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The Cup of Peace and Friendship


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#451 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 24 November 2009 - 19:59

:up: !!!

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#452 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 24 November 2009 - 20:16

1986 Hungaroring

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from memory:
Vaclav Lim 21 leading,
Jan Vesely in a red RAF is just behind him(and almost out of picture), Jiri Moskal 24 in a Metalex 1-06,
Uli Melkus in #81 MT-77, Jiri Vesely in #23 RAF, Jerzy Mazur in #3 Melalex 1-06,
then my memory fades and I can tell only Poles:
#9 Andrzej Wojciechowski, #1 Tomasz Sikora (in two types of Promot) and #5 Jacek Szmidt in Metalex 1-06.

Great photo!

Edited by GrzegorzChyla, 24 November 2009 - 20:17.


#453 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 24 November 2009 - 20:55

Wojciechowski and Sikora seem to be driving the cars of the same type, the only difference between them being the absence/presence of the sidepods.

#454 sat

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 06:21

51 Laszló Oroslan RAF
52 István Tarró MTX1-06
54 Matiás Szigetvári MTX?
90 Heinz Siegert MT77-1
29 Jiří Mičánek SRG
112 Corneliu Biribi Dacia

#455 RobertS

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 09:36

51 Laszló Oroslan RAF
54 Matiás Szigetvári MTX?

The authentic Hungarian version of their names >
51 László Oroszlán
54 Mátyás Szigetvári

52 - István Tarró MTX1-06 & 3 - Jerzy Mazur MTX 1-06
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Interesting the different bodys on the same MTX 1-06 chassis >

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("ferdi" = "RobertS" - somehow I could not use my old reg.)

+ some seldom seen details from MTX workshop in 1976

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Edited by RobertS, 25 November 2009 - 18:23.


#456 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 14:38

("ferdi" = "RobertS" - somehow I could not use my old reg.)

Welcome back! :wave:

If you have the high-resolution version of your first photograph from Hungaroring '86, could you please tell me the number of the obscure yellow car in the background? This must be a Romanian driver, I guess...

#457 RobertS

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 15:52

If you have the high-resolution version of your first photograph from Hungaroring '86, could you please tell me the number of the obscure yellow car in the background? This must be a Romanian driver, I guess...

no.58
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58 -
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Hungarian car.
Unfortunately I do not have start-list or results from 1986.
Csaba Kesjár run with no.58 in 1982...


#458 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 17:36

This is the RAF 79, or else Kovács KH 02 - Arpad Kurcz perhaps?

Edited by Alexey Rogachev, 25 November 2009 - 17:37.


#459 RobertS

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 18:15

This is the RAF 79, or else Kovács KH 02 - Arpad Kurcz perhaps?

Árpád Kurcz run with no.59 in 1986.


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#460 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 18:38

Let's be scientific and apply the elimination method :) Ray Purucker's web site says seven Hungarian drivers had taken part in the race: http://www.puru.de/pff86.html#P3. We can see László Oroszlán, Mátyás Szigetvári, and István Tarró on your photo. Also I suppose that the red RAF 80 behind Mazur's MTX is Zsoltán Stiller (no. 53) - I have the photo of it, taken in Riga in 1988. László Kalmandi-Pap, Frigyos Turán and Árpád Kurcz are left. According to the results table, Kalmandi-Pap and Turán were driving the MTX. So I think it was Kurcz who was at the wheel of the RAF 79.

#461 RobertS

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 19:13

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Árpád Kurcz was the co-driver of the Hungarian Rallye Champion > László Ranga.
Their hometown was city Pécs, their team - Pannon Volán.
You can read on the front of the car no.59 > " Pannon Volán Pécs "

My problem >
On no.58 the front sticker is " Pannon Volán " too >

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and on the rear wing > " Ranga-Service "... :drunk:

Edited by RobertS, 25 November 2009 - 20:01.


#462 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 19:17

I acknowledge my defeat... :blush:

#463 RobertS

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 19:20

I acknowledge my defeat... :blush:

I edited my previous post.
I am completely confused now...
I think you were right first, car-type determinates > no.58 is probably Árpád Kurcz

Edited by RobertS, 25 November 2009 - 19:32.


#464 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 19:57

In 1988, the driver who had no. 59 was László Harkányi. Unfortunately I don't have any photos of his car...

#465 ziepars

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 20:35

Some "new" pictures from CPF 1988 in Riga here:
Racinghistory.lv
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Edited by ziepars, 08 November 2010 - 21:58.


#466 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 25 November 2009 - 22:00

Wojciechowski and Sikora seem to be driving the cars of the same type, the only difference between them being the absence/presence of the sidepods.

no, they were different types.
Wojciechowski is in a Promot II, last year of production, Sikora is in Promot III.

Promot II are wedge shaped, Promot III are cigar shaped.
Promots II were modified for last year of production - they had a wide based rollbar, and front shock absorbers hidden inside body.
Perhaps inside Promot IIa (unofficial name) was more like Promot III.

As for MTX 1-06:
Mazur's was heavily modified by owner, while Tarro's is MTX 1-06cx (as build by Dlouhy/Vorel/Dobrota trio - info from Velebny's book)

#467 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 26 November 2009 - 19:39

Well, since you are a big specialist in this question, I wouldn't argue :) On Robert's photo, however, Wojciechowski's and Sikora's cars look very similar. Couldn't the Promot III body panels be installed on the Promot II frame?

#468 ziepars

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 18:52

Some pics from 1969 CPF event 2 at Borovaja:
Racinghistory.lv
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Edited by ziepars, 14 December 2009 - 18:11.


#469 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 10 December 2009 - 21:35

Well, since you are a big specialist in this question, I wouldn't argue :) On Robert's photo, however, Wojciechowski's and Sikora's cars look very similar. Couldn't the Promot III body panels be installed on the Promot II frame?

They were definitely different looking cars
This is Wojciechowski in Promot IIa:
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And this is Sikora in Promot III:
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Here is a photo of a Promot II to show how the body looked:
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Here is a short summary:
Promot II: narrow roll-bar, front shock absorbers visible
Promot IIa (Wojciechowski in 1986): same body panels as Promot II, but wide based roll-bar, with one support, front shock absorbers hidden
Promot III (Sikora in 1986): new body panels, wide based roll-bar with TWO rear supports, front shock absorbers hidden.

Wojciechowski indeed raced a Promot III but in 1987.

Hope this clears all your doubts.

Grzegorz

#470 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 04:31

Indeed it has done :)

#471 RobertS

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 17:21

1986 - Hungaroring

Can you help me with the driver's names ?

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#472 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 11 December 2009 - 17:57

94 - Klaus Gohlke, East Germany; 26 - Rudolf Machánek, Czechoslovakia (both Lada 2105's).

Edited by Alexey Rogachev, 11 December 2009 - 18:03.


#473 Alexander M

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Posted 19 January 2010 - 12:45

I have found a couple of 2007 articles about Boncho Dunev's career in the web with a number of photos of his VMGI-01.

Article 1
Article 2

Edited by Alexander M, 19 January 2010 - 13:54.


#474 Alexander M

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Posted 21 January 2010 - 15:48

Here is a pictue of Laurentiu Moldovan from Romania with his Formula Easter (judging by the text on its nose it is called LGM 1). I think it wouldn't be a crime to suppose a Dacia engine for it? The source is an article in the Internet.

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#475 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 21 January 2010 - 18:12

What year is it from? Seems to be a copy of the Estonia 19 with the Estonia 20 sidepods...

#476 Alexander M

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Posted 21 January 2010 - 18:27

Maybe somewhere around 1981, because until 1979 he raced touring cars, at least in Romanian national events, while in 1981 he has become a Romanian champion in Formula Easter class.
(Source)


#477 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 21 January 2010 - 18:50

For all this is a Romanian car I think it had the Lada engine - the common unit for F. Easter in that period.

#478 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 09:15

Delving recently into my CPF photo collection – which is, unlike the photo archive of national Soviet events, still not classified and cataloguized – I discovered that the CPF rounds in Riga in 1984-1988 have the very good photo coverage from a number of sources. So as not to keep it for nothing (I really don't know when I start investigating into the CPF history in earnest), I have decided to post some of these photographs here. To begin with, here is an illustrated list of almost all the participants of the 1984 Riga CPF round. The full race results can be found on my web site: http://www.ussr-auto.../1984fscc3.html.

F. Easter

2 – Józef Kiełbania, Poland, MTX 1-06
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3 – Jerzy Mazur, Poland, MTX 1-06
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4 – Tomasz Jeromin, Poland, Promot 78
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21 – Jiří Červa, Czechoslovakia, MTX 1-06
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22 – Jan Veselý, Czechoslovakia, RAF 80
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23 – Jiří Mičánek, Czechoslovakia, MTX 1-06B
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24 – Jiří Veselý, Czechoslovakia, RAF 80
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56 – Zoltán Stiller, Hungary, MTX 1-06 (his car seems to be a strongly modified MTX 1-06 but I concede that it may be a completely original Hungarian single-seater)
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57 – István Tárró, Hungary, MTX 1-06 (Tárró's car, like also Oroszlán's one, was the MTX chassis with the self-built streamlined body)
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58 – Csaba Kesjár, Hungary, MTX 1-06
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59 – László Oroszlán, Hungary, MTX 1-06
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60 – Raimonds Gudriķis, USSR, Estonia 20
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64 – Toivo Asmer, USSR, Estonia 21M
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71 – Edgard Lindgren, USSR, Estonia-MADI 03
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72 – Toomas Napa, USSR, Estonia 21M
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75 – Ivars Krūmiņš, USSR, Estonia 20
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77 – Alexandr Ponomarev, USSR, Estonia 20
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78 – Viktor Kozankov, USSR, Estonia 20
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79 – Alexandr Medvedchenko, USSR, Estonia 20
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81 – Ulrich Melkus, East Germany, SRG MT77
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82 – Heiner Lindner, East Germany, SRG MT77
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93 – Bernd Kasper, East Germany, SRG MT77
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96 – Manfred Günther, East Germany, SRG MT77
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#479 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 09:21

Group A2

22 – Vlastimil Tomášek, Czechoslovakia, Lada 21011
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23 – Petr Samohýl, Czechoslovakia, Škoda 130L
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27 – Oldřich Vaníček, Czechoslovakia, Lada 21011
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28 – Zdeněk Němec, Czechoslovakia, Lada 21011
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41 – Lyubomir Peshev, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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42 – Georgy Geradzhiev, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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43 – Georgy Peterneychev, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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44 – Ivan Ivanov, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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46 – Rumen Davidkov, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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53 – László Harkányi, Hungary, Lada 21011
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55 – András Gergely, Hungary, Lada 21011
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62 – Jaan Tedre, USSR, Lada 2105 (no photo)

64 – Alexey Grigoriev, USSR, Lada 21011
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66 – Yury Serov, USSR, Lada 2105
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70 – Sergey Dadvani, USSR, Lada 21011
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72 – Yury Katsay, USSR, Lada 2105
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73 – Mikhail Gorbachev, USSR, Lada 21011
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78 – Vladimir Egorov, USSR, Lada 2105
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87 – Wolfgang Krug, East Germany, Lada 21011
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95 – Hans-Jürgen Käppler, East Germany, Lada 21011
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97 – Klaus-Peter Schachtschneider, East Germany, Lada 21011
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99 – Dietmar Isensee, East Germany, Lada 21011
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101 – Nicu Grigoras, Romania, Dacia 1300
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102 – Stefan Jancovic, Romania, Dacia 1300
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103 – Victor Nicoara, Romania, Dacia 1300
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108 – Werner Hirschvogel, Romania, Dacia 1300
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Unfortunately these two didn't take part in the race… :-)
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#480 arttidesco

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 09:48

Wow! I just been reading through this thread and I am amazed at how much racing went on behind the 'Iron Curtain' thanks to everyone who has contributed :-)

Some where I have a picture of a single seater on the back of trailer in the middle of 'East' Berlin taken in the winter of 1987 - 1988 I'll dig it out and maybe after twenty years I'll finally find out what it is :-)

Edited by arttidesco, 11 May 2010 - 09:48.


#481 Quixotic

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 01:42

I love this thread.... :clap:

I especially like the Estonia 21M It looks like an early Lotus Ground Effect car.

How much would it cost to buy one of these cars today?

Regards,

Quixotic


#482 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 04:52

Not too much, I believe. This is not a rarity - there were 295 21M's and 21.10's produced and several tens of them are now in former Soviet republics as well as in Poland and Germany.

#483 Quixotic

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 05:20

Not too much, I believe. This is not a rarity - there were 295 21M's and 21.10's produced and several tens of them are now in former Soviet republics as well as in Poland and Germany.



Do they still get raced? How much do you think one would be worth?

#484 Vitesse2

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 08:26

Are you guys aware of a website called Lost Bulgaria?

I can't seem to link directly to the pictures, but just follow this link and click on sport:

http://translate.goo...ostbulgaria.com

Starts with a few modern pics, but then goes on to feature a BMW driver called Dimitar Sokolov, who would seem to have been the Bulgarian Petre Cristea (if you see what I mean!). Some pre-War rally pictures and then some post-War dirt oval racing.
There are also some interesting car pictures in the transport gallery, including a couple of motor show pictures of the Bulgarian-built Alpine.

#485 arttidesco

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 09:46

Are you guys aware of a website called Lost Bulgaria?

I can't seem to link directly to the pictures, but just follow this link and click on sport:

http://translate.goo...ostbulgaria.com

Starts with a few modern pics, but then goes on to feature a BMW driver called Dimitar Sokolov, who would seem to have been the Bulgarian Petre Cristea (if you see what I mean!). Some pre-War rally pictures and then some post-War dirt oval racing.
There are also some interesting car pictures in the transport gallery, including a couple of motor show pictures of the Bulgarian-built Alpine.


Excellent find thanks for sharing Vitesse2.

Dimitar Sokolov certainly seems to have been 'The Man' in Bulgaria, looks he got his money's worth out of his BMW 319 (Sold under licence as a Fraser Nash BMW in the UK).

I wonder if the Bulgaralpine's were as cherished as their Renault Alpine A110 cousins, if so there must still be some about.

#486 Vitesse2

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 10:05

I think you'll find that's a BMW 315 :wave:

#487 arttidesco

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 10:17

You maybe right Vitesse2 I think I need some definitive pics of the two models :-)

#488 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 20:37

Do they still get raced?


there is a HAIGO series in Germany.

And on May 29-30 there is a demo on Poznan track (Poland) - I don't know how many cars will there be (I am affraid not many since it is first historic formula event in Poland...)

Mid september there is planned a historic race in Riga (Latvia)

#489 Quixotic

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Posted 12 May 2010 - 23:34

When did the Estonia race cars move to a full Alloy monocoque set up?

Does any one have close up photos of the Estonia 21 through to the Estonia 23 cars.

I am quite interested in finding out more information about them. I believe the Chassis were built in the same factories that manufactured the Hip 8 helicopters.

Regards,

Quixotic

#490 arttidesco

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 01:34

Was trying to find an answer to the TARK question post #489 when I stumbled across this incredible selection of pictures of racing in the Soviet Union plus dip into the Soviet Car Dump and you will find a nebulous Russian adorning what looks like a 1970 World Cup Rally Moskvich ! Sorry can't get you any closer the the Moskvich you'll have to scroll down :-)

Now back to finding out about Tark monocoques ! :-)

Edited by arttidesco, 13 May 2010 - 01:45.


#491 arttidesco

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 01:44

According to the great dustbin of all knowledge wikipedia the 1985 Estonia 24 featured 'Aluminium monocock chassis was used and Lada 1600 engine was equipped with fuel injection and electronic ignition. 4 made'. But I am far from an expert in these matters much less even remotely local :-)

PS I left the WIKI spelling mistake in :-)

#492 Allen Brown

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 10:47

According to the great dustbin of all knowledge wikipedia the 1985 Estonia 24 featured 'Aluminium monocock chassis was used and Lada 1600 engine was equipped with fuel injection and electronic ignition. 4 made'. But I am far from an expert in these matters much less even remotely local :-)

PS I left the WIKI spelling mistake in :-)

Isn't monocock the only option available? If there is an upgrade, nobody mentioned it to me.

#493 Vitesse2

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 11:02

Isn't monocock the only option available? If there is an upgrade, nobody mentioned it to me.

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

Actually, there is apparently an upgrade available, but you need to switch off Google Image Safe Search first ...

#494 Terry Walker

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 11:04

Or be one of those reptiles which have a spare . . .

#495 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 14 May 2010 - 17:31

Do they still get raced? How much do you think one would be worth?

5,000...10,000 euros approximately, depending on a state of a car and an availability of spare parts. There are fully repaired 21.10's, able to take part in real racing (like HAIGO series), and there are 'exhibition' cars - only for festivals. The former are, of course, more expensive.

#496 Quixotic

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Posted 15 May 2010 - 10:37

5,000...10,000 euros approximately, depending on a state of a car and an availability of spare parts. There are fully repaired 21.10's, able to take part in real racing (like HAIGO series), and there are 'exhibition' cars - only for festivals. The former are, of course, more expensive.




10,000 euros huh......... that sounds very reasonable. I'm guessing that the Estonias were the best car of their era? What other monocoque cars were there in runninbg at the same time?


#497 GrzegorzChyla

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Posted 15 May 2010 - 18:08

295 21M's and 21.10's produced

What other monocoque cars were there in runninbg at the same time?


Estonia 21 was tubular space frame (with exception of one monocoque prototype). Unfortunately it was outlawed from competition because drivers feet are ahead of front axle...

Monocoque version is Estonia 25. It had a tubular frame version also, and the one Estonia 25 I know of is tubular - it's owner choose it because it is possible to repair it after an accident.

BTW: great set of photos, Alexey!

#498 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 15 May 2010 - 18:22

To be more exact, there were 18 monocoque E25 and 48 tubular frame E25.20 made in 1990-1994.

BTW: great set of photos, Alexey!

I'm going to post a similar photo set from the 1985 Riga CPF race the next week. Stay tuned! :)

Edited by Alexey Rogachev, 15 May 2010 - 18:23.


#499 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 19 May 2010 - 16:32

The promised illustrated list of the 1985 Riga CPF round participants. As usual, the full race results are on my web site: http://www.ussr-auto.../1985fscc3.html.

F. Easter

2 – Józef Kiełbania, Poland, MTX 1-06
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3 – Jerzy Mazur, Poland, MTX 1-06
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7 – Mariusz Podkalicki, Poland, Promot 78
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10 – Stefan Banaszak, Poland, Promot 78
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21 – Jiří Mičánek, Czechoslovakia, MTX 1-06B
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22 – Jan Veselý, Czechoslovakia, RAF 80
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23 – Jiří Veselý, Czechoslovakia, RAF 80
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25 – Jiří Červa, Czechoslovakia, MTX 1-06B
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41 – Raycho Sergiev, Bulgaria, MTX 1-06
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44 – Stefan Kazakov, Bulgaria, MTX 1-06
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47 – Stamo Iliev, Bulgaria, MTX 1-03 (?)
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50 – Csaba Kesjár, Hungary, MTX 1-06
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51 – László Oroszlán, Hungary, MTX 1-06
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53 – Zoltán Stiller, Hungary, MTX 1-06
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60 – Raimonds Gudriķis, USSR, Estonia 20
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64 – Toivo Asmer, USSR, Estonia 21M
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67 – Valdas Jonušis, USSR, Estonia 20
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68 – Viktor Kozankov, USSR, Estonia 20
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71 – Urmas Põld, USSR, Estonia 21M
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72 – Toomas Napa, USSR, Estonia 21M
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75 – Ivars Krūmiņš, USSR, Estonia 20
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77 – Alexandr Ponomarev, USSR, Estonia 20
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79 – Alexandr Medvedchenko, USSR, Estonia 20
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81 – Ulrich Melkus, East Germany, SRG MT77
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86 – Wolfgang Wöhner, East Germany, SRG MT77
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93 – Bernd Kasper, East Germany, SRG MT77
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96 – Manfred Günther, East Germany, SRG MT77
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#500 Alexey Rogachev

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Posted 19 May 2010 - 16:34

Group A2

8 – Henryk Mandera, Poland, Lada 21011
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21 – Vlastimil Tomášek, Czechoslovakia, Lada 21011
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26 – Petr Samohýl, Czechoslovakia, Škoda 130L
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27 – Josef Studenič, Czechoslovakia, Lada 21011
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30 – Oldřich Vaníček, Czechoslovakia, Lada 21011
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41 – Lyubomir Peshev, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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42 – Georgy Geradzhiev, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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43 – Georgy Peterneychev, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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44 – Ivan Ivanov, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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45 – Valentin Antov, Bulgaria, Lada 21011
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55 – András Gergely, Hungary, Lada 21011
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56 – László Harkányi, Hungary, Lada 21011
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64 – Alexey Grigoriev, USSR, Lada 21011
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66 – Yury Serov, USSR, Lada 2105
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72 – Yury Katsay, USSR, Lada 2105
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74 – Mikhail Tarakanov, USSR, Lada 21011
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75 – Rolands Dūda, USSR, Lada 21011
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77 – Guntars Judeiks, USSR, Lada 21011
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78 – Vladimir Egorov, USSR, Lada 2105 (no photo)

79 – Vladimir Krivosheev, USSR, Lada 21011
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91 – Gerhard Hahnel, East Germany, Lada 21011
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96 – Sieghard Sonntag, East Germany, Lada 2105
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97 – Klaus-Peter Schachtschneider, East Germany, Lada 21011
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99 – Dietmar Isensee, East Germany, Lada 21011
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