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#1 twymanj

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Posted 19 March 2002 - 19:36

Hello, Im looking for any information and pictures of the Gilby car campaigned in around 1963. Does anyone know the full history of the car? Many thanks in advance!

Joe :)

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#2 David McKinney

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Posted 19 March 2002 - 22:03

1) Gilby-Climax sportscar
2) Gilby-Climax F1
3) Gilby-BRM F1
Which?

#3 scheivlak

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Posted 19 March 2002 - 23:42

Some info on 8W (of course...) : http://8w.forix.com/gilby.html
Well well, a Len Terry design!
Intriguing sentence: "It is said to be undergoing a restoration right now." - october 2000.

#4 Marcor

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Posted 20 March 2002 - 00:03

GILBY story (my answer in 8W, a compilation of all my knowledge about the driver Sid Greene and the Gilby cars, numerous sources)


Who? Keith Greene
What? Gilby Engineering Co Ltd Gilby Special
Where? Nurburgring (Karussel)
When? 1962 German GP

Why?
A father, a team and a son
Sid (Sidney or Syd) Greene was 16 years old and an engineering apprentice when he lost his left arm in a bike accident. Pre-war he raced cars in England then he became a WW2 RAF fighter pilot, nicknamed the " Wingless Wonder ". After the war he continued to race and also built up his Company, Gilby Engineering. He became a notable entrant in British racing even after retiring from active racing in 1953 when he was 47. The young Stirling Moss driving Sid Greene’s Le Mans Replica Frazer Nash won the 1951 British Empire Trophy at Douglas. In 1953 Greene entered a 2-litre Maserati sports cars in British races.

In the Autumn 1953, Sid Greene proposed buying a new Maserati GP car for Roy Salvadori. They both travelled together to Modena to discuss the purchase with the Orsi brothers and Salvadori had the opportunity of driving the 250F 2505 with which Juan Manuel Fangio had just won the Argentine GP in January 1954.

They took delivery of their car - 2507 - in March 1954. It was the first production Maserati 250F sold to a private customer. Harry Schell, Prince Bira and Roberto Mieres had ordered cars earlier but had to make do with 250F engines fitted to A6GCM frames. The car was painted in British Racing Green with a large BRDC badge on the nose and raced extensively in UK Formule Libre and F1 races. Although they suffered problems with the car in its early days, including rather alarming clutch weakness and a very high non-standard first gear, it was the one truly competitive F1 car available to private entrants. Salvadori raced the car weekend after weekend for three successive seasons and enjoyed considerable success in most British races. The team raced on a very limited budget, which meant that he always had to drive with great self discipline to restrict the engine revs, but the car and the driver were probably one of the most successful F1 combination in British events during the year 1954 to 1956.

In 1954 Salvadori won two short races and the Curtis Trophy at Snetterton on June 5 and was second at Goodwood on Easter event (Lavant Cup and Chichester Cup) and on July (BARC F1 race). Because of the limited budget, the team was rarely able to race abroad, but Salvadori managed to take in the ACF GP at Rheims in which he retired and finished third at Rouen behind Trintignant’s Ferrari 625 and Bira’s Maserati 250F 2504.

Salvadori had a crash at Oulton Park in August 1954 when the throttles jammed open. The car went off the road and hit a tree. Salvadori escaped with bruising but the chassis 2507 was heavily damaged and was returned to the factory. In Modena, a new chassis was built retaining the number '2507.' The new chassis was then returned to the team and Salvadori finished third in the Goodwood Trophy and seventh in the Daily Telegraph Trophy at Aintree.

In 1954 a Gilby Engineering Maserati A6GCS sports car was also usually driven by Roy Salvadori, except when he was at the wheel of a works Aston Martin as in the sports car race at the British Grand Prix meeting in July 1954 or in the Dundrod TT where Colin Davis and Horace Gould drove the car but were not classified.

In 1955 Roy Salvadori purchased an Aston Martin DB3 which was entered by Gilby Engineering. The car won at Goodwood on Stirling Moss’s hands and twice at Aintree with Salvadori himself. The 1954 2-litre A6G sports car had been very successful the previous year but the engine impressed more than the hefty chassis. Greene asked then to Cooper to built a front-engined Cooper Maserati that was certainly lighter than the A6G but it proved dreadfully unreliable that season and Roy scored only one fairly lucky win with this Special, at the Snetterton meeting.

With the Maserati 250F It was much the same story in 1955 when Salvadori won six races, including the Richmond Trophy, the Glover Trophy, a Formule Libre race at Snetterton and the Daily Telegraph Trophy at Aintree. He also finished second to his friend Peter Collins with the Owen Organisation 250F 2509 in the Daily Express International Trophy at Silverstone. In the British GP, though, Salvadori retired with gearbox problems. The team made the long trip to Syracuse maybe lured by the promise of vastly generous starting money but the car had problem with the fuel tank and had to be retired.

Syd Greene’s son Keith, born on January 5, 1938 in Leytonstone, was now 17 years old and Sid ordered a Bob-tail for him. The car was late completing so for Keith’s competition debut at Stapleford hillclimb in Essex they borrowed Ivor Bueb’s works car. Keith beat Alan Stacey which had a very quick Lotus and the two young drivers became the best friends after that.

By 1956 the Maserati 250F 2507 was outdated compared with the Works car, but as well as continuing to enjoy considerable success in British races of a less important nature, Salvadori had the satisfaction of leading all the works cars from every team in the British GP at Silverstone before he was forced to stop at the pits to have a trailing tank-retaining strap fixed, he rejoined the race and retired soon afterwards with a misfiring engine. He managed to finish third in the Caen GP and set a lap record. Salvadori had a nasty experience in the Daily Express Trophy at Silverstone when the rear end locked up and the car rolled at Stowe. Despite those accidents the three seasons with the 250F and the Gilby Team were amongst the happiest in the Salvadori’s racing career, working with a good team, supported by superb mechanics and driving for an entrant, Sid Greene, who put immense zest and enthusiasm into his racing.

The car was driven for Gilby by Jim Russell and Ivor Bueb in 1957 and then retired to a museum. Gilby later ran Coopers of various types for Keith Greene including a Maserati engined F2 car. In 1957 Keith finished second sandwiched by Innes Ireland and Chris Bristow in the Brooklands Memorial Trophy at Goodwood. (a minor F2 or sports car race).

Keith Greene with Mike Taylor as co-driver, took part in the Tourist Trophy at Goodwood on September 13, 1958 and they came home the Lotus 11 Climax in tenth position.
In 1959 Keith drove a Cooper T43 Maserati in several races including events abroad. He was eight at Pau. In a race mixing F1 and F2 at Aintree Mike Taylor won the F2 division from Keith who was sixth overall. He failed to qualify at Aintree in the British GP and in August Keith won a minor F2 race in Snetterton.

Keith drove for Lotus in sports car big races including the 1000 km of Nurburgring, the 24-Hours of Le Mans and the RAC Tourist Trophy at Goodwood. The result was not fantastic as he only finished 11th - with Tony Marsh - at Goodwood and retired at Le Mans, partnered with his friend Alan Stacey. Gilby had purchased a Lotus 19 which proved to have a severe handling problem and when Lotus sacked its first assistant designer, Len Terry, Sid employed Terry to sort out the problem. From then it was a short step to a Terry-designed Gilby-Climax sports car, which raced with some success in 1960. It was again a short step to making a F1 car.

In the 1960 Easter Goodwood’s Glover Trophy F1 race Sid Greene’s Gilby Engineering concern entered the proprietor’s son Keith in the ex-Atkins 59 Cooper T45 F2-1-58 Maserati which they had just bought. Keith retired and finished 11th four weeks later in the International Trophy at Silverstone. He started from the last grid and was the first to retire when his engine overheated. On August 1, he finished 12th in the Silver City Trophy at Brands Hatch ahead of Munaron’s Ferrari-engined Cooper and Richardson’s Connaught RRA-engined Cooper.

AND NOW THE GILBY CAR !!!
For the introduction of the 1.5-litre F1 formula in 1961, Gilby built their own car for Keith to drive, regarded (rightly or wrongly) as a Cooper copy, originally powered by a 4-cylinder Climax motor. The car was designed by Len Terry and was conventional, since it was to be run by a small team from a little workshop. As with most Terry designs it was a striking machine to look at, especially low since the engine was canted to lower the cars profile.

The car appeared first at Goodwood on the Easter meeting. In testing Keith Greene showed his inexperience by lapping at about 1m 35 sec so he started from the last grid. Bruce McLaren was invited to drive it and he returned a time of 1m 29.8 sec, 1/10 second of the lap record at Goodwood. That bucked everyone up and motivated the driver. Needless to say, that caught the attention of many in the trade and much was expected. The constraints of a tight budget were to prove too much, alas, and for many and sundry reasons the Gilby never lived up to its initial promise, although the potential was clearly there. In the Naples GP Keith retired and the Gilby was making one of its rare appearances in Championship race in the XVI RAC British GP at Aintree, with number 54. There Keith qualified 23rd of 30 and finished 15th, six laps down of the winner Wolfgang von Trips. Keith Greene was then sixth in the non-championship Danish GP and the car’s best result was fourth in the late season Lewis-Evans Trophy sprint race at Brands Hatch. The meeting was an opportunity for the privateers to shine since the teams were off in America. It was run as a national event. Tony Marsh’s BRM P48 484 Climax sat on the pole with Mike Spence in an Emeryson along side, along with Keith Green in the Gilby and Tim Parnell in his Lotus 18 filling up the front row. When the flag fell, Marsh motored off and won by a minute. Spence was second followed by Parnell and Greene.

1962 started on a better note, as the driver had more experience and a 6-speed Colotti gearbox was fitted. Fourth places were taken at three non-championship races in April : the Brussels GP, the Lombank Trophy at Snetterton and the Lavant Cup at Goodwood. In May, Keith Greene took his best result with the car, third in the Naples GP behind the two Ferrari 156 of Willy Mairesse and Lorenzo Bandini.

Meanwhile the team took delivery on its long awaited BRM V8-engine. Len Terry had designed a new frame to accommodate it. Unluckily the BRM’s customer version was much less powerful than the works engines and the Gilby was the worst of a poor bunch, and it gave hardly more power than the Climax it replaced.

The second F1 Gilby, powered by the V8-BRM, qualified a whole minute off the pace from the German GP and was 19th on the grid (sixth row). Keith retired with suspension failure, finished then seventh in the Mediterranean GP at Enna Pergusa and failed to make the grid for the Italian GP.

The team had been in financial difficulties and had been taken over by another company which had agreed to continue the racing team if it could prove itself financially viable. Of course it could not and the team was wound up at the end of 1962.

The Coventry Climax frame was sold to a special builder while the second car was sold to Ian Raby who raced it in a number of minor events during 1963. Raby had a typical privateer’s season with it, the highlight of which was third in the Rome GP at Vallelunga behind Bob Anderson’s Lola T4 BRGP43 Climax and Carel Godin de Beaufort’s old fatty Porsche 718-201. He failed to qualify for either the German and Italian races.

Len Terry later went back to Lotus where he designed the Indy winning 38, to All-American Racers (the first F1 Eagle) and to BRM (the P126/133).

Keith Greene still competed some seasons on sports cars races, especially at Nurburgring where he drove for MG in 1963, 1964 and 1965. He seemed to like the circuit as he was driving there in 1966 a Porsche with Perrier. In 1967 Chris Barber entered a Lotus 47 for him and John Hine in two World Sports cars round, at Nurburgring (of course) and in the BOAC 500 Brands Hatch.

Keith Greene subsequently became heavily involved in management duties for a wide variety of teams. In the 70’s he was the manager of the "Ecurie Evergreen" which boss was Alain de Cadenet. As a manager Keith Greene came back in Formula 1 when this team entered a 1970 Brabham BT33 for Chris Craft in the end of the 1971 season. The car would be used to design and build the Duckhams sports car which was seen at Le Mans, where Alain de Cadenet and Chris Craft finished 12th. Keith later was running among other things the Ford C100 endurance project into 1983.

#5 twymanj

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Posted 20 March 2002 - 15:58

Thank you very much I think that I have enough info now! But if there is any other interesting material regarding the Gilby Climax F1 car it would be much apreciated! :up:

#6 ry6

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Posted 20 March 2002 - 17:45

I have a nice picture (signed by) Ian Raby of him racing this car.
I will endeavour to have it scanned and then "post" it.

#7 Barry Boor

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Posted 13 January 2006 - 09:11

Up comes another old thread.... :)

At the 2004 Aintree 'Festival', a Gilby Climax was shown in all its glory. T'was the first time I had seen one for 40 years! (Apart from slot-racers, of course.... ;) ) I have not seen or heard of the car running in any historic meetings yet. Does anyone know what is happening with it? And are we likely to see it soon?

On another Gilby-based matter, I am intrigued by the exhaust system used by Ian Raby in 1963 when he bought the car from Gilby. I have a picture of him at the German Grand Prix with the usual upswept BRM stack-pipe system. But another photo from the British Grand Prix just 2 weeks earlier shows a 4 into 1 megaphone on the right hand side of the car - yet the records I have access to indicate that this was also a BRM V.8.

Sheldon, anyone?

Incidentist, I now have 2 B.R.M engined Gilbys. Is this a record?

#8 Barry Boor

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Posted 13 January 2006 - 09:17

Here is the Aintree car.

Posted Image

Posted Image

#9 petefenelon

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Posted 13 January 2006 - 11:43

Another Gilby-Climax shot from Aintree (click the small one for a fullsize one).

http://irkthepurists...20726154-S.jpg

#10 gilby

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Posted 13 January 2006 - 12:20

[IMG]http://img207.images...gilby7oi.th.jpg[/IMG]

the missing badge on the front (forget the "cosworth!)

#11 werks prototype

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Posted 03 November 2010 - 18:21

I like the idea of Gilby Engineering. And with this in mind, I thought I would share a potential reference, I recently came across. There is a very nice, detailed painting by Richard Wheatland (painted in 1996) of Roy Salvadori driving the Gilby Engineering Maserati 250F, winning the Daily Telegraph Formula 1 Race at Aintree. It is quite a stunner. After doing a little searching around TNF, this seems to be perhaps the best spot to make note of such a thing. A four year 'Bump!'.

#12 RWB

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Posted 03 November 2010 - 23:14

Hello, Im looking for any information and pictures of the Gilby car campaigned in around 1963. Does anyone know the full history of the car? Many thanks in advance!

Joe :)

Joe - could it be that you are going to race the car?

#13 Barry Boor

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Posted 28 February 2011 - 17:29

Is the Gilby likely to be seen this year, please?

#14 molestrangler

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Posted 28 February 2011 - 19:07

On the Aintree shots of the Gilby Climax the carburettors are on the wrong side.

#15 Barry Boor

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Posted 05 September 2014 - 09:07

Trying once again to get some info on the Gilby cars.

It's now ten years since we saw a car at Aintree and as far as I know no Gilby has yet made it to a circuit.

Does anyone know if this is ever likely to happen?