15 replies to this topic

[angst]

I've searched high and low for information on the proposed rear-engined Connaught ('53-'55?) which was to be powered by the Coventry -Climax 'Godiva' V8. I read that there were drawings of the Connaught design, does anybody have access to those, and can anybody come up with any information about that car, the 'Godiva' engine (how good could it all have been, had they not been scared off by the horsepower claims of certain other manufacturers of the time), and also the Kieft and HWM cars which were also awaiting the new V8?

Thanks in advance.

[Macca]

264 bhp at 7900 rpm.

There was a feature article about the Kieft in Motor Sport a few months ago; don't know about the others.

DSJ did an article in the late 1980s, with a doctored photo of a Vanwall with eight stub exhausts, to suggest that Lotus might have come into F1 sooner, and since Capman designed the Vanwall's chassis...............................



PWM

[Peter Morley]

The Connaught book "to draw a long line" has some sketches of the concept.

Maybe the new book on Coventry Climax engines will have some new material - whenever it is eventually released.

[Roger Clark]

[VAR1016]

If the engine was cancelled because of the horsepower claims of other manufacturers, yet it gave 264HP, whose claims frightened Coventry-Climax?

From memory, I think that most makers at that time claimed around 260HP. Perhaps some journalists got a little over-excited?

PdeRL

[GIGLEUX]

Angst, I think that the best is to refer to the following sources:
-Climax in Coventry by Walter Hassan and Graham Robson.
-To draw a long line by C.E.'Johnny Johnson (about the Connaught J3 project)
-Motor Sport about the Kieft car

[angst]

Something that has puzzled me. If Connaught were designing a rear engined car for the C-C V8, why when they produced the Type B did they not continue with the rear-engined concept?
Was there something about the Alta 4cyl that precluded a good rearengine design, or was there something about the V8 that was particularly attractive for such a layout?

[D-Type]

I think there's a question of timing here.

Could it be that the Type B was originally a development of the Type A for the Alta engine in Formula 2 and it got behind schedule. Then it became a Formula 1 stopgap until the Climax-engined Type C came on line. Then when the Godiva was dropped the best option for Connaught was to stick with the front-engined Type B design and develop it, leaving the rear engine for when a bigger budget was available.

(Pure speculation whilst at work with no access to any references)

[angst]

Doh!
B-Type before C-Type. Not an unusual or unexpected progression, so brain in gear before posting in future.

Just reading through Karl Ludvigsen's book on the front engined Grand Prix cars and he makes reference to the designs of the type-D (a rear-engined, Alta powered car) which were discovered when the company went into liquidation. Another what if.

Why is it that a company with so many innovative ideas, and (from what I gather) such a strong engineering base have so many financial difficulties? Any good books on Connaught? The more I find out, the more intrigued I am.

[Michael Oliver]

I've searched high and low for information on the proposed rear-engined Connaught ('53-'55?) which was to be powered by the Coventry -Climax 'Godiva' V8. I read that there were drawings of the Connaught design, does anybody have access to those, and can anybody come up with any information about that car, the 'Godiva' engine (how good could it all have been, had they not been scared off by the horsepower claims of certain other manufacturers of the time), and also the Kieft and HWM cars which were also awaiting the new V8?

Thanks in advance.

Just to resurrect this thread, I stumbled across the following photo while looking for something else. To my untrained eye, it would appear to show a rear-engined car in manufacture and the caption says "Connaught factory" with no date.

http://www.motorsnap..._5_1_1.jpg.html

However, the next image in the gallery is the same artists impression of the rear-engined J3, which appears above, so is the factory shot of the J3 under construction or something completely different?

http://www.motorsnap..._5_1_7.jpg.html

The factory shot appears to show a high rear body section, whereas the sketch does not. Anyway, I'm sure someone can answer this who knows a bit more about Connaught than I do (which would not be difficult!).

[Paul Parker]

Just to resurrect this thread, I stumbled across the following photo while looking for something else. To my untrained eye, it would appear to show a rear-engined car in manufacture and the caption says "Connaught factory" with no date.

http://www.motorsnap..._5_1_1.jpg.html

However, the next image in the gallery is the same artists impression of the rear-engined J3, which appears above, so is the factory shot of the J3 under construction or something completely different?

http://www.motorsnap..._5_1_7.jpg.html

The factory shot appears to show a high rear body section, whereas the sketch does not. Anyway, I'm sure someone can answer this who knows a bit more about Connaught than I do (which would not be difficult!).

What a shame if there really was the possibility of a rear engined 'Godiva' powered Connaught. I too as per VAR1016's post have always been puzzled by the claim that Coventry Climax were frightened off by the supposed power outputs of rival manufacturers when surely those involved in period must surely have known that c260 bhp was more than enough.

Instead perhaps the costs were the real reason the project got binned.

[Paul Parker]

What a shame if there really was the possibility of a rear engined 'Godiva' powered Connaught. I too as per VAR1016's post have always been puzzled by the claim that Coventry Climax were frightened off by the supposed power outputs of rival manufacturers when surely those involved in period must surely have known that c260 bhp was more than enough.

Instead perhaps the costs were the real reason the project got binned.

First line should have read 'What a shame if there really was the possibility of a rear engined 'Godiva' powered Connaught that was abandoned'.

[Peter Morley]

Just to resurrect this thread, I stumbled across the following photo while looking for something else. To my untrained eye, it would appear to show a rear-engined car in manufacture and the caption says "Connaught factory" with no date.

http://www.motorsnap..._5_1_1.jpg.html

However, the next image in the gallery is the same artists impression of the rear-engined J3, which appears above, so is the factory shot of the J3 under construction or something completely different?

http://www.motorsnap..._5_1_7.jpg.html

The factory shot appears to show a high rear body section, whereas the sketch does not. Anyway, I'm sure someone can answer this who knows a bit more about Connaught than I do (which would not be difficult!).

It's interesting how advanced the car was, most reports suggest they didn't get much further than ordering the 5 speed preselector transaxles.
(Given the wheels, radiator, engine etc are as used by Connaught I think it is fair to assume the caption is correct).

The sketch must be of the original concept (monocoque?), before they knew the Climax V8 wasn't coming.

The engine in the car is a normal 2.5 litre Alta as used in the B & C types, given it is much taller the tail would have had to be changed.
The shape of the tail shows a family resemblance to the Toothpaste tube B & C type bodies.

What the sketch doesn't show is enough fuel tank space, the space frame chassis looks like they intended carrying a lot of fuel either side of the driver.

Incidentally Connaught, & other teams, tried to persuade Jaguar to let them have the XK100 engines which were also stillborn.

[Allan Lupton]

Based on a hurried re-reading of a bit of Johnny Johnson's "To Draw a Long Line" the photo is of the J5 which was a second go at the J3 after C-C had abandoned the Godiva. They had tried an Alta in J3, but it was too tall, but in February 1955 there was a revised Alta-engined version (J5) in preparation.

[RWB]

About 20 years ago there was a project to build the rear-engined Connaught using an Alta engine. I was working in insurance and was told that enquiries were made about arranging cover for the project. This was confirmed by a very reliable source. A local source (unconfirmed) said he thought Jim Stokes had eventually used the engine in a "recreated" B type but I have not found any details of that.

[bradbury west]

Bear in mind that the idea of a rear engined spaceframe car had already been designed and mocked up in 1952. Rodney Clarke had penned a lightweight F2 device to take 2 x 998cc JAP Vtwins at the rear, with a motor at each side just aft of the driver driving back to a chain drive via a cross shaft to a Burman gearbox. The engines were expected to produce around 180bhp in total for a race-ready weight of some 980lbs. So the concept was not new to them for the Godiva engine at the rear.

[Why is it that a company with so many innovative ideas, and ....such a strong engineering base have so many financial difficulties?

]

Answer; Because Connaught Engineering was a simple indulgence on the part of Kenneth McAlpine, who funded the whole thing out of personal funds. Looking at what he achieved at the time, and in comparison with some others, our sport owes him huge respect and thanks.
Roger Lund