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Red Bull will quit F1 if not given engine parity


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#4001 Marklar

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:09

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#4002 InSearchOfThe

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:09

The same could be said about Renault.

 

When RBR and Honda have a joint announcement I'll believe it.



#4003 Owen

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:17

Tobias Grüner (twitter):

#F1 Apparently Red Bull only looks for a stop-gap solution for 2016 (Honda) and then go on with someone else. AMuS: http://ams.to/redbull-honda 



#4004 Wingcommander

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:17

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#4005 SealTheDiffuser

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:20

Please, make that happen. I cant wait for the McLaren vs. Red Bull chassis comparisons next year in this forum :rotfl:

 

?

 

good comparison possibility for McLaren to see if RB Newey sorcerer's apprentice Prodromou is worth the $$$   imo   (I ll never learn his name...)

 

RBMac versus the realRB

 

and 2017 it will be Porsche NOT Audi. (I hope Piech is a wise man).


Edited by SealTheDiffuser, 23 October 2015 - 15:23.


#4006 femi

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:23

Tobias Grüner ‏@tgruener  52s52 seconds ago
Breaking news: According to AMuS information Red Bull is close to a deal with Honda about 2016 engine supply. AMuS: http://ams.to/redbull-honda 

I would be a bit worried if I were McLaren: IIRC, McLaren have exclusive use of Honda engine till next year(?) beyond which Honda is free to choose other customers(partners). Honda is going to come good at some point and when that happens, here is hoping that RB does not do to McLaren what Brawn GP did to them!

I am almost certain Ron D must have been squeezed real hard to agree to this!

Edited by femi, 23 October 2015 - 15:25.


#4007 SealTheDiffuser

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:24

I would be a bit worried if I were McLaren: IIRC, McLaren have exclusive use of Honda engine till next year(?) beyond which Honda is free to choose other customers(partners). Honda is going to come good at some point and when that happens, here is hoping that RB does not do to McLaren what Brawn GP did to them!

 

I think no need to worry. Especially when TR is driving circles around RB in 2016 :stoned: .



#4008 muramasa

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:24

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#4009 Nemo1965

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:38

It's interesting how the media has become factionalised - quite a lot of them have taken Renault's "side" and painted them as the victim without looking at the fuller picture. *cough* Gary Anderson. I'm disappointed in Autosport for running a series of Red Bull bashing articles. 

 

Renault have longer and deeper relationships with many in the paddock and I think this is paying off for them in this conflict with Red Bull - who are the younger, brasher party that nobody likes very much. The facts are left behind. 

 

Okay, now let us put 'who is to blame' aside. Let us just look at what demonstrably happened...

 

1. Red Bull terminated contracts with Renault. (We won't discuss the manner).

2. Red Bull asked for 2016 spec engines from either Mercedes or Ferrari. (We won't discuss the manner).

3. Red Bull SAID (if it was negotiating tactics or not) they did not want a customer or 2015 spec engine.

4. Red Bull SAID (if it was negotiating tactics or not) they would get either works engines from either, or they would quit.

5. Red Bull will not get 2016 spec engines from either Mercedes or Ferrari.

6. Red Bull will not quit (if the rumours about Honda are correct).

 

We can have different opinions about who is to blame, who is the culprit, but in the end it seems very probable Red Bull did not get want it wanted - an engine on exact the same level as Ferrari or Mercedes. So the headline 'Red Bull's scare tactics have failed' (without the 'why') would have been rather factual...


Edited by Nemo1965, 23 October 2015 - 15:39.


#4010 GhostR

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:38

That doesn't mean that they wouldn't have accepted it. Standard negotiation tactics is to ask for more than you expect to get or for Ferrari to offer less than they were actually willing to supply, and as I stated above, I'm pretty sure RBR prefer a 2015 Ferrari to a Renault or Honda at this point. 

 

Ultimately none of us know what really went down between Ferrari and Red Bull, or for that matter between Red Bull and Mercedes (there are all sorts of contradictory stories about what was and wasn't agreed there). It's all conjecture. 

 

The Autosport article brings nothing new, a sad pattern of late. It's just a rehash, and an unbalanced one at that. 

 

Read an article on (I think ) Motorsport.com the other day suggesting that both Mercedes and Ferrari were originally willing to supply Red Bull, but then pulled out when they got wind of the deal being a short-term stopgap until RB could get a VW brand on board. By the time the VAG emissions scandal broke and most likely scuppered VAG deal, it was too late and both Merc and Ferrari continued to refuse.

 

 

Really? From Marko's comment, it was on offer. The fact that they are desperately looking for an engine now can only mean that they didn't accept that offer.

 

No, that's not the only interpretation.

 

There are two possibilities: 1. Red Bull refused the offer, or 2. Ferrari withdrew the offer. There are rumours that support both options as potentially being correct (or even both options being simultaneously correct).

 

 

From the AMuS article: Dennis doesnt want to supply Red Bull. But as the FIA helped McLaren with the recent rule changes and due to the fact that Red Bull just want to stay for 1-2 years with Honda it may happen. Red Bull would stil targeting to cooperate with Audi or Porsche.

 

If I was McLaren, I'd cut a deal with Honda: go ahead and supply Red Bull on a short term deal. But the supply contract must include clauses such as:

 

1. McLaren receives a significant portion of the fee Red Bull pays to help top up their finances.

2. If the engine rules are changed to allow in-season development again next year, McLaren get first access if logistics mean there are not enough upgraded parts for 4 cars.

3. McLaren get access to any engine related data that Red Bull gather.



#4011 Mandzipop

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 15:45

We've got to the maximum posts a new thread has been started.