14 replies to this topic

[Redliner]

Well, what a web we weave. This tournament has already caused a fair share of debate I'm happy to say, and also in one case, inexplicably immature behaviour, this poll is a bit of fun Mr Mark Beckman, and as such I would appreciate not being vilified just because I can be arsed to run it for the enjoyment of others. If my rules don't make you happy can I suggest you either like it or lump it? I have made my position quite clear in terms of what allows a driver to be entered into this tournament. These decisions have not been taken as part of some facist conspiracy to exclude the drivers that you beleive should be in it, but rather to make the administration of this poll managable. If this distresses you then I am very sorry. I am not about to change the entry for one individual who is spoiled enough not to want to play anymore.

Anyway, onto slightly happier matters. With the closing of Groups 3 and 4 I can confirm that Jacky Ickx, Mika Hakkinen, Maurice Trintignant, and Rene Arnoux are all through. Unfortunately we must say bye to Ruben Barrichello (edged out by Arnoux) and the Pampas Bull, a shame but maybe he would struggle to race with the lightning fast Hakkinen and the versatile Ickx.

Now, onto Group 5 which is a very tough one. The gentlemen up for consideration in this Group are. . .

1.Giancarlo Baghetti
2.Stefan Bellof
3.Mike Hawthorn
4.Tom Pryce

A difficult group by no mistake. Maybe Hawthorn will edge it by virtue of his WDC win, but it is a case of what may have been for Pryce and Bellof, and will Baghetti's stunning early success be enough to get him through?

[dmj]

An almost impossible group to vote... Hawthorn should be a winner by results he achieved but I slightly dislike him, even if reasons for it could be put in question (as they were in another thread). So I voted for Bellof, just from pure personal sympathy for this great "what if".

[F1master]

one of the best drivers ever, stefan bellof, no doubt

[BRG]

Pryce - what might he have achieved? Plus he didn't (AFAIK) wear a bowtie...;)

[Barry Boor]

Toughie, this one!

Hawthorn was a World Champ; Bellof may well have become one but his heyday would have co-incided with Senna's; but IMHO Tom Pryce was a certainty to be champion if he had got his 'arris into the right car.

[2F-001]

I have oft championed the cause of Tom Pryce - but since there is an element of 'just-for-fun' capriciousness about this, 6m 11s for the Nordschleife gets the nod and so Bellof it is...

[Richard Jenkins]

Tom Pryce.. who else?!

[Zawed]

Bellof, such a shame about the 84 season points being taken away...

[scheivlak]

If Bellof wins this, we know simultaniously who's the most overrated driver ever.

[Ray Bell]

Who voted for Baghetti?

I went for Tom Pryce largely because I know more about him than Bellof... and I figured Stefan has penty of admirers anyway.

[2F-001]

I'm feeling guilty now...

[Joe Fan]

If Mike Hawthorn doesn't win, then this whole poll thing is a crook. Hawthorn was quick in anything (first to break the 4 mile barrier at Le Mans), first Briton to win a World Championship GP, arguably the fastest British driver all-time, and he lived long enough to win a WDC. In my opinion, we don't have enough info on Bellof to rank him near the top.

[oldtimer]

Originally posted by Joe Fan
If Mike Hawthorn doesn't win, then this whole poll thing is a crook. Hawthorn was quick in anything (first to break the 4 mile barrier at Le Mans), first Briton to win a World Championship GP, arguably the fastest British driver all-time, and he lived long enough to win a WDC. In my opinion, we don't have enough info on Bellof to rank him near the top.

Can't see that JMH was 'arguably the fastest British driver ever', but when he was in the mood, he sure could hustle. It was those 5 fastest laps in his championship year that made the difference.

[Disco Stu]

I sure feel conflicted about this one. I know in my head I should have voted for Hawthorn, he was a world champion, but I still felt compelled to vote for Bellof. I guess it's a combination of two things: 1) Hawthorn was before my time and 2) the "what might have been" factor with Bellof. If things are tough to decide now, think what it will be like in the later rounds, that should be a nightmare!

[Joe Fan]

Originally posted by oldtimer


Can't see that JMH was 'arguably the fastest British driver ever', but when he was in the mood, he sure could hustle. It was those 5 fastest laps in his championship year that made the difference.

I will add that I think Stirling was ultimately the best British driver better but Hawthorn wasn't far off talent-wise from Sir Stirling.

Consider this.

In Hawthorn's first F1 World Championship start at Spa, he outqualifed Stirling. He also finished fourth in that race which was about the best you could do in a Cooper-Bristol unless the Ferraris had trouble. Then in his third start, he finished 3rd. In his ninth start, he became the first Briton to ever win a World Championship GP as well as the first to become WDC later in 1958 for Ferrari. In sports cars, as I mentioned earlier he was the first driver to break the 4 minute barrier at Le Mans. He also won the 24 Hours of Le Mans and the Sebring 12 Hours. He didn't get too many opportunities at the Ring in a sports car but he did set the pole at the 1958 Nurburgring 1000KM. I at one time thought Mike was one of the lesser talents to win a WDC but after taking a closer look at his career, he really was one of the greatest talents who could be as fast as anyone (even Fangio and Moss-undoubtedly two greats) on a given day.