25 replies to this topic

[Bakeryman]

Does anyone know what became of W S (Bill) Perkins? I know he drove an HRG at the 1954 Brighton Speed Trials while in 1956 he drove a Lotus 6/BMW at Brighton and at the Great Auclum Hill Climb.  I also know he competed at Prescott in September 1960 in a Lotus Elite and I wonder whether this was Edward Lewis’ dark blue car KNH 7 which he apparently sold at Prescott  in September the previous year, a meeting at which Perkins was also competing, still in his Lotus 6/BMW.

 

Perkins was a long standing member of the Bugatti Owners Club, having joined in 1947, but I can find nothing more about  him or his activities since 1960 save that in 1967 he was still living in the Bilton area of Rugby.  Quite possibly he is no longer with us.

[Bakeryman]

I should have added that at both the Brighton meetings a J M Perkins competed in a Bugatti and an Arnott repsectively.  Brothers perhaps?

[Rupertlt1]

Perkins was a class winner at Firle Hill Climb, 9 September 1955, in his Lotus-BMW, 29.06 secs.

 

Could this be the Lotus at Prescott in 1959?

 

https://revslib.stan...log/ns338rs2255

 

Lotus Elite, KNH 7 is here:

 

https://revslib.stan...log/sv460pb4473

 

RGDS RLT 

Edited by Rupertlt1, 15 January 2016 - 00:11.

[Sharman]

Perkins was a class winner at Firle Hill Climb, 9 September 1955, in his Lotus-BMW, 29.06 secs.

 

Could this be the Lotus at Prescott in 1959?

 

https://revslib.stan...log/ns338rs2255

 

Lotus Elite, KNH 7 is here:

 

https://revslib.stan...log/sv460pb4473

 

RGDS RLT 

 

Before I even looked at your photo I thought "It would need a a hell of a bonnet bulge to put a BMW engine in a 6" and so I looked....

[Rupertlt1]

See also: http://forums.autosp...otus-mk-vi-bmw/

 

RGDS RLT

[Rupertlt1]

Does anybody have entry, results, report, pictures for BOC Prescott Hill Climb, April 2/3, 1960? RGDS RLT

[Bakeryman]

Try Paul Gibbons, the Bugati Owners' Club archivist.  He is very helpful. 

 

Since my initial posting asking about Bill Perkins I have established that he was born in 1906, married in 1949 and died in 1966. He bought Ted Lewis's Lotus Elite KNH 7 in late 1959 and entered it at Prescott in September the following year.  The car is now being restored by Peter Murray in Melbourne.

 

Bill's love of hillclimbing, and an HRG,  was shared with his brother Jack who branched off on his own in 1949 and bought a type 35C Bugatti.

[Rupertlt1]

Bakeryman: I am already in touch with Paul Gibbons at BOC. We now know that Bill Perkins drove a Lotus Elite at Prescott on 1 May 1960. Was he a competitor at Prescott 2/3 April 1960? Did Edward Lewis also compete at that event? RGDS RLT

[Bakeryman]

Unlikely.  According to the BRDC Lewis switched to the British Touring Car Championship in 1960 with an A40.  My research, on behalf of Peter Murray, has been limited to the history of Lewis's Elite KNH 7 and its owners. Apart from Perkin's appearance in the Elite at the September 1960 Prescott (and, as you have mentioned, in May as well)  I know nothing more thus far about the car's history  between then and when it was purchased in 1969 by an Australian who took it back home two years later. 

[Rupertlt1]

Going over the facts re KNH 7 from another thread:

 

In Autosport 16 Oct 1959 (page 507) and 23 Oct 1959 (page 555) there is a For Sale notice posted by Ted Lewis announcing the car is for sale.  I have been advised earlier in the year that Ted had no recollection who bought the car, only that “he sold the Elite to a chap at Prescott Hill Climb who came up to him in the paddock and asked if it was for sale. A deal was done but he can not remember the name of the chap or where he was from.”

 

Assuming Perkins bought the car, as seems most likely, you have to ask when the deal was done? By the time the car was offered for sale in Autosport the Prescott season for 1959 was over.

 

So the only opportunity for Lewis and Perkins to meet at Prescott, in time for Perkins to race the car at the May 1st meeting, was April 2/3 1960, Bugatti O.C. Presumably the buyer would be asking if the car was still for sale, having seen the advertisement in Autosport?

 

This begs the question was Edward Lewis a competitor on April 2/3 1960 in Lotus Elite, KNH 7?

 

Also begs the question was Bill Perkins a competitor at Prescott April 2/3 1960? That would place Lewis and Perkins there together?

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 14 February 2016 - 20:49.

[Bakeryman]

We know Perkins and Lewis were both competing at the September 1959 Prescott where Lewis won his class in KNH 7, quite possibly making the car an attractive purchase.  The timing of the ads in Autosport could be explained by the lead time required for their submission. In Lewis's own words, "A deal was done in the paddock at Prescott"  but very possibly he didn't withdraw them until money had changed hands, by which time they were committed to print anyway.

 

By April 1960 Lewis would presumably have been ready with his A40 for the start of the British Touring Car Champiopnship.  I am sure he sold the Elite to Perkins in September 1959.

[Rupertlt1]

Bakeryman: OK, you may be right. In which case did Perkins race the Lotus Elite at Prescott 2/3 April 1960?

Don't forget that Autosport was a weekly publication. Why would Lewis be advertising in it in the second half of October 1959 if he had already sold the car?

I've just looked at the only old copy of Autosport available to me from 1951 (I am packed to move) - the deadline for advertisements was 5 p.m. Monday for publication on the following Friday. The lead time argument doesn't really stand up.

It could be that the sale of the Lotus Elite was conditional on Bill Perkins disposing of his Lotus MkVI-B.M.W. Is there any evidence of this car being offered for sale at this time? 

(I don't deal in sure and unlikely, only the facts.) RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 15 February 2016 - 13:59.

[Bakeryman]

"Facts" can be few and far between some 50 or more years after the event! But they can help lend credence or otherwise to possible scenarios.  What does seem clear, in chronological order, is that both Lewis (Elite) and Perkins competed at Prescott in September 1959,  Lewis competed in the Elite later that month at Chateau Impney and a week after that at the beginning of October at Brands Hatch while two adverts for the Elite appeared in Autosport later the same month. And Lewis "did a deal" with [supposedly] Perkins at [a] Prescott.  Lewis was a Life Member of the BRDC which states he switched to saloon cars for the 1960 season.

 

I can envisage a scenario where Lewis agreed at Prescott in September 1959 to sell the Elite to Perkins at the end of the season. When the time came perhaps Perkins was not yet in a position to complete so Lewis inserted a couple of ads in case he withdrew altogether.  None of this can be "proved" at this stage, but a programme showing Lewis still competing in the Elite at Prescott in April 1960 would certainly disprove it. Do BOC not have one?  And we don't know (yet) whether Perkins still owned the Elite when he died.

[Rupertlt1]

Bakeryman: Thanks. Looking on the bright side we've already moved the Perkins ownership of an Elite from September to May 1960. It is logical to try and move it back to April. The BOC archivist operates on Wednesdays -bless him - so we might hear something shortly. Of course neither driver may show up on April 2/3 in which case it is a bust. Some evidence of Perkins selling the Lotus MkVI-B.M.W., registration SNX 640, would help? Possibly to a Mr. Ward? Does the MkVI show up at Prescott in 1960? RGDS RLT

 

P.S.

Motor Sport, March 1962:

LOTUS B.M.W. 270 b.h.p./ton. £325 o.n.o. Also

K.M.G. spares. 38, Green Road, Birmingham, 28.

 

P.P.S.

We should investigate Great Auclum from 1960 onwards, as Perkins appears to have been a regular there

Edited by Rupertlt1, 15 February 2016 - 21:28.

[pmurray]

I have asked the BOC Archivist whether an event occurred on 2 & 3 April 1960 and if so whether Lewis or Perkins were competing and if so what car(s) did they enter.

 

We should have an answer to that matter in two or three days.

 

As Bakeryman has said the trail is very cold after 50 odd years.  If Perkins did own the car from late 1959/early 1960 to his death, December 1966 there is still the period 1966 - 1969 unaccounted for and no clues to follow-up.

 

I got the impression whilst searching through 11 years of Autosport magazines that hillclimbs reports were fairly brief and it was usually only the top placings that were mentioned so if Perkins or a later owner weren't up with the front runners then they'd never get a mention, let alone a photo. 

[Rupertlt1]

Motor Sport, April, 1960, Page 230:

2/3 April, Bugatti O.C., Prescott, Cheltenham, Hill-Climb (C.), 11.00 a.m.

 

RGDS RLT

[Rupertlt1]

Speed Hill-Climb, C.A.N. May, Pages 143-144:

"It has been the custom of the Bugatti Owners Club, over quite a number of years, to have a practising weekend at the hill, for drivers to acclimatize themselves again after the winter, and this usually takes place about a month before the first climb. At the 1960 practice, Rivers Fletcher flipped the H.W.M. Jaguar coming into Orchard, and the accident didn't look too good. Fortunately Rivers Fletcher was not so badly hurt as seemed likely, but was not in action again until the meeting at Great Auclum, in August."

This was about a month before the first meeting on 1 May. Unless there is some paperwork at B.O.C. ref the practising weekend, or an account in Bugantics, I guess we are out of luck. RGDS RLT

[Charles Helps]

In reply to post #14 I have a Ted Walker photo captioned "1960 MMEC Silverstone Ward's Lotus 6 BMW".  The Mk VI carries racing number 15 and the registration SNX 640. I don't have a programme or date for the event.

[Rupertlt1]

The date was Saturday, June 25th 1960:

 

http://www.progcover...stone600625.jpg

 

RGDS RLT

[Geoff E]

In the "other" thread, one post said Perkins was aged 51 in 1957.

 

A post in this thread says he was living in Rugby in 1967 ... if that info was from a directory, it's possible he was already deceased at that time.

 

In any case, the death of a William S Perkins aged 60 was registered in Rugby at the end of 1966.

 

The 1939 registration finds him in Rugby, date of birth stated as 1 July 1906. At that time he was a "Commercial Electrical Engineer"

 

The 1911 census shows him to have been born in Finchley, his father was a Travelling Representative (Machine tools)

[pmurray]

The information about living in Rugby came from information supplied by the Bugatti Owners Club Archivist who found it in the BOC Members Pocket Book of 1967, apparently the final members pocket book.  It seems Bill was born on 1st July 1906 and died on 26 December 1966.  We haven't asked what the financial year for membership is for BOC but it is feasible that the record in the pocket book shows he is a financial member but not necessarily alive.

 

The BOC Archivist has responded that the event at Prescott on 2nd/3rd April 1960 was a testing weekend and no officlal results were kept.   The club magazine covering that date does not mention Perkins but does say amongst other makes entered for the GT event that a Lotus Elite was there.

[Rupertlt1]

Does anybody have entry, results, report, pictures for Great Auclum, 6 August 1960?

 

We are looking for Bill Perkins, Lotus Elite.

 

Does anybody have entry, results, report, pictures for MMEC Silverstone, Saturday, June 25th 1960?

 

We are looking for a Mr. Ward, Lotus MkVI-B.M.W.

 

RGDS RLT

[Charles Helps]

Thanks for the date of the MMEC Silverstone meeting, Rupert.  As I wrote above I have a Ferret picture of Ward in the Lotus Mk VI-BMW taken at that meeting...

[Rupertlt1]

Great Auclum, 6 August 1960 Results

Saloon Cars:

1. J.J. Brock (Austin Se7en) 24.78 sec

2. D. Richmond (Austin A40) 25.04

3. D.C. Johns (Wolseley)

Sports Cars up to 1,100 c.c.:

1. #22 P. Boshier-Jones (Lotus Eleven) 21.79 sec

2. J.J. Richards (Lotus-Climax) 22.07

3. J. Playford (Lotus-Climax)

Sports Cars up to 1,100 c.c. and up to 1,400 c.c. un s.c.:

1. J. Derisley (Lotus), 22.78 sec

2. M. Adlington (Lotus), 23.00

3. J.A. Ball (Lotus VII) and J.G. Marks (Lotus Elite)

Sports Cars up to 1,400 c.c. and up to 2,000 c.c. un s.c.:

1. #49 Ray Fielding (Cooper-Climax), 22.13 sec

2. Peter Bailey (Lotus-Climax) 22.43 

3. Betty Haig (Lotus VII)

Sports Cars over 2,000 c.c.:

1. P. Scragg (Lister-Jaguar), 22.11 sec

2. J. Randles (Cooper-Climax)

3. J.P. Chapman (Chapman-Mercury)

Formula Junior:

1. Jack Welton (Elva-D.K.W.), 26.09 sec

2. Pauline Brock (Elva-D.K.W.)

Racing Cars up to 500 c.c.:

1. G. Pashley (Cooper), 22.64 sec

2. R.E.G. Hill (Cooper-J.A.P.)

3. M.S. Manning (Cooper MK. II)

(Motor Sport: 1. R.E.G. Hill (Cooper-J.A.P.), 23.33 sec; 2. A.R. White (Kieft), 24.11 sec)

Racing Cars 500 c.c. to 1,100 c.c.:

1. D. Boshier-Jones (Cooper) 20.49 sec

2. D.R. Good (Cooper) 20.98

3. J.W. Cuff (Cooper)

Racing Cars over 1,100 c.c.:

1. Jim Berry (E.R.A.), 21.63 secs

2. Arthur Owen (Cooper-Climax) 21.77

3. G.H. Keylock (Cooper)

R.A.C. Hill-Climb Championship

1. D. Boshier-Jones (Cooper) 23.23 sec

2. D.R. Good (Cooper) 23.73

3. M. Hatton (Cooper)

4. Jim Berry (E.R.A.)

5. Arthur Owen (Cooper-Climax)

Other competitors:

Jaguar Mk VII, L. Avenin

H.K.-Jaguar, Gordon Parker

Mason Master, J.M. Perkins

Omega-M.G., J. Wilks

Allt'cok, F. Bruce-White

Chapman-Mercury, J. Chapman

Cooper s/c, A.T. Norton

Cooper s/c, Haigh

Semmence, Ridley

H.W.M.-Jaguar, Rivers-Fletcher

Cooper, Patsy Burt

 

Still no sign of Bill Perkins?

 

RGDS RLT

Edited by Rupertlt1, 23 February 2016 - 13:56.

[pmurray]

For some updated information on this subject see my new posting in

 

http://forums.autosp...ly-lotus-elite/

[pmurray]

I've posted an update to this thread:

 

http://forums.autosp...lite/?p=7534551