41 replies to this topic

[ghinzani]

Ok Im going to be a bit vague here but I was recommended to read a book he wrote, possibly with Jenks. All I know about him was that he was part of Autosport when it started (got that from the Autosport 50th Anniversary edition). Can anyone fill in the blanks for me please?

Thanks

[petefenelon]

Originally posted by ghinzani
Ok Im going to be a bit vague here but I was recommended to read a book he wrote, possibly with Jenks. All I know about him was that he was part of Autosport when it started (got that from the Autosport 50th Anniversary edition). Can anyone fill in the blanks for me please?

Thanks

Would that be Posthumus and DSJ's "Vanwall", or Posthumus, DSJ and
Clutton's "The Racing Car - Development and Design"?

The former is an excellent warts-and-all technical and racing history of
the marque, the latter one of the best one-volume introductions to
racing cars from the dawn of time to the 50s.

pete

[ghinzani]

I guess its the latter because it was a history of GP car development - thanks for that. Strange an Autosport man writing a book with a Motor Sport man!!

[Doug Nye]

Cyril Posthumus was a wonderful bloke.

He grew up in Sunbury-on-Thames, not far from Weybridge and Brooklands, and he visited it many times as a lad. He couldn't afford to buy a ticket, so he and his chums would smuggle themselves in whenever they could through holes in the fence.

During World War 2 Cyril served as an anti-aircraft gunner - "made a terrific amount of noise and never harmed a thing" he'd cheerfully admit. He contracted a chronic intestinal malady from drinking bad water on remote gun sites which would dog him for the rest of his life ... developing into chronic colitis.

Postwar he became a professional model maker. He made a model of Hugh Hunter's Alfa Romeo 8C-2900A sports car and one of the Napier-Railton in fake Land Speed Record form for the movie 'Pandora and the Flying Dutchman'. In the movie the car crashes mightily over a cliff. What crashed over the cliff for the cameras was Cyril's large-scale model. He sought patents for a method of modelling scale wire-spoke wheels using drilled hubs and rims and tensioned continuous wire.

I think he contributed articles to 'Iota' and/or 'The Light Car' before he went to work for 'Autosport' as junior to Gregor Grant and John Bolster. He was notionally Assistant Editor, I think, during the weekly's formative years. Old Man Tee who ran 'Motor Sport' brought in Cyril from 'Autosport' in 1955 to found 'Motoring News' - his company's weekly motoring newspaper. It was there that Cyril and Jenks became colleagues and really got on together very well.

Eventually Cyril moved to 'The Motor' and spent periods in between times as a freelance, writing excellent books on the British sports car, co-authoring a great book on Grand Prix cars with Sam Clutton and Jenks, and doing an excellent biography of Segrave. He was always very derisive about Maurice A. Smith, perfectly capable Editor of 'The Autocar' - the rival British weekly motoring magazine - simply because he styled himself as 'Wing-Commander...DFC' on the publication's flannel panel, and Cyril mounted a campaign for 'The Motor' to list him as 'Gunner Cyril Posthumus'.

After another spell with 'The Motor' he was engaged as Editor of 'Motor Racing' magazine, with me as his No 2.

He was a delight - a gentle, self-effacing, humorous man of immense knowledge and capability. Jenks rated him highly which tells you all you should want to know. At one stage we had a lovely new girl - just married - come to work for us as a Secretary. She'd only been with us for a week or two when she was found murdered in her home. It was pretty ghastly. A stalker crazed by her marriage to somebody else was eventually convicted, but the police for some reason grilled Cyril several times and he took it badly - he was totally, utterly innocent, they were just grasping at straws and for some reason cooked up a half-baked suspicion involving him in some way.

When 'Motor Racing' was taken over by another company, Cyril went back to freelance work - I was asked to stay on and in view of what they had done without good reason to Cyril I immediately told them to fold their job 'til the edges were sharp and then stick it right up.....etc etc. I joined 'Motor Sport' and 'Motoring News'.

Cyril freelanced, becoming European (or UK?) Editor for 'Road & Track' magazine, doing further racing car books, including his great book on Vanwall with Jenks which was badly let down by lack of imagination on the part of the publishers who did a cheapskate print job with it - several titles on racing motorcycles, and he also became Editor for a period of the Brooklands Society's publication.

In later life poor Cyril became depressed and bothered that forgetfulness was the harbinger of Altzheimer's. There may have been other reasons - I don't know - but one day he went missing. His car was eventually found in a carpark on the banks of the River Thames at Walton Bridge. In childhood one of his older brothers had drowned in the Thames, being eventually recovered at Sunbury weir. After quite a long period - 10-days to 3 weeks I think - Cyril's body was also recovered from the Thames at Sunbury weir. He had made his own choice - and after 60 years or so was reunited with his long lost brother. It was a very, very, very sad affair. He was - as I said in the beginning - a wonderful bloke...I had immense admiration and affection for him, and still do. I owe him a great deal...

DCN

[karlcars]

A agree about Cyril. What a wonderful fellow. I have always taken it badly that his fine book on the Land Speed Record was beaten for the Montagu Trophy in 1972, I think, by mine on Mercedes-Benz.

I am reminded of Cyril daily because our files contain I think most of his old reference files, complete with correspondence, scripts and notations.

Thanks for your warm tribute, Doug.

[ghinzani]

Thanks for that - most comprehensive! Basically he wrote for all the important Motor Racing tomes - no wonder his book comes highly recommended. I think I will see if the Dorset library service has it, if not better exercise the old wallet!

Road and Track was an American magazine correct? were'nt they the ones to give Roebuck his first job - did'nt Innes Ireland and/or Rob Walker write for them too? Its funny you dont really get many Racers doing journalism these days... apart from those ghosted articles you see in Autosport where you just know the driver in question could'nt have strung together that many big words!

Doug I notice he was from Sunbury - why is it that Motorsport magazines seem to be concentrated around south-west London, what with Autosport being based at Teddington etc - is it a legacy of Brooklands or something? I once went for an interview for an IT job at Sony who are based at Weybridge and when they asked me why I was attracted to that particular location I told them (more thru panic and having nothing to say) it was because it was near Brooklands!

I cant beleive Cyrils own employers would have stitched him up so with reference to the poor lady who was murdered... unbeleivable! Was there really enough freelance work for Cyril to make ends meet in those days? I guess it just depends on how many contacts you have in the business? Did he have outside business interests... I guess in a world before PR and Promotional work journalists had to work for a living ;)

What a shame Cyril has such a sad ending, but I guess you could say he had no wish to be a burden - at least we still have the printed word, for others to discover (like myself) and remember him by. I sit and read the few Motor Sports I have from the 70s and lose myself in the GP reports by DSJ , and they make me wish I had been born 20 years before I was. And yet the impression you get from DSJ of a scene that was undergoing great change is balanced by an ability to see the long term picture and to contrast the 70s with the 50s and the 30s and show that, as in all things, racing is a cyclical thing.

[Doug Nye]

Don't get fussed about the south-west London notion - it's a total mirage - 'Autosport' was in amongst the dodgy shops and 'French dresser - no Drawers' in Praed Street, central London, for many years, 'Motor Sport' was in east-central London just up from St Paul's, 'Motor Racing' was at Brands Hatch, then St Paul's, then West Wickham in Kent - there's no connection with Brookers at all. Secondly, how did you figure that Cyril's "own employers" suspected him? He wasn't employed by the police.....??????

DCN

PS - Karl - I didnt realise Cyril's material had ended up with you. Delighted to hear it's in such a good home.

[ghinzani]

"When 'Motor Racing' was taken over by another company, Cyril went back to freelance work - I was asked to stay on and in view of what they had done without good reason to Cyril I immediately told them to fold their job 'til the edges were sharp and then stick it right up.....etc etc. I joined 'Motor Sport' and 'Motoring News'."

Sorry thought you were implying his employers tipped off the Police or something... on re-reading you are saying the new employers let Cyril go and thats why they were'nt on your xmas card list... doh! Did think that was a bit strange !! Child of the 80s naturally defaults to conspiracy theory and all that

[Roger Clark]

Cyril Posthumus was one of the few writers whose works were comprehensible to a young teen ager first becoming interested in motor racing and are still informative and entertaining forty years later.

[Doug Nye]

Exactly, Roger. Cyril's work was/is the same for me...

DCN

[desmo]

Being only a relative youngster here, I only knew Cyril's writing from R&T and some books from the library. I must second Roger clark's opinion that he was both eminantly readable for a young teenager, yet still satisfying today. No mean feat.

I still recall my mother picking up one of my R&Ts from the early 70s and commenting that his name must surely be pseudonymous.

[Vitesse2]

And me ...

I have a copy of his German GP book - well-thumbed and well-read (often).

[Dennis David]

ghinzani take a look at this post ...

http://www.atlasf1.c...y=&pagenumber=2

Doug, Karl this would be a nice book ... The early days of motorsport journalism as told by the people who were there. Instead of Dick and George you would have maybe Cyril, Dennis, Bill et al.

Instead of their official correspondence we would find out what they really thought about the teams, drivers and officials of the day. They could tell us what they really thought of the raod cars they tested as well.

[Hans Etzrodt]

Since my early days of collecting grand prix racing literature, I soon realized that Cyril Posthumus belonged to the more important writers and I have his following works:
1966 - The German Grand Prix
1966 - 1926 - 27 1 1/2-Litre Delage
1967 - The 1906-1908 Grand Prix Renaults
1967 - 16-cylinder G.P. Auto Union
1967 - Deutschland's Grosser Preis
1972 - The 4 1/2 Litre Lago Talbot
1978 - Mercedes and Mercedes-Benz Racing Car Guide
1980 - The Roaring Twenties
1985 - Land Speed Record (with David Tremayne)
1991 - Classic Sports Cars ( with David Hodges)

[ghinzani]

Originally posted by Dennis David
ghinzani take a look at this post ...

http://www.atlasf1.c...y=&pagenumber=2

Thanks Dennis - conjures up another world totally does'nt it? Letters as communication.... email somehow tends to be less personal, and as 4 txt msgs...
I can picture what it must have been like blasting round the roads around Midhurst and Hook, when I lived in Hants I often used to go for a blast out that way in my RWD Volvo and latterly BMW - but that was with a steel saftey cell around me as opposed to a 50s sportscar.

He has a very personable and friendly letter writing style, I look forward to reading some of his books - I notice hes Dutch, any particular reason why his family came over?

[tombe]

In the March 1970 issue of R&T there is a, in my opinion, marvellous article by Mr.Posthumus called 'Surrey - Seat of Speed' . It is an highly entertaining piece of motorsport history from an 'unusual' angle.
I remember it made me believe he described what then had to be the centre of the universe .

As I understand some TNFers lives in this area. Don't tell me I've been under the wrong illusion.........;) .

[dmj]

Originally posted by ghinzani
Its funny you dont really get many Racers doing journalism these days... apart from those ghosted articles you see in Autosport where you just know the driver in question could'nt have strung together that many big words!

Don't know for F1 drivers but I once ghostwrote diary of a Porsche Supercup driver, that also happened to be a grandson of then still alive Croatian president. I don't believe he could write a diary or article but for someone like him it is much more important to sign his name clearly on a cheque! (Sadly, I don't know it from personal experience...)

[ghinzani]

Croatian? was that Tudjmans son then?

[dmj]

Tudjman's grandson. Sinisa Kosutic. And I was joking - he is an interesting bloke with great respect and some knowledge of people like Ortelli, against whom he drove in that series... Also, his comments to my text were far from what I would call iliterate... Can't say he could become next Rob Walker but certainly not a man inable to express his opinions with words.

[Eric McLoughlin]

Ghinzani - those roads are still a blast, if the traffic's light. My forays to Goodwood take me through Midhurst and my local Lotus 7 club meets are at The Phoenix Inn in Hartley Wintney, one of DSJ's old haunts..

[Doug Nye]

DSJ asked in his will for his ashes to be scattered at The Phoenix....where he had been so involved with the VSCC in early days and where he lived for a period and where he later had an interest in Alan Southon's Phegre Engineering company - the Weber carburettor specialists - based in one of the adjoining workshops there. If any DSJ fans ever stop off for a beer or a meal at The Phoenix, Hartley Wintney, do raise a glass to the old boy...he's just there, listening, ready to share true enthusiasm...ready to argue....

DCN

[Dennis David]

Adding to Hans' fine list a copy of Sir Henry Seagrave from my own humble library.

[Milan Fistonic]

Also to add to Hans' list I have these Posthumus books.

1956 - The Racing Car Development & Design (with Clutton & Jenkinson)
1959 - The British Competition Car
1961 - World Sports Car Championship
1975 - Vanwall (with Jenkinson)
1978 - Classic Racing Cars

[Eric McLoughlin]

The "historic" context of "The Phoenix" goes up and up! I'll make sure to remember Cyril when I'm there next. If any TNF'rs want to see some Lotus / Caterham Sevens, the North Hants and Berks branch of the Lotus 7 club meet at The Phoenix on the second Wednesday and the last Thursday of each month (My Seven is registered Q524 APN).

The only Cyril Posthumus book I own is "Classic Racing Cars" which I picked up in a remaindered book-shop in Dublin about 20 years ago for about £3. The book was originally published around 1976/77.

[Barry Lake]

Not necesarily Posthumus Classics, but I do have the following listed, in addition to those alreay mentioned.

British Racing Cars Cyril Posthumus 1948 Floyd Clymer Publications

Castrol Series of Grand Prix Cars 1948-1967 Cyril Posthumus 1967 Castrol Limited

Everybody's Book of British Racing Cars Cyril Posthumus 1947 The Vitesse Publishing Co

Motor Cars Cyril Posthumus 1982 Wayland Publishers

The Story of Veteran and Vintage Cars Cyril Posthumus 1977 Books for Pleasure

Vintage Cars Cyril Posthumus 1973 Hamlyn Publishing Group

Sports Cars Automobile Library Cyril Posthumus and David Hodges 1981 Hamlyn Publishing Group

And wasn't he involved in the excellent motor racing season reviews in The Motor Yearbooks of the 1940s and 1950s?

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by Barry Lake
.....And wasn't he involved in the excellent motor racing season reviews in The Motor Yearbooks of the 1940s and 1950s?

Barry,
The MOTOR year book 1949 by Temple Press, published April 1949 with content about the 1948 year was compiled by Laurence Pomeroy and Rodney Walkerley.
The MOTOR year book 1950 about the 1949 season was published March 1950 and both writers signed responsible again.
I don't have the later issues and don't know if Cycil Posthumus had his hand in them. According to Mortimer's record, which records this series up to the 1957 issue, the authors were always Laurence Pomeroy and Rodney Walkerley.

[Doug Nye]

During the period when Cyril was with 'The Motor' he often did much of the donkey work on the annual while the senior team members - Walkerley and Pom - got to have their names credited. The 'Gunner Posthumus' syndrome you see...but in their august - and genuinely respected - company, Cyril didn't mind.

DCN

[Arjan de Roos]

Many years ago I heard someone claim Cyril Posthumus was from a Dutch family? His family name does indicate so. But he wasn't born in Holland, let alone raised, or was he?

[Geoff E]

This is the index entry of a likely birth registration-

Births Dec 1918
POSTHUMUS Cyril (mother nee Van Den Bosch) Staines 3a 2

The first references I can find to the surname in the GRO indexes is the 1877 marriage between William Frederick POSTHUMUS and Elizabeth RAMSEY and the birth of their son Ramsey POSTHUMUS the following year. I don't see this family in a later census.

In the 1901 census there was a Johannes POSTHUMA and a William POSTHUMUS ... both Dutch seaman.

There seems to be every chance that his parents were both Dutch.

[Arjan de Roos]

This is the index entry of a likely birth registration-

Births Dec 1918
POSTHUMUS Cyril (mother nee Van Den Bosch) Staines 3a 2

The first references I can find to the surname in the GRO indexes is the 1877 marriage between William Frederick POSTHUMUS and Elizabeth RAMSEY and the birth of their son Ramsey POSTHUMUS the following year. I don't see this family in a later census.

In the 1901 census there was a Johannes POSTHUMA and a William POSTHUMUS ... both Dutch seaman.

There seems to be every chance that his parents were both Dutch.

Thank you Geoff,
Wikipedia mentions August 28th 1918 as his day of birth.
Van Den Bosch is also a clear Dutch family name.

[Doug Nye]

Cyril was British born to a family of Dutch extraction, hence his surname. His grandmother was certainly Dutch as he used to answer the telephone using the expression he vividly recalled her using when the newly installed apparatus rang. She would summon up the best of her very limited English and bawl "VOSS YOU DAIR???"...

DCN

[Arjan de Roos]

Cyril was British born to a family of Dutch extraction, hence his surname. His grandmother was certainly Dutch as he used to answer the telephone using the expression he vividly recalled her using when the newly installed apparatus rang. She would summon up the best of her very limited English and bawl "VOSS YOU DAIR???"...

DCN

Haha, I suppose she wanted to say "Was you there?", Dunglish for "Are you there?".

[Doug Nye]

Precies!

DCN

[surreyman]

This is the index entry of a likely birth registration-

Births Dec 1918
POSTHUMUS Cyril (mother nee Van Den Bosch) Staines 3a 2

The first references I can find to the surname in the GRO indexes is the 1877 marriage between William Frederick POSTHUMUS and Elizabeth RAMSEY and the birth of their son Ramsey POSTHUMUS the following year. I don't see this family in a later census.

In the 1901 census there was a Johannes POSTHUMA and a William POSTHUMUS ... both Dutch seaman.

There seems to be every chance that his parents were both Dutch.

I can confirm that his parents were both Dutch, Eke Pieter Posthumus & Nanette Marie Elizabeth Van Den Bosch (not actually married until 1924), they moved to the UK in 1909.
The lady that Doug Nye refers to as his Grandmother was in fact his Mother, known to all as Betsy, she spoke English with a strong Dutch accent.
CP was born and brought up in England and apart from using the odd dutch phrase was to all intents completely English (His two sisters spoke fluent Dutch and both married Dutchmen).

[Arjan de Roos]

... she spoke English with a strong Dutch accent.

I sank you frum de buttom of mai hard for dis ans-where!

[ChamounIssa]

Hi Doug,

 

thank you for all that information about Posthumus. It’s great to find out more about him.

 

As you knew him I was wondering if you could clarify a few things about him. His obituary in Motor Magazine states that "Cyril leaves a widow, Betty, and son". Did he marry a second time or is the obituary wrong? Do you know the name of his son?

[Vitesse2]

 

Hi Doug,

 

thank you for all that information about Posthumus. It’s great to find out more about him.

 

As you knew him I was wondering if you could clarify a few things about him. His obituary in Motor Magazine states that "Cyril leaves a widow, Betty, and son". Did he marry a second time or is the obituary wrong? Do you know the name of his son?

 

I'm not Doug, but I think you may be confusing his mother - 'Betsy' - with his widow - Betty? Cyril married Betty M Mason in 1954. I've found the birth of their son, but as he's still apparently alive, I've sent you the details I found via personal message.

[63Corvette]

Thanks for that - most comprehensive! Basically he wrote for all the important Motor Racing tomes - no wonder his book comes highly recommended. I think I will see if the Dorset library service has it, if not better exercise the old wallet!

Road and Track was an American magazine correct? were'nt they the ones to give Roebuck his first job - did'nt Innes Ireland and/or Rob Walker write for them too? Its funny you dont really get many Racers doing journalism these days... apart from those ghosted articles you see in Autosport where you just know the driver in question could'nt have strung together that many big words!

Doug I notice he was from Sunbury - why is it that Motorsport magazines seem to be concentrated around south-west London, what with Autosport being based at Teddington etc - is it a legacy of Brooklands or something? I once went for an interview for an IT job at Sony who are based at Weybridge and when they asked me why I was attracted to that particular location I told them (more thru panic and having nothing to say) it was because it was near Brooklands!

I cant beleive Cyrils own employers would have stitched him up so with reference to the poor lady who was murdered... unbeleivable! Was there really enough freelance work for Cyril to make ends meet in those days? I guess it just depends on how many contacts you have in the business? Did he have outside business interests... I guess in a world before PR and Promotional work journalists had to work for a living ;)

What a shame Cyril has such a sad ending, but I guess you could say he had no wish to be a burden - at least we still have the printed word, for others to discover (like myself) and remember him by. I sit and read the few Motor Sports I have from the 70s and lose myself in the GP reports by DSJ , and they make me wish I had been born 20 years before I was. And yet the impression you get from DSJ of a scene that was undergoing great change is balanced by an ability to see the long term picture and to contrast the 70s with the 50s and the 30s and show that, as in all things, racing is a cyclical thing.

Both Innes and Rob wrote for R&T at one time or another. I had the pleasure of meeting Rob in the paddock at Watkins Glen several times in the 1970s. Back then you could walk around and meet (engage, converse with) ANY or the GP drivers and principals (DiMontezemolo, Lauda, Hunt, Fittipaldi, Hill etc) at will as they were ALL friendly and approachable.

[Jack-the-Lad]

Thanks to those who explained the origin of CP's surname. I had always wondered about that.

[Doug Nye]

Cyril's wife Betty had been Gregor Grant's secretary at 'Autosport' magazine when Cyril was deputy editor there.  During one great British printing strike - god bless our old trades union movement, many of them playing out the them-and-us tribal jealousies focused during the second world war - Cyril played a decisive role in managing to keep 'Autosport' publishing, week after week, using printers found for Gregor by their mutual friend 'Jabby' Crombac in Paris.  I can't recall the year without looking it up - and right now I am NOT prepared to stir my stumps and do that - but it was sometime in the early to mid-1950s as I recall.  With their great publishing houses politically unable to print using scab labour, 'The Motor' and 'The Autocar' both missed many issues, punctuating their 'journal of record' status.  As a shining example of enthusiastic avoidance-tactic, 'Autosport' maintained its service to readers...and ---- the unions who would have spoiled our fun...  Had they met Betty Posthumus they would never have dared.

 

Anyone care to argue about that?  

 

DCN

[Vitesse2]

Early 1956, I think, Doug. As usual, it revolved around NATSOPA - or NOTSOBA, as Private Eye (always printed by non-union firms IIRC) used to call them!

[Doug Nye]

Thank you V2 - when I started work with 'Motor Racing' magazine in 1963 I was sent to the print works of Oxley & Son - proudly self-promoting as 'printers to HM Queen Elizabeth II' - in Windsor to learn the ropes. Parts of their print works were like a scene from Dante's 'Inferno' with hot metal print blocks being cast, fumes and smoke, while the typesetters were an overtly superior, highly-skilled breed apart, clattering away at their Linotype machines and spitting blood over the hand-scrawled original text and corrections I had been instructed to take with me.  There's no substitute for throwing a young kid in at the deep end...  I learned enough to appreciate that that part of being a staff man was absolutely NOT for me.  For the blokes to whom it became a career - signing their lives away to spend so many hours a day in such conditions, and beset by so much noise - one shouldn't be surprised they were prone to bad temper, envy, irritability and every other trait for which traditional printers (in my experience) became notorious. Cyril Posthumus - bless him - seemed able to charm even those buggers out of the trees...a measure of the man.

 

DCN