58 replies to this topic

[eronrules]

http://www.motorspor...weekend-format/

 

 

"I think it was fine," Raikkonen told reporters after Sunday's race. "Obviously we start a bit more early, to be honest it would be much nicer to run two-day weekends.

"That way everybody watching would see cars always running.

"In some cases, we can't even run because we don't have enough tyres or we have to save engines. Obviously, that means people don't see a lot of cars running.

"They come to see us practicing and racing, so I think we could easily manage to put the running nicely into two days, like we demonstrated here.

"We could do all the three practices on one day. There's certain reasons I guess why we have three days, but it would be cheaper for all the teams to be away for less days.

 

 

[Rurouni]

As a viewer, I don't mind 2 day race weekends, but they probably make it 3 days because you will have 1 FP and qualification session in similar time as the race itself, which is important in terms of setting up the car.

[eronrules]

As a viewer, I don't mind 2 day race weekends, but they probably make it 3 days because you will have 1 FP and qualification session in similar time as the race itself, which is important in terms of setting up the car.

 

but more often than not, they dont' even use all the time allowed in first 2 Free practices. yes i agree that FP3 is perhaps the most important of all the practices, so extending FP3 to 2 hours would be a better choice, they can use one extra set at the beginning to finetune race setup, then use  last half hour to finetune qualy.

 

recently, even Nico Hulkenberg voiced similar opinion regarding reducing FPs

 

Hulkenberg wants reduced practice in F1

 

 

Following a Friday of wet running ahead of a predicted dry race at Suzuka, when asked if he likes the challenge of adapting on Saturday, Hulkenberg replied: "I think it's good, yeah.

"I’m sometimes of the opinion we have too much practice in Formula One. Two times 90 minutes and then on Saturday another hour, it’s a lot of practice. I think I would find it personally more interesting if we had a lot less like in GP2.

"Maybe not quite as little where you only have half an hour and then you get thrown in to the water, also then there’s a lot more emphasis and focus on the driver. Because here, sometimes if you struggle you have so much practice to get around it it’s maybe too much.”

[warp]

Why not?

 

But at the same time, teams must be given back that testing time at the very least. Give those days they are not running at a GP as testing days wherever they choose to and no restrictions for engines, tyres, etc.

 

Also, it will only save money to small teams. those on a shoestring. Big teams will redirect their money somewhere else.

[Craven Morehead]

I would much prefer a two race format to each weekend.

[krea]

It's wrong to believe that less time would put a higher focus on the driver. It would be quite the opposite and the engineering team on the track and back home would be even more important than today.

[JeePee]

I don't want both qualy and race on the same day. That would eat my sundays.

 

Sat; FP1 > Qualy

Sun: FP2 > Race

 

That can work. We can then also have our special qualy and race setups back.

Edited by JeePee, 27 October 2015 - 07:39.

[Sparky68]

I don't want both qualy and race on the same day. That would eat my sundays.

 

Sat; FP1 > Qualy

Sun: FP2 > Race

 

That can work. We can then also have our special qualy and race setups back.

But what would happen in the event of bad weather as we have just seen ?

[eronrules]

I would much prefer a two race format to each weekend.

2 race weekend is not really a possibility in F1 due to the complexity (and thus fragility) of the machinery. tin-tops can do it as well as GP2/GP3 as most of them are spec and built to last.

 

 

It's wrong to believe that less time would put a higher focus on the driver. It would be quite the opposite and the engineering team on the track and back home would be even more important than today.

 

you have a point, but it'll mean that spending and running every possible moments on track will be even more essential, which is the point isn't it?? too many times we've seen teams running first half hour due to free tires, then sits out rest of the session as the tracks are still green. it's actually more fun to see FP3 as the teams are really pushing for ultimate laptimes. most of the times, FP1 and 2 aren't even necessary, although Engineers, TPs and drivers like to hype it up. a good car will be good regardless of high fuel runs (which btw they does on FP3 anyways) and cars that are bad usually don't improve that much regardless of their efforts. so it's a waste really to run the car for 3 hours on fridays when there's always a chance that it'll come to nothing.

[SenorSjon]

I would much prefer a two race format to each weekend.

 

Yuck, please no. It is a Grand Prix, not Tiny Prix.

 

 

The core of the problem is the lack of tires and engine use. That is why they don't run as much. Perhaps solve that problem instead? 

- four engine rules apply for Q and Race engine only, not the FP1-2-3 one. That way new iterations can be field tested without grid penalties.

- more tires to use in practice. Also have more (and better...) Wet and Intermediates available.

Edited by SenorSjon, 27 October 2015 - 09:39.

[HoldenRT]

Would 2 days instead of 3 mean less revenue for the organisers and hosts?  Because it's hard enough for them to pay the high fees as it is.

[superdelphinus]

Yep, I guess that's the main reason it's spread out over three in the first place to be honest

[Ice1Fan]

Would 2 days instead of 3 mean less revenue for the organisers and hosts?  Because it's hard enough for them to pay the high fees as it is.

Wouldn't the organisers pay less overall then if it is 2 days instead of 3?

[TheManAlive]

The rationale here is messed up. They dont run now due to engine and tyre limitations, so the suggestion is to reduce the days they run. Surely a better alternative would be to allow more engines and more tyres - that way they run and the fans get to see them. Trackside numbers already dont make enough for the races to make good money, removing Friday would only make the tickets more expensive and allow for less running. 

[Fonzey]

Would prefer it as a TV spectator, but would prefer 3 day weekends as an actual Grand Prix attendee - as it makes for more of a weekend, especially if it's somewhere nice!

 

Got admit, when I settled in on the sofa for qualifying on Sunday morning - I felt very much content that I'd have almost a full day of F1 coverage to sit and veg out to!

[Razoola]

What would two day weekends mean for support races on the same weekend? Those could be entirely cancelled due to delays and such.... I can't ever see two day weekends happening unless some support races are dropped or all F1 tracks are mandated to have lighting systems.

I also wanted to add two day weekend would also mean more street circuits and the loss of dedicated race tracks in the future. The Way Bernie wants it is with F1 becoming the same as the Eurovision song contest... Not so much about the songs but as the winning country using it to advertise themselves.

We could loose SPA because of two day weekends.

Edited by Razoola, 27 October 2015 - 10:14.

[CoolBreeze]

I've said it before...1 hour race on Saturday, reverse grid on Sunday, perhaps a time of 1 hour 30 mins race. 

[Kristian]

Would prefer it as a TV spectator, but would prefer 3 day weekends as an actual Grand Prix attendee - as it makes for more of a weekend, especially if it's somewhere nice!

Got admit, when I settled in on the sofa for qualifying on Sunday morning - I felt very much content that I'd have almost a full day of F1 coverage to sit and veg out to!

That's what the powers that be thought for 2005 when they did Sunday morning qualifying, but it was abandoned mid season as it was so unpopular. I certainly don't have time for all day f1 on Sundays.

[Amin]

Would prefer it as a TV spectator, but would prefer 3 day weekends as an actual Grand Prix attendee - as it makes for more of a weekend, especially if it's somewhere nice!

 

Got admit, when I settled in on the sofa for qualifying on Sunday morning - I felt very much content that I'd have almost a full day of F1 coverage to sit and veg out to!

Agreed. When I'm paying £100 for a weekend ticket, I want as many days as possible.

[Jon83]

The format is fine the way it is just now.

 

It was an exciting weekend for sure but let's not kid ourselves into thinking it would always be like that. Hungary was exciting this year with the normal running format.

[Lotus53B]

Wouldn't the organisers pay less overall then if it is 2 days instead of 3?

Not if Bernie is still in charge...

[uffen]

I don't want less running when I pay big and travel far to see a G.P. I want three days of cars in action.

 

Another point: Bernie sold governments on the idea that the tax revenue generated by all those bodies attending a race weekend would more than justify said governments throwing money at Bernie in order to secure a race.

What happens if we have a two-day race weekend and that tax revenue is reduced by one third?

[Jazza]

Last race is good reason to keep it at 3 days. Imagine a 2 day race weekend with Saturday being a complete washout due to weather. We would then have the situation of having qualifying on Sunday and that session being the first time the cars had ever been on track. At least with 3 days you can find some window to get some running in.

Plus some tracks actually make use of the 3 days. Melbourne is just one support race after another and even covers 4 days. For a lot of tracks, the F1 weekend is more than just the F1.

[Exb]

I'm another one who likes the 3 day format - especially if I am at there, I want as many days at the circuit as possible (so 4 if you include the Thursday) I'm not sure I would bother going to a European race if it was only for 2 days + Fridays are my favorite dy anyway, there is often roving Grandstands and I love being able to see the cars from as many different points as possible.

 

Also from a watching from home point of view I would really struggle to fit in both quali and race on 1 day (unless its the very early morning races). I couldn't do it last weekend and had to miss qualifying, it would be a huge shame (for me) if that became the normal .

 

I'm sure some people would prefer it though and I understand why they are looking into it with falling viewers and attendences at races down, but they need to be careful as it could make it worse if they don't get it right.

[Watkins74]

I've said it before...1 hour race on Saturday, reverse grid on Sunday, perhaps a time of 1 hour 30 mins race.

Don't say it again.

[djonas79]

I agree that Fridays are useless, but the 2 race format and reverse grid ideas are completely bollocks. This is F1 and it has a history. No need to piss at it.

[eronrules]

but, considering that the majority of the F1 audience worldwide is TV and online viewers (like me), FP1 and Fp2 are just colossal  waste of time.

 

from a team's perspective, they don't want to run cause they don't have enough tire and engine. Also, even with extra allocation of tires for the first half hour (a stupid rule if u ask me), teams don't want to run FP1s due to track being green, don't wanna cause damage to cars, or conserve engine mileage (basically, teams will invent any amount of excuses not to run, unless they have to)

 

 

so again i ask, what really is the point of friday running?? 

[Otaku]

Bring back Friday Qualy and Sunday's Warmup. That way you'll see more running each day.

[August]

As a TV viewer, two-day weekend is enough, assuming qualifying and race are on different days or it's a doubleheader with the two headline series racing on different days.

But as a fan attending the event, I'd prefer it to be three days with a good support package.

[NateF]

F1 already is a two day event for me, sometimes even a one day event

[muramasa]

　

Suzuka is full of events from Thursday (pitlane walk and driver signing which is the same for all venues but also have some other events), and packed with numerous talk shows, demo runs and events and such throughout Fri-Sun, you can stay in Suzuka Circuit for 10-12 hours for all 4 days and can never get bored, impossible to cover all events and activities even if you want to. They even have an post-GP event on Monday.

 

With 2 days GP weekend It will be shrunk massively and a lot less fun and exciting to attend, so please no. Current format is already the minimum it can be.

[eronrules]

　

Suzuka is full of events from Thursday (pitlane walk and driver signing which is the same for all venues but also have some other events), and packed with numerous talk shows, demo runs and events and such throughout Fri-Sun, you can stay in Suzuka Circuit for 10-12 hours for all 4 days and can never get bored, impossible to cover all events and activities even if you want to. They even have an post-GP event on Monday.

 

With 2 days GP weekend It will be shrunk massively and a lot less fun and exciting to attend, so please no. Current format is already the minimum it can be.

but you can count such devoted fanbase in such circuits with one hand

 

japan, UK, Spa, Monaco, maybe brazil and australia ... that's about it.

 

have u seen grand stands in all middle eastern, russian, chinese, malaysian etc races on fridays???? only a handfull of peoples and bunch of journos, that's it.

Edited by eronrules, 27 October 2015 - 18:17.

[pdac]

I think they should do a 1-day event. A test session in the morning more or less rolling straight into the quali session before lunch and then after lunch the race. Of course, a day of bad weather and you end up with nothing.

[Frank Tuesday]

If the weekend is cut by 1/3, do you think the FIA is going to keep the tyre and engine allocations the same?  If an engine is supposed to last 5 races with Friday running, surely it will last 7 without Friday running, so you're engine allocation just went down to 3 for the year.  Pirelli can bring the teams 5 sets of tyres for the weekend instead of the 7 or 8 that they currently bring. 

[KingTiger]

How about they cut his wage by 33% and decrease ticket prices by 50%. Then I'll agree to it. 

[Hellenic tifosi]

Why not use some Mondays as test sessions, with engines not counting towards the years's allocation? This means that teams can develop stuff, but having minimal preparation ahead of the race means that we are more open to unpredictable results.

[eronrules]

Why not use some Mondays as test sessions, with engines not counting towards the years's allocation? This means that teams can develop stuff, but having minimal preparation ahead of the race means that we are more open to unpredictable results.

this was suggested before, but then they'll have to pay the circuit for extra days (who may have other commitments), and delay freight dispatches (which is the main reason it won't work, specially when they have back to back weekends)

 

regarding supplying extra test engine ... the main problem is ... who's gonna pay for them? what spec they'd be? what happens if that test engine goes kaput?

[ViMaMo]

No for me. How would it increase excitement? If it was atleast two teams fighting it out for WDC, then maybe yes but otherwise its a no. 

[eronrules]

No for me. How would it increase excitement? If it was atleast two teams fighting it out for WDC, then maybe yes but otherwise its a no. 

how does having friday running increase excitement anyways??? and what does that have to do with how many teams are fighting in the WDC 

[ViMaMo]

how does having friday running increase excitement anyways??? and what does that have to do with how many teams are fighting in the WDC 

 

Teams need time to dial in their cars don't they? If they could, they wouldn't be running on Friday. This is the format for many racing series, qualifying a buildup to the big race on Sunday. I don't want Sunday fun diluted. I like the gradual buildup. 

When we have more teams fighting it out for the race win, I might like to see 2 race format. Otherwise its the same bore fest. Hey... its Hamilton again and again and again 

Edited by ViMaMo, 28 October 2015 - 03:54.

[ClubmanGT]

I don't just go to see F1 cars. I go to a race weekend. That means seeing F1s, V8s, F500s and GTs. If that event is only going to be two days long then that's less time for vendors to make money and less justification for me to spend a grand on airfares per person each way for a trip. 

[Waggy]

I feel with the 3 day weekend it allows the cream to rise to the top. Many times we have seen drivers like Hamilton and Vettel struggle on Friday and Saturday only to figure out a good set up on a Sunday.

 

I feel with a 2 day weekend it brings the drivers closer together and would suit the lesser drivers......

[TheManAlive]

Bring back Friday Qualy and Sunday's Warmup. That way you'll see more running each day.

 

Agree with the second part, I remain open about the first.

 

Sunday Warmup was a wonderful thing to see. I remember my first gp 1988 at Silverstone, arriving to hear the engines firing up and then watching them go out on track. They really should bin the parc ferme rules (its not like they can change engines or gearboxes anymore) so they can mess around with settings. Let them set the cars up for qual, then change the settings for the race. It would mean a potential change in pace in the race.

 

Not so sure about Friday qual. I think this is probably too important to hold on a day when most people cant actually see it live due to work. I would prefer a return to good old open qual (maybe limited laps) for an hour. Anyone who watched FP3 this weekend had a wee glimpse into what it could be like as they thought it might set the grid. Yes we may get some quiet bits during the session but the TV guys need to learn to then cut to pre prepared segments!

[SenorSjon]

Friday qualy dry and Saturday wet? A bore to watch. Aggregate timing? Hard to follow. 

 

Just bring back the pre parc fermé weekend! So with proper qualifying again. No messing about with too wet to run Q3, etc.

[HuddersfieldTerrier1986]

If they weren't limited by engines, gearboxes, cost of running per lap etc as well as the general schedule (ie the support races) then I'd be tempted to say make Friday a test day BUT only young drivers can take part on the Friday, with the race drivers doing 1 practice session on Saturday morning before quali and then the race on the Sunday. Obviously all the things I mentioned at the start make that impossible though.

[LORDBYRON]

The best way would be FP Friday then Saturday support racing like GP2 then quali then race day as normal.

Make it mandatory that all teams must run time slots so they are out and give fans a bang for there buck

[Hellenic tifosi]

this was suggested before, but then they'll have to pay the circuit for extra days (who may have other commitments), and delay freight dispatches (which is the main reason it won't work, specially when they have back to back weekends)

 

regarding supplying extra test engine ... the main problem is ... who's gonna pay for them? what spec they'd be? what happens if that test engine goes kaput?

 

Freight despatch is not an issue, as if weekends turn into a two-day format this means that they can afford to arrive one day later than they do now.

 

Regarding extra engines, I assume that one would need just one extra engine per year.

[GTRacer]

Freight despatch is not an issue, as if weekends turn into a two-day format this means that they can afford to arrive one day later than they do now.

 

They would still have to fly out at the same time they do now because if you have all the support categories out on Friday the F1 teams would still need to be setup on Thursday so to not disrupt the support categories running through Friday.

 

 

I personally think 2 day weekends would be the wrong thing to do as it would be less value & less F1 running for fans attending the event to see.

 

Additionally it would actually put the smaller teams at a big disadvantage because several of them don't have simulators & dropping a day & 2 sessions of running would put a larger emphasis on using simulators to get a baseline setup before arriving at the event. The bigger teams already hit the ground running because of that but with the practice running they have the mid-field are able to catch up & they generally go into FP3 more or less on-par with larger teams in terms of setup/car balance.

 

I've always felt the way to look at Friday practice is that its a test session for the teams & as a result i've always felt that they should not be forced to run. Friday practice/testing & the practice sessions in general are there more for the teams benefit & not so much there for the fans.

 

 

As to Saturday races, Reverse grids etc... No & No!

 

With regards to bringing back the Warm-Up, I'd actually rather they didn't because Sunday mornings are better now than they used to be because we now get 3 races from the support categories which I find a lot more interesting than a half hour F1 session where nobody was really pushing all that hard. Its also not really needed now because of the parc-ferme rules & the fact that even without those with the limits of engines/gearbox's etc.. they wouldn't be changing everything overnight like they used to so there would be no reason to run on Sunday mornings.

[Jon83]

I've said it before...1 hour race on Saturday, reverse grid on Sunday, perhaps a time of 1 hour 30 mins race. 

 

You can say it as much as you like but it's a rubbish idea. If you want it, you have GP2 and GP3.

 

I want more running, not less. It's F1 for goodness sake. This budget F1 idea is rubbish.Scrap Parc-Ferme and give them more tyres.

 

For those even advocating a one day event, what if several engines fail in the morning, leaving no time to be fixed or replaced and less cars on the track for the race? How can that ever be a good thing?
 

Edited by Jon83, 28 October 2015 - 13:03.

[Alexandros]

Let's put things under proper perspective: In-season testing was cut massively and the "compensation" was more Friday practice time for teams to evaluate new parts etc. The cost cutting is already there by teams not going around for a 4 days in Barcelona, Silverstone, etc etc.