29 replies to this topic

[Hugo Boecker]

Mercedes Starsearch

After a very bad 1936 season Mercedes was looking for new driver talents. They deceided to go the Auto-Union way of a „Racing School". Neubauer inveited Drivers from his famos black book, proteggees and a number of Daimler peaople. At all there were 26 up to 30 candidates according to sources (Book Männer Frauen und Motoren by Neubauer and Rowe an Leif Snellmans website The Golden Era of Grand Prix racing www.kolumbus.fi/leif.snellman/main.htm).
The test took place at the Nürburgring from October 8th to October 24th 1936. First they had to do some laps with a 2.3.liter Sportscar. There were many crashes and the young Johann Wolf crashed fataly at at „Karussel" Johann Wolf was a member of the Mercedes-Benz works. The best 10 drives in theese test became a chance to drive the Grand Prix Cars.

Contracted as Junior drivers were
John Richard (Dick) Seaman - Christian Kautz - Hans Hugo Hartmann - Heinz Brendel

but who were all the others

Johann Wolf - work member Neubauer told us that he owns a 750 BMW motorcycle. There was Johann Wolf in the 1934 German Championship with a 250 Velocette. The same man?
Willi Briem - he started with Amilcar 1,1 racing cars. He still raced in a few races after the war.
Köppen - from Berlin. He was German motorcycle champion, winner of the Targa Florio and an expierend touringcar driver.
Herrmann Gunzenhauser - successful Speedway racer. Did a lap in 13:50.

Who else any informations are welcome.

So long

[Hans Etzrodt]

AUTOMOBIL-REVUE 1936, No.83, p5
There was a brief paragraph:
During the week of October 5-10 Auto Union and Mercedes-Benz both conducted driver tests at the Nürburgring.
Schmitz from the Mercedes-Benz factory crashed fatally.
Others mentioned:
Gunzenhauser (Neidlingen)
Paul Köppen (Berlin)
Schumann (Stuttgart) a well known NSU driver
Briem (Ludwigsburg) a famous Amilcar driver
Several Mercedes-Benz Factory employees (no names!)
Bäumer
Oesterreicher
Hesseller

AUTOMOBIL-REVUE 1936, No.84, p4
A brief note that the driver tests were continued during the week of October 12-15. Drivers mentioned were
Kautz (Switzerland)
Seaman (England) did 8 continuous laps

AUTOMOBIL-REVUE 1936, No.85, p3
Article that Kautz and Seaman were hired as Nachwuchsfahrer for Mercedes-Benz.
In the final tests of the 27 drivers were Seaman, Kautz, Köppen, Hartmann, Joa, Brendel and Briem.
Seaman and Kautz drove their fastest lap in 10m52s while the others were unable to beat the 11-minute barrier. Rosemeyer's lap record at that time stood at 9m57s.

[Hugo Boecker]

Originally posted by Hans Etzrodt
AUTOMOBIL-REVUE 1936, No.83, p5
There was a brief paragraph:
During the week of October 5-10 Auto Union and Mercedes-Benz both conducted driver tests at the Nürburgring.
Schmitz from the Mercedes-Benz factory crashed fatally.
........

Thanks for that infos, but do you know why Neubauer changed the name of the works emloyee ?
He did the same with Peter and Lil ( Paul and Ilse Pietsch) In the times he wrote his book it could have made sense. But why with Wolf ?

so long

[Vitesse2]

We did discuss this briefly some time ago.

http://forums.atlasf...=&postid=692239

Rob Young's reference to Cholmondeley Tapper also appears in TPCT's "Amateur Racing Driver": he and Johnny Wakefield had travelled by way of Bologna where they had enjoyed an extended visit to the Maserati factory. Hilton's inference appears to be wrong, although he did go skiing after going to Monza and finding that Mercedes Benz had decamped.

This of course begs the questions: "Why wasn't he invited to the tests in Germany? Did Mercedes Benz consider him a better (or equal) driver than Seaman?"

Or is it all BS?

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by Hugo Boecker
...do you know why Neubauer changed the name of the works emloyee ?
He did the same with Peter and Lil ( Paul and Ilse Pietsch) In the times he wrote his book it could have made sense. But why with Wolf ?...

Wether it was intended to protect the family of the deceased or just a slip of memorizing the right name, we might never find out.

Come to think of it, it could also have been a mistake by the magazine. To prove Neubauer wrong of giving a false name, we need to find more magazines that had published reports about these driver tests. I don't have them in my copy collection, which does not necessarily mean that those reports did not exist; I might have just decided not to copy those articles because due to lacking interest at that time.

[Ray Bell]

Doesn't Neubauer state that 'Johann Wolf' is a false name?

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Doesn't Neubauer state that 'Johann Wolf' is a false name?

From page 214 to 219 in Neubauer's book Männer Frauen und Motoren is his story about the 1936 Rennfahrerschule, racing driver school, as he called it. Johann Wolf was only 21 and worked for the Mercedes factory. He was the 30th driver picked for these tests and crashed to his death in the Karussel when his car left the steep part of the corner's inside, came with his car over the flat part of the corner where the car tumbled over. His name was mentioned several times, no indication that it was a false name.

[eukie]

Disappointment at the Nürburgring
AAZ 1936 Nr.42, p. 7-8
mentions "more than two dozen" drivers, but names only the following:
Kautz (from Switzerland)
Briem (Ludwigsburg, Germany)
Hoffelt (from Austria)
Schumann (Nuremberg, Germany) - motorcycle driver (NSU)
Gunzenhauser (Neidlingen, Germany) - motorcycle driver (Jawa)
Hermann Schmitz, works driver from Untertürkheim - fatal accident on Oct 8th. in the Karussell
Heinemann (Geilenkirchen, Germany) - "Alfa driver" - Alfa - I didn`t know that! see: http://forums.atlasf...&threadid=63930

[Barry Lake]

Has anyone tried the Daimler-Benz Museum archives?

I have seen extremely detailed records they kept for all tests and race meetings in the 1930s. Considering this, wouldn't they have lap times, full names etc for all the drivers tested on that occasion?

The problem, I imagine, might be in finding the right channels to get to the information. And perhaps it would be best not to mention the fatality, specifically, rather to focus on the search for new drivers.

[Hugo Boecker]

Originally posted by eukie
Disappointment at the Nürburgring
AAZ 1936 Nr.42, p. 7-8
mentions "more than two dozen" drivers, but names only the following:
Kautz (from Switzerland)
Briem (Ludwigsburg, Germany)
Hoffelt (from Austria)
Schumann (Nuremberg, Germany) - motorcycle driver (NSU)
Gunzenhauser (Neidlingen, Germany) - motorcycle driver (Jawa)
Hermann Schmitz, works driver from Untertürkheim - fatal accident on Oct 8th. in the Karussell
Heinemann (Geilenkirchen, Germany) - "Alfa driver" - Alfa - I didn`t know that! see: http://forums.atlasf...&threadid=63930

Herrmann Lang remembered in his biography "Vom Rennmonteur zum Meisterfahrer" his own driver test at Monza in early spring (February/March ?) 1935. Togeter with him there were also Soenius, a wellknown motorbike, and Kohlrausch, MG-driver, tested. He was on equal terms with Kohlrausch and Soenius was far behind. Kohlrausch and Soenius were tested later by Auto-Union but didn' t made it. Were they given a second chance in 1936.


so long

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by eukie
Disappointment at the Nürburgring
AAZ 1936 Nr.42, p. 7-8
mentions "more than two dozen" drivers, but names only the following:...[/url]

I just looked at my copies of AAZ 1936 Nr.42 and I saw that I just copied page 16, a brief report about the Vanderbilt Cup race. It just proves that when I went through all these magazines in the late 80's, I just concentrated on the grand prix races. I then must have considered drivers test something secondary in importance.

[Wolf]

Originally posted by Hans Etzrodt
From page 214 to 219 in Neubauer's book Männer Frauen und Motoren is his story about the 1936 Rennfahrerschule, racing driver school, as he called it. Johann Wolf was only 21 and worked for the Mercedes factory. He was the 30th driver picked for these tests and crashed to his death in the Karussel when his car left the steep part of the corner's inside, came with his car over the flat part of the corner where the car tumbled over. His name was mentioned several times, no indication that it was a false name.

Other indication that it should be his real name is found on pg. 176-

Peter Paulsen und Lil heißen natürlich in Wahrheit anders. Aber es gibt Gründe, die dafür sprechen, ihre wahren Namen zu verschweigen: es sind die einzigen Namen in diesem Buch, die ich geändert habe, obwohl jedes Wort, das ich über sie berichte, der wollen Wahrheit entspricht.

[Leif Snellman]

I have received the following information from Konzernarchiv der DaimlerChrysler AG

"There is a problem regarding the driver of the "Rennfahrerschule". We own a
report written by A. Neubauer and he mentioned in it, that the names of the
driver is content of a enclosed sheet but this paper is missing. There were
27 driver driving on sports cars and then the number of participants for
racing cars has been reduced to 14.

So I will try to collect the names:

First team (27) :

Company emploee (testing drivers)

Georg Lindenmaier, Untertürkheim, mechanic in racing department
Hans Holzwarth
Hermann Fischer
Herbert Lauenstein
Friedrich Schneider
Alfred Neher

other:

Hoffelner
Hermann Schmitz (died on track)

Second team (14) :

Richard Seaman
Christian Kautz
Fritz Back, emploee in Stuttgard as driver
Heinz Brendel,, Frankfurt a. M.
Willy Briem, driving teacher
Hermann Gunzenhauser
Heinz-Hugo Hartmann, Dortmund, emploee of DBAG, driver
Paul Heinemann, Geilenkirchen
Leonhardt Joa, Pirmasens Bugatti driver
Paul Köppen, Berlin, sales man of DBAG
Georg Lindenmaier
Alfred Neher
Friedrich Schneider
Hans Schumann

Later on a motorcycle driver Steinbach made some laps but he soon gives up .

So 8 driver's names are missing. I hope to find the lost list some day.

Stan Peschel M.A.
Communications
Konzernarchiv der DaimlerChrysler AG
DaimlerChrysler AG"

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by Leif Snellman

So I will try to collect the names:

First team (27) :

Company emploee (testing drivers)

Georg Lindenmaier, Untertürkheim, mechanic in racing department
Hans Holzwarth
Hermann Fischer
Herbert Lauenstein
Friedrich Schneider
Alfred Neher

other:

Hoffelner
Hermann Schmitz (died on track)...
...So 8 driver's names are missing. I hope to find the lost list some day."[/I]

The first team of 27 tested in sports cars.
Schmitz was from the Daimler-Benz factory and crashed fatally.
Others mentioned who were driving in the tests with sports cars:
Gunzenhauser (Neidlingen)
Paul Köppen (Berlin)
Schumann (Stuttgart) a well known NSU driver
Briem (Ludwigsburg) a famous Amilcar driver
Several Mercedes-Benz Factory employees (no names!)
Bäumer
Oesterreicher
Hesseller

[Tomas Karlsson]

Is there anyone who knows if Mercedes did any more of these tests of new talents? I have talked to a Swedish motorcycle driver who told me that he had a test-drive for Mercedes round 38-39. But I have never been able to confirm that story.

[Leif Snellman]

I think that could possibly have been during a demonstration run rather than a proper test session At least Auto Union showed their car in Sweden in the late 30s. Could it have been during such a demonstation?

[Jonas]

Originally posted by Tomas Karlsson
Is there anyone who knows if Mercedes did any more of these tests of new talents? I have talked to a Swedish motorcycle driver who told me that he had a test-drive for Mercedes round 38-39. But I have never been able to confirm that story.

Well, this doesn't prove anything, but I know that this person has been pretty thoroughly interviewed on the matter by a person I know. The interview was videotaped. I've never seen it, though..
Anyway, the test run was supposed to have taken place at Avus in 1938.

I've also heard him telling the story. Several times. It's really interesting! And I have no reason to doubt his stories.

Apparently it was a try-out for a drive and not just a demonstration.

[taylov]

Originally posted by Leif Snellman
I have received the following information from Konzernarchiv der DaimlerChrysler AG

[ There were 27 driver driving on sports cars and then the number of participants for
racing cars has been reduced to 14, inc Company employee (testing drivers)

Georg Lindenmaier, Untertürkheim, mechanic in racing department
Hans Holzwarth
Hermann Fischer
Herbert Lauenstein
Friedrich Schneider
Alfred Neher

Here's a signed photo of Friedrich Schneider, Mercedes employee, at the 1936 Mercedes tests which I've not seen published elsewhere. Tony

[RStock]

I remember reading somewhere that Bernd Rosemeyer had test drove a Mercedes GP car once , and remarked at how much better it handled than his Auto Union . Does anyone know if this is true ? Was it around the same time as these tests ?

[metalshapes]

Originally posted by REDARMYSOJA
I remember reading somewhere that Bernd Rosemeyer had test drove a Mercedes GP car once , and remarked at how much better it handled than his Auto Union . Does anyone know if this is true ? Was it around the same time as these tests ?

Wasn't that in Carraciola's book?

I think I remember reading that they tried eachothers cars...

[scheivlak]

Originally posted by metalshapes


Wasn't that in Carraciola's book?

I think I remember reading that they tried eachothers cars...

Yes, it's in Caracciola's autobiography - it was during one of the practice sessions for the 1937 Italian GP.

[scheivlak]

Originally posted by Simon Davis
In which version of Caracciola's autobiography is this mentioned?

In my Dutch one

[Tim Murray]

In my copy (the MBC edition of A Racing Driver's World) the story appears in chapter 22, following the descriptions of the 1938 Swiss and Italian GPs. It mentions that the swap took place at Monza, but doesn't specify the year.

[scheivlak]

Originally posted by scheivlak

Yes, it's in Caracciola's autobiography - it was during one of the practice sessions for the 1937 Italian GP.

Have to correct this - it was in Monza so not at the 1937 Italian GP, which was held at a Livorno circuit!

[RStock]

Thanks fellows , for the replies about Bernd and the swap . What I'm curious about is , was this some sort of "official" swap , or just a "lark" by the drivers themselves ?

The only thing I remember about it is , that it happened and Bernd was amazed at how much better the Mercedes handled .

[scheivlak]

Originally posted by REDARMYSOJA
Thanks fellows , for the replies about Bernd and the swap . What I'm curious about is , was this some sort of "official" swap , or just a "lark" by the drivers themselves ?

The only thing I remember about it is , that it happened and Bernd was amazed at how much better the Mercedes handled .

Caracciola tells us that the swap was with both teams' spare cars and that it was allowed beforehand for the occasion by both teamleaders, dr. Feuereissen and Neubauer.
According to Rudi, Rosemeyer immediately complimented Mercedes with the excellent brakes and the adhesion to the track. Caracciola himself was full of praise about the Auto Union engine and transmission, flawlessly working "from the lowest revs to the highest speed".
Together they concluded that the best car should have a Mercedes chassis, Mercedes brakes and the Auto Union engine. "But it should be in front!", added Caracciola.....

[Hugo Boecker]

Caracciola tried the Auto union at Monza in 1934. In Molter's book " Rudolf Carracciola Titan am Lenkrad" page 104 is a picture of the event. Rudi at one of the chicanes in a 1934-Typ Auto Union.

[scheivlak]

Originally posted by Hugo Boecker
Caracciola tried the Auto union at Monza in 1934. In Molter's book " Rudolf Carracciola Titan am Lenkrad" page 104 is a picture of the event. Rudi at one of the chicanes in a 1934-Typ Auto Union.

But Rosemeyer wasn't there in Monza in 1934!

So that was either another occasion or that 1934 Auto Union was the spare car that was used when Rosemeyer and Caracciola swapped cars in a later year.

Quite likely the occasion was the 1935 Italian GP, as Mercedes didn't participate in 1936.

[taylov]

Originally posted by Simon Davis
Dear scheivlak,
The photo in Gunter Molter's book is of Caracciola trying Hans Stuck's A-Type Auto Union at Monza during practice for the 1934 Italian Grand Prix.
And by the way I have a Dutch copy of Caracciola's autobiography - "Mijn leven als coureur" - trouble is I can't read Dutch!!!

The photo also turns up in Chris Nixon's "Auto Union Album 1934-1939" on page 22 and is described as being during the 1934 Monza "testing". The car is carrying no obvious race number.

Tony

[Egor]

Herewith picture of Bernd Rosemeyer trying out the cockpit of a Mercedes W25 at the 1935 Spanish Grand Prix at Lasarte. Alfred Neubauer looks on approvingly. No evidence of whether Rosemeyer actually took the Mercedes for a spin.

Bernd was a big fan of sitting in the cars of other teams?

Caracciola tried the Auto union at Monza in 1934. In Molter's book " Rudolf Carracciola Titan am Lenkrad" page 104 is a picture of the event. Rudi at one of the chicanes in a 1934-Typ Auto Union.

Edited by Egor, 10 December 2011 - 15:49.