19 replies to this topic

[Barry Boor]

A friend of mine sent me a photo of John Surtees sitting in what looks like a 1.5 litre Ferrari, but wearing a plain white helmet.

I had to admit that I thought he wore the white one with the light blue band and stripe from 1962 on.

My view is that he never actually raced a Ferrari when wearing a plain white helmet but, am I wrong?

[Roger Clark]

Which model and any clues where it is?

[Barry Boor]

It's a very close up shot, Roger, and all I can see is part of the engine cover with what looks like vertical trumpets so I'm guessing it's a 158 or a 1512. There is no background visible to give a clue about the location.

[D-Type]

Maybe a test either possibly before he joined the team

[Barry Boor]

No, because the car he is sitting in is definitely later than the 1963 car.

Anyway, just because it's a test, why would he wear a different helmet? Fact is though, he did. The picture proves it.

[Tim Murray]

Pure speculation, but assuming his existing helmet was written off in his 1965 Mosport crash, he might not have got round to putting the stripes on the new one when he first returned to the cockpit. He said in his (second) autobiography that he used the 2.4 V6 Dino-engined single-seater as his training car during his recovery, putting in many laps at Modena - might this possibly match the car in the photo?

[Barry Boor]

After much f-faffing about, I can now show you the picture (source unknown).

 

[Collombin]

That pic is from the front cover of one of his autobiographies, and with the book in my hands the stripe is clearly visible.

[Tim Murray]

Dear oh dear. You'd have thought I might have spotted that, having had the book sitting in front of me for the last couple of hours.

Agreed absolutely, the stripes are clearly there. The photo is attributed to Geoff Goddard, but there are no details about what or when.

[Barry Boor]

Ha! I've got that book too.......

I guess someone has scanned the picture and lost the clarity, thus the stripe has faded. Thank you, everyone.

[Collombin]

Dear oh dear. You'd have thought I might have spotted that, having had the book sitting in front of me for the last couple of hours.
 

 

I'm shorter than you, my eyes were closer.

[Doug Nye]

Geoff Goddard photo indeed - now copyright The GP Library.  Geoff got on very well with Shirtsleeves - they were on the same short-fused wavelength.

 

DCN

[bill p]

Geoff Goddard photo indeed - now copyright The GP Library.  Geoff got on very well with Shirtsleeves - they were on the same short-fused wavelength.
 
DCN

Stupid question Number 431, if the blue stripes are Photoshopped out is it still a GP Library copyright - I think I know the answer!

Bill P

[Barry Boor]

I don't think it's photoshopped out, Bill. Even on the cover of the book it is barely visible. In the reproduction of the photo that was sent to me it's just that much lighter so the stripe appears to have disappeared. If that is possible!

[Roger Clark]

It's certainly a V8 and it looks like number 1 which means early '65 - South Africa, Race of Champions, International Trophy or Belgium. I can't recall seeing a Geoff Goddard photo from South Africa so suspect he wasn't there. At Spa the Ferraris had an extra fuel tank over the engine - Surtees had run out at Monaco. It could, therefore be one of the English non-championship races.

Or possibly not.

Edited by Roger Clark, 21 July 2016 - 21:59.

[bill p]

I don't think it's photoshopped out, Bill. Even on the cover of the book it is barely visible. In the reproduction of the photo that was sent to me it's just that much lighter so the stripe appears to have disappeared. If that is possible!

Thank you, Barry

That may be but it doesn't answer my query on Copyright at post #13

Bill P

[D-Type]

Stupid question Number 431, if the blue stripes are Photoshopped out is it still a GP Library copyright - I think I know the answer!

Bill P

I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think modifying a copyright picture takes it out of copyright.    

[Barry Boor]

I thought I had sort of answered the question when I said that I don't think the picture had been fiddled with.  The stripe is very faint on the book cover so I think the apparent lack of stripe is simply down to poor reproduction.

 

There must be another version of the picture somewhere else because the book cover shows nothing of the car, unlike the version that was sent to me.

[Doug Nye]

I think you all need the services of a decent optician.  The base stripe around JS's crash helmet in Geoff's photo is part hidden by his goggles strap, yet clearly visible through the googles lenses - through which the foot of the vertical stripe running up the front of the helmet is also clearly seen. The gloss stripe almost - but not quite - vanishes in the highlighted area running up over the top of the helmet.  In fact it's clearly visible there as a slight change of tone.  The 'white helmet' matter is a complete phantom. Get a grip boys...  

 

DCN

[JacnGille]

You had to go and ruin the beginnings of a perfectly good conspirosy theory, didn't ya?????