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Auto Union hillclimb picture identification: when, where, who?


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#1 Holger Merten

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 14:30

I got these pictures from Uechtels great archive. Both pictures are saved as Hans Stuck 1939 at the Wiener Höhenstrassenrennen - a hillclimb outside of Vienna.

First of all I have problems with the cars. As you can see the second one is a twin-wheeler at the rear axle. But what about the first picture? Did Stuck start with twin wheels for one run and without at the other one?

Second, I have also problems with the situation and the persons. Looks to me, that the second picture shows Stuck for sure in his twin wheeler, but where? Is that the Wiener Höhenstrassenrennen? And doesn't the first picture show Müller at the Grossglockner in 1939, but there he had # 125? Please help me out here.

Hans?

1.
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2.
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#2 D-Type

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 14:55

To state the obvious.

These photographs are not of the same event. The position of the number on the side of the car is different. So we are looking for two events.

My monitor is none too clear and my eyesight not as sharp as it was, but there are a couple more clues in the numbers.

In the first picture the number is either 3 or *3. It looks like a 3 on the tail and could be a 3 on the side of the nose (the big black blob). Or it could be *3 and we can see the bottom half of twofigures in front of the dark blob.

In the second picture it looks like a 3-digit number. I would guess at 143, but it could be 123 or possibly 133, either of which would fit with the Müller car at the Grossglockner if there was more than one A-U competing.

The helmet in the first picture looks darker than in the second.

Is it the same car in both pictures?

Over to the experts.

#3 panzani

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 15:19

The noses of the cars are pretty different, #1 has no radiator grill and has two wings.

#4 Holger Merten

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 15:22

D-Type a wonderful name for this Typ C/D thread. :lol:

Is it the same car in both pictures?




I would say no. The first picture shows a more or less Typ C Hillclimber. While the second one could be a Typ C/D Hillclimber in 1939 specification. Both with V16 engines, and therefore a little bit different to the real Typ Ds.

But for Grossglockner 1939:

HP Müller # 125
Hans Stuck # 126

Nothing fits. :drunk:

BTW: I'll agree with all your other comments to the two pictures.

#5 BertlF

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 15:40

To throw my 5ct worth in:

The first picture is definitely not the "Wiener Hoehenstrasse". Being from Vienna myself, there's no such landscape anywhere around the Hoehenstrasse. No way! Grossglockner sounds reasonable...

The 2nd picture, being a closer shot, does not reveal much of the landscape, However, the concrete posts along the edge of the road are a distinctive sign of the Hoehenstrasse in Vienna. I'm not sure when I drove this road the last time, must have been some 15 years or so ago.... I remember for sure that these concrete posts have been there at least until the 1970's and a lagre part of this road is still today cobblestones (not sure about the concrete posts).

From the location I would say Pic. No. 1 is the "Grossglockner Hochalpenstrasse between Salzburg and Kaerneten in Austria whereas the 2nd picture c o u l d well be the "Wiener Hoehenstrasse".

Bert

#6 Hans Etzrodt

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 16:27

Vienna Mountain Climb, June 11, 1939
#181 – Lang (Mercedes-Benz)
#182 – Müller (Auto Union)
#183 – Stuck (Auto Union)
#184 – v. Brauchitsch (Mercedes-Benz)

Grossglockner Mountain Climb, August 6, 1939
#125 – Müller (Auto Union)
#126 – Stuck (Auto Union)
#127 – v. Brauchitsch (Mercedes-Benz)
#128 – Lang (Mercedes-Benz)

Grossglockner Mountain Climb, August 28, 1938
#81 – v. Brauchitsch (Mercedes-Benz)
#82 – Lang (Mercedes-Benz W125)
#83 – Stuck (Auto Union)
DNS – Müller (Auto Union)

#7 Mark Bennett

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 17:24

Originally posted by panzani
The noses of the cars are pretty different, #1 has no radiator grill and has two wings.


Ummmm
Which way do you think the first one is facing?

#8 panzani

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 17:51

Originally posted by Mark Bennett


Ummmm
Which way do you think the first one is facing?

:blush:

#9 GIGLEUX

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Posted 25 March 2004 - 21:10

For me N°1 is Stuck, Grossglockner 1938 with a C-type car. Racing number: 83.
Every ime the cars had a three digit racing number, they had not it on the tail-end.

Picture N°2 is Wien-Kahlenberg in 1939. There Stuck had the C-type with D-type body and N°183.
Müller had a classical C-type and N°182.

Two pictures of Stuck at Grossglockner in 1938
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Now Müller at Wien 1939
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Stuck, Wien 1939
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#10 Holger Merten

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Posted 26 March 2004 - 07:50

Yes Jean-Maurice, looks possible, everything. Thank you.

#11 Hans Etzrodt

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Posted 26 March 2004 - 08:40

Originally posted by Holger Merten
Yes Jean-Maurice, looks possible, everything. Thank you.

Holger,
There are no other possibilities. That's why I posted the starting numbers, which makes it very simple for anybody to figure it out. :cool:

#12 Holger Merten

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Posted 26 March 2004 - 09:05

Hans, s***, haven't seen your post, the browser brought me automatically to Giglieux post, and I didin't check any other posts between my last visit and Giglieuxs post. :|

Thank you Hans. :up:

#13 GIGLEUX

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Posted 26 March 2004 - 20:14

Hans, thank you. Holger my name is GIGLEUX

#14 Holger Merten

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Posted 26 March 2004 - 22:11

Sorry for the double typo GIGLEUX. :rolleyes: