20 replies to this topic

[Barry Boor]

I'm wondering if this was the last time that any non-works team ran four cars in a Championship Grand Prix. Whether it was or not, I also would love to know how many mechanics Yeoman Credit took over to look after their four cars. This latter question is probably very unlikely to be answered!

The other thing is that I note there was no car #1 on the entry. I wonder if they allocated that number to Rodger Ward, as was done at Sebring the previous year and the good Mr. Ward, remembering his relative humiliation the previous year, thought better of it.

[Rob29]

Was also I think the last time Yeoman Credit sponsored the BRP team?

[RA Historian]

Was also I think the last time Yeoman Credit sponsored the BRP team?

I believe that you are right. In 1961 Yeoman Credit switched to the Reg Parnell team, while UDT-Laystall sponsored BRP.

[Tony Robinson]

There were six B.R.P. mechanics including myself at Riverside in 1960.

Don Haldenby

Rod Gueran

Aidan Jones

Stan Collier

Dick Johnson

[Barry Boor]

Fantastic, thank you, Tony.

[D-Type]

I've been wondering about this.  Presumably Yeoman Credit made a 4-car entry on other occasions, but were there any other private 4-car entries?  Possibly Centro-Sud

[Ray Bell]

In the past our late friend David McKinney told us that virtually the whole field of entries from this race was shipped to New Zealand for their International races...

There was no series as such at the time, but this abundance of cars and drivers mostly moved on to race in Australia for races at Warwick Farm, Hume Weir, Ballarat and Longford.

Undoubtedly the fact that the formula had run its course contributed to them coming to our corner of the world. Several of the cars were sold here.

Did all the Yeoman Credit cars come? Certainly the drivers didn't... Phil Hill wasn't to come here for another four years, Henry Taylor, Tony Brooks and Oliver Gendebien didn't either, but Roy Salvadori and Jo Bonnier drove for them in a Lotus 18 (not from the US GP team) and one of the T51s. Another Yeoman Credit Cooper was leased by Denny Hulme.

Which Lotus was this and where were the other two Coopers?

[raceannouncer2003]

I don't know which Lotus this was, but here is a photo, Lavant Cup, Goodwood, April 3, 1961, Salvadori, Lotus 18.  Same car?

 

https://revslib.stan...log/xj477fx1852

 

Vince H.

[Rob29]

In the past our late friend David McKinney told us that virtually the whole field of entries from this race was shipped to New Zealand for their International races...

There was no series as such at the time, but this abundance of cars and drivers mostly moved on to race in Australia for races at Warwick Farm, Hume Weir, Ballarat and Longford.

Undoubtedly the fact that the formula had run its course contributed to them coming to our corner of the world. Several of the cars were sold here.

Did all the Yeoman Credit cars come? Certainly the drivers didn't... Phil Hill wasn't to come here for another four years, Henry Taylor, Tony Brooks and Oliver Gendebien didn't either, but Roy Salvadori and Jo Bonnier drove for them in a Lotus 18 (not from the US GP team) and one of the T51s. Another Yeoman Credit Cooper was leased by Denny Hulme.

Which Lotus was this and where were the other two Coopers?

chassis #371 according to Graham Vercoe(Golden Era of New Zealand Motor Racing)

[Roger Clark]

The F1R gives the following chassis numbers for the BRP/YC cars at Riverside:

 

Brooks F2-24-59

Gendebien F2-26-59

Taylor F2-2-59

Hill F2-1-59

 

David's notes say the destination of each car in 1961 was:

F2-1-59 - Serenissima, with Maserati engine

F2-2-59 - Joe Eckhoff (S. Africa)

F2-24-59 - no record

F2-26-59 = Hulme, Mansel, Thomasen

 

David would always state that his work on Coopers was very much work in progress and should not be accepted without questioning, but I think it's better than most of us could do.

[Roger Clark]

David's notes say that the Lotus 18 driven by Salvador in New Zealand and in British Intercontinental Formula events was 904.  He says that 371 was a Team Lotus car throughout 1961, driven by Jim Hall at the USGP, sold to him.

[Ray Bell]

The reason for my curiosity is because of the 'wholesale' shipment of cars to New Zealand after the event...

It's logical that the cars in the US would be shipped, but the Lotus 18 was an extra, it seems. Of course, they might logically have chosen not to ship all four Coopers but the inclusion of the Lotus is something of a surprise. Unless it was at the US GP as a spare or something.

[Barry Boor]

Ray, as far as my meagre knowledge goes, Yeoman Credit had nothing to do with Lotuses in 1960 and I didn't think in 1961 either when they were Bowmaker Yeoman. But as I say, I don't know much. Perhaps Tony can clear this one up.

[Roger Clark]

There was, of course, no connection between Yeoman Credit in 1960 (BRP) and Bowmaker Yeoman in 1961 (Parnell). The Lotus 18 #904 was a Formula 2 in 1960, entered mainly by R H H Parnell (who, to keep things simple was Tim). The most frequent driver was Geoff Duke One one occasion (Modena) it was driven by S Moss. In 1961 it was fitted with a 2.5-litre engine and driven by Salvadori in the Lavant Trophy, entered by Bowmaker Yeoman. Tim Parnell drove it in the International Trophy, entered, I think, by R H H Parnell.

Edit: I should have said that both Parnells were Reginald Harold Haslam. I think that the 1960 entrant was Tim, but I'm not sure.

Edited by Roger Clark, 26 June 2015 - 06:56.

[Ray Bell]

Bruce Sergent's site shows the NZ entries as Yeoman Credit, while for decades here we've referred to the cars that came out as 'ex-Yeoman Credit' cars when owned by others.

I also doubt that Tim was involved as it's almost a certainty that Chris Amon came under Reg's notice during this time and IIRC his later career was stilted by Reg's death.

Again, my main point is to do with the bulk shipping of the cars rather than their identity or source.

[Lotus11Register]

Not an answer to any question yet but a fragment to throw in anyway. One of the also-rans in that event was Brian Naylor in his JBW-Maserati, On one of the mornings of that weekend Naylor was driving this car on the street from a local garage to the track. A policeman pulled him over and ticketed him for not having a valid license plate.  The citation described the JBW as a "Formula 1 car" and although the officer was mildly sympathetic Naylor was warned not to be caught doing this again.

 

The ticket was still in Naylor's scrapbook when Graham Capel and I interviewed him in 1988 (dealing mostly with his Lotus experiences). That yellowed traffic citation made us wonder where the JBW might be and what a treasure this surreal artifact would be for the owner.  No telling where the ticket is today but we held it in our hands then.

 

Jay

[bradbury west]

ISTR a good length article by Brian Naylor in  Autosport in period  about his US adventures.

Roger Lund

[Rob Ryder]

Another question..
 
Skip forward 4 years to the 1964 US GP at the Glen.

https://revslib.stan...log/mc983dq5037

https://revslib.stan...log/zd346sz1546

https://revslib.stan...log/jp791rk1486

I can't find any mention of an altercation between Lorenzo or Innes in my literature, or on the web.
Any idea what is happening in these photos?

Rob

[Tim Murray]

I've found this in Louis Stanley's Grand Prix 1964:
 

With 8 laps left , Hailwood fractured an oil pipe and the corner above the pits became an ice rink. Bandini and Ireland did their best to scatter cement, only to find their efforts blocked by brawling marshals who appeared to have no idea what they should have been doing.

[Rob Ryder]

Brilliant Tim, and quick! I don't have that book.

 

It just goes to prove that you can make the wrong assumption about an uncaptioned photo, I assumed that it was Lorenzo and Innes going at it with the marshal as referee...

 

Rob

[Roger Clark]

Motoring News said that Ireland and Bandini had already retired and ran from the pits to dust the corner.  That makes sense as they're wearing jackets which presumably they didn't race in.