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Felday 4 FWD sportscar


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#1 Zagato

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 10:06

:drunk:
I am trying to find as much information on this car for a friend in France who hopes to produce a model. We know the car was tested by Jim Clark and we have a photograph of the car with Clark driving with numbers and Clarks name on it. This suggests he may have raced the car, if so where and when and with what result. Also the pictures we have are black and white, Anyone know the cars colour. Any pictures information towards this project would be gratefully received.
Thank you
Peter Radcliffe

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#2 Vitesse2

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 10:13

Clark raced the Felday once, in the Guards Trophy at Brands Hatch on August 29th 1966. He was first in his class in the first heat, but retired in the second heat.

#3 Pete Stowe

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 12:22

There’s a colour picture of the car being driven by Peter Westburyat the 1965 Boxing Day Brands meeting on the front cover of the February 1966 Motor Sport, which shows it to be a mid-blue colour ( possibly metallic :confused: ) & the 1966 Easter Monday Goodwood program lists the car as blue. So unless it was repainted between April & August.......

#4 ian senior

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 12:32

Don't know if it's of any help at all, but I'm about 99% certain that I saw this car competing in hillclimbs in the early 70s, and it was a nice darkish metallic blue colour.

#5 David Beard

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 12:41

The Felday was the subject of a puzzle car photo competition in Classic and Sportscar recently. perhaps Mick Walsh can elaborate?

The car was the subject of one of those cutaway drawings in Motoring News soon after it appeared, I definitely recall.

#6 2F-001

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 13:07

Not specifically about the sportscar, but a bit of Felday background I found...

In ''Motor Racing Team Colours and Markings'' (by John Baxter, pub. Model Aeronautical Press, 1967 - a book aimed at modellers) it says:

(quote)

Felday Engineering Limited
Forest Green, Dorking, Surrey

(b&W pic. of badge)

drivers:
Peter Westbury, Mac Daghorn.

cars:
Felday 4 (no. 4001); Felday 5 Ford 7-litre V8 sports car (no. 5001); Felday 6 Formula Libre (6001).

The company was formed in May 1963 during which year Peter Westbury drone Felday ''1'' (with supercharged Daimler SP250 engine), winning the British Hillclimb Championship. In 1964 he drove the 4WD Ferguson P99 to win the British Hillclimb Championship for the second time. An attempt was also made at the European Championship in a 2-litre BRM powered Lotus 23. There were no Felday cars being raced in the1965 season but Peter Westbury drove the works BRM 4WD car twice in Britain and once in Switzerland. On Boxing Day1965 Mac Daghorn drove Felday ''4'' to win the Formula Libre race, and Peter Westbury drove the same car into second place in the sports car event.

A full racing programme is planned for the 1966 season.

colours and markings:
Felday Blue - a specially mixed dark metallic shade - (not too helpful there - many other entries in the book provide ICI or other paint reference codes)
Wheels - alloy rims with gold painted spokes and chrome caps.

There is another Felday 6 owned by Tony Griffiths of Sutton Coldfield which is painted Racing Green.

(quote ends)

#7 Doug Nye

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 14:02

By coincidence I was talking with Peter Westbury just last week about - ahem - another matter. The Felday sports car was painted a handsome darkish mid-blue with very heavy metallic flake mixed in - the tone about midway between the pale and dark Cobra Daytona Coupe shades?

Jim drove the car very impressively at the Guards Trophy - until its V8 engine drank the last drop of available oil. During practice JC had apparently said to Peter - "It's going to take some learning, this one..." - whereupon the hillclimb specialist who was also test driver for Harry Ferguson Research on 4WD said "If you don't mind me offering some advice, up at Druid's Hairpin, just try getting back onto the power impossibly early...and see what happens...". Jimmy went out again and within a couple of laps was 3secs faster. He brought the car back into the pits grinning from ear to ear, saying "That's just incredible! It went round as if on rails then came out of the corner like a rocket..."

The car was sold and subsequently 'used up' in other projects but its bare bones - the robust monocque chassis - still survive in private hands today. I was press officer at the frosty Boxing Day Brands meeting at which the car was driven by Mag Daghorn - v. pleasant Channel Islander and a very good driver. He's still around too.

DCN

#8 Roger Clark

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 17:26

Originally posted by Doug Nye


Jim drove the car very impressively at the Guards Trophy - until its V8 engine drank the last drop of available oil. During practice JC had apparently said to Peter - "It's going to take some learning, this one..." - whereupon the hillclimb specialist who was also test driver for Harry Ferguson Research on 4WD said "If you don't mind me offering some advice, up at Druid's Hairpin, just try getting back onto the power impossibly early...and see what happens...". Jimmy went out again and within a couple of laps was 3secs faster. He brought the car back into the pits grinning from ear to ear, saying "That's just incredible! It went round as if on rails then came out of the corner like a rocket..."


and what impact did that have on subsequent Lotus cars?

#9 Bumblyari

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 18:13

And of course back in the 60s the car was the subject of one of the nicest 1/32nd slot cars ever produced (by MRRC).

4WD, steering, ball races the lot, and the driver's got a beard, at least mine has.

#10 David Beard

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 19:20

Originally posted by Doug Nye
By coincidence I was talking with Peter Westbury just last week about - ahem - another matter.
DCN



What is his memory like?

A week or so ago I was rummaging through some anorak junk...and came across something I just cannot resist producing at this juncture.

As a spotty teenaged oik in the mid sixties, I used to spend a lot of time imagining I was a car stylist and sending off my doodles to various people. When the cutaway drawing of the Felday 4wd sports car appeared in Motoring News I traced over it and converted it to a closed GT car..unusually, I somehow made a copy of my efforts. You can't really tell what I've based my creation on, but I have also still got the reply I received from Peter Westbury to prove it!

Posted Image

!Posted Image

#11 bill moffat

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 21:33

David..well for a spotty teenager I reckon it looks rather pretty. I would however suggest that you speak to your lawyer. Ford obviously became involved in some industrial espionage; your design re-emerged several years later as the GT 70..

#12 dmj

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Posted 16 December 2002 - 22:10

GT 70 was my first thought too but it also has a strong resemblance of (also much later) Ligier JS2.

#13 Zagato

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 10:15

Many thanks for all the info, It will be a great help in the project, I think the next stage is to try to contact Peter Westbury. I am also glad to see I was not the only school boy doodler!
Any pictures anyone might have would also be a great help.
Regards
Peter

#14 Doug Nye

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 13:39

Zagato - proper channels - try writing to Peter Westbury c/o British Racing Drivers' Club, Silverstone Circuit, Silverstone, Towcester, Northants NN12 8TN, England. They are very good at passing on correspondence to members.

#15 mickj

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Posted 18 December 2002 - 09:17

How far was Felday Engineering from Rob Walkers Racing Team.By their addresses they would have been close.

#16 BRG

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 12:14

Originally posted by mickj
How far was Felday Engineering from Rob Walkers Racing Team. By their addresses they would have been close.

Just south of Forest Green (maybe a mile or so) is the hamlet of Walliswood. There is a racing team based there - currently it is the Gruppe M team who race Porsches very successfully in the FIA GT championship. Certainly, GT cars have been run out of there for quite a few years. Was this site either Felday or Rob Walker?

#17 Wolf

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Posted 25 October 2005 - 12:34

Is this of any use?

http://www.vsrnonlin...C_V3N7_p328.jpg
http://www.vsrnonlin...C_V3N7_p329.jpg

#18 Allen Brown

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 08:59

I just spotted this which I thought might be helpful to someone looking up Feldays in the future.

Tony Griffiths advertised "Felday VI single seater March 1966 used hill-climbs, Ford 4.7" from Sutton Coldfield, Warks in Autosport 19 May 1967 p808.

#19 EDWARD FITZGERALD

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 10:12

if your friend is planning a 1/43 scale model please keep us posted

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#20 fuzzi

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 16:50

At the Nostalgia Film show yesterday I put my hand in a pocket of my jacket and pulled out a piece of paper I had been handed at the VSCC Spring Silverstone meeting.

We were walking around the paddock when we were stopped by this lady who asked us if we knew anything about Felday cars. We certainly did know a little and we all contributed something. Having captured our attention she handed us a flyer with a photo of Jim Clark in the Felday 4 on one side and this one the other:

"WANTED TRANSMISSION - FERGUSON GEARBOX INCORPORATING TRANSFER BOX FOR 4WD

"FELDAY 4 AND 5 WERE BUILT BY PETER WESTBURY UNDER HIS COMPANY NAME FELDAY ENGINEERING. BOTH WERE 4WD THE FELDAY 4 WITH THE MID MOUNTED FERGUSON GEARBOX DRIVING FOR[E] AND AFT WITH THE 5 THE LATER THINKING FERGUSON GEARBOX ON THE BACK OF THE ENGINE DRIVING THE REAR WHEELS AND IN TURN SENDING A SHAFT FORWARD TO DRIVE THE FRONT DIFFERENTIAL. ADVANCING TYRE COMPOUND TECHNOLOGY BEAT THE EXTRA WEIGHT AND COMPLEXITY OF THE SYSTEMS. BOTH CARS, WHICH I NOW OWN, WERE BROKEN UP IN 1971-1972 AND I AM STILL SEARCHING FOR THE FERGUSON CENTRAL MOUNTED GEARBOX SYSTEM FOR THE FELDAY 4. I AM CERTAIN THERE ARE ABOUT THREE SYSTEMS OUT THERE UNDER SOMEONE'S BENCH.

"AN AMERICAN MECHANIC (Rob Thurman) I BELIEVE TOOK THE COMPLETE SYSTEM HOME WITH HIM OUT OF THE FELDAY 4, TO THE USA IN APPROX 1973.

"DO YOU KNOW HIM? IS HE STILL ALIVE? DID HE USE IT? DO YOU KNOW ANY OF THESE ANSWERS?

"PLEASE HELP ME TO BRING ANOTHE RHISTORIC CAR BACK TO LIFE. IF YOU HAVE ANY INFORMATION PLEASE CONTACT ME:

"J. GRAHAM GALLIERS"

If you can help, please let me know and I will put you in touch.

Edited by fuzzi, 05 May 2013 - 16:53.


#21 Alan Cox

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 17:09

Sorry, Jeremy, but I can't put you in touch with Rob Thurman, but I thought I would post these details from Graham's website which may be of interest. It would be splendid if he were able to put these cars back into running order.
http://www.ggalliers...5felday5brm.htm
http://www.ggalliers...4felday4brm.htm

#22 Mistron

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 17:53

Many years ago I'm sure I sent Graham a scan of a cutaway of the Felday 4 and an article (from BRSCC 'Motor Racing' If I recall correctly) Both showed the 4WD components, just in case anyone recognises it, I'll try to dig out either the scans or the article.

I think I also sent him a lead on an FF Interceptor project I came across as a possible source of components to get the car running, but apparently (and I found very surprising, given it is a one off car) there was insuficient similarity to make this worthwhile

Al

#23 Mistron

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 18:04

Checking my emails, it seems I didn't scan, but sent copies of the following, if anyone has them available (goodness knows where my copies are)

"Motor Racing - the BRSCC mag - May '64 has an interview with Westbury and shows him in chassis and a shot of engine/rear diff
Motor - W/E March 27 '65 caried a full article on the car, with a lovely Hatton sectional drawing as well as a fairly full tech spec. and photos of the chassis. many components seem to be taken from BRM or Ferguson -i.e the 'sensing' unit and many are shared with the car Wizzo / Moss drove at Goodwood this year.

Rear Hubs are brabham, fronts are.... BMC ADO17 (Austin 1100!!!!)"



#24 sterling49

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Posted 05 May 2013 - 18:17

Clark raced the Felday once, in the Guards Trophy at Brands Hatch on August 29th 1966. He was first in his class in the first heat, but retired in the second heat.



I was at the race, the BRM engine was losing oil in the 2nd heat and Joim was Black flagged IIRC.

#25 Catalina Park

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 03:09

Rear Hubs are brabham, fronts are.... BMC ADO17 (Austin 1100!!!!)"[/i]

ADO17 is the 1800.
The 1100 is the ADO16.

#26 pete53

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 11:37

There is a feature on the Felday 5 in the October 1966 edition of Motor Racing which provides various technical details about the car. It was a shame that it didn't make its debut until what was the last ever Group 7 race in the UK - The Guards Trophy at Brands. It was mentioned in the article that the team were keen to do the Can Am series but only if sponsorship was forthcoming, which presumably it wasn't. Mac Daghorn was the driver, with Jim Clark, as already mentioned, taking the wheel of the "4" that Daghorn usually drove.

#27 Mistron

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 11:40

ADO17 is the 1800.
The 1100 is the ADO16.


Ah that makes sense - the 1800 was so much 'sportier'! :drunk:

#28 StanBarrett2

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 19:30

I have wondered for a long time about the Felday 4 front suspension layout.

The earliest photo I have seen (below), has two angled radiators in the nose and coil over dampers between the wishbones, as drawn by Brian Hatton in his cutaway.

This cutaway and photo is from a 1965 article out of Motor magazine.

The Bill Bennett cutaway (Motoring news 18-01-1966) shows a single slanted radiator, and the springs (operated by triangle shaped upper “rocker wishbones” ) lying horizontaly

above the front differential. The dampers are operated from the lower wishbone.

A photograph in MotorSport August 2014 accompanies Doug Nye’s “From the Archives” piece about the car’s racing history. This photograph ( of the remains of the car  

sold by Bonhams – Lot 306 ) clearly shows the car’s suspension in the Bill Bennett configuration.

Every descriptive piece I have read about the car, notes the horizontally mounted springs.

This would mean that there was a redesign sometime late 1965.

Does anyone have more info for me on this car, or can you refer me to a book or other magazines?

 

Bill Bennett’s cutaway from Motoring News of 18th January 1966.

B_Bennett_Felday_4_kopie.jpg

Brian Hatton’s rendering from Motor of 27th March 1965.

B_Hatton_Felday_Ferguson_4_WD.jpg

Photograph of chassis under construction  (photo is from internet and credited as being part of the

Motor magazine original article). The Brian Hatton cutaway is based on this build.

ss_l1601_kopie.jpg

 

macoran


Edited by StanBarrett2, 02 September 2016 - 19:32.


#29 bradbury west

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 21:28

Pete, is there any chance of a copy of the MR article on the Felday, please, to top p my Felday file ? I bought a job lot of 60 odd MR mags earlier in the year but they are mainly 1950s, good though that is, and only half a dozen in the 60s.

Many thanks

Roger Lund



#30 group7

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Posted 03 September 2016 - 04:11

Roger & pete53, I think the article on the Felday was in the October '67 Motor Racing. there is a thread on "Autodiva" out of France titled "Peter Westbury et les Felday" where two pages from the article are reproduced. there are also a couple of pictures of the car sans bodywork driven I think by John McCartney at Prescott and one other venue in 1968. these are Mike Hayward photos. I cannot do a link because one has to subscribe to see them. if you can't access the site pm me and I can pull the images and send them to you.

 

Michael Scott



#31 Mistron

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Posted 03 September 2016 - 11:46

There was  a copy of the MR issue on Ebay the other week - I know 'cause I was sending  copy of various articles I have on the cars to Hepworth International who have the car (it's currently for sale, along with the 5) and I had given them to Graham Galliers, but they'd not received them with the car.

 

Lots of period and detail photos of the car can be found in the Bonhams on-line catalogue from Goodwood when they sold it last year

 

Al 



#32 pete53

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Posted 03 September 2016 - 13:48

Pete, is there any chance of a copy of the MR article on the Felday, please, to top p my Felday file ? I bought a job lot of 60 odd MR mags earlier in the year but they are mainly 1950s, good though that is, and only half a dozen in the 60s.

Many thanks

Roger Lund

Roger I don't have a scanner, but I could do a photocopy and send on if that's any use to you? Just to clarify, the article I have is on the Felday 5 7 litre car not the Felday 4.