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Alfetta identification : have you seen this pic before?


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#1 Felix Muelas

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Posted 14 January 2003 - 22:30

Whilst browsing through an otherwise excellent book in Spanish I found this picture erroneously identified as the Attilio Marinoni´s experimental Alfa 158. I say erroneously because I understand that this picture published in David Venables´ "First Among Champions" IS the Marinoni Alfa.

So now I have this picture with a wrong caption and I was wondering if it might be the remains of either Emilio Villoresi´s acccident at Monza OR Giordano Aldrighetti´s at Pescara. Not having seen any images of neither of the cars , the lack of numbering might tempt me to prefer Monza to Pescara, but this is pure speculation.

I am assuming that this picture, with that number 03672 , might be known by someone out there...is that the case?

Thanks for your help. ;)

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#2 Marcor

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Posted 14 January 2003 - 23:28

Sorry I've never seen the picture. Just one thought. It was maybe not the result of a fatal crash.

About he death of Aldrighetti, Venables (The Racing 1500) said: "Aldrighetti crashed his car outside Spoltore village in practice (of the 1939 Coppa Acerbo at Pescara). The unfortunate driver was trapped when the car overturned into a ditch and caught fire, and by the time he was released he had suffered burns from which he succombed soon after."

#3 jarama

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 01:11

Félix,

according to the book "Ricart - Pegaso / La pasión del Automóvil", this is Emilio Villoresi's car after his fatal crash at Monza, as you've guessed.

Quote: "La fotografía del vehículo accidentado que se reproduce, corresponde al Alfa Romeo 158 en el que Emilio Villoresi perdió la vida durante unos ensayos en el autódromo de Monza el 19 de junio de 1939 y que habitualmente se ha identificado como el '158 Experimental' de Marinoni, que se incendió después de su accidente, resultando virtualmente destruido."

Carles.

#4 Felix Muelas

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 08:23

Carles,

Muchas gracias! ;) Actually your answer solves all the aspects related to the picture, starting from its correct identification and finishing by the (curious) comment that acknowledges that it might be "usual" :eek: to confuse this picture with the Marinoni one, whilst at the same time explaining why one should not  ;)

un abrazo

Felix

#5 LittleChris

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 12:44

Strange, because the road markings on the picture would lead one to believe this is a public road circuit eg Pescara rather than an autodrome.
I also thought that Villoresi crashed at Lesmo which at the time would have been fairly heavily wooded but this doesn't appear to be the case here.
I'm not saying this isn't Monza, just that it doesn't look like it !

#6 Vitesse2

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 14:39

Originally posted by LittleChris
Strange, because the road markings on the picture would lead one to believe this is a public road circuit eg Pescara rather than an autodrome.
I also thought that Villoresi crashed at Lesmo which at the time would have been fairly heavily wooded but this doesn't appear to be the case here.
I'm not saying this isn't Monza, just that it doesn't look like it !


Chris - you and Carles are talking at cross purposes :) He is confirming that the picture in post 1 of the thread, with no background, is the remains of Villoresi's car. The burning car is Marinoni's, which hit a truck on the Milan-Varese autostrada.

#7 Patrick Italiano

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 14:50

I confirm I had seen that pic before, both WRONGLY captioned as Marinoni's and, otherwise identified as Villoresi's.

About Marinoni's, on page 129 of Borgeson's Alfa Romeo Tradition, a second pic allows to see the experimental De Dion axle fitted to it, as well as the truck it had crashed into. So, the burned car is undoubtly Marinoni's.

The number 03672 should be the Alfa archive number.

#8 Felix Muelas

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 14:52

LittleChris :

I see that my English is confusing you, my apologies.
The picture that is visible shows no road signs, and that is the one I was trying to locate.
The picture that you have to click to see is deemed to be the Marinoni car, hence the road signs (a public road).
Is it clearer now? ;)

Felix

#9 Felix Muelas

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 14:55

Thanks Richard and Patrick ;)
Obviously I hadn´t read your reespective messages...
fm

#10 LittleChris

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 15:52

Aha, now I understand. Where I was confused was that the picture on Felix' first post either didn't appear or was very slow loading so I assumed he was referring to the link. Thanks for sorting out my confusion everyone.

#11 Doug Nye

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Posted 15 January 2003 - 23:05

I don't recall ever having seen any details of the sequence of Villoresi's fatal accident in the Alfetta - from the look of the wreckage he must plainly have hit a tree with enormous force, or have pitch-poled the car end over end, subjecting the nose to some truly shattering impact. Has anyone absorbed proper detail concerning the sequence of the accident?????

Oh - and incidentally since today has seen Max Mosley taking the knife to Formula 1 technology, isn't it interesting that nostalgia-period racing conditions now gain favour as the perceived salvation of Formula 1????

(Yes, I know - perhaps this should be another thread - or it's not for TNF at all. Sorry pardon - but remember I exist in the hymn book - being interested in both Ancient & Modern)

DCN

#12 Leif Snellman

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Posted 16 January 2003 - 06:14

Originally posted by Felix Muelas
I was wondering if it might be the remains of either Emilio Villoresi´s acccident at Monza OR Giordano Aldrighetti´s at Pescara.

Felix, as I understand it the unlike the car on the picture the Aldrighetti car was destroyed by fire. (Sorry, I now see that Marcor seems to have mentioned that fact already). Anyway, does there exist any pictures of the Aldrighetti crash?