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#1251 Feliks

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 19:37

 
Well, finally, after a year, I received a cut down water, the elements of Plexiglas to model "Halfrotate Engine 1000 cc volume" ....
He is set to keep on hand, has 100ccm cylinder capacity .. 4 x 25.4 cm ^ 2 surface and 1 cm thick ..
 
to 1000 ccm this height h = 10 cm ..
to 3000 ccm this height h = 30 cm .......
First impressions: the piston surprisingly easy to change direction when moving your fingers inside the "barrel" .. I think very highly rotary engines will also be 
possible to build ..
 
100ccm.jpg
 
 
wszystkie.jpg
 
 
 
Andrew  :clap:


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#1252 Feliks

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 02:21

For this size Windmill Red Baron, surely the need for such an actuator driving a generator .. You know that place slot, achieved speed by air is three times greater than the wind blowing from the face of this wing?

 

beton%20zebro.jpg

 

 

 

Aerzen_Machines_Ltd_GQ_GR_positive_displ

 

 

speed%20zebro.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

twoprofile.jpg

 

 

Andrew :smoking:  :smoking:


Edited by Feliks, 24 November 2013 - 02:22.


#1253 Feliks

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Posted 03 December 2013 - 00:40

Do it now truest innovation .. every airman will save $ 500
In what way? do not have to buy these two venturi tubes to drive clocks ..
Just as in the right wing mount piping spot by not ordinary round a tube and connect the plastic with clocks ... cost of $ 5 .. 
 
After all, on top of an airplane wing vacuum is too .. :D
 
 
SAM_0108.JPG
 
 
 
 
Andrew 

Edited by Feliks, 03 December 2013 - 00:41.


#1254 Feliks

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Posted 23 December 2013 - 03:07

Christmas gifts:
here my scan such a disease illustrate how will they move the pistons in my engine in 1981, there was no possibilities of making animation and we had to somehow manage .. and the adoption of a decision which is to be the angle of the upper shaft between the pistons was not easy .. But it turned out, however, the simplest of which is 90 degrees should fulfill its task and so happened .. Exactly the drawing start is: 0 degrees angle of the suction piston, the piston 90 degrees exhaust (the figure is badly) and the main piston 80 degrees ..
 
fase1982.jpg
 
 
Here how the work ..
 
half%20rotate600ccm.JPG
 
 
Mary Christmas
 
Andrew  :wave:

Edited by Feliks, 23 December 2013 - 03:12.


#1255 Feliks

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Posted 26 December 2013 - 02:28

Here, a model project of The Spoon Red Baron Tractor. Human powered Dedalus, a comprehensive Weight about 100 Kg. It has been proved that, at a power of 0.3 Kw can take place before long flights .. Here my project model can be 100 times lighter, or to his same drive just 300 watts / 100 = 3 watts .. I think that such a model will be able to produce up more, so I called him a Tractor, he can still pull a glider behind him ..

 

tractor.jpg

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=pPZWUQlhvDA

 

Andrew   :smoking:  :smoking:



#1256 Feliks

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 01:10

 
With time on holidays, this Yoda even sent a picture from NASA Simulator, explaining many things ...
Oh yes you can see that the lift force (lift) is three times greater than the resistance (drag) the wings .... The diagram shows that the velocity profile at 25% is almost 3 times higher on average .. The purple line on the graph .. The green line is the wind speed .. Yellow is the speed of the lower side profile .. Wind speed is 15 km / h ... At the start of a profile is almost 50 km / h ... Such profiles should have the Red Baron Windmill (spoon too) ..
 
velocity%20meter.jpg
 
velair.jpg
 
If the speed is increased by three times, then by using dual such a system, we can get about 9 times Increased speeds the wind that blows on the system .. it is worthwhile to do so .. Well of course, because in the formula for Velocity windmill power plays up to the third power, it is possible to obtain power .. no examples listed here .. for 5 m / s .. Windmill with a diameter of 100 meters are 2,000 KW us .. Now if we take a larger representation rate 9 times that or 45 m / s, it is already at 10 meters in diameter windmill get 2,300 KW. ie the same windmill is ten times smaller .. the rest of the structure is virtually immobile and will not be higher than 50 meters .. as follows from theoretical calculations.'s say the length of the building is 100 m, which can fit 10 windmills in it .. theoretically get 23 MW at a wind speed of 5 m / s.
But of course we can use the Windmill Red Baron ..
 
podwojne.jpg
 
 
Andrew  :smoking:  :smoking:


#1257 manolis

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 05:01

Feliks,

unless you are joking, this kind of “perpetual motion amplifiers” exists only in your imagination.

Take the easiest case, say “an acoustic sound amplifier” (like your acoustic guitar, regularly mentioned in the previous posts) and follow the energy.

The energy, just like the mass, cannot be created, nor be can destroyed; it just passes from body to body, from atom to atom. At the end, it is an interaction between atoms and nothing more (Boltzmann).

The total energy of the sound emitted by the acoustic guitar is ALWAYS less than the mechanical energy provided to the guitar strings.
You disagree?
Can you focus on the above simple sentence and explain what makes you think that the energy of the emitted sound is more than the energy given to the guitar strings?
Have you made any experiments / measurements that prove the opposite?
Or it is just your “feeling”?

The acoustic guitar is a good start.
Then you can “evaluate” properly your rest “perpetual motion amplifiers”.

On the other hand, I still think you are joking.



By the way, at your post 1181 it is mentioned the dual module OPOC engine of EcoMotors / Bill Gates.
Imagine having in your car a two module OPOC. When the load is light, you operate only the module near the gearbox. From time to time (when the load is heavy) the second module gets into play.
Did you think what is the reliability of this arrangement?
If not, take a look at http://www.pattakon....ariableCapacity

Thanks
Manolis Pattakos

Felix,

the above quote was posted on August 9, 2013. Please read it again.


Regarding your last "perpetual motion amplifier" (double-spoon version):

Take a big wind mill that drives an electric generator that provides an electric power of 100 kW when the speed of the air is only 10m/sec.

Take also an electric motor having a small propeller secured on its shaft.

Feed the electric motor with the 100 kW of the electric power of the wind mill.


Question: Can the propeller provide air of 100m/sec speed?

Answer: Of course it can.


Question: Can the propeller provide air of 200m/sec speed?

Answer: Of course it can.


Question: Can the power of the air stream leaving the propeller be 100 kW, or more than 100 kW ?

Answer: Of course it cannot.


Question: So, where is the mistake in the "double spoon perpetual motion amplifier"?

Answer: What counts is not only the speed of the air, it is also the quantity of the air.


It is like having a lever.
By applying 20 Kp force at the one end of the lever, the other end of the lever can apply a 200 Kp force (or a 2000 Kp force etc, depending on the leverage).
But from the energy (or power) viewpoint, the energy provided to the lever cannot be less than the energy generated by the lever. That simple.


Thanks
Manolis Pattakos

Edited by manolis, 28 December 2013 - 05:07.


#1258 Feliks

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Posted 28 December 2013 - 14:58

Best wishes of Happy New Year to wszytkich, and specially for you too Patakos .. 
Thanks for the clear exposition of Physics .. I'll have to go to the doctor to change my pills .. 
I think that after them, I will use only those windmills, no, and sometimes just a little bit bigger .
 
child.jpg.
 
 
Here you have the picture double venturi nozzles. This small tube in the middle improves height obtained vacuum ...
 
 
 
SAM_0108.JPG
 
 
Happy New Year   Andrew  :wave:


#1259 Feliks

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 01:37

Here subsequent example, that the piston does not have to rub on the cylinder....

 

http://www.youtube.c...d&v=NaPMaFSsgrkhttp://www.youtube.c...d&v=NaPMaFSsgrk



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#1260 manolis

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Posted 29 December 2013 - 06:27

Best wishes to you, too, Feliks.

Comparing the Wankel Rotary with the QuasiTurbine, are there any advantages of the second?

At the end of the youtube quasiturbine video it is shown a 3-D printer plastic model of a V-90 Harmonic reciprocating engine wherein the pistons does not have to rub on the cylinder liner (actually they rub, but not as heavily as in the conventional engines; the rotating bearing at the "bottom" of the piston tends to rotate the piston, while the cylinder liner applies the necessary force to stop it from rotating).

At the end of the http://www.pattakon....pattakonPPE.htm you can see photos and drawings of a fully functional Harmonic (i.e. the piston performs a pure sinusoidal reciprocation) engine prototype. It is based on the Yamaha XT250.

I1.jpg

353cc, 80mm stroke, 75 bore

I0.jpg

It is a single-cylinder four-stroke with pure sinusoidal (harmonic) motion of the piston.
It is perfectly balanced; as perfectly as the Wankel rotary engine; the only inertia force on its basis is its weight; the inertia moment on its basis is zero; zero is also the inertia torque transmitted to the basis and to the gear-box.
It can stand free on the ground operating from idling to top revs (9,000 rpm, 24 m/sec mean piston speed) without any tend to leave its place.


Here is the drawing of a better V-90 Harmonic, wherein the cylinder axes are on the same plane (zero inertia moment):

HARMO3.gif


And here is a recent effort of the Achates Power (funded by "the" Wal-Mart) for an opposed piston based on the same principle:

Achates_Harmonic.gif


Thanks
Manolis Pattakos

#1261 Feliks

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 01:23

If you do not believe my calculations, it can send a check to the CERN ..:rolleyes:
 
bicycley.jpg
 
Andrew :smoking:  :smoking:


#1262 manolis

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 04:55

If you do not believe my calculations, it can send a check to the CERN ..:rolleyes:
. . .
Andrew


Feliks,

I could ask you to increase the distance between the two green wings from 100 mm to 600mm and to substitute the 6 small propellers (100mm diameter each) by a single 600mm diameter propeller. With 6 times bigger total surface, 6 times more power will be generated (the 1.428Hp increases to 8.5Hp).

I hear you saying: but then the “double spoon effect” will not work.

I agree.
The “double spoon” effect needs an adequately small distance between the “spoons” otherwise it cannot work.


On this reasoning,

I could ask you to recalculate the power generated by the red propellers, with the distance between the two green wings being, this time, not 100mm (the diameter of the red propellers) but only 1mm (in order the “double spoon” effect to have a chance to work). In such a case you have to use propellers of 1mm diameter, with the number of them being 60 in total. The power “generated” drops 100 times.

I should also ask you to calculate the power consumed by the aerodynamic resistance of your structure as it moves into the air and to subtract it, in order to take the net power your system provides or consumes.


However, there is a more practical and straightforward way.

As your structure is quite simple (all it takes is four wings, six small electric generators of, say, 0,2 kW each, and six small propellers), I propose to make a calculation of the cost (and of the time required) to built and test a working prototype.
Why?
In case things work as you say, the world goes upside-down in one day.
So, I would like to fund your project in order to participate in the revolution.

Thanks
Manolis Pattakos

#1263 gruntguru

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 09:51

1. With 1.5 hp available (plus rider input) the pushbike will go a lot faster than 5 m/s.

2. Of course your windmill will then generate even more power.

3. So your bike will go even faster.

 

Repeat processes 2 and 3 as many times as you wish.



#1264 Catalina Park

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:38

The spoons need to be attached directly to the engine...



#1265 Feliks

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 12:38

The spoons need to be attached directly to the engine...

Oh yes, here you can see that they have a secret power tablespoons .. Of course driven new4stroke, efect would be double .. :clap:

 

Happy New Year  :wave:



#1266 Feliks

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Posted 04 January 2014 - 17:04

So embarrassing new year to start something pleasant .. Here, the recording band Blue Black and Ada and Wojtek cover what is served up at concerts in the Soviet Union in 1973, passing from the scene, the better, "my Friend" than the "cold war" .. ..
And I think I succeeded ..
 
Ada unfortunately died 1 January 1991.
 
 
 
Here, too, if someone did not know that Beatles song and accompaniment of the Kings ...
 
 
Andrew   :wave:


#1267 Feliks

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Posted 05 January 2014 - 00:46

So on your way I think, why this project Manchattan taken a Pole, who only since the outbreak of war in 1939 was in England .. After all, his English was not too good for sure .. British citizenship also quickly got something to this project could attend ... ... But I know war, accelerates various activities ... But the English did not really even war .. Therefore I am full of admiration .. as a sincere desire ..
Here in the video you can see, the then fairly good the English had ..
Each fought as best he could to make this world a better place .. Sometimes it was not easy ..
 

 

:wave:


Edited by Feliks, 05 January 2014 - 00:48.


#1268 Feliks

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Posted 06 January 2014 - 18:12

 
In the new year, new designs .. 
Air bike, designed in a similar way Hunting N.126.
 
 
 
aairbicycle.jpg
 
text%20bicycle.jpg
 
 
 
 
 
It is the lightest machine to move in the air, which is designed ..
 
Andrew  :smoking:  :smoking:


#1269 Greg Locock

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Posted 07 January 2014 - 01:09

I must say at first sight that using an unfaired cyclist to get up to speed seems a bit daft to me, as the additional drag once in the air will soon eat up any energy saved in the acceleration phase. Perhaps you could do some maths to disprove my cynicism.



#1270 gruntguru

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Posted 08 January 2014 - 08:11

"Stall speed 51 km/hr"

 

It will need a better engine than my bike. Mine won't sustain 51 km/hr on level ground and that is just the aero drag of me and the bike. God knows how slow I would be with a big wing to push along as well.



#1271 Feliks

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Posted 08 January 2014 - 12:27

"Stall speed 51 km/hr"

 

It will need a better engine than my bike. Mine won't sustain 51 km/hr on level ground and that is just the aero drag of me and the bike. God knows how slow I would be with a big wing to push along as well.

Can you read? Stall speed for a bicycle is attached to the 25 km / h .. And for those speeds are calculated parameters engines and wing surface.

 

:smoking:



#1272 gruntguru

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 07:23

Sorry Feliks - didn't read the fine print.



#1273 Wuzak

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Posted 09 January 2014 - 08:43

I wonder how stabke it would be with its raised CoG, less contact with the road (that is the point - isn't it?) in a howling cross wind.

#1274 Feliks

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 02:10

Ok Gruntguru, :wave:

 

 

 
 
 
 
Well, here , a movie that shows that " spoon effect" is possible to obtain a large area, no such model of the wing , set " bellies " to each other. Between the wings , air is blown using an ordinary hair dryer .. The second part of the film , you will see that blowing this way only one wing , we can feel the hand , there is some lift of the wing . Simply it is so microscopic that it can not feel , despite the fact that once we're blowing on the wing , then do not . I do not feel any difference. The reason is also that the air dryer has a very low speed, and it is relatively very little ..
However, as we hold as two wings . set ' bellies to each other, and kept at one end , the other end , a very intense vibration , bouncing off each other, as a result of blowing the hair . the film do not really see these vibrations because their speed is high , as the camera does not records so quickly. records and revealed that the image of " waving wings. " In a time while also heard the " clack " of themselves striking the wings .. so attractive force them to each other must be large, as seems the powerful sound of beats between them. wing to descend , and then diverge , and again, there are withdrawal force with each wing , and so the circle. But fairly quickly , despite the relatively large area of ??the wings in relation to a small air stream flowing between them ..
In any case , it is this force several times to each side of the Astringent greater than the lift of a single wing , which you can not even feel that there is in these conditions ..
 
 
Andrew :smoking:  :smoking:


#1275 Wuzak

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 05:33

Isn't this "spoon effect" actually just a venturi effect?

#1276 Feliks

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 10:54

Isn't this "spoon effect" actually just a venturi effect?

Yes, it is actually a Venturi effect on a flat surface .. But the suggested such a simple physical experience that everyone can perform in the kitchen, you can easily see the effect of the venturi I think that for this may be popular, I gave the name of the spoon effect. Because it is not a classic Vebturi, Circular or rectangular ... Here can be theoretically infinite length of your wings .... For I have given this name to distinguish, but you have another good name, it can be that I can enter .. For example, the amplifier of the wind, or something like ..

 

Andrew :smoking:  :smoking:



#1277 Kelpiecross

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:39

Isn't this "spoon effect" actually just a venturi effect?


Coanda Effect maybe?

#1278 JAW

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:50

'Scuse me if this has been covered already in the previous 25 pages, & I 've missed it, Felicks,

 

-but just  how well did your research proposal - for a funding grant - swim - when you presented it to that..

 

..august facility..

 

The Uri Geller Institute of Advanced Spoon-bending..

 

- any joy , perchance?



#1279 Greg Locock

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:55

Hi Felix, in your considered opinion, if you take a conventional funnel, or cone, and place it in an airstream with the big end facing forward, what is the pressure and flow rate in the exit? 



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#1280 Feliks

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 16:36

Coanda Effect maybe?

 

No, I know , but do not distinguish between two data completely different projects , despite . wings, that the drawings are very similar ?
 
One is " a flying bicycle ," which is thanks to Coanda efetowi is able to fly at a very low speed of 25 km / h .. And it is a project of the Coanda effect , long known, but by me calculated and set to Weight bicycle with a large electric power assist .. but it is well to fly ..
I t is one of the project ..
 
The second project , this is a bike that will propel additional force from cycling , which arises as a result of " spoon effect" and that as seen in the film reinforces the aerodynamic effect of the vacuum ( the lift ) that each wing , and it repeatedly . Anyone can repeat this experience easy .. length of the wings can be unlimited .. palpable seen here strengthen the aerodynamic forces . The gap on the wing occurs at some other place than the Coanda effect , and the movement is entrusted , dale us energy , and not the movement we need to force the engine as it is in the Coanda ....
 
tractor.jpg
 
 
 
And here, in this version, the wing may well fly, and the version without propellers work as Windmill Red Baron, the strengthening of "spoon effect", several times also better than the Red Baron (single wing) without this method to enhance .. The resulting pressure at "spoon effect" can be a double version several times larger, and even reach the third atmosphere! ... At 100 km / h (ie, more like a tornado). and now depends on the size of the wings as his performance at this vacuum will .
 
Andrew :rolleyes:  :rolleyes:


#1281 Feliks

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Posted 15 January 2014 - 02:30

Of course the pipe that goes through the negative pressure means can be any lengths, and generators placed On the surface of the earth .. This may be from a set of several such sets ..

 

redbaron%20spoon.jpg

 

 

 

Andrew :smoking:  :smoking:



#1282 Feliks

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Posted 17 January 2014 - 00:59

Here a further explanation of why dual Red Baron can give at 100km / h about 300 mm of mercury vacuum. .. . .. 
Here is a pdf of the classical venturi air, and why is it used double nozzle. 
 
 
vent37.jpg
 
And now, what are the parameters of the two nozzles that you can buy .. of similar size 
The first nozzle gives 4 inches (101 mm Hg) of vacuum of mercury and has a length of 10 inches.
 
 
The second nozzle gives up 9cali (228 mm Hg) of mercury vacuum, and the length is 11 1/4 inch. That is 11% plus growth in vacuum and lengths are more than 100% .. That depends on the vacuum from a very proper way to design the nozzle .. 
 
 
Similarly, the need to design a properly configured dual Windmill Red Baron to repair the effects were good. 
Here you can not scoff case. 
The rest will depend on the size of the system..
 
Andrew  :smoking:  :smoking:

Edited by Feliks, 17 January 2014 - 01:02.


#1283 Feliks

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Posted 02 February 2014 - 17:25

Underground sarcophagus must be the first in Fukushima...

 

 

fuku.jpg

 

 

Andrew :smoking:



#1284 Feliks

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Posted 02 February 2014 - 17:26

Underground sarcophagus must be the first in Fukushima...

 

 

fuku.jpg

 

 

Andrew :smoking:



#1285 Feliks

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Posted 05 February 2014 - 13:13

Here, as the tunneling doing in the world, quickly and as cheaply ...

 

 

herenkneft.jpg

 

 

 

:smoking:  :smoking:



#1286 Feliks

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Posted 11 February 2014 - 11:22

So, here is the sea, the British shows them for years, as same storms the fenced off shore .. which formed small pool ... Now the water accumulated there, you can refer back to the sea, but by the turbine, which will be make electricity .. The simplest solution ... A little more civilized, I invent .. here they are. Even with the smaller waves works .. In Scotland, the annual average wave height is 3 m .. And the car would probably put a nuclear engineers to examine how quickly the corrosive materials used in its construction .. In the video you can see that even a police officer imagines that in such a way that you can produce energy ..:rolleyes:
 
 
oil500.gif
 
Andrew :smoking:  :smoking:


#1287 Feliks

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Posted 12 February 2014 - 19:59

waveturbine.jpg
 
Andrew  :rotfl:

Edited by Feliks, 12 February 2014 - 20:01.


#1288 Feliks

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Posted 13 February 2014 - 15:24

The turbine is to be the trigger salt water back into the sea. Here some drawings that explain. You can build a special vortex, as there is a high coast. And the picture only in the world peak power pump salt water. But pump water upwards through the for feedback electrical current. I propose that the water pump teeth using sea waves-moving pumps with valves ..
 
storage.JPG
aaa4t.gif
Okinawa.jpg
 
Andrew


#1289 Feliks

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Posted 18 February 2014 - 01:46

To this day, I can not reconcile with the fact that the existence Such "Queen" almost no one in Poland do not know ..
And the characteristic of moving the hair at the very beginning, it reminds me a metal .. 1977 ..
 
 
:wave:


#1290 Feliks

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 23:23

 
Here the power but sweet water .. has the power of 700 MW, ie as the average nuclear reactor .. If they build the seafront, a few thousand of these pumps that could Diaphragm Pump by waves and swimmers pumped into the upper reservoir of salt water .. the difference in the levels of this  plant is only 100 meters, so the pressure of the pumped water would have to be only 10 bar ..
 
 
800MW.JPG
 
DiaphragmPump1.gif
 
Andrew :smoking:


#1291 Feliks

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Posted 25 February 2014 - 23:24

 
A big thanks AndrewF .. 
 
 
Indeed as we have energy in excess, it can use it for pumping water on big height. Thanks tems Sytstem the waves of the sea may be even lower pressure designed .. Well, for example, only 2 bars .. which then drives the ram pump to a height of 125 meters, it can pump water  
 
 
Andrew :wave:


#1292 Greg Locock

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 02:36

I once stayed in a house that was built in 1820. it was at the top of a hill. At the bottom of the hill by the stream was a stone igloo. in it was a hydraulic ram that was used to pump water from the stream up to the house. it dated from 1860. I'm not quite sure why you are posting videos of Victorian era technology.



#1293 desmo

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 02:54

I've seen those, very cool if you aren't acquainted with them.

 

I generally pass on this thread but I just had to see what Greg posted  :lol:



#1294 Wuzak

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 02:58

Wave energy generator

 



#1295 Wuzak

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 03:01

I once stayed in a house that was built in 1820. it was at the top of a hill. At the bottom of the hill by the stream was a stone igloo. in it was a hydraulic ram that was used to pump water from the stream up to the house. it dated from 1860. I'm not quite sure why you are posting videos of Victorian era technology.

 

I did some research on available tidal energy technologies and came across an article detailing water turbines fitted to London Bridge in the 1500s which were used to pump water and provide power for other uses (eg flour mills, IIRC).



#1296 gruntguru

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 06:52

I must say the use of "water hammer" (water column inertia) to amplify pressure is a cool idea and achieves the desired result without any pumping elements - just a few valves.



#1297 Kelpiecross

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 14:02

I did some research on available tidal energy technologies and came across an article detailing water turbines fitted to London Bridge in the 1500s which were used to pump water and provide power for other uses (eg flour mills, IIRC).


Do you have a reference for this? - 1500's seems very early.

#1298 Feliks

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 14:47

I wonder who's so unreal and everything niefektywne ideas, like the one shown in the film wuzaka pay?

 

In addition, such oływaki can be putting up over the entire surface of the undulating sea, not even a few kilometers from the coast, where they will fit even tens of thousands. Each swimmer will be emitted raised in loud the top and on each wave., And it can not be eliminated completely, so next in towards the shore also will be raised up, maybe slightly less .. A network of collection pipes do under high-pressure water is child's play .. I can propel as such will not adequately pump. The case is only obtained in large quantities of water under pressure. In the sea you do not run out :)

also published the water tank, the top may be the way to the horizon visible on the photograph, you know how emergy can be stored?

 

:wave:



#1299 gruntguru

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Posted 26 February 2014 - 23:35

No doubt there is an optimum height for pumped storage (probably a lot higher than generally available). Producing the higher pressure is not difficult regardless of the energy source.

 

Increasing the storage height (and therefore the pressure) reduces the storage volume required, pipe diameters, pump and turbine sizes, friction losses . . . .



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#1300 Wuzak

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Posted 27 February 2014 - 05:13

Do you have a reference for this? - 1500's seems very early.

 

http://www.waterhist...stories/london/

 

 

Started in the very late 1500s, but more properly in the 1600s. I was out by a century!

 

"Artist's conception of London Bridge circa 1600. The first arch on the north was used for a water wheel and the first two arches on the south were occupied by wheels for corn mills "