1030 replies to this topic

[Barry Boor]

I know this really has no place on a racing forum but it IS a little bit nostalgic and I know there are a few people who may be a slightly interested. And anyway, where else will you see 35 mid-1950's F.1 cars altogether?



Apologies to all.

[Mike Argetsinger]

I can't think of a better place Barry! The cars are gorgeous. Thanks for posting the picture.

[Eric McLoughlin]

No need to apologise Barry. Any chance of naming the cars and drivers?

[917]

Is this the starting grid of the Grand Prix of Gibraltar?

Seriously: the picture is great and I know no place where it would fit better.

Kind regards
Michael

[petefenelon]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
I know this really has no place on a racing forum but it IS a little bit nostalgic and I know there are a few people who may be a slightly interested. And anyway, where else will you see 35 mid-1950's F.1 cars altogether?


Apologies to all.

None needed Barry....

There are a lot of those "bloody red cars" there though! At least there's some idiosyncratic French weirdness to blaance it out!

pete

[Felix Muelas]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
...I know this really has no place on a racing forum...

What are you talking about? After the years it has taken us to agree on the basics...;)

Thanks for posting that gorgeous family...

[Paul Medici]

Outstanding work Barry, and what did you say you do in your spare time?;)

[Felix Muelas]

Originally posted by 917
Is this the starting grid of the Grand Prix of Gibraltar?

Michael,

Can´t think of a more appropriate place for an "historic" meeting ;)

[Rob G]

Fantastic! Yes, please, identify the drivers shown!

[Roger Clark]

I can tell you for certain that Barry's cars go as well as they look. He has written the story of these historic series at http://website.lineo...boor/index.html and included the results of the races as they are completed. It is probably the most interesting current racing championship..

In the true spirit of TNF quizzes, shouldn't we identify the cars and drivers?

[Don Capps]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
I know this really has no place on a racing forum....

Barry,

Since when have we ever let that minor detail get in the way of anything interesting or a good discussion?

[2F-001]

That's a beautiful sight, Barry - and like the other posters (I imagine) I can think of few places it would be more welcome or more appreciated!

BTW - do you have something against odd numbers?

[jarama]

Barry,

nice collection.

Carles.

[bobbo]

Barry:

Absolutely PERFECT for this forum!!

The only thing that would look better would be the same line-up, buw with the REAL CARS instead.

Keep up the good work!

Oh, yeah. Will there be more in the future??

Bobbo

[dretceterini]

I assume they are 1/43rd scale...

[TODave2]

Eau Rouge looks a bit easy... Naples looks a total nightmare

[Barry Boor]

I assume they are 1/43rd scale...

No, they are all 1/32nd scale slot racing cars. And as Roger says, they all go.

As for who and what..... I'll list them if you wish, or you can sort them out for yourselves.

[ensign14]

I see that no. 62 is a DNA...

[Pedro 917]

Just love your old rubbish......

Luc

[TODave2]

This should get the 'tsk, the youth of today' comments coming in:

What's that stripey red number 64 in the back row? I like the colour scheme - a bit like Starsky & Hutch go F1 racing

[Barry Boor]

In answer to the last question, I must defend myself against pickers!

Please don't be too picky about this. It is only a hobby and as such I use an extremely large slice of 'artistic licence' in the cars I add to the series.

Broadly, this set is supposed to be based around 1954-5-6; and it is, BUT, with a certain amount of flexibility at either end of those years.

I wanted to include a few Ferrari 500s, which, of course, were F.2 cars in 1952 and 53. However, some were re-engined with 2.5 litre units for the new F.1 in 1954. So I looked to see who had raced privately entered 500s and included them in the set, even though they may not have actually taken part in F.1 after 1953.

The main case in point is #64, which as many will spot is the Swiss colours on Rudi Fischer's car.
#58 is Louis Rosier; #66 is the Belgian car, that was driven by both Johnny Claes and Jacques Swaters and #70 is Giorgio Scarlatti.

As a simple rule, as long as a driver drove that particular type of car at some time during thise years, I consider it acceptable for him to drive that car in my series.

[Vitesse2]

Originally posted by ensign14
I see that no. 62 is a DNA...

Nah, it's Ottorino Volonterio. He wasn't quick enough to get in the picture .....

[Vincenzo Lancia]

wauw..... and there's a Bugatti ...

How fast do they go?.....I mean...in reality, not scale-mph, or the originals...?

[Martin Roessler]

wonderful collection barry!!!! And like the others said...a good forum to place the pic....

I'm a big modelcar fan so i was happy to find that in here...hmmm...i think i've got an idea ;)

PS: what brand are the cars?

[marion5drsn]

Barry Boor; that is some fine work! It certainly shows the difference in area of the cars. Yours, M.L. Anderson

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
#66 is the Belgian car, that was driven by both Johnny Claes and Jacques Swaters

At the risk of being "too picky", the Belgian car was raced in 1954 by Swaters and Laurent, and in its F2 days before that by the same pair plus de Tornaco (and once Tom Cole). But never IIRC by Claes

[Frank S]

If you are a serious collector (not restricted to models) you may want to consider writing about it for a collection now in assembly. No pay, but apparently a genuine and scholarly project. Lengthy Call For Proposal follows.

Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 18:58:10 -0700
From: "Susan Koppelman"
Subject: Invitation to write about your collections/collecting

Well, first there was the book thing and then there was the shoe thing (or the other way around) and now there is:

"My mother collects things from coffins. Then she gives them to me."

So, here's this for you:

Susan Koppelman and Alison Franks are editing four books on collectors, collecting, collections, collectibles and all that is peripheral to collecting (agents, curators, patrons, copyright, economics, gallery owners, heirs, docents, venues, etc.).

We are interested in almost everything coming under the collecting heading: your personal collection; public collections (fine art, books, spittoons); particular collectors or collectors' agents (museum people, artists, your mother); the history of collecting; the philosophy or psychology of collecting; the politics of collecting; collecting and gender, race and ethnicity, class, disabililty/ability, sexual orientation; the curating of collections; the business and economics of collecting. I have probably left many interesting headings out of the list, so please don't feel limited to the ones mentioned. In fact, if you think of any aspects of collecting missing from this recitation, we would really like your suggestions.

We will be publishing with the University Press of Kentucky which does good work in the area of material culture.

We want the submissions as soon as possible, although we will continue to read until our fourth book goes to press. Of course articles received sooner rather than later will have more influence on the shaping of the book(s). We can only work with what we actually receive.

Here are the practical matters for planning and writing the essays. We prefer "regular" article length (about 20-25 pages including endnotes); however, we are delighted with shorter submissions (and have already accepted two nine page essays and one two page essay) and will consider longer ones. We have negotiated with the press for a total of five illustrations per article, but we ask that you not include any that are not truly integral to what you have to say. The press has concerns about the expense of color illustrations, so, unless we can find a subvention for color, try to use color material that will look good in black and white as well.

As authors, you will be responsible for any needed permissions for using quotes and visuals but you don't need to secure these permissions before sending in your essays. In your initial submissions to us, please (if you use citations at all) use whichever citation format you like best. Before we go to press, we will provide all writers with style sheets reflecting the final decision and ask you to readjust your copy. Endnotes are preferable to footnotes, to us and to most publishers. We will also let you know later on about disk format (don't worry about it now, during your inspired writing), since we will certainly need the final versions, once it is time for press, on disk.

We ask that you keep in mind that these books are intended for a very broad audience, including but not limited to academics from a broad spectrum of intellectual disciplines. Considering the variety of possible audiences, please do eschew jargon and write in accessible and graceful prose rather than ponderous portentous boring obscure academese.

Bearing all the above palaver in mind, please send your ideas/abstracts/indication of your interest via email to Susan at and/or Alison ASAP.

Eventually we will ask for two hard copies of your essay, one to each of us at the addresses below. Photocopies of visuals are fine for now. Please, when you do, include a SASE in one of the envelopes so that we can send back a copy with questions, notes, etc. on it.

Susan Koppelman
4375 East Coronado Ridge Lane
Tucson, AZ 85739

Alison Franks
4000 Aspen Avenue, NE
Albuquerque, NM 87110




Susan Koppelman

[TODave2]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
In answer to the last question, I must defend myself against pickers!

I absolutedly was not picking! I'm mighty impressed. It was a geniune query, I assure you

[fines]

Jus' wonderful...

[Barry Boor]

bobbo asked:

Oh, yeah. Will there be more in the future??

Er..... well, actually..... er..... there are these,

[David Beard]

Originally posted by Rob G
Fantastic! Yes, please, identify the drivers shown!

Well I can Archie there in Connaught number 46.....

[Bladrian]

Gorgeous!


Now please excuse me whilst I slink away to hide my piss-poor-pathetic display of 1/32nd Fly and Ninco slots .....

[David Beard]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
bobbo asked:


Er..... well, actually..... er..... there are these,

Lotus 16 Number 32 interests me...the only photos I have seen of David Piper's car in those one off colours (Goodwood 30/03/59) are side views. Did you have a plan view or did you sort of interpret what you saw from the side?

It was number 15 that day...but you have a numbering system just for your races I guess?

[Barry Boor]

David, the number on the Piper car is actually 52. I number the cars once, at the beginning of the 'season' and keep the same numbers throughout all the races I run with the cars. (Changing them every race would be time consuming and expensive.)

As for the colour scheme of that '16', I took it from page 16 of 'Theme Lotus' by some chap called Nye. The caption is interesting since it states that the colours were "sage green and white though David insists today they were actually blue and white."

I would have gone for the regular Piper green, but just fancied having another blue car so I took David at his word!

In answer to a question about my having something against odd numbers...... Yes, I do! Seriously though, back in the fifties there were virtually as many races run using even numbers only as there were using all numbers.

For me it is mainly an economic thing. On any sheet of transfers you only get a limited quantity of each number. If you use all the numbers the '2' always runs out very very quickly. (You always get a lot of '1's on a sheet because they are narrow!)

Sticking to even numbers means that 3, 5, and even sometimes 7 get used where with the other system, they don't.

Having said all that, my next series 1961-2, is planned to be number from 1 to 30, or thereabouts.

[Barry Boor]

Seeing that no-one seems to be bothered about identification of the older car series, I'll list them.

[list=1]
2 - J. M. Fangio -- Mercedes Benz W.196
4 - S. Moss -- Mercedes Benz W.196
6 - K. Kling -- Mercedes Benz W.196
8 - H. Herrmann -- Mercedes Benz W.196
10 - P. Collins -- Owen Organization Maserati 250.F
12 - F. Gonzales -- Ferrari 555
14 - M. Hawthorn -- Ferrari 555
16 - A. de Portago -- Ferrari 555
18 _____________ -- Ferrari 555 (originally yellow - P. Frere, now red driven variously by N. Farina and M. Trintignant
20 - C. A. S. Brooks -- B.R.M P.25
22 - - R. Flockhart -- B.R.M P.25 (has been driven by Collins)
24 - S. Moss -- Private Maserati 250.F (has been driven by L. Macklin & M. Hawthorn)
26 - A. Ascari -- Lancia D.50
28 - L. Villoresi -- Lancia D.50
30 - E. Castellotti -- Lancia D.50
32 - J. Behra -- Maserati 250.F V.12
34 - L. Musso -- Maserati 250.F V.12
36 - R. Mieres -- Maserati 250.F (also driven by H. Schell)
38 - C. Menditeguy -- Maserati 250.F (also driven by J. M. Fangio, C. Perdisa & H. Schell)
40 - H. Schell -- Vanwall
42 - K. Wharton -- Vanwall (has also been driven by S. Moss)
44 - J. Fairman -- Connaught B-type (has also been driven by C.A.S Brooks & L. Leston)
46 - A. Scott-Brown -- Connaught B-type
48 - S. Lewis-Evans -- Connaught C-type (toothpaste tube)
50 - A. Pillette -- Gordini 32
52 - R. Manzon -- Gordini 16
54 - G. Pollet -- Gordini 16 (has also been driven by N. da Silva Ramos)
56 - E. Bayol -- Gordini 16 (has also been driven by M. Sparken & J. Behra)
58 - L. Rosier -- Private Ferrari 500/625
60 - M. Trintignant -- Bugatti
64 - R. Fischer -- Private Ferrari 500/625
66 - J. Swaters -- Equipe National Belge Ferrari 500/625
68 - R. Salvadori -- Gilby Engineering Maserati 250.F
70 - G. Scarlatti -- Private Ferrari 500/625
72 - M. Gregory -- Scuderia Centro Sud Maserati 250.F
[/list=1]

In the way of things during the 1950s (and later) not every car went to every race. Hence the variation of drivers in some cars. When Mercedes do not race, Moss usually drives his own Maserati (although I put him in a Vanwall at Goodwood recently, while Hawthorn drove the Moss Maserati), while Schell often drives a works Maserati when Vanwall do not race.

I do not follow any original entry lists but try to work fairly logically regarding who would race where. E.g. for a race in Italy, few British teams go (I ran 2 Connaughts at Syracuse but with no success this time, I'm afraid!); while a race at Goodwood had no Italian teams, although Gordini turned up!

My next race in this series is at Zandvoort and the entry is a whopping 28 cars!

[Ray Bell]

Barry... you have some nice dreams...

But tell me, does your wife have nightmares?

Brilliant stuff.

[Barry Boor]

The Pre-historic Bari Grand Prix is about to get under way.

Here is the grid, with Hawthorn on pole.



Apologies for the relatively poor image quality. If I didn't J-peg it down it would take longer to load than the race will take to run!

[Ray Bell]

No air cooled cars?

And do you ever include the DB just for the sake of variety?

[Macca]

And what about an Arzani-Volpini?

Love you collections, look forward to '61-'62.

[Macca]

And then of course there is Black Jack's Bobtail Cooper with a Bristol engine, Aintree 1955.

Great work Barry, how do you make the bodies?

I shall now skulk back into my little lair with my pathetic collection of Matchbox Lotus 25's and BRM P261's painted up to look like (part of) the fields from 1964-1966.

[Barry Boor]

Macca, for info, check your P.M list.

[David M. Kane]

Wow! How many man hours do you estimate you have in this project? Amazing
work, thanks for sharing your passion.

[Barry Boor]

My pile of rubbish just got bigger. Compared with the image in the first post of this silly thread, the picture below carries 7 more cars, plus some repaints:

Added; 2 Cooper T.43s; 2 more Connaughts (1 Walker, 1 Works), Private Maseratis for Halford, Bonnier and Rosier. The Owen Maserati has passed to Bira and Centro-Sud's car has been sprayed white and blue.



There is a further new works 250.F to come soon (more renumbering required - dammit!) and I have a second Merc streamliner which I may or may not use. I have the option to put Fangio back in an open-wheeler, which I will do for Aintree.

Am I barking or what??????

BTW, in answer to David's last question - not as much as you may think. I try to spend around an hour or maybe up to 2 each day doing something, but when I am running a race, they normally take about 6 hours to complete, plus another three or so for practice etc, but generally I do that over 3 or even 4 days.

[fines]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
There is a further new works 250.F to come soon

What chassis number will it have? Oh, wait, just post a pic and let Barrie or Don do the guessing...

[fines]

Sorry, of course David will join in as well...

[Ray Bell]

Any chance of trying a short wheelbase W196 streamliner? I'd love to know how one of them went...

[Barry Boor]

I am now embarking on my new slot-race series which I call The Halfton Series.

The cars are from 1961 & 62.

Here are the first 3 cars completed and ready to go...

[petefenelon]

Originally posted by Barry Boor
I am now embarking on my new slot-race series which I call The Halfton Series.

The cars are from 1961 & 62.

Here are the first 3 cars completed and ready to go...

Awww, now they're beautiful! Going to do both 65 and 120 degree cars? And any chance of an Aiden-Cooper?

pete

[Barry Boor]

Going to do both 65 and 120 degree cars?

Sorry, Pete, just the 120 degre-ers.

But please, what is an Aiden Cooper?????

[petefenelon]

Originally posted by Barry Boor

Sorry, Pete, just the 120 degre-ers.

But please, what is an Aiden Cooper?????

A very pretty but utterly uncompetitive rebodied Cooper-based special from Hugh Aiden-Jones... In its original form it had a needle-nose and side rads - looked rather like an early-seventies F2 or F3, then when that didn't work the rad moved to the nose and it looked like a Cooper with vaguely wedgy bodywork. Looked years ahead of its time ('62), unfortunately performed years behind it. It was basically an FJunior chassis with an old F2-spec FPF - and despite the lovely bodywork it went exactly as the description would suggest

http://8w.forix.com/aiden.html has a picture of the car in its second incarnation. DCN's Autocourse History of the GP Car 45-65 has a pic of it in its original form (p170) and it's a stunner.... Alas what looks right isn't necessarily right ;)


pete