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Experiments: weird, bizarre, useless, etc...


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#151 Tim Murray

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 17:14

Yes indeed - the photo was taken by Michael Cooper and appears in BRM Vol 3, but that Snetterton race was in 1964 (Hill won the 1963 race).

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#152 Ray Bell

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 20:18

Originally posted by 962C
Turbo visors are still pretty common in kart racing.


Graham Hill also used and championed this visor...

There's a photo of him at Longford in the torrential '68 race posted by Rod Mackenzie on another thread.

#153 D-Type

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 22:09

And in 1951 Farina demonstrated a similar visor! A photo (copyright the Ludvigsen Collection) can be found in John Tennant's MOTOR RACING the golden age on page 17. See post #135

#154 Graham Clayton

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 07:30

The much-touted Hydrolink suspension that Tyrell used on the 023 car for the 1995 World Championship season, which was removed from the cars halfway through the seasn due to its problems and inefficiences.

 

I am not sure if qualifies as an experiment, but the transparent cockpit cover on Graham McRae's F5000 GM3 was certainly different - has anyone else used a similar transparent cover?



#155 alansart

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 09:11

 

I am not sure if qualifies as an experiment, but the transparent cockpit cover on Graham McRae's F5000 GM3 was certainly different - has anyone else used a similar transparent cover?

 

Why did McRae do that?

The early 6 wheeled Tyrrells had windows in the cockpit so the drivers could see the front wheels.


Edited by alansart, 31 January 2014 - 09:11.


#156 Macca

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 09:22

Vanwall tried a streamline perspex cockpit cover in 1957 or '58, I think, and Brabham definitely used one in practise at Monza in 1967; both were apparently ineffective - I don't know if the McRae version was similar.

 

Paul M



#157 Stephen W

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 09:26

 

I am not sure if qualifies as an experiment, but the transparent cockpit cover on Graham McRae's F5000 GM3 was certainly different - has anyone else used a similar transparent cover?

 

 

Why did McRae do that?

The early 6 wheeled Tyrrells had windows in the cockpit so the drivers could see the front wheels.

 

Protos and Brabham both experimented with a Perspex bubble style screen but soon discarded them.



#158 Glengavel

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 09:28

Why did McRae do that?

The early 6 wheeled Tyrrells had windows in the cockpit so the drivers could see the front wheels.

 

I think the windows were added after initial testing when the drivers complained. Incidentally, what happened to Projects 1 to 33?

 

I remember one of the columnists in Autocar writing about the P34 and betting that 6-wheel cars would be banned the following season. When they weren't I wrote in and reminded him of his comments but I've yet to receive my winnings...



#159 2F-001

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 10:28

The windows on P34…

I'm sure I recall reading a report that, prior to the transparent panels being fitted, one of the drivers came in from a run in testing and said he thought he may have low pressure in one of the front tyres; one of the crew gestured to him to get out and take a look… as one of the front wheels was missing completely.
Does anyone know if this tale is actually true?

Edited by 2F-001, 31 January 2014 - 10:29.


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#160 Catalina Park

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 10:32

The McRae clear cockpit was not a bubble over the drivers head, it was a windscreen that started in front of the drivers feet.
He just used a sheet of Lexan to make the cockpit body instead of the usual fibreglass.

#161 nicanary

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 11:31

Why did McRae do that?

The early 6 wheeled Tyrrells had windows in the cockpit so the drivers could see the front wheels.

Nothing new under the sun - the Tyrrells copied the Austin/Morris FG trucks of the 50s/60s. Windows in the lower part of the cab for manoeuvering in narrow streets.



#162 Stephen W

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 12:20

The early 6 wheeled Tyrrells had windows in the cockpit so the drivers could see the front wheels.

 

 

I think the windows were added after initial testing when the drivers complained.

 

 

In 1976 at the British GP the 'windows' in the Tyrrells were increased in size. One of the commentary team said it was "so the spectators could see the drivers at work" but was it really done to help the drivers take a quick glance at the front wheels?



#163 E.B.

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 12:28

I think Scheckter (never a P34 fan) commented that they were of little benefit in that regard. I can't remember if that's because they got dirty very quickly or whether they were trying to solve a problem that he felt didn't exist.

#164 Ray Bell

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Posted 31 January 2014 - 15:13

Surprisingly, the cast alloy monocoque/s from de Tomaso haven't yet been mentioned in this thread...

 

There's some  detail in this thread, but precious little else to be found on the internet about them.

 

I'm of the opinion that the '62 F1 car with de Tomaso's own flat eight and 6-speed gearbox was made of cast sections while the Indianapolis version is said to be a one-piece mono.

 

Definitely different...



#165 Peter Morley

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 08:46

In 1976 at the British GP the 'windows' in the Tyrrells were increased in size. One of the commentary team said it was "so the spectators could see the drivers at work" but was it really done to help the drivers take a quick glance at the front wheels?

Weren't the windows so that the drivers could actually see the front wheels which were too small to be seen over the cockpit top - e.g. so that they could place them the appropriate distance from a kerb?



#166 D-Type

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 09:14

The windows on theTyrrells were definitely added so that the drivers could see the wheels.  But I always understood that the reason they needed to see them had nothing to do with placing the car - after all anybody in a modern saloon with a 'dropaway' bonnet doesn't have problems nor did drivers of Minis, Can-Am cars and indeed any sports cars with an all-enveloping body (as opposed to cycle wings).  The purpose was to allow them to check the wheels, for condition (e.g. wear and graining),  whether they were still pointing in the right direction after a bump and, if the story above is true, to check whether they were still there.

 

I don't have the Motor Sport disc for the 1970's to see what DSJ wrote at the time, but I know he would have written about them as it's the sort of detail he revelled in..



#167 Ray Bell

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 09:37

Not only that, the rear wheels formed a much wider car section, they'd have climbed kerbs that the front wheels missed...

 

These kinds of judgements most drivers would make as a matter of course.



#168 Catalina Park

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 10:34

Not only that, the rear wheels formed a much wider car section, they'd have climbed kerbs that the front wheels missed...


Yep.

P34Archive001.jpg

#169 Roger Clark

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 10:59

Surprisingly, the cast alloy monocoque/s from de Tomaso haven't yet been mentioned in this thread...
 
There's some  detail in this thread, but precious little else to be found on the internet about them.
 
I'm of the opinion that the '62 F1 car with de Tomaso's own flat eight and 6-speed gearbox was made of cast sections while the Indianapolis version is said to be a one-piece mono.
 
Definitely different...

The flat eight car had a tubular space-frame.

#170 arttidesco

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 11:29

In 1976 at the British GP the 'windows' in the Tyrrells were increased in size. One of the commentary team said it was "so the spectators could see the drivers at work" but was it really done to help the drivers take a quick glance at the front wheels?

 

The window's were definitely not in place when the car was launched, IIRC larger windows were fitted for the British GP and Uncle Ken said he would suggest they become mandatory to the authorities if he got enough support, which regrettably he did not.



#171 2F-001

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 12:58

E.B. said:
"I think Scheckter (never a P34 fan) commented that they were of little benefit in that regard. I can't remember if that's because they got dirty very quickly or whether they were trying to solve a problem that he felt didn't exist."

I think the latter possibility rather reflected Scheckter's view, at the time, of the six-wheeler project as a whole, rather than just the 'windows', didn't it?

#172 Michael Ferner

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Posted 01 February 2014 - 17:46

Yep.

P34Archive001.jpg


:D

#173 onelung

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Posted 08 February 2014 - 01:35

Can't for the life of me understand why this was never picked up for Formula 1...

hgb9.jpg



#174 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 08 February 2014 - 08:03

Yep.

P34Archive001.jpg

That's what modern F1 needs, proper tyres! And that pic is fabulous, just back em into a corner and drive them out. Spectacular. And near impossible to do on modern tyres as they have so much grip.

#175 Michael Ferner

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Posted 09 February 2014 - 10:50

Can't for the life of me understand why this was never picked up for Formula 1...
hgb9.jpg


A whacky concept... like "cornering on rails"... Hey, wait a minute!

;)

#176 Allan Lupton

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Posted 09 February 2014 - 11:09

Can't for the life of me understand why this was never picked up for Formula 1...

 

Wasn't it?

Something makes 'em corner boringly well these days.