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#1 Mac Lark

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 00:56

Can someone tell me when national anthems were first played after a race for the winning driver and team.

And what about the unilateral post race interviews?

Thanks

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#2 Double Apex

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 01:11

Wilhelmus van Nassouwe
Ben ick van Duytschen bloet,
Den Vaderlant getrouwe
Blyf ick tot in den doot:
Een Prince van Oraengien
Ben ick vrij onverveert,
Den Coninck van Hispaengien
Heb ick altijt gheeert.

Mijn Schilt ende betrouwen
Sijt ghy, o Godt mijn Heer,
Op u soo wil ick bouwen
Verlaet mij nimmermeer:
Dat ick doch vroom mach blijven
V dienaer taller stondt,
Die Tyranny verdrijven,
Die my mijn hert doorwondt.





All you need to know...;)

#3 Mac Lark

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 02:11

Is a national anthem that has never been played after a Grand Prix?

#4 Rob29

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 06:57

Anthems that HAVE been played;
UK
Brazil
Germany
Argentina
France
Austria
Australia
Finland
Italy
USA
Canada
South Africa
Colombia
New Zealand
Switzerland
Belgium
Sweden
Mexico

To find the first you would have to go back before the World Championship started.Before TV or radio existed to record it!

#5 ensign14

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 08:07

Had Rikki von Opel ever won a GP, would they have played both the Liechtenstein (for him) and British (for Ensign/Brabham) anthems? I only ask because the tune for both is the same...

Anthems must have been played in the 1930s, given the story that Nuvolari presented a copy of the Italiana anthem to be played after he won the German GP and the organizers had been sure of a German win. Whether they played the anthem for the driver and team, I have no idea.

#6 VAR1016

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 09:09

Yes, Raymond Mays describes how he won in the E.R.A. at the Nurburgring in 1935 (after a battle with Richrd Seaman: "A uniformed Nazi official of high rank placed a laurel wreath round my neck and the band played 'God save the King'."

PdeRL

#7 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 09:31

The Irish national anthem (Amhrainn na Fiann - The Song of the Fianna) has been played a few times - for Jordan GP and one, in error, for Eddie Irvine (who is British). If Ralf Firman ever wins (ha ha) it might get played again.

#8 Blackjack

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 09:51

Eric, a minor correction:
The Irish National Anthem has only been played twice, (first time in France and second time in Monza, both during 1999) although Jordan has won 4 times.
At the first win for Jordan in Belgium 1998, no anthem was played for the constructors as the organisers had no copy of the music.
At the Brazilian Grand Prix, Raikonnen was declared the winner, which was corrected at the following race. I don't know if the anthem was played at the correcting ceremony.
As regards Eddie Irvine and the National Anthem, that was in Argentina when he came second (no anthem) but the Irish Flag was raised instead of the Union jack.

#9 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 10:12

I did say "few" - I didn't want to commit to numbers as I wasn't sure. Point taken on the faux pas over Eddie Irvine and the Irish flag. My point was to ensure that the Irish Anthem was included in the list of anthems played as it had been omitted.

By the way, the UK flag is properly called The Union Flag rather than the Union Jack.

#10 Tim Murray

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 10:22

In Cyril Posthumus' biography of Henry Segrave, it says, following his win in the 1923 French GP:

"Then out rang 'God Save the King' for the first time ever in the greatest of Grands Prix . . "

I would assume that the playing of the winner's national anthem has been standard practice since the earliest days.

#11 Blackjack

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 10:23

point taken on the Union flag.
If I wanted to be picky I could point out that Amhrán na bhFiann actually translates to "A Soldier's Song" but I think it's more important to clarify that it was played, which as you point out had been omitted in Rob29's post.

#12 Pilla

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 11:03

Originally posted by Blackjack
Eric, a minor correction:
The Irish National Anthem has only been played twice, (first time in France and second time in Monza, both during 1999) although Jordan has won 4 times.
At the first win for Jordan in Belgium 1998, no anthem was played for the constructors as the organisers had no copy of the music.
At the Brazilian Grand Prix, Raikonnen was declared the winner, which was corrected at the following race. I don't know if the anthem was played at the correcting ceremony.
As regards Eddie Irvine and the National Anthem, that was in Argentina when he came second (no anthem) but the Irish Flag was raised instead of the Union jack.


This surprises me surely the organisers would have a copy of the national anthem from all the countries participating, just incase a brazil happens.

#13 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 11:17

The common translation of the Irish anthem is "The Soldier's Song". However, Fiann is not the Irish word for Soldier. The Fiann were an ancient mythical band of warriors. The correct Irish word for Soldier is Coisinteoir (the spelling is probably incorrect - after 27 years of non use my Gaelic is very ropey)..

#14 Blackjack

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 11:35

I think we're going a little off the point, so I'll hold my fire.

#15 mmoore97

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 12:42

What year did they change the playing time of the anthems? It seems that only a year or two ago they played only 60 to 90 seconds of any anthem, and then abruptly cut it off in midstream. I always thought that was more than just a bit insulting. Don't they pretty much play anthems in their entirety these days??

#16 Rob29

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 12:49

Sorry,my list was of countries that have a driver or team that has won a WCGP.I have no way of proving that anthems were played. I fail to see how Jordan is an Irish team as its based in England. Nearest to an Irish win was Sarah Kavanagh winning the F3000 class of a EuroBOSS at Mondello Park!

#17 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 14:00

Although Jordan's technical base is Silverstone, it is registered with the FIA as an Irish team.

Since when did geographical locality have any meaning in F1?

#18 petefenelon

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 14:52

Originally posted by ensign14
Had Rikki von Opel ever won a GP, would they have played both the Liechtenstein (for him) and British (for Ensign/Brabham) anthems? I only ask because the tune for both is the same...



Before the start of Le Mans they play the national anthems of all the countries supplying drivers. This year the Italian anthem crept in twice -- does someone share (one of the many!) tunes that it uses, or was it just a cockup?

#19 David Beard

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 15:01

Originally posted by petefenelon



Before the start of Le Mans they play the national anthems of all the countries supplying drivers. This year the Italian anthem crept in twice -- does someone share (one of the many!) tunes that it uses, or was it just a cockup?


No one would complain so long as a certain German driver doesn't pretend to conduct... :lol:

I would be quite happy if no national anthems were played at all actually, but then I'm a bit odd.

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#20 petefenelon

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 19:18

Originally posted by David Beard


No one would complain so long as a certain German driver doesn't pretend to conduct... :lol:

I would be quite happy if no national anthems were played at all actually, but then I'm a bit odd.


I'm something of an anarchist and definitely no monarchist; the only time I ever sing God Save The Queen is the annual us-vs-the Frogs "who can sing the loudest" contest before the off at Le Mans! :)

#21 Mac Lark

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 20:12

Fabulous stuff

What about the post race TV interview

When did that start?

#22 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 21:29

Mid 90s?

#23 Vitesse2

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Posted 10 August 2003 - 21:41

Originally posted by Eric McLoughlin
Mid 90s?


Earlier than that, Eric. But the Beeb never showed them live, only on their highlights programme: the first time I saw one live was when I got Eurosport in 1994. I'd guess it was one of Bernie's early-80s innovations.

#24 Geza Sury

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 07:03

The mandatory post race interviews started in the early 90s. AFAIK it was the Hungarian television which inaugurated it, when they interviewed Nigel Mansell immediately after his famous 1989 win at the Hungaroring. Second placed Ayrton Senna was also present, but the third participant was not Thierry Boutsen, who had finished third, but Alain Prost, who had just missed the podium. (I must add, IIRC :lol: ) The World Championship was very tight at that time, and when Senna (or was it Mansell?) was asked, who did he think the World Champion would be, he answered: "Someone in red overalls" :D

Initially the person who made the interviews was from the local TV station, but now we have the same person in every race.

#25 Ralliart

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 16:54

:smoking: I believe that national anthems have no place at sporting events (nor musical events, for that matter). All that cornball nonsense that goes on before the Indy 500 (and, at the recent Brickyard 400) and the anthems before and after races. What accompanies these anthems and all is, of course, politicians who, by my way of thinking, have no place at all. Not at ball games throwing out the first pitch and not at auto races handing out trophies. It's not as if the racers and teams are doing it for Old Glory (no matter what nation) - the racers do it for themselves (and to keep their position on the team) and it's not as if the teams/drivers have, as their beneficiaries, nations. There is no connection. If politicians want to attend a GP and glad hand it with the aces, have them buy a pit pass like everyone else but keep them off the podium and keep their nations' anthems "off the air". Politics and racing doesn't and shouldn't mix.

#26 VAR1016

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 18:11

Originally posted by Ralliart
:smoking: Politics and racing doesn't and shouldn't mix.


I agree with this.

However, I, being an Englishman am fortunate in that our national anthem has nothing to do with politics.

Read Sir Henry Birkin's "Full Throttle" (an the introduction by the Earl howe) for an exposition of my very old-fashioned views.

PdeRL

#27 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 18:29

This has been debated at least once before on TNF. For those of us from small countries whose anthems get rarely played, certainly as far as victory celebrations are concerned, it can be quite moving to hear the anthem and see the flag go up. I can understand Germans and Brits getting a bit fed up hearing their anthems especially as they seem to get played virtually every GP week-end.

#28 Bladrian

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 18:30

At the South African GP, in 1967, there was a bit of consternation after the race, which Pedro Rodriguez won - there wasn't a copy of the Mexican National Anthem to be found. An enterprising soul did produce a record of "South of the Border (down Mexico way)", which was duly played ..... :rotfl:

#29 paulhooft

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 19:12

I was very moved when the played
God Save the Queen at the Dutch Grand Prix at Zandvoort 1967..
But my Favourite is:
Land of Hope and Glory by Vera Lynn
its such a great piece of music...
Still I hope..
Someday Great Britain will go for the Better???
Paul

#30 Kerb Bouncer

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 19:21

National anthems are a funny thing, at baseball games, they play the national anthems of the teams--Star Spangled Banner , or O Canada for Toronto and Montreal. I don't know what the national anthem is for the Dominican Republic, but all the Dominicans on all the teams would probably love to hear it once in a US or Canadian ball park. :D

An enterprising soul did produce a record of "South of the Border (down Mexico way)", which was duly played .....



When Honda had its own F1 team, did the Japanese anthem get played at its wins?

#31 ensign14

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 19:42

Originally posted by Kerb Bouncer
I don't know what the national anthem is for the Dominican Republic...

Here ya go.

Just think, had Moss not turned up at Sebring in the OSCA in 54 (?), Rubirosa would have had it played for him...

#32 VAR1016

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 19:52

Originally posted by paulhooft
I was very moved when the played
God Save the Queen at the Dutch Grand Prix at Zandvoort 1967..
But my Favourite is:
Land of Hope and Glory by Vera Lynn
its such a great piece of music...
Still I hope..
Someday Great Britain will go for the Better???
Paul


Hmm, quite a good idea, but the words are as "politically incorrect" as those of my preferred choice: "Rule Britannia"!!



PdeRL

#33 petefenelon

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 20:55

Originally posted by paulhooft
I was very moved when the played
God Save the Queen at the Dutch Grand Prix at Zandvoort 1967..
But my Favourite is:
Land of Hope and Glory by Vera Lynn
its such a great piece of music...
Still I hope..
Someday Great Britain will go for the Better???
Paul


As an English anarcho-atheist - all I can say is:

Bring me my Bow of burning gold;
Bring me my Arrows of desire;
Bring me my Spear: O clouds, unfold:
Bring me my Chariot of Fire!
I will not cease from Mental Fight,
Nor shall my sword sleep in my hand:
Till we have built Jerusalem
In England’s green and pleasant land


Now there's an anthem worth having!

#34 Kerb Bouncer

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 21:26

Terribly off topic I know:

As an English anarcho-atheist



Well, I would like This Land Is Your Land as the national anthem here, but I sing O Canada when I go to see the Expos play the Pittsburgh Pirates.

From Woody Guthrie's answer to God Bless America :

I saw sign there, said Private Property,
But on the other side, it didn't say nothing
That side was made for you and me.

Thanks Ensign ! Was that the anthem under Trujillo? It isn't bad at all.

#35 VAR1016

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 22:16

Originally posted by petefenelon


As an English anarcho-atheist - all I can say is:



Now there's an anthem worth having!


Of course! Jerusalem - William Blake - an excellent suggestion

PdeRL

#36 Ray Bell

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 23:05

Oh bring on Farrer Fenton!

#37 Pilla

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Posted 11 August 2003 - 23:36

Everyone in New Zealand complains at how boring our national anthem is, I dont have any problems with it, its no worse than anyone else.

#38 gdecarli

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Posted 12 August 2003 - 03:06

Originally posted by Pilla
This surprises me surely the organisers would have a copy of the national anthem from all the countries participating, just incase a brazil happens.

Now I understand the real reason why they declare Raikkonen as winners, even if it was quite obvious that the winner should have been Fisichella :lol:

Originally posted by Eric McLoughlin
Although Jordan's technical base is Silverstone, it is registered with the FIA as an Irish team.

Same as Benetton: after 1996 is was registred as an Italian team, so I think (but I'm not sure about it) that when Berger won Germany 1997, they should have played "Inno di Mameli" (Mameli's anathem). Now I'm quite sure Renault is a French team :) but its factory is still the same, located at Enston, England :eek:

Originally posted by mmoore97
It seems that only a year or two ago they played only 60 to 90 seconds of any anthem, and then abruptly cut it off in midstream. I always thought that was more than just a bit insulting. Don't they pretty much play anthems in their entirety these days??

I agree. As usual also in many Italian events, Italian is still not played complete, they miss the introduction. You can listen the complete one as background MIDI on this page
By the way, I like to hear national anathems, even if I don't like ours (we have much better music!).
I don't see them as a politic message but only as a "acoustic national flag". If you look carefully at words, some anathems are quite terrible and surely ours is one of them! :eek: (click here for the complete Italian words and partial English translation; untranslated section is much worse!)

Ciao,
Guido

#39 Mac Lark

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Posted 21 December 2004 - 06:16

Originally posted by ensign14
Had Rikki von Opel ever won a GP, would they have played both the Liechtenstein (for him) and British (for Ensign/Brabham) anthems? I only ask because the tune for both is the same...

Anthems must have been played in the 1930s, given the story that Nuvolari presented a copy of the Italiana anthem to be played after he won the German GP and the organizers had been sure of a German win. Whether they played the anthem for the driver and team, I have no idea.


Was that 1935?

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#40 Jimmy Piget

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Posted 21 December 2004 - 21:59

Originally posted by petefenelon
As an English anarcho-atheist


Hi Pete ! Nor god nor master nor border !
Countries are small, the world is wide.
And I add : no more anthem, just only rock 'n roll !

#41 lustigson

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Posted 21 December 2004 - 22:14

Originally posted by Double Apex
Wilhelmus van Nassouwe

A bit of an old version, DA, but nevertheless the most important one.;)