18 replies to this topic

[No brain no pain]

According to Auto, Motor, und Sport; Mercedes will help Renault in getting their F1-engines "up-to-date" in 2016. This will include both know-how and parts.The two companies do have strong ties within the development of road-car engines.

[Jordan44]

I'll believe it when I see it happen.

[v@sh]

So if true and goes ahead already confirms what we already know which is Renault did such a piss poor job that they need another manufacturer to help them. Says it all really...

[JHSingo]

'Might' as in how it was once reported that Mercedes 'might' supply Red Bull with engines?

 

Yeah...whatever. Can't see them wanting to help out a competitor who might then be able to beat them. But it would be pretty ironic if Renault finally sorted out their engines just as Red Bull had walked away.

Edited by JHSingo, 19 September 2015 - 22:56.

[No brain no pain]

They say will in that article, but I wrote might.

Edited by No brain no pain, 19 September 2015 - 23:10.

[BlinkyMcSquinty]

Isn't this a bit late? Renault have made the formal announcement, they have notified any engaged parties, and filed the proper paperwork. They are on the way out, that's not going to stop anything.

 

Of course, Renault are obligated to provided engines to any teams still under contract, and will do so. But I strongly suspect that any team that informs Renault that they don't want any after the end of this year, Renault will be very happy to accommodate them. And don't be surprised that any teams will be running Renault next year, and 2015 is the last year for this incarnation.

 

Now the win-win for Mercedes and lose-lose for Renault. Anyone who understands engineering knows that each year the product improves, and even what is a sad state for Renault right now will be a better engine for 2016. But if Mercedes get into the pool, guess who will claim credit for improving the engines? Even if Renault do 90% of the heavy lifting on improving the engines, they won't get any respect or credit, the song will be "yea, but they built crap engines, it was Mercedes who saved their butts".

 

And if Renault politely tell Mercedes to shove their MGU where the sun don't shine, Mercedes will appear to be the nice guy who tried to help the down and out bum on the sidewalk.

[Jordan44]

Isn't this a bit late? Renault have made the formal announcement, they have notified any engaged parties, and filed the proper paperwork. They are on the way out, that's not going to stop anything.

Of course, Renault are obligated to provided engines to any teams still under contract, and will do so. But I strongly suspect that any team that informs Renault that they don't want any after the end of this year, Renault will be very happy to accommodate them. And don't be surprised that any teams will be running Renault next year, and 2015 is the last year for this incarnation.

Now the win-win for Mercedes and lose-lose for Renault. Anyone who understands engineering knows that each year the product improves, and even what is a sad state for Renault right now will be a better engine for 2016. But if Mercedes get into the pool, guess who will claim credit for improving the engines? Even if Renault do 90% of the heavy lifting on improving the engines, they won't get any respect or credit, the song will be "yea, but they built crap engines, it was Mercedes who saved their butts".

And if Renault politely tell Mercedes to shove their MGU where the sun don't shine, Mercedes will appear to be the nice guy who tried to help the down and out bum on the sidewalk.

Paddock sources suggest the papers requesting Renault to take over Lotus were signed today, so I'm not sure on your source. Renault haven't said they are leaving.

Edited by J0rd4n, 19 September 2015 - 23:46.

[No brain no pain]

This has been publically known since the IAA in Frankfurt -Germany. I don't understand that none except for Autocar and AMuS have written about it. They WILL do this, and maybe use a loophole and call the engine Infiniti. (Renault-NIssan brand)

Edited by No brain no pain, 20 September 2015 - 00:11.

[Wuzak]

Paddock sources suggest the papers requesting Renault to take over Lotus were signed today, so I'm not sure on your source. Renault haven't said they are leaving.

 

They did say that they won't be supplying customers.

[Tsarwash]

They did say that they won't be supplying customers.

Isn't that against the engine supplier rules ?

[No brain no pain]

No, not if it's a new works team Renault F1.

[Myrvold]

Isn't that against the engine supplier rules ?

I also thought so, but then McLaren-Honda happened.

[loki]

I wonder if VW will then use these joint Renault/Mercedes engines...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[No brain no pain]

Yes, Red Bull Racing F1 can do that... and most probably will do that.. and it might be badged Infiniti. They terminated the deal they had with Renault, but this is a new deal so no problems at all. Same goes for the new Renault F1 works team, but they do have a strong engine which might be badged Renault. 

[Heisenberg]

I would laugh my ass off if they will and someday, maybe not in 2017, but in 2018 let's say, Renault wins the championship. The same goes for Ferrari, if Red Bull develop a better chassis and use Ferrari engines.

Edited by Heisenberg, 20 September 2015 - 14:03.

[Clatter]

Isn't that against the engine supplier rules ?

Dont think so. There were rules for tyre suppliers that they had to supply a certain number of teams, and there is a rule that a manufacturer can only supply a certain number of teams without agreement, but I don't think there is a rule saying they have to supply other teams.

[No brain no pain]

VW as a brand-name will not be used in F1.

[FPV GTHO]

Dont think so. There were rules for tyre suppliers that they had to supply a certain number of teams, and there is a rule that a manufacturer can only supply a certain number of teams without agreement, but I don't think there is a rule saying they have to supply other teams.

When there was a tyre war, if there were 2 suppliers each had to be capable of supplying 60% of the grid. If 3, 40% of the grid.

[RockBrocaine]

So if true and goes ahead already confirms what we already know which is Renault did such a piss poor job that they need another manufacturer to help them. Says it all really...

We'll see what happens when they finally use their token spend in Russia. I feel like Renault rejected Red Bull's hired help out of pride and that's what really soured the relationship. They will either be vindicated with a significant increase of performance or prove to be as stubborn as Red Bull made them seem. It would be hilarious though if Renault's engine was suddenly on par with Ferrari and Red Bull fought Mercedes for podium finishes for the remainder of the season. Oh that would be a gift from the gods.