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'Almost-moves'


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#1 Nilz295

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Posted 14 July 2002 - 13:48

Hi!!

Can you tell me more information about drivers, who should move to one team, but then decided to go to another team (or to retire) because of different reasons?

Like:
Alesi 1991 Williams, but then Ferrari
Beltoise 1976 Ligier
Alboreto 1989 Williams, but moved to Tyrrell
Bellof 1986 Ferrari
....


Thank you for any reply!!

Nilz295

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#2 Richard Jenkins

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Posted 14 July 2002 - 16:07

Well, I think the most famous one was Derek Warwick who should've raced with Lotus in 1986 but for the behest of Senna.

Having a look back recently over my research, I was interested to see Paul Stewart strongly linked with Minardi for 1994. That might've been quite interesting in the end.
There's also a vague recollection (could be wrong) that March wanted Michael Schumacher & not Karl Wendlinger back in 1991 & Wendy got the job at the 11th hour after something stopped Schumi racing.
I know there's more but my mind isn't working correctly right now, if you know what I mean. :)

#3 ensign14

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Posted 14 July 2002 - 16:56

There are posts elsewhere which deal with Watson replacing Mansell at Lotus in 1984; I'm sure Wattie was to drive the second Toleman in 1985, but that never got off the ground (as team-mate to Stefan Johansson, who had a lucky break with Arnoux leaving).

Gunnar Nilsson had signed for Arrows and Ronnie Peterson with McLaren, both for 1979...

Fulvio Ballabio was a choice for Spirit for 1984. Again there is a thread here about it.

Gabriele Tarquini appeared on entry lists for c. 1989 in the FIRST, but ended up replacing Philippe Streiff for AGS.

Oliver Gavin was due to drive a Pacific in late 1993 or 1994 but his superlicence did not come through in time.

I also believe Christophe Bouchut was tagged to drive a Larrousse, just as Gerard pulled out of F1 (I think he was in the Autosport season preview, with Erik Comas).

Patrick Tambay was due to replace the injured Marc Surer at Arrows in the first few races in 1982, but was fed up with the politicking and went to America. Just think, he could have ended up in the Tyrrell and Brian Henton in the Ferrari...hands up those who think Superhen would have done better? :p

And talking of Minardi I believe Alessandro Nannini was the original choice to drive in 1985.

#4 Nilz295

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Posted 14 July 2002 - 21:33

Hey, thank you for the replies!! :up: I would like to hear MORE!!!!!!!!!


I recently read on this forum, that JJ Lehto almost became a 1991 Jordan driver. Why not??

Paul Stewart in the Minardi in 1994 :eek: , wow, that would have been interesting, indeed!! Why didn't he get a chance??

Now I have a question! When Gunnar Nilsson should have driven an Arrows in 1979, for which team Gunnar would have driven in 1978? Lotus? :confused:


Please don't stop posting!! :wave:

#5 AlesiUK

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Posted 14 July 2002 - 23:09

It seems to me that the Alesi/williams move is often misunderstood.Many ppl say Alesi let his heart rule his head and chose ferrari,this is not entirely the case.Williams was Alesi's 1st choice for 91,he had agreed the contract with Frank at the beginning of the season and Frank had promised to confirm it by hungaroring mid season.At hungaroring Alesi had still heard no more from williams and so went to speak to Framk.Frank said something along the lines of "of course i want to confirm it,but you know how it is,we have to wait for Senna"meaning Senna was franks 1st choice for 91 if he could get him.

So what was Jean to do?if he hangs on and waits for Senna he could end up wothout a drive,Patrese already signed for 91.So Jean makes the choice to go to Maranello.There cars had been more competitive than Williams in 1990 anyway.

It just anoys me that so many ppl blame Alesi for making this move on emotional reasons only and ruining his career.

#6 ensign14

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 01:18

Originally posted by Nilz295
Now I have a question! When Gunnar Nilsson should have driven an Arrows in 1979, for which team Gunnar would have driven in 1978? Lotus? :confused:


Sorry - brain fade - Gunnar was down for Arrows in 1978, presumably in the seat which went to Rolf Stommelen.

Rob Wilson apparently was due to drive for Tyrrell at San Marino in 1981, but Michele Alboreto came up with some funding and got the seat for the remainder of the season.

#7 Jimmy Piget

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 05:44

We must consider 4 chapters in this thread : 1. The true "moves" from one team to another (e.g. Alesi 1991)
2. Drivers who signed with a team but cannot finalized because of untimely death or illness (e.g. Nilsson 1978)
3. Drivers who signed or were entered, but eventually did not appear (e.g. Gavin 1995)
4. Drivers only related to a GP entry (e.g. Rob Wilson)

Before checking for new examples, let's consider the ones yet mentioned :

1. Tarquini 1989 (the First entry was withdrawn before the first GP — a matter of money lacking I think — so he was chosen as Streiff's replacement at AGS)

2. Peterson has signed for McLaren 1979, Bellof for Ferrari 1986

and also : it was intended by Talbot-Lago to enter works entries in 1951 with Raymond Sommer as leading driver.
French F3 ace Jean-Luc Salomon was entered in the 1970 French GP by Team Lotus but was killed the previous week-end at Rouen.
Indy 500 winner Bob Sweikert was keen to buy & race a Maserati 250F in Europe for 1957
Riccardo Paletti was linked to the RAM team for 1983
Didier Pironi has a contract with Larrousse for 1988
Martin Donnelly was officially entered by Team Lotus for 1991

3. Patrick Tambay tested the Toleman in unofficial 1982 Kyalami practice
John Watson was officially entered by Toleman 1985 along with Johansson — remember it was the only team in history to ever come at some GPs without any tyre !
Fulvio Ballabio never got his superlicence in 1984 to finalize his deal with Spirit 1984, hence his sponsors (Topolino = Mickey Mouse !) left along wit him. (It was a kind of a relief for Emerson Fittipaldi who was chosen as leading driver and who was strongly disappointed by the testing he did)
Other problems of superlicence : Michael Andretti (Benetton 1990, to replace the injured Nannini), Geoff Brabham (Brabham 1985), Paulo Carcasci (Pacific 1995), Pascal Fabre (Spirit 1984), Marco Greco (Eurobrun 1990), Ricardo Londoño-Bridge (Ensign 1981), Tiff Needell (Ensign 1979), Hideki Noda (Forti 1995), Kazumi Yamamoto (Pacific 1995)...

(to be continued)

#8 Geza Sury

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 06:22

Originally posted by ensign14
Oliver Gavin was due to drive a Pacific in late 1993 or 1994 but his superlicence did not come through in time.

Are you sure it was Gavin? Kelvin Burt should have made his debut at the 1995 Australian GP, but there had been too many driver changes at Pacific, so the team's only option was to get such a driver into the car who had already driven for them earlier in that year.

Other examples:
1. Mario Andretti was ready to jump into Patrick Tambay's Renault at the 1984 US GP if the Frenchman was to be unfit to drive the car after an accident at the previous GP.

2. In the 1986 US GP, Haas-Lola intended to replace the injured Patrick Tambay (again!) with Michael Andretti, but without a superlicence it was impossible. Eddie Cheever got the drive.

3. In the book "Superswede" Alan Henry mentions the Ronnie Peterson almost swapped places with Tom Pryce in 1976, but finally Peterson stayed at Lotus and Pryce at Shadow. Ronnie even slipped into the Shadow's cockpit at the season opening Brazilian GP.

4. Peter Revson had serious talks with Ferrari in 1974. Than he signed to drive a third McLaren, but eventually went to Shadow to be killed in testing just a couple of weeks later.

5. Alex Caffi tested a Benetton in 1987, but didn't get the seat.

#9 Viktor

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 07:23

Originally posted by AlesiUK
It seems to me that the Alesi/williams move is often misunderstood.Many ppl say Alesi let his heart rule his head and chose ferrari,this is not entirely the case.Williams was Alesi's 1st choice for 91,he had agreed the contract with Frank at the beginning of the season and Frank had promised to confirm it by hungaroring mid season.At hungaroring Alesi had still heard no more from williams and so went to speak to Framk.Frank said something along the lines of "of course i want to confirm it,but you know how it is,we have to wait for Senna"meaning Senna was franks 1st choice for 91 if he could get him.

So what was Jean to do?if he hangs on and waits for Senna he could end up wothout a drive,Patrese already signed for 91.So Jean makes the choice to go to Maranello.There cars had been more competitive than Williams in 1990 anyway.

It just anoys me that so many ppl blame Alesi for making this move on emotional reasons only and ruining his career.

I think you are wrong. Frank Williams has a F1 Ferrari from 1990 or 1991 that he got from Ferrari as a part of the deal with Alesi. I think he got it some years after 1991. This is what I have heard and I dont think Ferrari give out a F1 car just for fun :)

/Viktor

#10 dmj

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 09:19

And there is interesting case of Riccardo Patrese, who should go to Brabhan two years earlier but stayed in Arrows instead, supposedly because he waited for a Ferrari offer. He repeated mistake in 1993 - he could stay in Williams but he signed for Benneton before Mansell decided to quit team.

#11 Viktor

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 09:32

Didn't Mika Häkkinen have a signd contract with Williams for 1992 but Williams was forced by the Lotus boss to give Mika back to Lotus because thay were to late with there entery to FIA and if Lotus did not get Mika back thay woth stop Williams from entering F1 in 1992?

/Viktor

#12 silver

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 09:55

That is true Viktor.

Hakkinen already had Williams driving suite with his name on at his home...

#13 Nilz295

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 16:12

I heard that, that Ayrton Senna wanted to stay at Williams for 2 years (1994 and 1995) and then he wanted to move to Ferrari. Can anyone confirm this???

Also I heard that Sandro Nannini had an offer from Ferrari for 1991. Is that right??

If Häkkinen had driven the Williams in 1992, what would happened to Mansell and Patrese??? One of them had to be replaced, but who??

Please don't stop posting!

#14 Geza Sury

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 17:17

Originally posted by Nilz295
I heard that, that Ayrton Senna wanted to stay at Williams for 2 years (1994 and 1995) and then he wanted to move to Ferrari. Can anyone confirm this?????

At least something like this is mentioned in his girlfriend's (Adriane Galisteu's) book.

Also I heard that Sandro Nannini had an offer from Ferrari for 1991. Is that right??

Don't think so. Nannini had a multiple-year contract with Benetton.

If Häkkinen had driven the Williams in 1992, what would happened to Mansell and Patrese??? One of them had to be replaced, but who??

Williams made the offer late '92 for the 1993 season.

#15 ensign14

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 17:44

Originally posted by Geza Sury

Are you sure it was Gavin? Kelvin Burt should have made his debut at the 1995 Australian GP, but there had been too many driver changes at Pacific, so the team's only option was to get such a driver into the car who had already driven for them earlier in that year.


Kelvin is from Tamworth (ie near me) and I would have remembered had I heard about it; I definitely remember Gavin mentioned but Kelvin could have been as well as you say.

Eddie Cheever (IIRC) had a one-off drive for Beatrice Lola in 1986 - that was originally marked for Michael Andretti but there were licence problems.

Rick Mears had the opportunity to buy a Brabham drive in 1980.

#16 fines

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 18:16

Johnny Parsons had a Ferrari contract in 1952, Giuseppe Farina one with Daimler-Benz in 1951. Alberto Ascari and Luigi Villoresi were expected to join Alfa Romeo in 1950.

#17 Mike Argetsinger

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 21:03

Chris Amon was slated to join the works Cooper team in 1966 beginning with the French GP at Reims. Richie Ginther had been on loan to Cooper from Honda up to this time and the 2nd spot on the team - alongside Jochen Rindt - was to go to Amon for the balance of the season. Of course, between Spa and Reims came LeMans and the famous blow up between Surtees and Dragoni that resulted in John Surtees walking away from Ferrari. When Surtees became available to Cooper it put Roy Salvadori (team manager) in an awkward spot. He felt very bad about Amon being the odd man out and really moved heaven and earth to have the third car prepared for Reims so Amon would at least get his drive there. But it was never envisioned that they would try to run three cars beyond that event. It would have been a good drive for Amon as the Cooper-Maseratis were quite competitive that first year of the 3-litre formula.

Off topic, but Surtees departure from Ferrari was quite a sensation. I believe, strictly from memory, that he had just won something like four races in a row for Ferrari - certainly Syracuse and Spa in F-1, and Monza 1000K in the sports car - I think another sports car race as well, but I can't think of it just at the moment. My memory may be sllightly off here but I do recall that Surtees and Ferrari were on an impressive run at the time. This made his departure during LeMans all the more dramatic and, if nothing else, is a vivid illustration of how highly principled and uncompromising John Surtees was (is) as a man. It really upset the balance of power that season and (this is just my opinion) played a huge role in the outcome of the championship.

#18 AlesiUK

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Posted 15 July 2002 - 21:30

think you are wrong. Frank Williams has a F1 Ferrari from 1990 or 1991 that he got from Ferrari as a part of the deal with Alesi. I think he got it some years after 1991. This is what I have heard and I dont think Ferrari give out a F1 car just for fun



ok,my memory of the place was wrong,but the info was from Chris Hilton's book on Jean.

Wiliams entered into an agrement with Jean on Feb 2nd 1990,subject to them being able to proper and legal release from the tyrell contract he was under. Jean was promised a contract to sign by Silverstone.At silverstone Frank hardly speak to Jean because he was busy chasing after Senna and Mansell.Finally when Alesi pushed him on the subject he(frank) said hockenhiem definately.

He heard nothing at Hockenhiem so he decidied that that was it,a few days later he signed for ferrari.

this is how trevor foster descibes it

Jean freaked,williams said to him"you know how it is,we have to wait for senna".but jena said "i know senna is senna but i am Jean Alesi,do you want me for myself or as first reserve"

at this stage it was realistic that williams could have Senna and Mansell for 91,and jean would be left with no where to go.

#19 Geza Sury

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 06:08

Originally posted by ensign14
Kelvin is from Tamworth (ie near me) and I would have remembered had I heard about it; I definitely remember Gavin mentioned but Kelvin could have been as well as you say.

In this case you're definately right! But I do remember Kelvin was in contention for the Pacific seat some time in the middle 90s. I'm forgetting things way too quickly :lol:

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#20 Dave Ware

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 16:33

I believe Beltoise's "almost move" was '75, not '76. As I recall, he did most or all of the testing for the new Liger F1. Then the team tested Lafitte and he was faster. It was a one-car effort, so exit M. Beltoise. I'm quite sure that he never raced F1 after that. A shame, as he often put in good results and Rob Walker rated him quite highly.

Dave

#21 AndreasF1

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 17:28

I know that Bernie Ecclestone offered Niki Lauda a gazillion $'s to mount a comeback with Brabham after his retirement in 85. Laude declined due to his airline, the rest is histroy.

#22 ghinzani

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 17:38

[i]French F3 ace Jean-Luc Salomon was entered in the 1970 French GP by Team Lotus but was killed the previous week-end at Rouen.

Riccardo Paletti was linked to the RAM team for 1983

Didier Pironi has a contract with Larrousse for 1988

Kazumi Yamamoto (Pacific 1995)...

(to be continued) [/B]

Didnt another French ace die that same weekkend at Roeun?

Paletti to RAM? The silly season started early that year then! Riccardo died in June in his 3rd GP start (or 2nd if u discount Detroit) - when was he linked to RAM? I know his old F2 team Onyx were running the offshoot March 821 for De Villota , is that where the linkup sprung from? De Villota gave up soon after anyway - do you think Riccardo intended to jump ship? Does anyone know why Enzo didnt run anyone in the 2nd car for the rest of the year? I mean it was a nice gesture but for a team as financially strapped it seemed generous... or had Pioneer paid for Riccardo until the end of the year?

I remember reading an Autosport when Laffite was recovering in which Pironi had tested the Ligier -Renault and Guy Ligier was keen to sign him for 87 - did he price himself out of the drive? I know Alfas choice for the second seat was Ghinzi but surely when they dropped Alfa a call should have gone in to Didier?


Yamamoto?? who he? sounds like a ww2 warship!

intrestin thread this!

thanks

#23 ghinzani

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 17:41

Originally posted by AndreasF1
I know that Bernie Ecclestone offered Niki Lauda a gazillion $'s to mount a comeback with Brabham after his retirement in 85. Laude declined due to his airline, the rest is histroy.


When he retired in 79 Niki had an open invite from Bernie to return whnever he wanted... he was linked to a Mclaren-BMW in 1980... and in 81 before he went to see Mclaren he was again linked with Brabham, and also with Arrows whose sponsor Ragno were represented by Daniel Audetto his former SEFAC colleauge.

#24 ensign14

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 18:24

I keep thinking of them. Akihiko Nakaya, for Brabham in 1992. His superlicence bid was turned down. Giovanna Amati somehow got one and rivalled Stuppacher himself for speed, before a certain D Hill turned up.

#25 ghinzani

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 18:36

Talking of Brabham Josele Garza sat in a car during the Mexico GP and was favored to get a ride in 88 with Brabham (in the event they ran) or Minardi but then nothing happened... any of our highly knowledgeable Mexican friends know the reason? I always liked Josele in CART... a hard trier who wasted his time at the Machinist Union team -- can you imagine the General Municipal and Boilermakers or the TGWU in Britain running an F1 team? haha!

#26 AlesiUK

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 22:13

What about Prost and Ligier?after he left williams he tested for them and seemed certain to race for them,but the deal fell thru.

Other problems of superlicence : Michael Andretti (Benetton 1990, to replace the injured Nannini), Geoff Brabham (Brabham 1985), Paulo Carcasci (Pacific 1995), Pascal Fabre (Spirit 1984), Marco Greco (Eurobrun 1990), Ricardo Londoño-Bridge (Ensign 1981), Tiff Needell (Ensign 1979), Hideki Noda (Forti 1995), Kazumi Yamamoto (Pacific 1995)...



How did Noda fail to get a super licence in 95 having raced in f1 in 1994?

i think Carcasci also tested for march/leyton house and was in contention for a drive in about 92 or 93,Paul Belmondo got the drive courtesy of a big suitcase full of cash :rolleyes:

#27 Nilz295

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Posted 16 July 2002 - 22:22

What about Prost and Ligier?after he left williams he tested for them and seemed certain to race for them,but the deal fell thru.



Yep, that's right!! The car was too bad for his level, although it was one of the better Ligier cars since 1986 and it had a Renault engine!!!!!


I just remembered from the german magazine "Motorsport aktuell" that Mark Blundell almost got the Sauber cockpit for 1996 instead of Herbert!!!!!!

#28 Geza Sury

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 07:00

Originally posted by Jimmy Piget
Other problems of superlicence : Kazumi Yamamoto (Pacific 1995)...

IIRC I saw a picture of Yamamoto testing the Pacific at Silverstone. He should have driven for the team at Suzuka. The picture was sent me by forum-member Rainer (Nyberg), but when my hard drive broke I lost it. If only Rainer could post it here...

#29 mikedeering

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 10:15

Hunt was offered $2m to drive for Brabham in 1982, as was Jackie Stewart IIRC.

Hunt was also due to sub for Prost at McLaren at Long Beach 1980...he broke his leg skiing during negotiations so the deal collapsed

Frank Williams was allegedly going to sign Herbert for 1989 - he was at Brands the day Johnny wrecked his legs in 1988.

Ferrari claimed to have a contract for Mansell for 1987...they at least had a meeting.

Mario Andretti was lined up to sub for Berger at Monaco in 1989, but he wasn't able to test the car before hand so the deal fell through.

I thought Prost was in line for a Ligier drive in 92 - before he drove for Williams.

Jordan tried to sign Senna for 1993 - the Hart engine connection and Rubens Barrichello being the key!

Marco Apicella was due to race for the doomed Japanese DOME F1 project before it folded. He eventually did one race for Jordan.

#30 byrkus

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 10:21

Originally posted by mikedeering
Mario Andretti was lined up to sub for Berger at Monaco in 1989, but he wasn't able to test the car before hand so the deal fell through.


:eek: :eek: Are you sure about that one??? Mario Andretti should be aged 49 by then!!!

#31 mikedeering

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 10:26

I know! I read about it in an interview with Mario in the early 90s - I think it appeared in that great publication Grand Prix Editions.

I was v. surprised too. I think Mario said he was interested but ovbiously wanted the opportunity to test the car first (since he hadn't raced an F1 car since 1982...). Due to Indycar commitments, and the fact that at Monaco first qualifying was on a Thursday, it was impossible to find a slot for Mario to test, so the deal was never finalised - and Berger was back for the next race.

Even at 49 though Mario was still a formidable racer - he had a won a couple of CART races in 1988.

#32 Frank de Jong

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 14:16

Originally posted by ensign14

Rob Wilson apparently was due to drive for Tyrrell at San Marino in 1981, but Michele Alboreto came up with some funding and got the seat for the remainder of the season.


IIRC Huub Rothengatter was strongly linked with Tyrrell at San Marino 1981 as well... it must have been busy out there...

#33 Gert

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 14:55

Originally posted by ghinzani
Talking of Brabham Josele Garza sat in a car during the Mexico GP and was favored to get a ride in 88 with Brabham (in the event they ran) or Minardi but then nothing happened... any of our highly knowledgeable Mexican friends know the reason? I always liked Josele in CART... a hard trier who wasted his time at the Machinist Union team -- can you imagine the General Municipal and Boilermakers or the TGWU in Britain running an F1 team? haha!


More Brabham ... Wasn't Swedish Formula 3000-driver Thomas Kaiser rumoured to drive for them in 1987? Or was that 1986, after De Angelis' death? :cry:

#34 Nilz295

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Posted 17 July 2002 - 23:11

Rick Mears in talks with Brabham, Michael Andretti with Lola and Benetton, Parsons with Ferrari....

Are there more US-Stars, who had negotiations with F1-Teams??

The Unsers (Al, Al jr, Johnny) Johnny Rutherford, Gordon Johncock, Jeff and John Andretti, Tom Sneva, Bill Vukovich, Arie Luyendyk, AJ Foyt Jr. , Parnelli Jones, Jim Rathman, etc......

I know that Bobby Unser, Roger Penske, Walt Hansgen, Jim Hall, Troy Ruttman and Sam Posey drove in Formula 1!

Did Gil de Ferran or Kenny Bräck negotiate with Formula 1 Teams??

I remember that I read somewhere that Paul Tracy had tested a Benetton from 1994!

Did Bob Wollek, Klaus Ludwig, Paul Warwick, Ross Cheever, Jordi Gene, Gonzalo Rodriguez, John Nielsen or Marc Goossens come close to a F1-Contract????

I remember that J. Gene tested for Benetton in 1993....

Don't stop posting!

#35 Gert

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Posted 18 July 2002 - 09:49

Originally posted by Nilz295

I remember that I read somewhere that Paul Tracy had tested a Benetton from 1994!


I think that's correct.

Al Unser Jr had some tests with Williams in at least two different years (one was in 1993 with the car with the SEGA-foots)
Davy Jones (former IMSA racer for TWR-Jaguar) tested for Benetton when Tom Walkinshaw was involved with the team (1991 or 1992 IIRC) but I think the only purpose was to let him drive the car, not for a race deal...

#36 Viktor

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Posted 18 July 2002 - 10:27

Originally posted by Nilz295

Did Gil de Ferran or Kenny Bräck negotiate with Formula 1 Teams??

Kenny Bräck tested for Williams at the end of 1993 on a wet Paul Ricard circuit, dont konw if he was ever thout of replacing Damon Hill or not, he won the Renault Clio cup in 1992 (won 9 of 10 races) so it was proberly only a test thanks to that.
In 1996 he signd up as test driver for Ligier (signed with Tom Walkinshaw) and when Tom got Arrows Kenny moved to Arrows with Tom but quit the job because Tom did not give him the testing time promised.
Before he signed for Tom he was in talks with both McLaren and Benetton (I think, I have a magazin that has the full story, day by day, cant find it now). He was also in talks with Pacific to drive the Pacific GP in 1995 but turnd down the offer because he woth not be able to test the car before the race.

/Viktor

#37 silver

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Posted 18 July 2002 - 14:12

Prost was considering McLaren for 1994 since they had Peugeot.

He tested the car and was 1.5 secs slower than Hakkinen in the same test so he decided to call it quits....

#38 Don Capps

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Posted 18 July 2002 - 17:31

Autoweek once had a news item stating that Lee Roy Yarbrough would be in the fourth BRM at the 1970 USGP.

#39 lumepo03

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Posted 18 July 2002 - 17:53

I spoke with Davy and he said he tested a Brabham in the early 80's

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#40 Richard Jenkins

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Posted 18 July 2002 - 19:18

Originally posted by Nilz295
Did Bob Wollek, Klaus Ludwig, Paul Warwick, Ross Cheever, Jordi Gene, Gonzalo Rodriguez, John Nielsen or Marc Goossens come close to a F1-Contract????


Jordi Gene, I think, was the selected driver for the Bravo team, but it never came about. Rodriguez was in negotiations with a few teams, mainly with testing, before his unfortunate & tragic demise. I think Minardi were one, Arrows as a tester I think was the other.
Nielsen did but I can't remember when & where, Warwick I think undoubtely would've done - I think I recall Lotus were interested - Ross Cheever spoke to a few teams, notably Ligier & Goosens.. something tells me he was once linked to Larrousse.
Jason Watt, too was in the line for a drive somewhere before his accident that left him paralysed.

#41 Nilz295

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Posted 19 July 2002 - 14:58

Is it right that Bernd Schneider almost got a Jordan cockpit with the help of Warsteiner in 1991????


And how was it with Laurent Aiello and Juan-Manuel Fangio II?? Did they get a chance to become a Formula 1-Driver??


Thanks

#42 Richard Jenkins

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Posted 19 July 2002 - 19:57

I can't remember Aiello ever coming close to a seat. He was an outside bet for Pacific & I think he had the odd test but I can never remember him having any negoations with anyone.

#43 Geza Sury

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Posted 25 July 2002 - 19:22

Originally posted by Richie Jenkins
Jason Watt, too was in the line for a drive somewhere before his accident that left him paralysed.

Watt was to drive an Arrows thanks to co-owner Prince Malik, who wanted to support black drivers. A quote from www.pitpass.com:

The hopes for a first black F1 driver seemed closer than ever when Jason Watt, the London born son of a Danish mother and Jamaican father, was runner-up in the 1999 International F3000 Championship. When Nigerian, Prince Malik Ado Ibrahim led a consortium to buy a 70% stake in the Arrows F1 team he made it clear one of his aims was to encourage black participation. Prince Malik hoped Jason would benefit from his scheme with an Arrows F1 test. Whilst some may deem such schemes as this, and the African American Drivers Program in the US, as politically correct pacifiers and show, in a report Jason honestly admitted "If this is the way for me to get into an F1 car, then I'm all for it". Sadly, at the end of 1999 during a magazine photo shoot, Jason suffered a motorcycle accident which has left him paralysed from the waist down. Jason is committed to remaining in motorsports and has announced he hopes to race an adapted saloon car in the future. Prince Malik's flirtation with F1 was brief as after just seven months he stepped down from the Arrows board and the 'race debate' he'd briefly awakened went back into dormancy.



#44 petefenelon

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Posted 22 August 2002 - 16:01

Originally posted by ghinzani


Didnt another French ace die that same weekkend at Roeun?

thanks


(same weekend as Jean-Luc Salomon)

Wasn't this Denis Dayan, who was also tipped for greater things?

pete

#45 ghinzani

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Posted 22 August 2002 - 17:30

Originally posted by petefenelon


(same weekend as Jean-Luc Salomon)

Wasn't this Denis Dayan, who was also tipped for greater things?

pete


Thats the chap - did they have seperate accidents?

#46 petefenelon

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Posted 22 August 2002 - 21:27

I'm sure they've been done to death on other threads (bear with me, I'm new here!) but what about some of the Chris Amon moves that weren't -- firm offer of the second Brabham in '74 after Robarts and von Opel had been shown the door, and all the rumours of a Marlboro-backed Ferrari too?

(I recently picked up a complete '73 run of Competition Car. Chris's columns about the Tecno farce are almost heartbreaking, particularly when he starts to talk about his '74 plans..... Ouch.)

pete

#47 Thodore33

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Posted 08 October 2003 - 16:08

Hy,

I am quite sure that Mauro Baldi has almost signed with Brabahm BMW for 1987.
But, one week before the begining of the championship, Andréa De Cesaris, with the support of Marlboro italia, bought the Brabham BMW #8 seat.

#48 ghinzani

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Posted 08 October 2003 - 19:47

Mauro was only in line because the FIA refused Thomas Kaiser a superlicence. Bernie obviously didnt weild ultimate power with the FIA in those days!!

#49 Geza Sury

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Posted 09 October 2003 - 18:38

Originally posted by ghinzani
Mauro was only in line because the FIA refused Thomas Kaiser a superlicence. Bernie obviously didnt weild ultimate power with the FIA in those days!!

That sounds interesting! I also heard that Baldi was on the verge of joining Brabham, but never heard anything about Kaiser. Looking at his F3000 record, it's not surprising that the FIA refused him the superlicence. In 1985 and 1986 he scored only seven points, two fourth places being his best placings. And he was already 31 years old! On a second thought Kaiser should have awarded the licence. Think of Alex Yoong, not to mention Giovanna Amati... Perhaps the rules were more strict in 1987?

#50 Thodore33

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Posted 09 October 2003 - 20:13

Did Alboreto choose to go to Tyrrell in 1989, or did Frank Williams finally rather Patrese stay at Williams ? :confused:
Because I have heard that Michele should have gone to Williams in 1989, but I never known why he did not.

Thanks