good driver where he belongs.

 

Weird thing is, testing is banned due to costs, but McLaren has one long $200+m test session this season. Perhaps the powers that be recognize this, because it will be a problem for any team or engine manufacturer entering the sport (hence they don't, Haas was busy before 2014 started).