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'Grand Prix' - the out-takes?


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#651 Macca

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Posted 15 September 2006 - 18:05

..........and can anyone name the missing noted F1 driver who had a large involvement in filming?


Paul M

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#652 Keir

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Posted 18 September 2006 - 13:24

Maybe !!

#653 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 18 September 2006 - 13:43

Bob Bondurant?

#654 Keir

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Posted 18 September 2006 - 14:03

Barry, you're on !!!

#655 MrMacca

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 14:47

front: Mike Spence, John Frankenheimer, Brian Bedford; then Bob Bondurant, Jo Bonnier, Jo Siffert; Phil Hill, Antonio Sabato, Yves Montand; James Garner, Chris Amon, Graham Hill.

........but oddly Ritchie Ginther is missing; he did a lot of filming, standing in for Bedford, but perhaps at the time the photo was taken he had gone to Japan to start testing the Honda.

Paul M

#656 MCS

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 14:50

Wasn't Jo Schlesser involved in a lot of the filming too?

#657 MrMacca

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 15:03

Yes, but he wasn't a GP driver at the time - Rindt and Hulme of the then-GP drivers also did a lot of filming, apart from others who drove the kiddy-cars, and Jim Russell of course.

see:
http://www.jochen-ri...a_GrandPrix.jpg

http://www.jochen-ri...Prix/f2_1_b.jpg

Paul M

#658 Barry Boor

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 18:19

Paul, I gotta ask.... why the new name?

#659 FLB

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Posted 21 September 2006 - 18:40

Originally posted by MCS
Wasn't Jo Schlesser involved in a lot of the filming too?

He's in the Spa drivers' meeting scene. It's a wonderful bit. I don't know anywhere else you can hear his voice :love:

His bit of dialogue is 'C'est chaque fois la même chose!', just as Stoddard is arriving in the hotel lobby.

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#660 FLB

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 18:21

Looking for something else, I found an interview with Donal O'Brien, who played the role Jeff Jordan in Grand Prix.

#661 MCS

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 18:35

Originally posted by FLB
Looking for something else, I found an interview with Donal O'Brien, who played the role Jeff Jordan in Grand Prix.


And...?!! :cat:

#662 FLB

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 18:42

Originally posted by MCS


And...?!! :cat:


Sorry! Forgot the link... :blush:

http://www.christian...de/donalob.html

#663 MCS

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 20:54

Very interesting. So who was the "failed" leading lady then?

#664 R.W. Mackenzie

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 22:07

Ah, didn't Jack Watson play Jeff Jordan?

Bob Mackenzie

#665 R.W. Mackenzie

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Posted 22 September 2006 - 22:28

I did some checking and found that Donal O'brien played Wallace Bennett in "Grand Prix". I wasn't sure who this character was so I checked my trusty old copy of the "novel" of the same name written by Manning Lee Stokes and "based on the story and screenplay by Robert Alan Arthur". It states that Wallace Bennett was the Jordan team manager (Jeff Jordan was the team owner).

Funny, I've watched "Grand Prix" a million times and I never knew that Jeff Jordon's right-hand man was named Wallace Bennett. Now I'll have to watch it again to see if it's actually stated somewhere.

#666 Macca

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Posted 23 September 2006 - 19:53

Originally posted by Barry Boor
Paul, I gotta ask.... why the new name?


Forgot to change my password to something I could remember at work, so had to re-register............. :blush:


posted by MCS:

So who was the "failed" leading lady then?



Apparently it was Swedish actress Harriet Andersson, who appeared in many Ingmar Bergman films around that time..........she must have been BAD, because I think Eva-Marie Sainte was one of the weaker performances.

There's an article in the new issue of 'F1 Racing' magazine to celebrate the DVD issue, which mostly has photos often seen before. However, there is a large version of the publicity picture of the four cars and the main actors on the track at Monza............and Sainte is obviously superimposed - I wonder why. Presumably the photo was taken during filming, and she was at Monza then, so maybe she went home early.

Donal O'Brien is in this photo beside Jack Watson and Bedford; the only other 'lesser' character in it is the Ferrari team manager played by Enzo Fiermonte, who had several speaking/shouting scenes. I expect most of O'Brien's role ended up on the cutting-room floor, apart from the bit where he shouts in Jeff Jordan's ear at Monaco "You can't blame Pete for wanting to race."

Paul M

#667 Macca

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Posted 18 October 2006 - 21:42

garner-sainte-sm_zps75071f11.jpg

E-M S: 'Don't look now, but isn't that Jochen Rindt in Scott's car?"

JG: "Never mind that, where were you when they took the other photos?"



brabhamyamuragt40pj6.jpg

JB: "So, Mr Yamura, do you expect me to win?"

TM: "no, Mr Brabham, I expect you to scare Sabato **itless!"




Paul M


Edited by Macca, 10 September 2013 - 16:21.


#668 MCS

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Posted 09 November 2006 - 20:47

Where has the picture of Barlini stood outside the English pub gone...?

#669 Macca

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Posted 20 November 2006 - 22:48

It was actually Sarti outside the pub...............and I don't know where it's gone - Imageshack seems to be playing up :(

Posted Image



Paul M

#670 MCS

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Posted 21 November 2006 - 18:40

Originally posted by Macca
It was actually Sarti outside the pub...............and I don't know where it's gone - Imageshack seems to be playing up :(
Paul M


Paul - any chance you could re-post the picture?
I have a hunch as to where the pub is (was, actually).

Thanks
Mark

#671 Macca

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Posted 21 November 2006 - 22:31

Unfortunately the original photo was lost in a hard-drive crash.............perhaps someone who already has the DVD (mine is for Xmas!) could grab that frame off their PC and post it?

Meanwhile........maybe this should be in the helmet thread...........but probably not.............a recent foray to an autojumble produced great success - both Barlini's AND Sarti's crash-helmets, not to mention Sarti's stringbacks.............

Posted Image


;)


Paul M

Edited by Macca, 31 August 2012 - 15:14.


#672 Jerome

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Posted 22 November 2006 - 13:59

On the groupfoto (3 left, 4 missing)

Whos' the guy with the goatee in the smack middle? I've seen him a lot on old footage? To the left of Montand, to in front of Hill?

#673 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 22 November 2006 - 14:37

Joakim Bonnier ...??? :|

Greeting from Uithoorn

#674 picblanc

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Posted 22 November 2006 - 19:31

Jo Bonnier.

#675 Jerome

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Posted 24 November 2006 - 19:27

Ah thanx that's him. I've googled his image.

I saw him a lot on old footage, and he is almost too Errol Flynn like to be a real racing driver!

#676 Tomas Karlsson

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Posted 27 November 2006 - 19:05

Apparently it was Swedish actress Harriet Andersson, who appeared in many Ingmar Bergman films around that time..........she must have been BAD, because I think Eva-Marie Sainte was one of the weaker performances.



I just couldn't take that Harriet Andersson should have been bad, so I looked up her own view of what happened in an interviewbook written by Jan Lumholdt from 2005 (in my own quick translation) :

You were supposed to act in John Frankenheimer's "Grand Prix"?
"That's right. I heard from them when I was in London. I don't know if it was Sidney Lumet who recommended me or how it came up. Or why they even called me. That mr Frankenstein wasn't a nice man. Well in London it was all smiles, but then when we got to Monte Carlo, it was like Dr Jekyll and mr Hyde. He didn't like my acting style, I think. I think they had had Eva Marie Saint in their heads all along and when she became avaliable, they got rid of me. They had already got a lot of PR out of me. There were a lot of Swedish journalists down there. And there he stood, saying that I was one of the best actors in the world and all and then I was out, just as easy as I got in. And Eva-Marie Saint took my place."

Did you shoot any scenes?
"Sure. I was standing on some bloody balcony, with the cameraman in a helicopter and the cars running by down there. And then we were running in some corridor together with a couple of models. I was supposed to be some sort of model agent. We had taken photos and made up clothes and wigs in London. By the way, the hair-dresser had worked with Marilyn Monroe. But suddenly everything got strange. Simone Signoret called me. She wasn't in the film, but her husband Yves Montand was. He knew probably that something was going on and had told her.
They took me up to a big suite and there was James Garner and John Frankenheimer. 'Sorry. They don't want you back in the States', said Garner. Frankenheimer sat beside him and said nothing. 'No?', I said and thought, what the hell do I do now? But then I thought of what Simone had told me:'Don't leave Monte Carlo. Do as everyone else. Don't let them be able to say, that it was you that left'. So I did as she said and lawyers were called in. Everyone that was supposed to know then knew, that it wasn't me who had left the film. And I got some sort of economic compensation.
Maybe it was James Garner who didn't like me. He wasn't nice. And the film was bad.
But on the other hand, Hôtel de Paris is always Hôtel de Paris."

#677 Macca

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Posted 28 November 2006 - 15:53

Originally posted by MCS


Paul - any chance you could re-post the picture?
I have a hunch as to where the pub is (was, actually).

Thanks
Mark


The Imageshack link for the shot of the outside of the pub seems to be OK just now:

Posted Image

Here's the inside, from the movie programme:

Posted Image

..and some goods stills are appearing on the web now the DVD is out - Garner approaching Mirabeau:

Posted Image

#678 stovebolt66

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Posted 01 December 2006 - 12:22

Frankenhiemer made an interesting comment on the recently re-aired interview he did with Bruce Dern back in the 1990's when the then named Speedvison (now called Speed) first aired Grand prix as part of the Lost Drive In series.
He said he felt that he had short changed Garner's performance in that during the hectic post production, he cut several scenes of Aron (Garner) that would have made the character much more likeable and sympathetic to the audience.
Since the recently released DVD did not include any outtakes or unused scenes, one is left to wonder what might have been had those cuts not been made.
What would have they been about?
Possibly more of a look at the implied friendship with Sarti?
Garner all but disappeared the second half of the movie, mainly having his fireball of a finish at Brands and then winning the final race.
On a related note, Frankenheimer hinted that if had it to do over again, he would not have had Sarti die at the end, although this would have left the questions open: Had he lived, would he have retired?..would he have went ahead and fought for a divorce from his estranged wife to be with the Louise character?
Points to ponder, but unless some film turns up at a later time, we will never know for sure.

#679 Macca

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Posted 08 December 2006 - 21:06

Mark (MCS),

Did that picture of the outside of the pub help with identification?

On Dec. 21st it will be 40 years since the premiere of the film - here is some more info about the DVD:

http://www.dvdbeaver..._dvd_review.htm

....and an artistic tribute: 'Sarti's last Grand Prix':
Posted Image


Paul M

Edited by Macca, 05 January 2010 - 20:28.


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#680 MCS

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Posted 08 December 2006 - 21:33

Originally posted by Macca
Mark (MCS),

Did that picture of the outside of the pub help with identification?

Paul M


Yes I'm pretty sure it was a pub on the A20 / London Road heading back into London, about two or so miles from Brands. I say "was" as it's now flats.

I remember stopping off there many years ago (28 to be exact!).

Can't remember what it was called - it's certainly not evident now. I'll try to stop and ask next time I'm in the area - somebody will know I would have thought.

#681 Rob29

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Posted 09 December 2006 - 09:43

Originally posted by MCS


Yes I'm pretty sure it was a pub on the A20 / London Road heading back into London, about two or so miles from Brands. I say "was" as it's now flats.

I remember stopping off there many years ago (28 to be exact!).

Can't remember what it was called - it's certainly not evident now. I'll try to stop and ask next time I'm in the area - somebody will know I would have thought.

2 miles from Brands would put it in Farningham village.Main pub was 'The Bull'which was the timetable point for the buses.Dont know if it is still there as I have not been for many years.

#682 MCS

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Posted 09 December 2006 - 11:52

Yes, I think you're right, Rob.

It's not in the village per say though, but next to the A20 as you finish climbing up the hill from the roundabout.

#683 sterling49

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Posted 09 December 2006 - 12:13

Originally posted by Rob29
2 miles from Brands would put it in Farningham village.Main pub was 'The Bull'which was the timetable point for the buses.Dont know if it is still there as I have not been for many years.


I think the pub you are describing is (or was) "The Farningham Hotel" it used to have "HOTEL" painted on the roof so that you could see it on the way down Farningham Hill, rather like Dan Gurney was always painted at Druids,

#684 M Needforspeed

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Posted 09 December 2006 - 23:11

Originally posted by Macca
Posted Image
(source unknown)

Spa 1966, the Masta Straight - either Sarti is about to lap Rindt, or Surtees is moving up to take the lead as the track dries....................but where's the helicopter?

Paul M


it s well Surtees .I remember posting it on another site forum .I remember my scan that s not perfect .This shot is from the now defunct AUTOMOBILE HISTORIQUE monthly french mag .

#685 Nanni Dietrich

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Posted 13 December 2006 - 09:09

Originally posted by Macca
The latest issue of 'Octane' has an article about Trevor Taylor, Lotus no. 2 in 1962-63, illustrated by photos credited to Trevor himself.

Among them are some of the aftermath of his crash in paractise at Spa in 1963 in Lotus 25/R5, when his rear suspension came loose in the middle of Stavelot (either due to a loose nut, or a stubby screwdriver temporarily stuck in a bolthole and forgotten) - and the crash is identical to Sarti's at the same place a year later!

...

Paul M


J-P Sarti's Ferrari hit two young Belgian spectators, killing both (or just one? don't remember).
Did Trevor Taylor do the same? don't remember.

#686 Barry Boor

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Posted 13 December 2006 - 10:28

It was two but I don't recall Taylor hitting anything other than a telegraph pole; or was that Willy?

#687 Macca

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Posted 13 December 2006 - 11:09

No, that was a different one of Taylor's many big crashs.

It was 1962 when Mairesse knocked his Lotus 24 out of gear with the tip of the 'sharknose' at Clubhouse bend, sending Taylor along a ditch into a telegraph pole, while the Ferrari rolled and burned after throwing Mairesse out.

The Stavelot crash was in practise in 1963 in a 25, and nobody else was involved, no spectators, just the bottom corner of the commentary box or whatever it was.


Paul M

#688 Barry Boor

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Posted 13 December 2006 - 11:15

Trevor didn't have a lot of luck round there, did he?

He's a very lucky man to still be with us.

#689 Macca

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Posted 18 December 2006 - 19:04

Probably Trevor's luckiest escape was at Enna when a rock thrown by Bandini's BRM knocked him out and he was thrown limply along the track as the car destroyed itself, escaping with 'only' concussion, cuts and bruises.

Meanwhile............I'd posted this picture before, but I've numbered the drivers - any one care to try and fill in the gaps in my IDs?

Posted Image

1. Frankenheimer
2. Jim Russell
3. ?
4. Ginther
5. Rindt
6. ?
7. ?
8. Jo Bonnier (I've seen him elsewhere in that black anorak with the red collar)
9. ? maybe Hulme
10. Phil Hill?

(plus of course the obligatory officials and cops on the make........)


Paul M

#690 Macca

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 07:04

It was 40 years ago today................

Posted Image

Paul M

#691 Breadmaster

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Posted 21 December 2006 - 07:40

40 years seems such a big number!

#692 Macca

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Posted 11 February 2007 - 22:03

Someone mentioned they glimpsed the fake cars in the aerial footage of the Monaco GP on the old railway viaduct; I'd never seen them, either because that shot was cut from the version I last saw & videod on TV, or because the reduction from widescreen chopped them off.

Anyway, they are clearly seen on the DVD, together with the Lotus 33 camera car used by Phil Hill in practise, the Cobra in which Frankenheimer was driven around to plan shots, and the front & rear body sections of the GT40 camera car:

Posted Image

In another shot, where the camera car is following a Ferrari round Station Hairpin, the Hertz van used by Jim Russell to transport the fakes can be seen behind the stands.

Paul M

#693 Rob29

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Posted 12 February 2007 - 09:11

Pretty sure I have never seen that shot Macca.Must get that DVD-still cannot find it on sale in Lincolnshire :cry:

#694 Arjan de Roos

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Posted 12 February 2007 - 09:21

So they give it all away in a single shot... ;)

#695 Samas M.

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Posted 12 February 2007 - 10:07

Originally posted by Macca
........
Anyway, they are clearly seen on the DVD, together with the Lotus 33 camera car used by Phil Hill in practise, the Cobra in which Frankenheimer was driven around to plan shots, and the front & rear body sections of the GT40 camera car:
.........
Paul M


: Oh Boy, now you've done it, I'll just HAVE to watch it all the way through again to see if I can spot them!!! :lol:

#696 Breadmaster

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Posted 12 February 2007 - 10:54

This is a very dangerous games you've started....ok - when I get 5 mins i'll be going through the DVD frame by frame! :smoking:

#697 Ratcatcher

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Posted 12 February 2007 - 14:37

I was given the HD DVD version of Grand Prix for my birthday. Wow, is all I can say about the restoration job and detail when you watch this movie on a hi definition system!

What a great movie it is, my father Syd Diggory, took me to see it and we both loved it, I think it was on it's first run. He, of course knew many of the drivers in the movie. The driving scenes still look awesome to this day and shows that with all the cgi available to Hollywood these days there's nothing quite like strapping a camera to the car and driving fast!

This is a link to a review of the high def version of the movie: http://hddvd.highdef.../grandprix.html by the way if you haven't seen how good HD movies look on a proper HD television you may be surprised.

#698 Macca

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Posted 13 February 2007 - 21:01

And here is the shot from the opening titles that caused me as a boy in 1967 to think "Who is that?"

Posted Image

In the credits of the drivers who took part in filming is Skip Scott - here he is:

http://www.imca-slot...river-Scott.jpg

but he was only racing in sportscars in Europe in 1966, not in the Monaco F3 race.

Anyway, what happened to him?


Paul M

#699 AAA-Eagle

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Posted 22 February 2007 - 19:27

Grand Prix movie will be shown on TCM channels today evening and tomorrow early morning:

Today at 21.00 (CET) on TCM Europe

Tomorrow morning at 05.10 (CET) on TCM Clasico

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#700 macoran

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Posted 22 February 2007 - 19:54

Posted Image

Anybody know more about this "hitch" job??