Rallycross
#51
Posted 30 September 2007 - 11:12
@ sterling49: Sad enough Brian Culcheth’s 4WD Triumph 1300 was only seen a very few times in RX, but do not forget the great Rod Chapman and his 4WD 250+bhp Capri. He was still competing with the beast for quite some time after Ford and the Clark Bros. had already left the scene.
;)
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#52
Posted 30 September 2007 - 21:44
Originally posted by rx-guru
@ Jesper: Yep, the RS500 was really quite something in RX, but had rather 450–500 than 600bhp. Beside "His Kennyness" from Sweden do not forget the Norwegians Bjørn Skogstad, Eivind Opland, Roger Sandberg as well as Briton Trevor Reeves in similar cars.
;)
Not forgettin', but just didn't mention them. Skogstad seemed to be quite frustated at times, as he just couldn't do the job. Is it Tom Einar Aaserud who have brought out his RS500 in recent rallycrossing and hillclimbing? Gunnar Kittilsen got a comeback with the RS500 as well, I believe. Kennneth used Terry Drury machines - Drury had problems of keeping three RS500's running during the 1989 BTCC, but did the business in rallycross.
Jesper
#53
Posted 01 October 2007 - 09:34
Originally posted by Jesper O. Hansen
Not forgettin', but just didn't mention them. Skogstad seemed to be quite frustated at times, as he just couldn't do the job. Is it Tom Einar Aaserud who have brought out his RS500 in recent rallycrossing and hillclimbing? Gunnar Kittilsen got a comeback with the RS500 as well, I believe. Kennneth used Terry Drury machines - Drury had problems of keeping three RS500's running during the 1989 BTCC, but did the business in rallycross.
Jesper
Written for erc24.com by my friend/colleague Tim Whittington during the 2007 Norwegian ERC round at Momarken:
Tucked away in a corner of the support race paddock there was another former ERC star, now returned to Rallycross with a Supernational Volvo S40. In the days when the Ford Sierra Cosworth RS500 ruled the old two-wheel drive Group A category, Norwegian Tom Einar Aaserud was an underfunded but highly rated young racer. Aaserud was an event winner before calling a halt to his Rallycross career.
“I used the Cosworth in hillclimbs for many years,” said Aaserud. “Now I’m trying Rallycross again. It is about 15 or 16 years since I last did Rallycross, it’s just for fun now and I still enjoy the racing,” who is still settling into the Supernational category in his first full season back in Rallycross.
And yeah, "Kitta" also did one of his numerous comebacks with another RS500. I met him during the 2007 Dutch ERC round at Valkenswaard. I think he has no plans for another comeback yet. But with the 'Jackie Stewart (b)eater' (1st ever Norwegian RX at the Momarken Travbane, September 1 1972) and 'Martin Schanche godfather' one never knows…;)
#54
Posted 27 February 2010 - 22:14
Rallycars to be used divided in 2WD and 4WD classes over sprint races to be decided in a final sounds wery basic and not far from how rallycross was conceived.
Jesper
#55
Posted 28 February 2010 - 11:40
Best wishes from Austria - Alfred
#56
Posted 01 March 2010 - 02:48
It effectivly died in about 1980 at both Catalina and Tailem Bend SA as there was not enough dollars around and too few people were doing too much to try and keep it going.
The 79 Australian Title event at Tailem Bend was the last major event staged and was won by Larry Perkins in the Kruger Motors VW. The event also featured Peter Janson driving a quick Torana
Edited by Lee Nicolle, 01 March 2010 - 22:36.
#57
Posted 01 March 2010 - 20:43
Calder's rallycross track came about 1970. Brock and Watson were initial stars there and Brock wasn't in the HDT until late in '69.
Catalina only lasted two or three seasons from late '71 or so, maybe '72. Tailem Bend did go on much longer, probably till the late seventies.
#58
Posted 01 March 2010 - 22:34
You may be right about the start, I had a typo, I think 69, but Catalina was still going in 80 as I was going to go there. It was not 'big' time but was still happening, it may have gone on longer.Lee... we could tailor those dates a bit...
Calder's rallycross track came about 1970. Brock and Watson were initial stars there and Brock wasn't in the HDT until late in '69.
Catalina only lasted two or three seasons from late '71 or so, maybe '72. Tailem Bend did go on much longer, probably till the late seventies.
Tailem Bend ended in 80, I was State Champion for sedans!!
Edited by Lee Nicolle, 01 March 2010 - 22:36.
#59
Posted 02 March 2010 - 10:30
But by the end of '72 I don't recall any more such activity.
There may have been another less ostentatious start to the rallycross after that, but it certainly didn't make television and I never saw it. I have an idea it never happened, but I'm too far from my magazines to check. Tailem Bend was still being reported, however, I do recall that.
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#60
Posted 04 March 2010 - 07:04
Rallycross at Catalina was still going as late as June of 1980. The August 1980 edition of 'Racing Car News' has a report on its final page of the June 8 meeting. The article mentions that this was the first "2+4" Rallycross meeting, with the usual car, buggy & 4WD classes joined my motocross & motorally events with competitors sourced from the Cambridge Park and Oyster Bay Motorcycle Clubs. The accompanying picture is of Bob Parks rolling his Cortina, with Rob Worboys following closely in what looks like an ex- '79 Repco Trial Cortina
It mentions that the next meeting planned was for August 3, 1980.
#61
Posted 04 March 2010 - 09:42
I don't know who ran those events, but it certainly wasn't the original group... and I feel sure there'd been a gap of some years. I do remember that someone named McLintock ran some kind of 4wd or something in those later events.
I'm going to have to dust down some of my memory banks.
#62
Posted 04 March 2010 - 10:18
#63
Posted 04 March 2010 - 20:56
The track was used regularly for club sprints etc so was actually quite well used in its 4 years.
I believe some clubs ran sprints there far later too.
#64
Posted 04 September 2010 - 09:38
#65
Posted 01 October 2010 - 18:28
#66
Posted 01 October 2010 - 20:39
#67
Posted 13 January 2016 - 13:30
Just found a set of 24 pictures taken at the 'made for TV' event at Prescott in 1964 (currently misidentified as Monte Carlo Rally):
Start here and then hit next to tab thru:
https://revslib.stan...log/xq438fq7799
Does anybody know the exact date? Any data on the cars? Notice 569 FMO has morphed into #37.
Attention: Ford Falcon fundis.
RGDS RLT
Edited by Rupertlt1, 13 January 2016 - 13:43.
#68
Posted 13 January 2016 - 14:51
The actual event was held at Prescott on Saturday, 1 February 1964, and consisted of cars and drivers competing, by invitation from the BBC, which had already competed in the 1964 Monte Carlo rally the previous week.
Reports were in the specialist press of 6 or 7 February 1964 - the cars being 'works' machines.
No doubt the 'works' Mini was cloned because that year's actual winning machine was already on its way to a publicity tour elsewhere.
#69
Posted 13 January 2016 - 17:36
The whole 'works' team were part of the cloning exercise, being painted with the winning car's number and (I think) fitted with duplicate number plates, so that dealers in various corners of the country could all display 'THE Monte Carlo winner'. presumably at dealers situated further apart than the average 'mark' (aka customer) was thought to travel.
So the car at Prescott could have been any one of the 'family'.
#70
Posted 13 January 2016 - 18:24
I believe the name "rallycross" was coined by John Sprinzel as a mixture of "rallying" and "autocross", the latter being a very popular sport at the time especially the Players No6 National Autocross Championship.
I remember watching those early rallycross events on BBC Grandstand [from Lydden] & ITV World of Sport [Croft & Cadwell], even attending a few as a schoolboy speccie at Croft.
Seemed to me Autocross was a summer sport, with rallycross in winter....I wish some modern day rallycross took place in snow etc
#71
Posted 11 February 2017 - 16:30
Car #201 (Ford Falcon) was driven at Prescott (feb 1st, 1964) from Graham Hill. He finished 9th.
#72
Posted 12 February 2017 - 14:33
John Sprinzel has definitely told me in the past, that he came up with the name.
#73
Posted 12 February 2017 - 19:29
For me, the best days of Rally X were the early Lydden and Croft races circa 1968-1975, the cars were more or less rally/competition cars, with no fancy 4 wheel drive or trick differentials ( errr, except for Harry/Jan in BDA engined DAFs, and Roger/Stan Clark in the 4WD Capri and Culcheth Triumph 1300). In those days there was even mud to drive through and a good screenwasher was essential, the chalk at Lydden is now like a mettalled surface, although still slippery when wet. For me, the fact that I could (if I could afford it) replicate these cars with performance parts from either Leyland ST or Boreham, kind of gave us young guns something to aim for, we knew the bits we wanted, just had to earn the money. Try that now with a Focus WRC or Subaru!!!!
Bit's for BMW's Mini and Suzuki Swift are probably a little more affordable than those for WRC Fords and Scoobie doo's.
I went to my first Rally Cross meeting ever last year at Pembury and loved it.
While the oldies did not go back to 1967, they were still very entertaining
#74
Posted 12 February 2017 - 22:32
Ha ha, I visit a thread that interests me, after yonks, and see you quoted me Ralph! I thought I recognised the words!
Edited by sterling49, 13 February 2017 - 10:11.
#75
Posted 13 February 2017 - 07:51
Croft too- and if you want to see the most gifted young driver(in any discipline ) I have seen for years , look out for Daniel Rooke.
I watched rallyX from early days and whilst the zenith may have been the bonkers mid- late 80s with so many Gp B cars there are still some great cars out there . Yes, some are hugely expensive WRC cars but it is a class of racing where talent will out and although young Dan now has a WRC car himself he came on my radar (and every other seasoned observer who was there ) by harrying and beating WRC cars at Croft in a crappy little 200bhp Citroen AX
#76
Posted 13 February 2017 - 08:50
Slight misconception. Rallycross exists now really in two or 3 spheres.
It is around in the USA now under the guise of GRC but is struggling in popularity after a small boom a few years ago. Not helped helped by the start of.....
WRX is very new and was born out of amalgamating the old European series with the few Xgames events that were started in sort of 2012 to run at city venues as an Xgames franchise. It is run by an American PR company who have made a lot of changes, some good but most bad, for financial gain.
They call it a world championship but it mainly stays in Europe with the odd race in other countries like Canada and Turkey until they realise they have made a mistake paying for it and it is a massive loss maker.
It is short-termism gone mad with no thought for the future of the sport, temp tracks, isolation for junior classes, but sadly it is working and the kids love it as it makes F1 look dull, boring and predictable, even if the same guys usually win still in WRX too.
Nationally the series was split about 10 years ago by some idiot who decided he could also run a British championship himself when the real one was hardly busting paddocks and grids and the rift that caused has never been repaired so we now, stupidly have a main series and a clubmans series that do not really get on, So despite Top Gear providing rallycross with immense media exposure and interest, the cretins running the sport nationally decided to keep their little empires.
But it does OK somehow.
Rook is class agreed, but no different to what Rennison, Shield, Nick Jones, Richard Hutton did years ago, there are some truly superb and overlooked drivers in rallycross, I just hope he can move up into something worthwhile, which for him right now is probably WRX.
#77
Posted 13 February 2017 - 18:08
He's better than any of the chaps you name in my view ; the likes of Rennison were terrific drivers but I sense with young Dan an absolutely extraordinary ability- love to see him in a single seater .
#78
Posted 13 February 2017 - 18:38
Not looking good for me visiting Llydden for either of the rounds of this years RX championship unfortunately
#79
Posted 14 February 2017 - 08:06
Ooo that's a bold claim, Rennison was very close to getting a 1600 Escort into a European championship A final after winning a C and nearly winnign an A once! Rooke is good but has never done anything remotely like that. Rennison tried tog et into BTCC after his short rallycross career but fell way short and lost sponsors sadly, and disappeared until a few years ago when he came up driving in Pikes Peak.
Jon Milner used to qualify on the front row for A finals in Britain in a 1600 205!! These were the talents of my youth that went on to great things after.
He is good, but best ever, that is a bit bold, he was in RX Lites last year at Lydden and did nothing whatsoever. And that AX was lighter than the engine that was in it!!
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#80
Posted 14 February 2017 - 08:27
I stand by my point - and like you , I suspect ,I have been watching rallycross since Jan De Rooy's DAF . I have never seen anybody in this discipline display such extraordinary finesse- his control under braking is poetry. I'm a fan , yes-not often I get excited about somebody new but Dan is very much the man at Maison Aston.
Mind you , I have form for getting it, if not wrong per se, but less right than I should have. On the evidence of his FF2000 drives I was sure JJ Lehto was going on to win many Grands Prix. At least I didn't rave about poor old Dave Walker though ...
#81
Posted 14 February 2017 - 09:32
I am the same, I was convinced Enrique Bernoldi was the next Senna! And am convinced that in my old world of autograss that are one or two drivers there would could have made damn fine racing or rally drivers given the chance.
Dan is a great driver, but needs to either move up to WRX straightaway or go somewhere else, he is doing what Andrew Jordan did right now and beating a mediocre UK field, he had the contacts and budget to move on. Not sure Dan does as yet. As I said, Dan was pretty average in RX Lites last year at Lydden so will already be starting from behind the mark to impress WRX teams. If he had come in and beat allcomers then he would be on the radar far more. Those sort of one offs are hit and miss like that.
And driving a modern supercar is not the same as taming an RS200 or making a GpN car go fast with its inherent weaknesses. For me there are countless rallycross kids who could have been amazing given the budget, time and proper support. Rennison being one, Mike Shield, Nick Jones, Ian Evans, Richard Hutton, Guy Williams. You watch a guy like Vince Bristow now and think what he could have done in an RS500 or M3 in the 90's.
#82
Posted 14 February 2017 - 09:56
Rallycross at Tailem Bend South Oz. These are all 78/79. Excuse the pics, they are all pics of pics.
We ran sedan classes Div1 and Div2 plus offroad buggies and at times Scramble sidecars as well.
Like so many sports in the end there was too few doing too much and it folded at the end of the 1980 season.
The track was a properly road base for the dirt and about 1/3 bitumen. It was quite fast and sometimes frantic. A few proper rally cars competed at various times but they all seemed to understeer badly in comparison to the sedan based specials.
Car included Holdens, Toranas Cortinas, Datsuns, a few Minis Renault 750s with 16TS engines and later after a big crash a R8 with 16TS, plus the two Kruger VWs. One driven by sometime 5000 driver Keith Poole witha 2.5 litre engine and the other with an 1835 driven by various drivers.
pic 1, part of a poster that we put out for every meeting. Sidecar and Phil March [Yes the winner of both a National Speedcar and Sprintcar championship] in his very battered Datsun 1600. After a major end for end on one of the very first meetings. The car his father Les raced at Calder and AIR.
Pic 2 The Charlie Orlando Torana, this is the car that Peter Jansen drove in the 1979 Australian Championship. Larry Perkins won that event in the second Kruger Motors VW beetle
Pic 3. My HR Holden landing heavily on the nose over the big jump that led into the water splash.
Pic 4. A Practice day with me testing a V8 Manual HK Monaro. I decided that it would be no faster than the 6 cylinder HR. This ofcourse was the water splash. You had to throw the car sideways through the splash to get into the final dirt corner leading back to the bitumen.
Edited by Lee Nicolle, 14 February 2017 - 10:20.