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#1 Roger Clark

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Posted 17 September 2002 - 20:51

While we await The Word on the indexing of TNF, I wonder whether anybody would care to join me on another project which could prove useful; the creation of an index to Motor Sport magazine? I have indexes for some years in the 1950s but they are not particularly useful; they include such gems as items filed under "t" for "the". I have in mind something that would identify race reports, but not all the competitors as we can get the list of competitors from Sheldon and other reference books. The index would include all the references to cars and drivers in shourt articles and in such things as Continental Notes. We can discuss the level of detail if there is any interest.

I will act as collator and will post the results on a website linked from this thread. All we need is volunteers to undertake a "year".

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#2 Felix Muelas

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Posted 17 September 2002 - 21:15

Interesting, Roger...I "might" be tempted to go along with the early sixties (60-65)...and I wouldn´t object publishing the indexes "chez" 8W ...for obvious reasons :lol:

Un abrazo
Felix

#3 David Beard

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Posted 17 September 2002 - 21:20

Originally posted by Roger Clark
While we await The Word on the indexing of TNF, I wonder whether anybody would care to join me on another project which could prove useful; the creation of an index to Motor Sport magazine? I have indexes for some years in the 1950s but they are not particularly useful; they include such gems as items filed under "t" for "the". I have in mind something that would identify race reports, but not all the competitors as we can get the list of competitors from Sheldon and other reference books. The index would include all the references to cars and drivers in shourt articles and in such things as Continental Notes. We can discuss the level of detail if there is any interest.

I will act as collator and will post the results on a website linked from this thread. All we need is volunteers to undertake a "year".


Yes, this interests me. I believe it would be a worthwhile enterprise- unless an index already exists.

I have nearly all MotorSports from 55 ish housed in box files with very crude indexes on the box labels indicating what is within...but generally only the things that interest me. I once E Mailed MotorSport asking if an index was available. I got a reply from Gordon Cruickshank to the effect that there wasn't and that an enthusiast such as myself might like to undertake the task.

Obviously the task could be undertaken far more efficiently by a group such as the TNFers ...I would love to help. One thing though. What is the best format for the index? I would have thought data base software such as Microsoft Access would be best to make the index searchable, but this isn't something I understand how to set up properly.

#4 Doug Nye

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Posted 17 September 2002 - 21:41

I have indexes for 'Motor Sport' for at least the latter part of the period when it was rather more 'MS' than 'BS' 1966-1986. If anyone cares to come and copy them no problem...although I presume they should still be available from the publisher?

DCN

#5 Vitesse2

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Posted 17 September 2002 - 21:44

Well, I've only got about four other things on the boil at the moment, so why not?

As most of you probably know, I recently acquired a full run of Motor Sport from 1950-91. Some of those are bound volumes from the late 60s and early 70s, which include a basic index, but two pages to cover a whole year is underdoing it just a bit. :rolleyes:

Count me in Roger ....

#6 Roger Clark

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Posted 18 September 2002 - 18:20

It sonds as though the index Vitesse has is the same as I have for several years. I wouldn't use that even as a starting point. Doug's may be different; is it possible to post a page so that we can see how detailed it is?

Felix's offer of the use of 8W webspace is very generous. I had intended to use my Atlas user space, but it would be far better to use 8W. I would, however, like to post work in progress from time to time. Felix, would you be happy with that?

I don't think we need anything as complex as an Access database. A simple Word table will suffice: one column for the item being referenced, one for the article title and if necessary a short description and one for the year and page. This can be created in page number order, and then sorted by item reference. Easy!

As an example, here is an index I created last night for January and February of 1963. I only chose those years because I happend to have the volume on my desk; you can start anywhere.

http://www.jumbani.d...Sport Index.doc

There are a number of decisions to make:

[list=1]
[*]Do we include non-racing items? I have.
[*]Do we index pictures? I haven't done so but I think it would be a good idea.
[*]Do we include short news items? I haven't
[*]Do we include readers letter? I haven't but again it would be a good idea.
[/list=1]

#7 David Beard

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Posted 18 September 2002 - 19:49

Originally posted by Roger Clark


I don't think we need anything as complex as an Access database. A simple Word table will suffice: one column for the item being referenced, one for the article title and if necessary a short description and one for the year and page. This can be created in page number order, and then sorted by item reference. Easy!

As an example, here is an index I created last night for January and February of 1963. I only chose those years because I happend to have the volume on my desk; you can start anywhere.

http://www.jumbani.d...Sport Index.doc

There are a number of decisions to make:

[list=1]
[*]Do we include non-racing items? I have.
[*]Do we index pictures? I haven't done so but I think it would be a good idea.
[*]Do we include short news items? I haven't
[*]Do we include readers letter? I haven't but again it would be a good idea.
[/list=1]

A Word table would be easier for me, certainly. But can it be searched?

I would agree that non racing items should be included..many might find the road tests etc of interest.

Pictures..definitely.

Short news..could cover anything, so I think yes.

Letters. Perhaps not. I wouldn't want anyone to look at the readers' letters in the April 63 issue!
(Particularly one headed "Numbers Count")
On the other hand, letters of special interest used to crop up occasionally. I recall one from JYS reacting to a Jenks anti armco tirade. I wouldn't know where to find it now.

#8 Felix Muelas

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Posted 18 September 2002 - 20:21

Originally posted by David Beard
Letters. Perhaps not. I wouldn't want anyone to look at the readers' letters in the April 63 issue!
(Particularly one headed "Numbers Count")


Of course you have just achieved the opposite effect :lol:

#9 kabouter

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Posted 18 September 2002 - 21:54

Originally posted by Roger Clark
I don't think we need anything as complex as an Access database. A simple Word table will suffice.

From my own experience I'd say that if you're using tables, a spreadsheet program like Excel is more convenient than a text editor.

Good luck with the project!

#10 MichaelJP

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Posted 19 September 2002 - 15:52

Seeing as people are making this index, surely it's only a bit more work to scan the lot in and put the entire Motorsport set on the web!

Go on, it must be done for posterity, all that paper is bound to rot away in a hundred years:)

- Michael

#11 petefenelon

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Posted 19 September 2002 - 16:00

Originally posted by MichaelJP
Seeing as people are making this index, surely it's only a bit more work to scan the lot in and put the entire Motorsport set on the web!

Go on, it must be done for posterity, all that paper is bound to rot away in a hundred years:)

- Michael


Wouldn't be too massive either - I bought the Complete National Geographic recently and that's only 30 CDs. Motor Sport's only been going about half as long...

pete

#12 Don Capps

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Posted 19 September 2002 - 16:08

Originally posted by Roger Clark
I don't think we need anything as complex as an Access database. A simple Word table will suffice.

I have never thought of Access as being very complex and I detest using a spreadsheet (Excel) program for holding a database.

However, if I were doing it, I would use the same database I have already established to index my serials and other holdings: Access. Whenever I get the time, I just plug in the data to build more entries. When I need something, I can just plug in my query and get it. Being both overtaxed and being notoriously seized by massive inertia at times, I have set up the dbase and twiddled with it to the point where I am happy with it and ready to commit all my magazines into the dbase -- if I ever get around to it.....

#13 Roger Clark

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Posted 19 September 2002 - 17:21

Maybe complex was te wrong word, but Access contains a lot of facilities that we don't need for this application. I also don't like holding text in a spreadsheet. Can anybody suggest anything we might want to do with this that we can't do in Word?

#14 David Beard

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Posted 19 September 2002 - 22:01

Originally posted by Roger Clark
Maybe complex was te wrong word, but Access contains a lot of facilities that we don't need for this application. I also don't like holding text in a spreadsheet. Can anybody suggest anything we might want to do with this that we can't do in Word?


I'm quite happy with either Word or Excel. I have only a glimmering of a notion on how to use Access, but it thought it was designed for this sort of job.

Any sort of data base is useless until it is filled with info, which takes time. I have done a fair bit of Family History research in the past. I looked at a number of software packages before I convinced myself it was worth the effort of feeding in the fruits of my research.

So..is it possible to set up a search system on a Word or Excel file? I don't know of a way.
I still think it's important to consider this before deciding which way to go. We wouldn't want to do lots of work and put it in the wrong sort of container, unless we are sure it can be decanted into another one later if need be.

The main thing is to do it, though. I fit readily into the "A Little Knowledge is Dangerous" pigeon hole. :| I now bow to better judgement.

Can I do 58, 59, 60, 61 for starters?

#15 Doug Nye

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Posted 19 September 2002 - 22:24

I've found another 'MS' indices set - published by C.A.Winder of Harrogate in 1991 covering the years 1947-1983. It's not up to much, in truth, but it's more helpful than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick...

DCN

#16 Roger Clark

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Posted 12 October 2002 - 00:08

Here is the progress to date by David Beard and me.

http://www.jumbani.d...Sport Index.htm

1974 is complete and there is work in progress on 1950, 1958, 1960 and 1963. Any comments, criticisms or, best of all, contributions, will be gratefully received.

#17 Hans Etzrodt

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Posted 12 October 2002 - 06:01

Originally posted by Roger Clark
Here is the progress to date by David Beard and me.

http://www.jumbani.d...Sport Index.htm

1974 is complete and there is work in progress on 1950, 1958, 1960 and 1963. Any comments, criticisms or, best of all, contributions, will be gratefully received.

:up: for Roger and Dave!
I am definitely interested in such an index. So, please keep on trucking. I have done and still have to do similar work for my magazine copies and Automobile Quarterly collection.

#18 David Beard

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Posted 24 October 2002 - 21:08

Originally posted by Roger Clark
Here is the progress to date by David Beard and me.

http://www.jumbani.d...Sport Index.htm

1974 is complete and there is work in progress on 1950, 1958, 1960 and 1963. Any comments, criticisms or, best of all, contributions, will be gratefully received.


It's quite a slow task...one tends to be distracted by finding things to read on the way. Which makes it not really a chore at all.

But we do need some helpers. I'm sure that myself and Roger are not the only TNFers with a MotorSport Mountain waiting to justify its existence. :

#19 Joe Fan

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Posted 24 October 2002 - 21:21

:up: :up: Great work guys!

What you might what to think about doing later is dividing this info into categories like Drivers, Cars, Teams, Races, Motorsports series, etc. I have an Automotive Literature Index that indexes articles for Car and Driver, Road & Track, Motor Trend. It is very useful but I think it has a bit too many sub-categories.

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#20 Allen Brown

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Posted 16 April 2005 - 11:45

Hi guys

Where did this project get to? I notice the page has now disappeared. Is it somewhere else?

Allen

#21 Roger Clark

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Posted 16 April 2005 - 13:45

Originally posted by Allen Brown
Hi guys

Where did this project get to? I notice the page has now disappeared. Is it somewhere else?

Allen

A good question. The work in progress is all on my hard disk, but I removed it from my web space to make room for other things.

As noted above, David Beard and I did some work on 1950, 1958, 1960, 1963 and 1974. I also obtained a publisher's index for approximately 1950 -2000, which is very high level but at least a start. I started to scan it and convert it to a usable format; even after you pass it through an OCR program it needs a lot of work. I reached 1954 when pressure of work intervened and I put it to one side.

#22 Allen Brown

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Posted 16 April 2005 - 16:39

Originally posted by Roger Clark

A good question. The work in progress is all on my hard disk, but I removed it from my web space to make room for other things.

If web space is an issue, I'd be happy to host the progress so far on OldRacingCars.com.

Perhaps if we make the 1950-2000 index available as images, we may find some volunteers willing to transcribe it into a more searchable format?

Allen

#23 Roger Clark

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Posted 16 April 2005 - 19:31

Web space is not really a problem, I just needed to create some space a few months ago and deleted a few older files. This is the current state. Note that it's a 1GB word file, so don't download it unless you really want to. The years 1951-55 are done to the same level of detail as 1950 but need to be merged with this file, the years 1956-59 are scanned and ready for editing. The editing is very tedious and time consuming and it really helps of you've got the magazines to refer to. Any offers of help will result in hands being bitten off.

http://members.atlas...dex General.doc

#24 Rob Ryder

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Posted 16 April 2005 - 20:22

Originally posted by Roger Clark
Note that it's a 1GB word file, so don't download it unless you really want to.


You really frightened me :eek: :eek: :eek:
1MB!! .... :lol: :lol:
An interesting start...
Rob

#25 green-blood

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Posted 30 June 2006 - 14:58

would this help

http://www.bonhams.c...298035-11-1.jpg

#26 Vitesse2

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Posted 09 January 2007 - 22:06

Found purely by chance, an index of articles from 1972-99, not just in Motor Sport, but also:

Autocar
Autosport
Auto Italia
Cars & Car Conversions
Chequered Flag
Classic & Sports Car
Classic Toy
F1 Racing
Jaguar World
MG Enthusiast
MG World
Mini World
Model Auto Review
Model Collector
Off Road and 4wd
Performance Car
Porsche World
Practical Classics
Purely Porsche
Prix Editions
Road Back
Racecar Engineering
Race Tech
Rally XS
Sports Car International
The Automobile
The Golf
Triumph World
Volks World

Searchable in a number of different ways. Looks like a very useful resource!

http://ewa1.com/magin.html