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Motor sport during WW2


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#1 Graham Clayton

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 03:49

The common view is that all forms of motorsport came
to an abrupt end with the beginning of WW2.

This is not true, as American racing continued until the
end of 1941, while there was the Tripoli GP in 1940.

However, from 1942 up to mid 1945, the amount of
racing of all types would have been severely curtailed,
but not totally stopped.

Maybe the TNF members could help construct a list of
ALL of the motor racing events that were held in the
world from the beginning of 1942 up to the end of the
war in mid 1945?

Any event regardless of its stature should be mentioned,
as well as all forms of motor sport , eg were there still
speedway events in the US between 1942-45?

It seems the "Gestapo Grand Prix" will make a good start
to the list!

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#2 quintin cloud

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 09:30

Off hand in 1945 there is only the 3 races in Paris ,on the 9 September for cars less than 1500cc , 1500 to 3000cc and over 3000cc. :blush: :smoking:

#3 Rob29

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 11:03

That was AFTER WW2 Quintin. The only racing after Dec 7 1941,I have found was in Argentina,where Fangio was still racing in 42. Racing was only suspended there at the end of 42,due to fuel shortage. I assume the 'Gestaop GP' is some kind of wind up?

#4 Vitesse2

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 12:32

There was a short-lived thread about Brazilian racing during WW2:

http://www.atlasf1.c...&threadid=23786

:)

#5 Graham Clayton

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 22:02

Since I started this thread, I thought I might contribute some research.
For the purposes of the question, I think we are looking at all racing between 3 September 1939 and August 1945.
Here are some events that I have come across

AUSTRALIA
Full 1939/40 speedway season
1940 - Bathurst Easter meeting
- Pingelly (Western Australia)
- Applecross (Western Australia)
- Lobethal (South Australia)
1940/41/42? - last few meetings at
Penrith 1 mile oval in western Sydney
1944? - Unconfirmed reports of a speedcar
race at the Henson Park football ground
in the inner Sydney suburb of Newtown.

UNITED STATES
1940 - Indy 500
- Pikes Peak Hill Climb
1941 - Indy 500
- Pikes Peak Hill Climb
I presume that there would have been
speedway racing in 1940 & 1941?

EUROPE
1940 - Mille Miglia
- Tripoli GP

SOUTH AMERICA
1940-45 - Gran Premio del Norte - 5,900
mile road race, where Fangio made his name

I have also read of a tour of US speedcar drivers
to Argentina in 1938. Did speedway racing
continue in Argentina during WW2?

#6 Vitesse2

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 22:27

In addition to the US events you record, Graham, the AAA Championship continued in 1940 and 1941: there were races at Springfield (Aug 24th 1940), Syracuse (Sept 2nd (?) 1940), Milwaukee (Aug 24th (?) 1941) and Syracuse (Sept 1st 1941). I have put queries by the dates (which come from Peter Higham's book), since presumably these would have been Saturday races. As September 2nd 1939 was a Saturday, these dates must be open to doubt.

In Europe, you have also missed the Targa Florio, which took place at Palermo on May 23rd 1940.

#7 Gerr

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 23:17

Here is an article about Canadian racing during WWII..
http://www.geocities...ty/Garage/8819/
(Canada was at war as of September 10,1939)

#8 Gerr

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 23:20

On the link in the reply above,click on "Canadian Model T Races" at the left side of the page.

#9 Marcor

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Posted 04 October 2001 - 23:35

In Belgium, the "GP Automobile de l'Exposition Internationale de l'Eau de Liège" was cancelled between the practice and the race because of the mobilisation which was proclaimed on Sunday 27th in August 1939. This was the last motorsport event in Belgium until May 1946 (the "Rallye-Surprise" of the Motor Union) and more seriously the GP des Frontières (June 9th) and the Belgium GP events (June 16).

The race at Liège was a sportscar race. The 1946 Belgium GP were in fact three sportscars races.

#10 Felix Muelas

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Posted 05 October 2001 - 12:34

In addittion, and according to the Maserati website there were wins by Maserati drivers in the following events :

Camp Bay 12 Dec 1940 Winner Steve Chiappini

Tijuca 25 May 1941 Winner Diego de Sterlich


That (of course) do not ring a bell to me...

Felix

#11 Darren Galpin

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Posted 05 October 2001 - 12:55

That race at Tijuca could have been in Rio de Janeiro. The reason I say this is that there is a Tijuca Forest in Rio, and the Gavea track runs through it. We know that there were races through until 1941 in Rio, with a race being held at Gavea on the 28th September of that year.

#12 David McKinney

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Posted 05 October 2001 - 14:31

There used to be a hillclimb at Tijuca. I don't think I've ever heard of de Sterlich taking part though - most of his activity was ten years before that. Wonder if the reference was a misprint?

#13 Don Capps

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Posted 05 October 2001 - 14:55

Here are links to the Champ Car events in the US for 1939 thru 1941:

http://www.motorspor...year.asp?Y=1939

http://www.motorspor...year.asp?Y=1940

http://www.motorspor...year.asp?Y=1941

Suffice it to say that the European War of 1939-1941 had relatively minimal impact in the US until December 1941. There were other Sprint (Big Car) and Midget events which were held after the end of August 1939 and during the 1940 and 1941 seasons; in addition, there was that interesting race meeting at the NY World's Fair in 1940.

During the First World War (The Great War), American racing continued right through the War:

http://www.motorspor...year.asp?Y=1917

http://www.motorspor...year.asp?Y=1918

However, despite what is written in the yearly summaries, there were not AAA National Championships awarded for 1917 and 1918 (nor 1919 for that matter).

#14 Barry Lake

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Posted 08 October 2001 - 08:30

Originally posted by Graham Clayton

1940/41/42? - last few meetings at
Penrith 1 mile oval in western Sydney
1944? - Unconfirmed reports of a speedcar
race at the Henson Park football ground
in the inner Sydney suburb of Newtown.


Graham

The final two meetings at Penrith Spedway were 14 April 1941 and 25 April 1941. The former is well documented in newspapers of the time.

I have not yet found details of the latter. I believe the start time was delayed by a motorcycle riders strike to the extent that the car events could not be conducted.

Henson Park Midget Speedcar meeting definitely did occur in 1944. I believe it was in October, or thereabouts. Dinny Patterson was seriously injured during this meeting. The track was a banked, ashphalt cycling velodrome, with only a wooden picket fence surrounding it. The track was never used again for motor sport.

The elderly man you saw me speaking to at Brian Linigen's during the Vintage Speedcar Association swap meet, Jack Gay, told me he was at that meeting and described the racing in some detail (although, as I told you, his memory was very unreliable when it came to hard facts).

Jack Gay told me what others had told me before that the "Boys Town" speedway meetings on Sundays at the Sydney Sportsground, continued spasmodically throughout the war years. He said they were run in the daylight on Sundays because lights were not allowed to be used at night during the war years.

On the other hand, some old timers "who should know" have told me this was not so, that the "Boys Town" meetings finished in 1939 and the Sportsground did not re-open until 1945. Others, still, don't even believe this. They have told me that the re-opening was not until 1946.

I have no hard evidence either way. I suspect that if speedway was run through the war, in addition to that 1944 Henson Park meeting, it probably was not widely publicised and might not have been reported in the newspapers.

If you come across any eveidence of wartime speedway racing in Australia, I would love to hear about it.

The Vintage Sports Car Club of Australia conducted a One Hour Trial for its members in NSW on 11 March 1945, five months before the Japanese surrender.

#15 Darren Galpin

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Posted 08 October 2001 - 08:36

In "Fast Tracks" by Terry Walker, it suggests that the last meeting held at Penrith was in 1942.

#16 Vitesse2

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Posted 23 October 2001 - 12:27

I've recently been perusing various wartime magazines and discovered the following events. Rather than post lots of detail, I'll just give the basics and references (I have copies of all the reports:) )

Belle Vue Speedway, Manchester, UK, September 23rd & 30th 1939. Two meetings: no results for the first, but Frank Varey won both the Mancunian Trophy and the Farewell Trophy at the second event - Motor October 11th 1939 p327.

"Au Revoir" Motorcycle Scramble, Bagshot Heath, Surrey UK , October 18th 1942 - Motor Sport December 1942 p259.

Are these the only motor sport events held in the UK during WW2??

Mahagastotte Hill Climb, Ceylon, March 1940. FTD: V.Cox (Riley) - Motor Sport June 1940 p96

Buenos Aires GP, January 1942. Winner Jose Canziano (3.8 Alfa Romeo V12) - Motor Sport April 1942 p67

Judgeford Hillclimb, Wellington, New Zealand, January 4th 1945. Only four entries, due to fuel shortages! There is also a reference to the previous running of the event in February 1943. Also on the 1945 event Motor Sport says: "A very comprehensive film of the event was taken by Government Film Studio representatives and has been shown at all the leading theatres in the Dominion" - Motor Sport May 1945 p102

It also appears that a number of events took place in Ireland in late 1939 - Phoenix Park races on September 9th were the most important, but I've seen references to other sprints and trials in Motor - a hillclimb at Ballinascorney on September 23rd and a trial (where not stated) on December 26th. Another mysterious trial was scheduled for January 27th 1940, run by Dublin University, and another on March 18th (Irish MRC) - Motor passim

I've also found a reference to a speed trial held at Phillip Island, Australia in November 1939, won by James Gullan in a Ballot fitted with a Ford V8. The same article gives details of the Lobethal races - Motor Sport May 1940, p91.

Marc: Motor says that the Liege race was was first cancelled on the orders of the local military governor, then reinstated, then cancelled again after first practice - Motor September 5th 1939 p212

#17 Don Capps

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Posted 23 October 2001 - 14:05

Auto racing was officially terminated in the United States on 31 July 1942. Apparently there wasn't much activity going on, some midget and a few roadster events in the West.

#18 Hans Etzrodt

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Posted 23 October 2001 - 20:33

Originally posted by Vitesse2
I've recently been perusing various wartime magazines and discovered the following events.....

Vitesse 2,
Thank you for providing all that information. I appreciate your research of the old British magazines (something looooong overdue) and acknowledging your sources. Very professional. :)

#19 leegle

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Posted 24 October 2001 - 06:02

The same James Gullan was the reporter for both those events I suspect Vitesse2 and his writing required some editing.;) I met a man last night that would bear some more talking to for Barry's pursuit of information. :) He told me he raced Midgets at the Brisbane Speedway in 1943 but gave it up because he heard an old lady say it wasn't much of a night because nobody got hurt. :rolleyes: I will see if I can get some more information from him.

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#20 Vitesse2

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Posted 24 October 2001 - 11:17

Originally posted by leegle
The same James Gullan was the reporter for both those events I suspect Vitesse2


Indeed he was...

Originally posted by leegle
and his writing required some editing.;)


Eh?:confused:

#21 Jim Thurman

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Posted 26 October 2001 - 00:16

Originally posted by Graham Clayton
Since I started this thread, I thought I might contribute some research.
For the purposes of the question, I think we are looking at all racing between 3 September 1939 and August 1945.
Here are some events that I have come across

UNITED STATES
I presume that there would have been
speedway racing in 1940 & 1941?


Yes, short track oval racing continued in the U.S. until July 31, 1942 when a cessation order brought racing to a halt for the duration as a non-essential activity.

In researching various short tracks, I ran across a great newspaper item on the July 31, 1942 Midget race at Sportland Park in Bakersfield, California which mentioned how the fans and drivers milled around for a "lengthier time than normal" and noted "no one seemed to want to go home. They didn't know when they would do this again." Interesting stuff.

There have been some confirmed races held during a brief repeal of the ban. One I'm aware of was a race at the Indianapolis Speedrome on November 18, 1944.

Additionally, there have been rumors of some "unscheduled" races taking place in the U.S. during the cessation.


Jim Thurman

#22 Graham Clayton

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Posted 26 October 2001 - 00:35

Originally posted by Jim Thurman

Yes, short track oval racing continued in the U.S. until July 31, 1942 when a cessation order brought racing to a halt for the duration as a non-essential activity. Jim Thurman


Jim,
Do you have any details of the cessation order?
Was it done purely by the governing bodies,
or did a US government department "persuade"
the governing bodies to make the order?

#23 Jim Thurman

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Posted 26 October 2001 - 03:50

Originally posted by Graham Clayton


Jim,
Do you have any details of the cessation order?
Was it done purely by the governing bodies,
or did a US government department "persuade"
the governing bodies to make the order?


Graham,

I don't have any details other than I know the cessation of motorsport activity was by U.S. government order.

Some tracks didn't re-open after the war (Sportland Park being one)...but with the post-WWII Midget boom, there were plenty of new tracks.

A side note here: Sportland Park is where Bill Vukovich began to make his name, winning something like 12 straight Midget races there in 1941.


Jim Thurman

#24 leegle

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Posted 28 October 2001 - 01:15

Vitesse2: Jim Gullan's book suggests that anything he ever wrote was extremely self-centred and difficult to read.;) Sorry I still haven't had a chance to see that man who said he raced speedway in 1943 in Brisbane. :(

#25 David McKinney

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Posted 28 October 2001 - 11:13

BREAT BRITAIN
1939

02/09 Tourist Trophy, Donington Park - CANCELLED
09/09 Shelsley Walsh hillclimb - CANCELLED
30/09 Donington Grand Prix - CANCELLED
07/10 Crystal Palace - CANCELLED
14/10 Brooklands - CANCELLED

REPUBLIC OF IRELAND
1939

09/09 Phoenix Park
1940
--/-- Kilternan hillclimb

FRANCE
1939

03/09 Dieppe Grand Prix - some reports that this race took place, though no record of it seems to exist
03/09 La Baule Grand Prix - CANCELLED
10/10 Paris 12hr sportscar race - CANCELLED

BELGIUM
1939

27/08 Liège sportscar race - CANCELLED after practice

SWITZERLAND
1939

08/10 Zurich Grand Prix - CANCELLED

ITALY
1939

10/10 Italian GP - CANCELLED (offically because Monza was not ready)
1940
28/04 Gran Premio di Brescia
12/05 Tripoli Grand Prix
12/05 Targa Florio, Palermo

YUGOSLAVIA
1939

03/09 Yugoslavian Grand Prix, Belgrade
1940
14/08 Avola race
08/10 Benjica race

ROUMANIA
1939

--/09 Brasov hillclimb

#26 David McKinney

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Posted 28 October 2001 - 11:14

CANADA
dirt-track racing for Model Ts

USA
1939

03/09 AAA Championship Syracuse
also remainder of races for AAA regional championships, IMCA, midgets, stock-cars
1940
30/05 Indianapolis 500
06/07 Montauk Grand Prix
10/08 Round the Houses race, Alexandria Bay
24/08 Mount Washington hillclimb
--/08 AAA Championship Springfield
--/09 AAA Championship Syracuse
06/10 World's Fair GP, Flushing Meadows, NY
also full AAA regional championships, IMCA, midgets, stock-cars
1941
30/05 Indianapolis 500
--/-- Land’s End hillclimb. Colorado
24/08 AAA Championship Milwaukee
31/08 AAA Championship Syracuse
Also full AAA regional championships, IMCA, sprint cars, midgets, stock-cars. Several attempts were made to stage road races, but none actually took place
1942
AAA championship abandoned but both CSRA and IMCA continued with their events and there was midget-car racing, at least in the Midwest

MEXICO
1939

racing on Ignacio Zaragoza dirt-track
1940
racing on Ignacio Zaragoza dirt-track

BRAZIL
1939

29/10 GP Sabbado d’Angelo, Gávea
1940
12/05 Interlagos race, São Paulo
10/11 Rio de Janeiro GP, Gavea
--/12 Gavea
1941
--/02 Circuito de Gavea
25/05 Tijuca hillclimb
22-29/6 Gran Premio Presidente Getulio Vargas
28/09 Rio de Janeiro GP, Gavea
a second Tijuca hillclimb?

URUGUAY
1940

--/-- 24hr race, Autodromo Nacional

ARGENTINA
1939

10/09 Rafaele 500
24/09 Premio Semana, Tucumán
15/10 Casilda
19-20/10 Gran Premio Nacional
--/11 Gran Premio Extraordinario
09-10/12 Mil Millas Argentinas
also Fomento Limitada series for Model T Fords on Palermo dirt-track
1940
10/03 La Plata
17/03 Mar del Plata
--/03 Mendoza
07/04 Concordia race, Rivadavia Park
16/05 Paraná race, Urquiza Park
14/08 San Justo race, Sante Fe
27/09-12/10 Gran Premio Internácional del Norte
12/10 Concordia
10/11 500 Millas Argentinas, Rafaele
06-12/12 Mil Millas Argentinas
also Fomento Limitada series for Model T Fords on Palermo dirt-track
1941
12/01 Rafaela 12hrs
06/04 El Plumerillo race, Mendoza
03/08 Concordia
24/08 Premio Ciudad de San Justo, Santa Fe
31/08 Gran Premio de Añatuya
01/11 Circuito de Santa Fe
22/11 Premio Ciudad de Buenos Aires
13/12 Mil Millas Argentinas
also Fomento Limitada series for Model T Fords on Palermo dirt-track
1941
--/01 Buenos Aires to Rio de Janeiro race - CANCELLED
21/01-03/02 Gran Premio del Sur
02/04 Circuito Mar y Sierras, Mar del Plata
05/04 Premio Vendimia at Mendoza
02-03/05 Premio Ciudad de Santa Fe

#27 David McKinney

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Posted 28 October 2001 - 11:15

NEW ZEALAND
1939

Speedway racing at Western Springs (and possibly elsewhere)
1940
Centennial Road Race, Glendowie - CANCELLED
Speedway racing at Western Springs (and possibly elsewhere)
1941
Speedway racing at Western Springs (and possibly elsewhere)

AUSTRALIA
1939

03/09 Dowerin, WA
--/10 Bathurst, NSW
plus speedway racing
1940
01/01 South Australia 100, Lobethal
--/-- Rob Roy hillclimb, Vic
--/-- Albury, NSW
Easter Bathurst, NSW
--/-- Philip Island, Vic
--/-- Tooronga speed trials, Vic
23/06 Rob Roy hillclimb, Vic
--/-- Pingelly speed trials, WA
--/-- Patriotic Grand Prix, Applecross, WA
plus speedway racing
1941
--?-- Pingelly speed trials, WA
plus speedway racing

STRAITS SETTLEMENTS
1940

04/08 Gap hillclimb

MALAY STATES
1940

-/11Johore GP

THAILAND
1939

10/12 Bangkok Grand Prix - CANCELLED

CEYLON
1940

--/03 Mahagastota hillclimb
24/11 Mahagastota hillclimb
possibly other hillclimbs

SOUTH AFRICA
1939

???
1940
12/12 Camp Bay
???

#28 ry6

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Posted 28 October 2001 - 16:27

Sud Afrique

The Camps Bay event was a hillclimb.

#29 Vitesse2

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Posted 29 October 2001 - 01:14

On November 8th 1939, The Motor published an Italian racing calendar for 1940. All races for 1500cc Voiturettes unless stated.

April 7th Targa Florio, Naples
April 28th Grand Prix of Brescia for the Mille Miglia cup (sports cars)
May 12th Tripoli GP
June 23rd Piedmont Cup, Naples (sports cars)
July 21st Stelvio Hillclimb
August 5th Coppa Ciano
August 15th Coppa Acerbo
August 18th Targa Abruzzo (sports cars)
September 8th Italian GP

I have also found a reference, again in The Motor, to speed trials at Gopend in the state of Perak in Malaya in early 1940. On Whit Sunday 1940 there was a speed trial at Seremban, Malaya.

An Irish racing calendar for 1940 was also published in Motor:
May 4th IMRC sprint
June 8th Munster Road Race (Cork?)
June 15th Speed event
July 13th (or 27th) Leinster Trophy
August 10th Kilternan Hillclimb
September 14th Phoenix Park
September 28th IMRC Hill climb
October 5th Leinster Sporting Trial

The Balkan rally was scheduled for June 2nd 1940, but was cancelled in March ...

#30 quintin cloud

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Posted 08 April 2002 - 10:48

Originally posted by Vitesse2
I've recently been perusing various wartime magazines and discovered the following events. Rather than post lots of detail, I'll just give the basics and references (I have copies of all the reports:) )

Belle Vue Speedway, Manchester, UK, September 23rd & 30th 1939. Two meetings: no results for the first, but Frank Varey won both the Mancunian Trophy and the Farewell Trophy at the second event - Motor October 11th 1939 p327.

"Au Revoir" Motorcycle Scramble, Bagshot Heath, Surrey UK , October 18th 1942 - Motor Sport December 1942 p259.

Are these the only motor sport events held in the UK during WW2??

Mahagastotte Hill Climb, Ceylon, March 1940. FTD: V.Cox (Riley) - Motor Sport June 1940 p96

Buenos Aires GP, January 1942. Winner Jose Canziano (3.8 Alfa Romeo V12) - Motor Sport April 1942 p67


Richard Can you give me info on the Buenos Aires GP of '42. Is there a race result for the event other than the winner and if there was a entry list :confused:

#31 Vitesse2

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Posted 08 April 2002 - 12:09

I emailed this to Quintin, but I'll repeat it here for anyone else interested :)

This has been reconstructed from the published result and race report - not much detail on the heats I'm afraid, but the final is pretty complete. Names and initials are as complete as I can make them without delving into Tony's Temporada results but as I'm sure you're all aware it's easy to make a wrong assumption - IIRC there are at least two Pians for example!

Circuit: Argentine (length 1.5miles)

Presumably held over a weekend, as the meeting was 2 days.

Day 1: Heat 1 - up to 3500cc 15 laps
1 Barbalarga (Ford Model T Spl) 21 min 50.9 sec
etc

Ret:
Garat (???) Flywheel
Pian (Ford Special) Gear lever

Grid:
Barbalarga 1min 24.2sec
Ramonda (Ford Special)
Pian
etc

Heat 2 - up to 3700cc 15 laps
1 Martini (Mercury Spl) 21min 50.9sec
2 Puopolo (Graham)
3 Moyano (???)
etc

Grid
Martini 1min 25sec
Puopolo
Rossi (Ford V8)
etc

Heat 3 - over 3700cc 15 laps
1 Mario Chiozza (Mercury) 21min 31.8sec
2 Blanco (???)
3 Donzino (???)
etc

Ret
Nanni (Hudson) Lost tyre
etc?

Grid
Chiozza 1min 22sec 66mph
Pessanti (Chrysler) 1min 24.6sec
Meneghetti (Hudson) 1min 25sec
etc

Heat 4 - repechage 10 laps
1 Pian
? Nanni
etc?

Heat 5 - racing cars 15 laps

1 Canziani (3.8 Alfa Romeo V12)
etc

Grid:
Ramos 1min16.7sec
Canziani 1min 16.7sec
Landi 1min19.5sec
Malusardi (Alfa Romeo)
Green
Avelar
Ochatecho (Alfa Romeo)
Raul Riganti (2.9 Maserati 8CL)
etc?




Day 2

Specials Final: 25 laps

1 Chiozza
2 Pian
etc (at least 9 other finishers)

Ret
Donzino (???) Clutch 24 laps
Blanco Connecting rod

Final: 40 laps (60 miles) Handicap

1 Jose Canziani (3.8 Alfa Romeo V12) 53mins 49.5secs 67 mph
2 Oldemar Ramos (Alfa Romeo) 54mins 3.5secs
3 Mario Chiozza (Mercury)
4 Chico Landi (Alfa Romeo) (BR)
5 Avelar (Alfa Romeo) (BR)
6 Forrest Green (1.5 Maserati)
7 Martini (Mercury)
8 Brisco (??)
etc?

Ret
Raul Riganti
Malusardi (accident damage)

Grid:
19 starters. At the front were the top (? only) 11 finishers from the Specials final, which were given 1 minute start over the 8 racing cars and presumably lined up in finishing order.

#32 Vitesse2

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Posted 08 April 2002 - 14:34

Oh dear - we appear to have a confusion here!!! :blush: Alarm bells began ringing when I discovered Motor Sport calling the 1950 Buenos Aires race the second BA GP as well. I checked Hans' list and immediately spotted that he'd put Canziani in with a query as the winner - then hopped to Quintin's site and discovered that the result tallied with what he has for the race on 23/11/41! I suppose the date confusion can be put down to "the fog of war", but I wonder why Motor Sport specifically called it the second race - and not once, but twice!

So, just to clarify - there was no Buenos Aires GP in 1942!! Sorry guys ....

But, by way of compensation, here's a really obscure Formula 1 GP for you! Source "Motor Sport" Nov 1949, p452. Not wartime though ...

Johore Formula 1 Grand Prix, organized by Singapore MC, October 2nd 1949

1 CO Jennings (MG TC)
2 JA Milne (3750cc Milne Special)
3 S Theraviara (MG TC)

And from the same meeting:

Johore 1500cc race

1 CO Jennings (MG TC)
2 Chia Eng Quee (1098cc Wong Silver Arrow)
3 S Theraviara (MG TC)

Anyone know what the Wong Silver Arrow was?

#33 David McKinney

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Posted 08 April 2002 - 18:27

No, but I can boast to having seen Capt 'Mick' Jennings in action - a claim I'm sure denied to most TNFers! He brought a black (IIRC) MGA to NZ for 1959 sportscar races, with predictably negligible results. The 1949 Johore Grand Prix was not his first win in that event: he had won the 1940 race (which was in wartime, and therefore qualifies for inclusion in this thread :) )

#34 Ray Bell

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Posted 10 April 2002 - 06:46

Originally posted by Darren Galpin
In "Fast Tracks" by Terry Walker, it suggests that the last meeting held at Penrith was in 1942.


Barry has detailed the facts... Terry is quite happy to bow to the combined research of myself, Barry and others on the subject. His main object was the circuit details.

Graham, Lobethal was only run in 1938, 1939, 1940 and 1948.

Western Australian Jack Nelson once sent me the Motor Sport report on the 1940 event, this taking the form of a letter from (and photograph of...) Jim Gullan, who ran the 1919 Indy Ballot-Ford V8 there in rebodied form. The editor's note was full of enthusiasm for the fact that racing was indeed happening somewhere.

There was a couple of WA meetings, I'm away at the moment and can't get the dates, but Terry Walker's Around The Houses authenticates them... from memory Applecross in early 1941 followed by Pingelly around May or so. There may have been other WA meetings in 1940, in fact I'm fairly sure there were.

Barry?

I would have to consult notes, too, to see if I have dates for the illegal Mitcham Hillclimb in Melbourne, and the Tooronga Sprints. I do have photographs.

#35 ry6

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Posted 11 April 2002 - 10:50

Does anybody know anything about the Maserati with which Steve Chiappini won the 1940 Camps Bay Hillclimb, in Cape Town, South Africa?

It is always described locally as the ex-Oates Maserati. (I think Oates, a major, was a Brooklands driver.)

What model type and year? The photos I have seen indicate that even in the mid-30's it was an "old" car!

#36 David McKinney

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Posted 11 April 2002 - 16:07

I've got all this at home, Rob - will have a look later
Oates was the UK agent for OM cars in the 1920s and 1930s, IIRC, and a lot of Maseratis passed through his hands later. So be careful with any reference to "the ex-Oates" Maserati :)

#37 Don Capps

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Posted 11 April 2002 - 16:56

Nosing around for some information on Ted Horn, apparently there were Big Car races in the waning months of 1945 in the East. Not much detail, but Horn and a number of others who competed during 1946 did take part in several races during this time. I think the Russ Catlin book mentions these, but not sure as to whether there is much said about them. Just from what little I have seen, the races were in the VJ-Day period, later Summer and the Fall.

#38 David McKinney

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Posted 11 April 2002 - 18:31

Originally posted by ry6
Does anybody know anything about the Maserati with which Steve Chiappini won the 1940 Camps Bay Hillclimb, in Cape Town, South Africa?

It is always described locally as the ex-Oates Maserati. (I think Oates, a major, was a Brooklands driver.)

What model type and year? The photos I have seen indicate that even in the mid-30's it was an "old" car!

He drove a Scuderia Ambrosiana 4C-1100 Maserati in the 1939 South African GP, but that car presumably went back to Europe.
The Camps Bay car is more likely to be the 2.8-litre car Chiappini had raced in 1937, and which he did buy from Dickie Oats. It had started life in 1931 as a 4-seater 8C-2500, but I think Oats, who raced it at Brooklands 1934-36, converted it to a 2-seater - or even a single-seater. This was the car that Ian Fraser-Jones would race a few times in 1948, and I believe a later owner bolted a Chevy Six into it.

#39 TonyKaye

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Posted 14 June 2002 - 16:03

Courtesy of Hans Etzrodt and Motor und Sport (Feb 18 1940), here's the European Competition Calendar for 1940:

April 7 Targa Florio (1500 cc racing)
April 28 Brescia GP (i.e Mille Miglia) (sports cars)
May 12 Tripoli GP (1500 cc racing)
June 2 Balkan Rally (Greece?)
June 9 Parma-Poggio di Barceto hill climb (sports cars)
June 23 Coppa Piemonte (Naples) (sports cars)
July 21 Stilfser-Joch hill climb (sports cars)
August 8 Coppa Ciano (1500 cc racing)August 15 Targa Abruzzo (sports cars)
August 18 Coppa Acerbo (1500 cc racing)
August 25 Circuito del Carnaro (sports cars)
September 8 Italian GP and Milan GP (1500 cc racing)
September 29 Spanish GP
October 6 Feleac hillclimb (Romania)

Not surprisingly the bulk of these events were to be held in Italy. Although other events intervened, there seems to have been every intention to hold an Italian Grand Prix in 1940. That is completely new to me as I have never seen any references to it in books or articles devoted to the race.

Intriguingly, the planned Spanish Grand Prix was not specified for 1500 cc racing cars. Could it be that the organizers were still hoping to run their race according to the International formula with 3-liter Mercedes and Auto Unions?

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#40 Doug Nye

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Posted 14 June 2002 - 18:03

Fraternal solidarity??? The conviction that the little local difficulty would all be over within a few months...

DCN

#41 bpratt

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Posted 14 June 2002 - 18:26

On the west coast of Canada big cars ran at Langford Speedway (north of Victoria, BC) during the 1940 and 1941 seasons. And midgets ran at Con Jones Park in east Vancouver, BC during those same seasons. Both tracks relying on U.S. cars to make the bulk of the field.

A person keeps telling me that he went to an indoor race in Vancouver "during the war" but I haven't confirmed that yet. Midgets.

As well as running in Alberta the Model T's ran in Saskatchewan during the Second World War.
Brian Pratt
Burnaby, BC, Canada

#42 Felix Muelas

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Posted 14 June 2002 - 19:35

Originally posted by Doug Nye
Fraternal solidarity??? The conviction that the little local difficulty would all be over within a few months...


To the first sentence, I am tempted to answer yes, probably. Italian races AND that Spanish reference (albeit without any mention of track) in the context might have something to do with it. Who released that calendar? The AIACR?

On the second let me remind the readers that do not know or can´t place the subject on its right timing, that Spain had been at war from July 1936 to April 1939. A horrible war where, between other considerations, some of the "contenders" of the II WW had been "practising" so to speak. On both sides, don´t get me wrong...

So, under no circumstances would the Spanish point of view on the recently-started war be described or thought of as "little local difficulty"... actually maybe the (surviving) Spaniards might have been the only ones that might have gathered how long a war can be...

Anyway, I do not think that Spain, after three years of war, was in any way in a situation where organizing a motor race would have been a feasible proposition. The fact that a Spanish GP was included in that list has always puzzled me.

fm

#43 Vitesse2

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Posted 14 June 2002 - 20:41

Originally posted by Tony Kaye
Although other events intervened, there seems to have been every intention to hold an Italian Grand Prix in 1940. That is completely new to me as I have never seen any references to it in books or articles devoted to the race.



Originally posted by Vitesse2
On November 8th 1939, The Motor published an Italian racing calendar for 1940. All races for 1500cc Voiturettes unless stated.

April 7th Targa Florio, Naples
April 28th Grand Prix of Brescia for the Mille Miglia cup (sports cars)
May 12th Tripoli GP
June 23rd Piedmont Cup, Naples (sports cars)
July 21st Stelvio Hillclimb
August 5th Coppa Ciano
August 15th Coppa Acerbo
August 18th Targa Abruzzo (sports cars)
September 8th Italian GP

I have also found a reference, again in The Motor, to speed trials at Gopend in the state of Perak in Malaya in early 1940. On Whit Sunday 1940 there was a speed trial at Seremban, Malaya.

An Irish racing calendar for 1940 was also published in Motor:
May 4th IMRC sprint
June 8th Munster Road Race (Cork?)
June 15th Speed event
July 13th (or 27th) Leinster Trophy
August 10th Kilternan Hillclimb
September 14th Phoenix Park
September 28th IMRC Hill climb
October 5th Leinster Sporting Trial

The Balkan rally was scheduled for June 2nd 1940, but was cancelled in March ...


:)

#44 Vitesse2

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Posted 14 June 2002 - 20:54

Originally posted by Felix Muelas


To the first sentence, I am tempted to answer yes, probably. Italian races AND that Spanish reference (albeit without any mention of track) in the context might have something to do with it. Who released that calendar? The AIACR?


It seems to be essentially the same list as I found in the Motor, published a couple of months before, with just a couple of additions. This was presumably originally released by the RACI?

As to the Spanish reference, didn't Franco visit Germany round about January/February 1940? Perhaps there were hopes of some German/Spanish/Italian solidarity and this was just a way of cementing it?

#45 lynmeredith

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Posted 15 June 2002 - 01:52

Italy did not declare war (in Europe) until 10 June 1940. (Chronical of the Second World War, Chronical Communications, 1990). So Italy was neutral until then and to some extent life would be 'normal'.

LDM

#46 Hans Etzrodt

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Posted 15 June 2002 - 04:35

The A.I.A.C.R. had ceased to function soon after the Germans started expanding on all fronts. The A.I.A.C.R. in conjunction with the ACS had then planned a meeting in neutral Bern for Whit Monday, May 13, 1940 after the planned October meeting of the A.I.A.C.R. in Paris was not feasible.

AUTOMOBIL-REVUE, May 14, 1940, No. 20, pg. 1-2:
With the development of the world political events, numerous delegates saw themselves not in a position to follow the invitation to the Swiss Capital, as was not expected differently. Apart from Germany whose delegation was not announced up to the last hour, non-present at the convention had to be of course the Dutch, the Belgians, the United States, Monaco, England and Romania. It is true that the French and Hungarian delegation arrived, however considerably reduced. And also the five delegates of Switzerland did not arrive in full number. So the ACS, in whose hands rested the organization of the meeting, could only receive 18 delegates:

SPAIN: Gil de Reboleno, F. Manzanares; FRANCE (and A.I.A.C.R.) Vicomte de Rohan; HUNGARY: Dr. E. Landauer; ITALY: Count Albert Bonacossa, Senator Attilio Pozzo, Gr. Uff. Ing. A. Magnani;, Comm. G. Furmanik; PORTUGAL: Dr. de Gusmao Madeira; SWITZERLAND: Dr. E. Mende, L. Devaud, Prof. Steinmann, Dir. Primault; Turkey: Rechid Saffet Atabinen, Mecdet Alkin; Yugoslavia: Dr. Yankovitch, Baron de Born; AIACR: Vicomte de Rohan, Colonel Péron.

By the way, a fatal coincidence had it that just the presidents of the three commissions were absent.....

.....Regarding the Sporting Commission [CSI], only the Italian engineer Furmanik was present; under these circumstances a meeting was out of the question.

.....Regarding the International Sporting Commission [CSI], it was decided to deal with the business as explained in the treatise list on the circular manner. [poor translation - I admit]


MOTOR und SPORT 1940, Nr. 4, p. 3:
German Racing Cars in Italy
As we could already report in the last issue, Korpsführer Hühnlein had an extensive meeting with leading Italian motor sport personalities. It was also debated about the participation of our German racing cars in Italian races. The participation in the following races is considered:

14. April: 1000-Meilen-Rennen von Brescia für Sportwagen;
5. Mai: Großer Preis von Tripolis für 1,5-Liter-Rennwagen;
4. August: Coppa Ciano in Livorno;
18. August: Coppa Acerbo in Pescara, und
8. September: Großer Preis von Italien on the new track of the Monza Circuit, all three races for Formelwagen. [Formula cars]

#47 dmj

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Posted 15 June 2002 - 08:34

Originally posted by TonyKaye
June 2 Balkan Rally (Greece?)

Don't have anything to support it but I believe it should be either in Yugoslavia or Bulgaria, like later Balkan rallies...

#48 jarama

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Posted 15 June 2002 - 08:47

Originally posted by Felix Muelas


To the first sentence, I am tempted to answer yes, probably. Italian races AND that Spanish reference (albeit without any mention of track) in the context might have something to do with it. Who released that calendar? The AIACR?

On the second let me remind the readers that do not know or can´t place the subject on its right timing, that Spain had been at war from July 1936 to April 1939. A horrible war where, between other considerations, some of the "contenders" of the II WW had been "practising" so to speak. On both sides, don´t get me wrong...

So, under no circumstances would the Spanish point of view on the recently-started war be described or thought of as "little local difficulty"... actually maybe the (surviving) Spaniards might have been the only ones that might have gathered how long a war can be...

Anyway, I do not think that Spain, after three years of war, was in any way in a situation where organizing a motor race would have been a feasible proposition. The fact that a Spanish GP was included in that list has always puzzled me.

fm


Despite these circumstances, the first race meeting held in Spain after the cruel civil war was as early as in the 28th of April 1940, a mere one year after the finish of the war. It was, for sure, a national event, the Vallvidrera Hillclimb, just in the outskirts of Barcelona. The overall winner was José María Cucurella, Ford, 2'35"6.

#49 Felix Muelas

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Posted 15 June 2002 - 08:59

Originally posted by Vitesse2
...didn't Franco visit Germany round about January/February 1940? Perhaps there were hopes of some German/Spanish/Italian solidarity and this was just a way of cementing it?


No. One of the "characteristics" of Franco is that he would never -with just one exception, and the destiny was Portugal- travel outside Spain during his "reign".

But of course he met Hitler once. It was on October 23rd, 1940. The place was a train in the Franco-Spanish border (Hendaye). To simplify matters, Hitler told Franco that he needed to cross Spain with troops in order to reach North Africa. Should that "favour" be granted, Spain will recover "Gibraltar", amongst other things.
Franco said "I´ll think about it", turned round and went back home.

The next morning he gave instructions for the width of the train lines to be changed, making it impossible for trains coming from France to "force" their way into Spain...he never met Hitler again.

#50 dmj

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Posted 15 June 2002 - 09:14

Nice story, Felix. Didn't know that...