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Mosley's idea on driver swapping (merged)


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Poll: Mosley's idea on driver swapping (merged) (135 member(s) have cast votes)

  1. Good (38 votes [28.36%])

    Percentage of vote: 28.36%

  2. Bad (96 votes [71.64%])

    Percentage of vote: 71.64%

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#1 Robbie

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 08:55

from Autosport.com
FIA proposes driver team swap idea
Formula 1 drivers could find themselves swapping teams throughout the season and driving every car on the grid, if a radical idea from motorsport governing body the FIA is adopted.

The controversial rule is one of the proposals put together by the FIA and sent to the F1 team bosses. Along with the weight handicap system, it is likely to come in for ferocious criticism when discussed at this weekend's Japanese Grand Prix.

FIA president Max Mosley spoke of the idea at a ceremony in Bahrain yesterday (Tuesday), where construction on an F1 circuit is about to start.

"There is a large number of very radical proposals that have been circulated to the teams for discussion," he told the Daily Telegraph. "Some of these are very speculative ideas and we have to talk to the teams about them, but we mustn't sit there and not talk about things."

"There is an argument for each driver driving each car once. This has an advantage because then we would see who are the best drivers and teams and if there are means to make it more interesting for the public then we have to talk about them."

The proposal will be discussed at the next F1 Commission meeting on October 28.



What on earth is going on? There is absolutely no chance that anything like this could ever be contemplated. This is so absurd that it isn't even a mediational ploy (as somebody elsewhere on the BB suggested that the ballast idea was).

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#2 baddog

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 08:57

someones making shit up now

Shaun

#3 100cc

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:02

good shit though.


What should be done though is have the last race of the season be a triple-pointer, and have ferrari supply all 19 cars....michael gets to try the minardi. :rolleyes:

#4 Draco

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:03

They must've read the "how would Yoong go in a Ferrari" thread.;)

I can't see it happening, or how anyone could make it work in practice, but I rather like the idea. A whole helluva lot better than the ballast handicap one, anyway.

#5 Nustang70

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:07

http://www.crash.net...76&language_id=

admittedly, it would be interesting to see...but what a dumb idea. it could never happen. this one is even more radical than the weight-penalty idea.

#6 Clone

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:09

Yeah right. :lol:

Next we'll be racing on ovals.

#7 flyer72

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:20

How about giving Yoong a Ferrari and MS a Minardi????

#8 nicholasc

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:21

engage brain BEFORE mouth.
I think Max needs a couple of the Renault launch control technicians to do some work on his systems.

nick

#9 HSJ

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:31

Max! :clap: :clap: :love: :love: :kiss:

Yeah, right.

#10 Earthling

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:32

I dont doubt anymore that Max needs to get some serious help!
:eek:

#11 tinman

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:34

I don't understand these people. They've been in the business long enough and I do believe they know the recipe for success and yet. . . .


Max & Bernie seems to be losing the plot nowadays. Entering their second childhood phase perhaps? :drunk: :stoned:

#12 Oscar Jack

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:44

Originally posted by 100cc
good shit though.


What should be done though is have the last race of the season be a triple-pointer, and have ferrari supply all 19 cars....michael gets to try the minardi. :rolleyes:


:rotfl: :kiss:

:wave: :wave: :wave: :wave:

Love it!! I think Max and Bernie are deliberately being controversial so as to keep up the media attention. They know perfectly well that these proposals are utter BS and are having a good laugh at us all speculating about them, talking, BB'ing etc. Which is to say, achieving exactly their objectives of keeping us all watching the races.

Ah well.
Do you like feeling manipulated? :( :mad:

#13 PTTM

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:45

:lol:

So in their desperation the FIA really cleaned out the long forgotten "Suggestion box". And look what they found.

What more ideas can we expect?
Teams that win 2 races in a row get only 8 points for their second win? And 6 for their third win etc.

Anyone got more brilliant ideas? (prepare to be contacted by the headhunters of the FIA :) )

#14 Oscar Jack

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:49

Just a minute....
I thought this topic started with the heading "Are Max and Bernie sharing needles?"
Or was I dreaming :eek:

#15 Wolbo

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:55

Some very out-of-the-box thinking going on here. There is often a thin line between brilliancy and lunacy and I'm not sure on which side of the line this latest proposal falls but I'm inclined to say it's brilliant (but unrealistic).

The biggest practical problem would be who owns, pays, hires and fires the drivers? I'm sure Ferrari is not going to pay Schumacher 50M USD if he spends 90% of the races in cars that are not red.

#16 Viktor

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 09:57

What team want to pay over $100 milion to get a car that is better then the rest just to let other drivers then there drive the car?? I have always respected Max and not talked bad about him like most others but now I cant understand way I have been so blind :down:
Please leve Forumla One as it is, it will even out in 2004!

/Viktor

#17 Tomecek

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:00

Originally posted by Max Mosley
Mosley's idea on driver swapping

It sounds good :) Really, I would love see it :smoking: :up:

#18 wiligates

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:04

I think Max and Bernie must be pulling everyones leg .First we had the weight penalty idea now this ! Absurd .

#19 JForce

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:05

Originally posted by Tomecek

It sounds good :) Really, I would love see it :smoking: :up:


You've got to be joking.

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#20 VAR1016

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:07

So the idea is that each team will have to build sufficient chassis to accomodate the various sizes of driver?

Perhaps in order to save money, all teams will build instead, large chassis and be provided with a special FIA cushion to take up the slack when a small driver is installed?

What a load of bollocks.

PdeRL

#21 Baviaan

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:08

Mosley is a nutter. Completely out of his mind. No team will ever agree on this! :lol:

#22 mikedeering

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:11

I suggested this idea on the BB yesterday! Wow, step forward mikedeering, president-elect of the FIA.

Actually, my idea involved drivers drawing lots at each race, so a driver didn't necessarily always have a differnet car - it was down to the laws of chance. And my suggestion was rather tongue-in-cheek, unlike Max's...

#23 Nikolas Garth

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:12

I know it is a common negotiating tactic to make an unreasonable demand in the hope that the other party will end up agreeing to what you originally wanted, but this is too crazy for words.

#24 clipper

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:12

it sounds more and more like bernie and max came up with these ideas while smoking a bowl in amsterdam :smoking:

#25 Tomecek

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:20

Originally posted by JForce


You've got to be joking.

Well, maybe, but if you will have a look only on this, then you have to reckon it would be really really interesting ;) I really like it :smoking:

#26 Clone

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:20

Perhaps the greatest irony of it all (assuming some stupendous rule change takes place) is that those who have been making a huge deal out of Ferrari and the 'boring' aspects are probably responsible for such a massive shift in the ethos of the sport.

I'm just totally surprised that the suggestions coming through have nothing to do with grooved tyres or limited aerodynamics. In my opinion, the way the sport is, is great, except for the 'dirty air' problem cars encounter through corners. Surely that's the thing to fix, instead of Ferrari's dominance or Yoong's sudden improvement in form. :lol:

#27 Robbie

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:32

Of course the plan is an absurdity -- but were it to be forced through Premier GP (or whatever they intend to call it) would be a certainty.

And what would become of the most glorious element of F1, the paydriver? Would he have to pay 10 teams? :cool:

Here €ddi€, :cat: €ddi€ :cat: do you like the sound of this one too?

#28 CaptnMark

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:32

I proposed the same thing some time ago in this thread:

http://www.atlasf1.c...&threadid=42130

It makes sense if we want the drivers championship to really mean anything (no team orders) without having a spec series.

#29 100cc

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:35

Originally posted by Oscar Jack
Just a minute....
I thought this topic started with the heading "Are Max and Bernie sharing needles?"
Or was I dreaming :eek:


you must be sharing those needles too.  ;)

nah, topic merged and name changed to clarify.

#30 agarcia

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:36

Max to his daughter:

- Honey, what was the name of that German fella who's driving Bernie and me crazy??

Max's daughter:

- Alzheimer, Daddy, Alzheimer...



Max and Bernie must have gone nuts... Regards

#31 DOHC

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:43

The idea is interesting in theory, but in practice?

I think it only shows that both Max and Bernie are now getting desperate about what to do.

#32 MJP

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 10:45

Before we commence seat/car fitting to driver's individual physical characteristics, maybe we ought to begin with counseling BE and MM to take a hike and retire before this "youthful thinking" just sinks next to anchor also the whole boat.

I think the only people more disgusted then fans will be the whole engineering staff listening to 22 different drivers in 17 races. How the hek that adds up? Bernie, that's a riot... :rotfl:

Would they actually pay MS to drive Minardi $1 or 2 Mill/race? I would like to see Luca's face footing Michael's paycheck, while he is knocking his Ferrari with Minardi minnow. Or would be that Minardi would pay, and then you get "what you pay for" in return? :stoned:

#33 MattPete

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:39

Originally posted by baddog
someones making shit up now

Shaun


I dunno. This is the same idiot [Mosley] who thought grooved tires would be a great idea.

#34 lumepo03

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:43

A couple of questions.

1) Who would pay the salaries?
2) Who would do the testing?
3) What about contracts with Sponsors? How would a Shell sponsored driver
be able to drive a BP or TFE sponsored car?
4)Is there not a rule that says you can only change drivers X amount of times in a season?
5) What about paying drivers? If a Minardi driver paid Minardi for the drive how does that payment get divided to the other team/s?
6) How is this going to get more viewers to watch? Is the FIA moving away from sport events and into SITCOM COMEDIES?
7) Maybe we should leave F1 alone and switch Max and switch him to the OFF position.

#35 lumepo03

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:47

And finally.

8) Wouldn't we need to have 20 races so that each driver spent an equal amount of time racing each car?

#36 ensign14

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:47

I guess Tomas Enge's demonstration at the FIA hearing of how he REALLY had dope in his bloodstream was a little too successful...

More seriously, I think this is just joshing with the media. They've had F1 in the headlines for 2 days now when the title was decided yonks back.

#37 Viss1

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:47

Congrats, Max. This is officially the worst idea I've heard yet.

#38 hedges

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:48

I don't think it will come in for criticism. If I ran a team I wouldn't be able to stop laughing long enough to criticise it. Frankly this just makes F1s governing body look stupid. It is just so utterly pointless, there are no words to describe how pointless it is.

#39 The Kanisteri

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 11:53

TheKanisteri suggest Bernie and Max should stop using any weeds or just let non-screwloose fellows to take care future of Formula-one racing.

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#40 The Sensational

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:07

Any changes will just make the sport absolute shit and ruin the history of F1.

What they need to do is just remove driver aid and some aerodynamics, and put some stricter rules for engine manufacturers.

#41 FrankB

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:15

Or an alternative would be to put all the drivers in the same cars - let's have one design - all car's maintained by on organisation. Then we'll need a new name - what about Formula Audi Palmer?

#42 Mosquito

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:16

What can I say except......


Have they gone totally mad???!!!

:mad:

BTW, did anyone lookup the definition of 'April fool's day' in the FIA regulations by any change? :

I'm not even going to waste a thought on this regarding pros and cons, etc.... :rolleyes:

#43 Mosquito

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:16

Originally posted by FrankB
Or an alternative would be to put all the drivers in the same cars - let's have one design - all car's maintained by on organisation. Then we'll need a new name - what about Formula Audi Palmer?

The 'Formula One cup series'? No thank you...

#44 RV_Canada

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:17

This brings whole new meaning to the term "F1 circus".

On second thought, perhaps they could juggle or tame lions for the championship.

#45 Get Sirius

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:28

Originally posted by Clone
Next we'll be racing on ovals.


"We"?

One little slip of words, and your avatar suddenly makes sence. Rubens, is that you?

;)

But one comment on topic.

Strawmen, strawmen, strawmen aaallllll over the place. It's gonna be interesting to see EB's and MM's _real_ suggestion. Then everybody will go like: Hey, that's a good idea (better than enything you recently have suggested, anyway), let's have a go with it (before you have a fits again). Regrettably!



#46 Al.

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:40

Originally posted by FrankB
Or an alternative would be to put all the drivers in the same cars - let's have one design - all car's maintained by on organisation. Then we'll need a new name - what about Formula Audi Palmer?

I think you've just described the Premier 1 Series that has gone all quiet ( the one all the big Euro Football teams were going to support).

#47 AndreasF1

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:47

I for one would like the idea of having a driver swap. I always wanted to see how Michael would destroy DC if he was to drive a McLaren and DC the Ferrari. I am open to the idea and I think that we shouldn't judge it because it hasnt even been tried yet. I think its gonna give everybody an equal chance and we would see exciting racing for sure! And thats what I want. Hey, and if it doesnt work out, we can always go back to the old system.

#48 Get Sirius

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 12:49

Originally posted by FrankB
Or an alternative would be to put all the drivers in the same cars...


First I read "in the same car" and had a mental image of a Formula One bus...

#49 FredF1

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 13:13

Originally posted by Get Sirius


First I read "in the same car" and had a mental image of a Formula One bus...


You mean like that flat bed truck they use for the drivers parade?

They can all have a punch up to see who gets to drive it - fittest driver wins.

Alternatively, the FIA can choreograph the results just like the WWF.

Hmmm, motor racing & wresting together?

F1 = NASCAR :eek:

#50 glorius&victorius

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Posted 09 October 2002 - 13:24

I say change the structure of F1!

Let the FIA make the following rules:

- engine builders can't be chassis builders.
- chassis builders can't be engine builders.
- engine OR chassis builders have to at least supply 3 teams
- engine OR chassis builders are not allowed to run their own team.
- engine OR chassis builders are free to setup the working structure between them and the
GP teams.
- Reduce wings, increase tires, bring back slicks


With this we'll have at least 3 teams of the same succesfull Chassis/Engine combination
going for the championship. Imagine Michael, Rubens, Kimi, Juan, DC, Ralf in equal
packages. It will come down to drivers and team performance, not on technology and windtunnels
and simulation etc!

We won't need the ballast! (which I once proposed...I know I got bashed many times for that).
We won't need driver swapping. We'll have pure racing again and driver against driver and
team management against team management (pitstops against pitstop).

Where will the technological pinnacle-ness of F1 go? Let the chassis builders fight for it.
Let the engine builders fight for it. In the end the best survives, we get the best racing, at
a cheaper price!!!


F1 is becoming to centralised now and too much owned by big players. In the end it will become like NASA competing against the Russian Space Agency!!!
Decentralise it:
Bring back
-chassis builders
-engine builders
-tire manufactures
-drivers
-teams

separate them by healthy competition enhancing rules, let them each focus on what they can do best, but they cannot be allowed to do all!!! Let the FIA do this and we've got a healthy series, good for us, good for F1. And we won't miss the tech challenge, there be plenty of it.