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One off Bonneville speed attempts.


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#1 HistoricMustang

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Posted 16 April 2005 - 22:44

Going to Bonneville as a single team and attempting to break or set a record seems to impress most motorsport fans. This one caught my attention today:

http://aerowarriors.com/bv.html

Henry

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#2 rosemeyer

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Posted 17 April 2005 - 00:26

Love your posts I lived in Pensacola Fl. for 8 and a half years som I know where your coming from Those were some great times.

#3 HistoricMustang

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Posted 17 April 2005 - 22:37

A search at TNF could not locate the Frankfurt - Heidelberg circuit used for land speed records.

Could someone provide the "track" layout?

I reference this site dedicated to land speed records in the '30's:

http://www.kolumbus....ellman/reco.htm

I again am consumed by single or very few attempts at a certain venue for speed.

Henry

#4 gmw

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Posted 17 April 2005 - 23:24

The Fraknfort "circuit" that Mercedes and Auto Union used in the 1930s was the Fraknfort-Darmstatd aurobahn, which was much the same as it is today. There were two lanes eachway and no center barrier. Caracciola went 268.863 mph on this public road just before Resemeyer's fatal crash.

I'm glad you found my story on the Bobby Isaac/Harry Hyde Bonneville program interesting.

GMW

#5 Vitesse2

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Posted 17 April 2005 - 23:27

"Frankfurt-Heidelberg" was just a section of Autobahn, closed specially for the occasion.

As Frankfurt-Heidelberg was not used after 1936, I'd imagine that the Frankfurt-Dessau stretch was considered more suitable. I was reading a wonderful description of an MG record run in Germany: one minute the road was divided by a line of pylons - then each pylon was simultaneously removed by a line of soldiers who emerged from the woods alongside the road! Instant record strip!! Over several miles!!

#6 D-Type

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Posted 17 April 2005 - 23:29

Leif's site says
"Stuck made an attempt on the 100 Miles world record and took it also in the first attempt, making three other world records at the same time. He used a 113 km long section of the highway and at the end point Stuck had to stop and make a U turn for the last 48 kilometers of the 100 Mile run, making the 267.2 km/h record even more incredible. "

So there was no 'circuit' as such. They simply closed a length of the Autobahn. Obviously this would be the straightest stretch availablewith an interchange at one end. I would think it's Somewhere here as the alignment probably hasn't changed much in the last 60 years. (Frankfurt is at the top and Heidelberg at the bottom of the road map shown)

#7 HistoricMustang

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Posted 17 April 2005 - 23:41

Originally posted by gmw
The Fraknfort "circuit" that Mercedes and Auto Union used in the 1930s was the Fraknfort-Darmstatd aurobahn, which was much the same as it is today. There were two lanes eachway and no center barrier. Caracciola went 268.863 mph on this public road just before Resemeyer's fatal crash.

I'm glad you found my story on the Bobby Isaac/Harry Hyde Bonneville program interesting.

GMW


Thanks so much, and what a great video on Mr. Isaac hauling the mail at Bonneville. I hope others will enjoy. Today we have "X" amount of "test days" watched by officials of all types.

Interesting that the Salt Flats were used to test maximum speeds and advantages that may have been used at Daytona and others.

The link I posted above has several circuits for "land speed" records other than the "Salt Lakes" and "Daytona Beach" that we read so much about. Would like to see the actual layout of circuits other than the "salt" and the "sand".

Where were these individuals and their cars moving as fast as possible other than in the States?

Even if just for one attempt.

More important, which ones have not been documented into our memories! What remote areas or current urban jungles were used, perhaps without others knowing?

Henry

#8 simonlewisbooks

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Posted 18 April 2005 - 10:11

Henry
Here's a few...

Beach venues other than Daytona include -

90 mile beach in New Zealand (Norman Wizard Smith, failed flying mile attempt in the 1930s)

Pendine Sands in Wales (Campbell and Parry Thomas set land sped records there in 1925-7 and Thomas died there in one attempt)

Saltburn Sands in England (Two members of the Guiness brewing family ran a V8 Darraq at 120mph unofficially there in about 1908!)

Fanoe Beach in Denmark (Campbell set unrecofnised records there in 1925 but a thrown tyre killed a spectator and the venue ceased untill a retro event in 2004)

Southport Sands near Liverpool, England. (Henry Segrave set a record there in 1926 and the "7 miles of golden sands" there were once a tourist attraction have now almost vanished under weeds and silt due to changing methods of dredging the nearby river esturary).



Desert venues other than Bonneville include -

Vernuk Pan in South Africa (Maclolm Campbell, failed flying mile in 1930 but did get 5 and 10 miles record i think?)

Edwards AFB In Nevada (home of the Space Shuttle, used for a spurious attempt on the sound barrier in 1979 which was claimed and never proved by a believeable source....)

Lake Gairdner in Australia (home to a Bonneville-speed-trials event and used by Rosko McGlashen in the 90s in failed bid on the land speed record)

Lake Eyre in Australia (Campbell set land speed record there in 64)



Close public roads used for attmepts include-

Arpajon near Paris (last outright land speed record set on public road, Ernest Eldridge 1924, 146mph)

Gyon in Hungary (Nuvolari set class records in the Bi Motore Alfa Romeo and Eric Fernihough set an outright motorcycle record there one year and was killed the following year at the same place)

Jabekke (not sure of spelling) in Belgium (section of autoroute used in the 40s and 50s by various people including MG and Jaguar to set class records)

Promonade de Englaise Nice, France (used for an outright land speed record attempt in about 1905 during it's 'speed week' event)

.....there are literally dozens and dozens more venues, even in Russia, Tunisia, Jordan, Argentina , ireland and other places you would not always imagine to have a record breaking history!

Simon Lewis
Transport Books
www.simonlewis.com
Purveyors of Motor Sport Books and Photos since 1985

#9 D-Type

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Posted 18 April 2005 - 11:02

A couple more

Henry Ford set a record on the ice of the frozen Lake St Claire (Michigan, I think)

The Nardi test track in Southern Italy has been used by amongst others, Mercedes Benz

Richard Noble used Black Rock Desert, Nevadah for his records with Thrust 2 and Thrust SSC

Monza(Italy), Montlhery( France), Brooklands(England) and Indianapolis were used from their construction for countless long distance records. Daytona and some of the other US ovals have also been used.

landracing.com lists the venues for all of the outright World Land Speed Records, but not all the long distance ones. The FIA website has a section on current records for all classes and distances.

A pedantic point - there are countless International Class records. A World record is the fastest for a particular distance regardless of class.

#10 simonlewisbooks

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Posted 18 April 2005 - 12:15

We can also add

Millbrook (GMs English test track in Bedfordshire)

Bedford Autodrome/Thurliegh airfield used to set outright British record with the jet powered PRIME TIME a few years back, a venue now owned by ex GP driver Jonathon Palmer

Talledega (used by Penske/Porsche/Mark Donohue for setting outright closed course record in 1975 with a Porsche 917-30)

Elvington airfield, Yorkshire, England (many class records over the years)

RAF Fairford Airbase, England ( Derek Bell once set outright British land speed record there in an ex Le Mans Ferrari 512M)

RAF Greenham Common, England(home of the famous cruise missiles of the 80s, used by THRUST team to set British record that beat the above)

Muroc desert (Think this is new mexico? used for clkass records including 140mph+ in 1926 by a 1.5 litre Miller!)


the list goes on and on....

Simon Lewis
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Purveyors of Motor Sport Books and Photos since 1985

#11 TooTall

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Posted 18 April 2005 - 19:14

Muroc desert (Think this is new mexico? used for clkass records including 140mph+ in 1926 by a 1.5 litre Miller!)



Muroc is in So. California and is now better known as Edwards Air Force Base. The Air Force has set a few speed records there as well.

Cheers,

Kurt Oblinger

#12 Frank S

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Posted 19 April 2005 - 04:45

Seems to me Mickey Thompson did some records at March AFB, Riverside, California, multi-engines (?) in the late fifties.

--
Frank S

#13 HistoricMustang

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Posted 19 April 2005 - 12:42

Thanks to all!

Does anyone have a feel for when the 10 Mile "Round" circuit was used for the last time at Bonneville. Best I can tell, perhaps the early '70's?

This is from the "Racing Campbell's" web site but no mention on last use of the circuit. Seems the "round" track actually got everything going on the salt.



Despite the new highway, again racers ignored the salt flats until 1931 when Jenkins single-handedly drove a 12-cylinder Pierce-Arrow for 24-hours to what should have been a new world endurance record. He convinced the Utah State Road Commission to survey and scrape smooth a 10-mile circular track that was marked with 4-foot stakes spaced 100 feet apart. The course was lit for night driving using small, evenly spaced oil flares.

Dressed in white cotton duck pants and shirt topped with a leather jacket, Jenkins donned a cotton skullcap and two pairs of goggles, and climbed into the hopped-up motorcar. He stopped for gas 12 times, experienced no mechanical trouble, never changed a tire, or got up from behind the wheel the entire 24 hours. The constant roar of the engine made him temporarily deaf. The AAA Contest Board could care less and sniffed its official nose at the speed runs.



Henry

#14 gmw

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Posted 19 April 2005 - 13:46

Henry,

In 1971 Bobby Isaac set world records for 100 km and 100 mi running on a ten mile oval. One mile radius for the turns and 1.858 mile straightaway. There was not enough good salt for a 10 mile circle.

I remember that Mickey Thompson ran a number of different Mustangs for class records on a ten mile course some time later, probably he late 70s.

Mercedes used the Nardo track in southern Italy when they set higher 100 km and 100 mi records.

GMW

#15 Jesper O. Hansen

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Posted 04 August 2010 - 17:58

Henry
Here's a few...

Beach venues other than Daytona include -

Fanoe Beach in Denmark (Campbell set unrecofnised records there in 1925 but a thrown tyre killed a spectator and the venue ceased untill a retro event in 2004)

.....there are literally dozens and dozens more venues, even in Russia, Tunisia, Jordan, Argentina , ireland and other places you would not always imagine to have a record breaking history!

Simon Lewis
Transport Books
www.simonlewis.com
Purveyors of Motor Sport Books and Photos since 1985


Finally acquired the book about the Fanø beach races and here's a few additional informations gathered from the book. The speed trials were run from 1919 to the fatal Campbell run in 1924. Actually the unofficial mile record set by Campbell was set during the 1923 runs, but not recognized as unapprooved timing equipment and timing personell was used to record times. The organizers knew this beforehand but didn't expect any record speeds, so didn't bother with CSI rules!
The 1924 accident caused a change in Danish legislation regarding the beach races to a degree that this type of motorsport became impossible to organize. This also stopped the two other beach races in northern Jylland/Jutland at Blokhus (1922-1924) and Løkken (1923-1924). Both these events were minor compared to Fanø, but inspired by the early succes on the island.

Jesper