86 replies to this topic

[KTownDevil]

F1 journalist Fritz-Dieter Rencken just tweeted this.

 

Who's gonna get in?

 

Fangio, Senna, Schumacher ... ?

Edited by KTownDevil, 02 December 2015 - 19:54.

[Marklar]

I guess almost all WDC (with a few exceptions like Jacques Villeneuve, Damon Hill or Keke Rosberg and without current drivers) and a few non-WDC like Stirling Moss or Gilles Villeneuve.

[Victor_RO]

If it's an FIA Hall of Fame, and not just for F1, I reckon some names that will also go in immediately would be Derek Bell, Jacky Ickx, Tom Kristensen...

[Marklar]

Oh, didnt saw it. Personally I hope that Stefan Bellof will make it into the list then....

[JHSingo]

If it's an FIA Hall of Fame, and not just for F1, I reckon some names that will also go in immediately would be Derek Bell, Jacky Ickx, Tom Kristensen...

 

Just about to say, hope it's not just for F1 personnel. Totally agree with those suggestions too.

[KingTiger]

Seems a bit pointless. There haven't been that many super drivers over the years. It's not like football or music where someone can come out of nowhere. Especially if it's FIA only, they will probably ignore IMSA, Nascar, and Japanese drivers. 

[Ickx]

I have never understood the point of Hall of fames. If they do it, they should at least limit it to drivers that are able to accept the invitation, i.e drivers that are still alive.

[Anja]

Yay, another subject for hot internet debates. I can already see the "why xx is there but zz isn't" posts.

[Marklar]

Looking in Renckens twitter feed it is possible that it wont just include racing drivers, might be possible that Sid Walkins,for example, could be part of it,

[Volcano70]

Frank Williams and Ross Brawn could get in sometime.

Bernie will be inducted first year 

[Dolph]

I would assume the list will one day contain the names of F1 frontrunners, not only WDC. I assume the likes of Gilles Villeneuve, Michele Alboreto, Gerhard Berger, Jean Alesi, Rubens Barrichello, David Coulthard, Mark Webber etc deserve a mention in the list of racing top names.

 

Otherwise we are just gonna end up with a list of WDC winners + Bernie, Enzo, Colin, Max, Frank, Bruce, Sid, Ron, Flavio and a few others.

Edited by Dolph, 02 December 2015 - 22:10.

[Peter0Scandlyn]

F1 journalist Fritz-Dieter Rencken just tweeted this.

 

Who's gonna get in?

 

Fangio, Senna, Schumacher ... ?

 

Todt.

That's Jean Todt.....

[Myrvold]

Oh, they will probably limit the numbers of people inducted each year, and it will also depend on the criterias, is it just racing achievements, or what they meant for the sport as well. And if they have to be alive, and accept to be there for a ceremony (that I expect there will be).

Anyway I can think of a few rally names that might have a chance depending on the criteria... Loeb, Makinen, Kankkunen, Sainz, McRae, Waldegård, Mouton and Petter Solberg.

I am also guessing that we will get some big surprises... a FIA HoF don't have to come solely from World Championship events either.

[InSearchOfThe]

Wow.

A championship series that's been racing since 1950.

Way to get out in front of things, FIA.

Welcome to the 21st century.

Fangio, Nuvolari, and Ascari have to be in the 1st class, right?

[byrkus]

IIRC, FIA only got the present abbreviation after WW2; before it, it was called AIACR, Association Internationale des Automobile Clubs Reconnus.

 

Which somehow begs the question, if everything pre-WW2 will be ommited...? Hopefully not. Any racing Hall of Fame (specially European oriented, which I suspect it to be) without Nuvolari, Caracciola or Rosemeyer is just a joke of itself.

[ardbeg]

 I assume the likes of Gilles Villeneuve, Michele Alboreto, Gerhard Berger, Jean Alesi, Rubens Barrichello, David Coulthard, Mark Webber etc deserve a mention in the list of racing top names.

 

 

 

They would need a gigantic hall if names like that would be inducted. Gilles maybe, yes, probably, but the rest simply represent the averages.

[DampMongoose]

Graham Hill. Triple Crown and all that...

[karl100589]

Well if we follow the Nascar hall of fame I think the first inductees should be four drivers and someone from the technical side of the sport.

 

So my nominees would be Senna, Schumacher, Fangio, Prost and Colin Chapman.

[DampMongoose]

Well if we follow the Nascar hall of fame I think the first inductees should be four drivers and someone from the technical side of the sport.

So my nominees would be Senna, Schumacher, Fangio, Prost and Colin Chapman.

There are more series than F1 if you look hard enough...

[ardbeg]

They are way behind so they need to catch up. Would be strange if they would start with Nuvolari, Caracciola and  Rosemeyer. Then Fangio, Clark, Moss... and so on. It would take forever until for instance Vettel could come into question. It would also be strange if the 10 years from now put Graham Hill in the hall. 

My guess is that they will fill it up immediately with everyone up until around 1990. Not all drivers of course, but all HOF's 

Edited by ardbeg, 10 December 2015 - 19:31.

[itsademo]

Seems a bit pointless. There haven't been that many super drivers over the years. It's not like football or music where someone can come out of nowhere. Especially if it's FIA only, they will probably ignore IMSA, Nascar, and Japanese drivers. 

and do any of these series induct all time greats who never raced in their series

as still waiting to see drivers like moss or fangio et al who never raced in the above mentioned series inducted into any of their HOF's 

So why should the FIA take in all comers who never raced in any FIA sanctioned series?

[Dolph]

They would need a gigantic hall if names like that would be inducted. Gilles maybe, yes, probably, but the rest simply represent the averages.

 

But why Gilles. Yes, he's loved by many, but what are his achievements.

 

6 victories. There are 38 guys with more than that.

 

He was once second in the championship. So were Alboreto, Massa, Barrichello (twice), Coulthard, Irvine, Frentzen, Patrese, Pironi, Regazzoni, Peterson, Ickx (twice), von Trips, McLaren, Moss (four times) and Gonzales.
 

Maybe he has led many races he didn't win (I don't know). So has Alesi for example...

 

He is a talent lost too early? So are Bellof, Kubica, McLaren, Giunti, Cevert...

[jjcale]

Should be as big as possible since just getting to F1 is a great achievement - Perhaps all race winners or podium finishers who finished at least 30 years ago and then the rest should be spectacular achievers.

 

So middle aged "greats" and geriatric journeymen... current drivers need not apply. Once retired the greats go straight in - then the winners after 10 - 15 years then the podium finishers after 20 to 30 years.... time taken between retirement and induction to depend on reputation and good behavior .....  but all on podium should get there eventually - and guys like Hulk who were good should also get in based on points scored

[Collombin]

So to summarize, the Hall of Fame should include Nico Hulkenburg but not Gilles Villeneuve.

I bloody love this forum.

[YoungGun]

But why Gilles. Yes, he's loved by many, but what are his achievements.

 

6 victories. There are 38 guys with more than that.

 

He was once second in the championship. So were Alboreto, Massa, Barrichello (twice), Coulthard, Irvine, Frentzen, Patrese, Pironi, Regazzoni, Peterson, Ickx (twice), von Trips, McLaren, Moss (four times) and Gonzales.
 

Maybe he has led many races he didn't win (I don't know). So has Alesi for example...

 

He is a talent lost too early? So are Bellof, Kubica, McLaren, Giunti, Cevert...

 

There isn't more than a day or so that goes by on this board and some 35 years since Gilles came on to the scene that his name is still mentioned. Make of that what you will. I consider that a lasting legacy that surpasses being in a Hall of Fame.

[ardbeg]

But why Gilles. Yes, he's loved by many, but what are his achievements.

 

6 victories. There are 38 guys with more than that.

 

He was once second in the championship. So were Alboreto, Massa, Barrichello (twice), Coulthard, Irvine, Frentzen, Patrese, Pironi, Regazzoni, Peterson, Ickx (twice), von Trips, McLaren, Moss (four times) and Gonzales.
 

Maybe he has led many races he didn't win (I don't know). So has Alesi for example...

 

He is a talent lost too early? So are Bellof, Kubica, McLaren, Giunti, Cevert...

 

Because it is a Hall of Fame, not a Hall of Achievements.

[Dolph]

Because it is a Hall of Fame, not a Hall of Achievements.

 

Are they gonna leave out Vettel then because he is for some strange reason disliked?

[ardbeg]

Are they gonna leave out Vettel then because he is for some strange reason disliked?

Yes, Vettel will be banned. They told me over the phone yesterday.

[Szoelloe]

Ross Brawn, MS

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rest of the candidates

[Myrvold]

This became very F1 centered... It's FIA HoF, not F1 HoF.
 

[jjcale]

So to summarize, the Hall of Fame should include Nico Hulkenburg but not Gilles Villeneuve.

I bloody love this forum.

 

Said who??

[Collombin]

Said who??

You covered the first bit, Dolph the second.

[Fastcake]

Wow.

A championship series that's been racing since 1950.

Way to get out in front of things, FIA.

Welcome to the 21st century.

Fangio, Nuvolari, and Ascari have to be in the 1st class, right?

 

A Hall of Fame is basically an American concept, so I wouldn't have really expected the FIA to ever start doing one.

 

Ross Brawn, MS

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rest of the candidates

 

Only if your sole experience of motorsport was watching a few dozen F1 races between 2000 and 2004. For the rest of us, there are a considerable number of more and equally deserving candidates before hitting Schumacher.

[Mila]

It's difficult enough to get to the pinnacle of motorsports, but they couldn't just leave it at that.

Edited by Mila, 11 December 2015 - 19:54.

[P0inters]

Hopefully Alex Zanardi will get in .

[Nathan]

Zanardi's real achievements didn't happen while with the FIA.

 

Hall of Fame for scoring points and podiums?  Hall of Fame's are for the people fans are still talking about, or influencing the sport, one or two generations after they left.

 

If people like Hulkenberg are still spoken of in 20 years it will because of the potential they didn't realize, and that doesn't really warrant being in the company of the 'best-of-the-best', and I'm not sure if being killed is an exemption to that either.  If a person achieved, then they should be considered, but not because 'he could have'.

Edited by Nathan, 11 December 2015 - 22:01.

[jjcale]

Zanardi's real achievements didn't happen while with the FIA.

 

Hall of Fame for scoring points and podiums?  Hall of Fame's are for the people fans are still talking about, or influencing the sport, one or two generations after they left.

 

If people like Hulkenberg are still spoken of in 20 years it will because of the potential they didn't realize, and that doesn't really warrant being in the company of the 'best-of-the-best', and I'm not sure if being killed is an exemption to that either.  If a person achieved, then they should be considered, but not because 'he could have'.

 

I think it should be "worthy of being remembered" - rather that is "fondly remembered" .... and pretty much everyone who made it to F1 on merit is worthy of being remembered IMHO .

 

Isnt it true that more people have been to space than have driven in F1 (on merit anyway) .... or is that an urban legend?

[Myrvold]

I think it is more people have been to space than people who have won and F1 race, not sure though.

 

Nevertheless, there are so much more than F1 under the FIA banner, and not only World Championships either.

[ensign14]

F1 journalist Fritz-Dieter Rencken just tweeted this.

 

Who's gonna get in?

 

Doesn't matter.  Like all Halls of Fame, it'll be total ****.  PR bollocks for the Great Unwashed.

[Dolph]

Isnt it true that more people have been to space than have driven in F1 (on merit anyway) .... or is that an urban legend?

 

That doesn't sound right. Easily checked though.

 

536 people in space:

https://en.wikipedia...avelers_by_name
 

842 people in F1 according to this:

https://en.wikipedia...ula_One_drivers

 

105 F1 winners:

https://en.wikipedia...nd_Prix_winners

 

If you'd compile a list of F1 drivers on merit and counted them up you could make your own comparison.

Edited by Dolph, 12 December 2015 - 00:37.

[Dolph]

You covered the first bit, Dolph the second.

 

Why are you being so confrontational. Is it because you are frustrated people have different opinions to your own?

[sennafan24]

Why are you being so confrontational. Is it because you are frustrated people have different opinions to your own?

I think it's more due to how you defined Gilles based on his career stats. I am no expert on G.V, but from what I have read, he did things with the car that far surpassed what Rubens and D.C achieved.

Gilles's talent is gushed over by his peers, even today. In 40 years, would we expect Irvine to be celebrated in such a way?.

A 2nd place finish in the WDC in one context is always going to be more or less impressive than in other contexts. What's more acclaimed? Alonso's 2nd place in the 2012 Championship, or Nico's 2nd place this year?

[chunder27]

Yanks have halls of fame for everything, something we dont really want or need.

Would imagine therenis money to be made.

[Collombin]

Why are you being so confrontational. Is it because you are frustrated people have different opinions to your own?

Not really, I wouldn't take a motorsport hall of fame too seriously anyway. For what it's worth I would have more issues with Hulkenburg being in than Gilles being out, but that kind of depends on the parameters (how many new inductees each year etc). How high should the Hall set its bar?

Edited by E.B., 12 December 2015 - 09:23.

[byrkus]

Zanardi's real achievements didn't happen while with the FIA.

 

I think that he's the only driver with amputated limbs, who managed to win a FIA World Championship race. After all, WTCC is a World Championship under FIA.

 

But of course... There aren't enough superlatives to use with Alex Zanardi.

[goldenboy]

Seems kinda late to me! What are they going to do, add 100 drivers instantly (that deserve to be there) and then add a few each year? Not like it makes any difference to anything but i dont see the point.

[Bleu]

I think something like this would be good:

2016: Add 30 who have all died (great drivers like Fangio, Senna as well as personnel like Enzo Ferrari, Colin Chapman, Sid Watkins etc.)

 

2017: Add another 30 and include first living ones. A ceremony around FIA Championship event, place alternating yearly.

 

2018  onwards: Limited induction like maximum of four drivers and three personnel each year. Drivers have to be retired from racing, personnel may be active if they are over certain age (around 60-65)

[BRG]

The F1 WDC/WCC is failing

The WRC is failing

The WTCC is failing

 

Let's start a Hall of Fame, maybe nobody will notice....

[Nathan]

Can you always be succeeding??

[BRG]

Can you always be succeeding??

Nope, but let's throw up a smokescreen to cover it up.  Or we could try to fix things.......no, let's go with the smokescreen.