59 replies to this topic

[Gary C]

will any TNF-ers be at Brands Hatch for the HSCC Super Prix this coming weekend? I'm racing on the Sunday and look forward to having a chat with a few of you.

[james]

Hopefully there with the old mans b23 for the supersports race if we get the engine in on time.

[RTH]

Any news on your customer historic motorsport DVD production, Gary ?

[Gary C]

yes indeed, Richard, very, very soon!

[David Lawson]

I'm going both days. A great event and the F5000 in particular should be superb.

David

[David M. Kane]

;)

Gary some day I will see your lovely car live. It looks so great in photos. Please think of me as you roar through Dingle Dell!

Have fun, be safe!

Dave

[h4887]

I'll be there on Sunday

[Cirrus]

I'll definitely be there on Saturday. (I think we're runing about 6 cars) - maybe Sunday as well.

[DN5]

Yes, hoping to go both days.

What is it about July and motor racing? I've hardly been to any races this year and get 3 weekends full up with racing in one month!

Love watching the old Group Cs

Geoff

[DN5]

Saturday was great fun.

Well, worth the trip.

A Jagermeister 935 proving a nice surprise to see. Positively quiet in context!

There is more to come today;

for example the F5000s in just a few hours .....

Geoff

[Gary C]

unfortunately, the absolutely TORRENTIAL downpour directly coincided with my race in the FFords, and resulted, after approx 6 laps, in my very first visit to the armco barrier, all by myself! Happily it doesn't look like too much damage to the car (we'll find out tomorrow), hopefully we'll be ok for Silverstone next week.

[2F-001]

Sorry to hear that, Gary.
Unfortunately I couldn't get to Brands today (looks like the weather may have cleared a bit too) - but on the other hand I wouldn't have wanted to witness your immaculate car getting bent!

[RTH]

Originally posted by Gary C
unfortunately, the absolutely TORRENTIAL downpour directly coincided with my race in the FFords, and resulted, after approx 6 laps, in my very first visit to the armco barrier, all by myself! Happily it doesn't look like too much damage to the car (we'll find out tomorrow), hopefully we'll be ok for Silverstone next week.

It's bad enough when you can pick up the phone on Monday morning and order the new parts .........but when it's a historic , it can be your worst nightmare. Commiserations Gary, I do know the feeling all too well.

[Vicuna]

Did all the Kiwi 5000s survive the downpour?

[Gary C]

I'm afraid I don't know, I had to leave straight after my race to get to work!!

[David Lawson]

I felt very sorry for Gary when the heavens opened for his race. Taking photographs of the race was difficult enough let alone driving in those conditions.

Here are a couple of my snaps of gary in action.





You can see just how wet and gloomy the conditions were for the Formula Fords.

The Superprix is a great weekend of racing and I'm puzzled each year at just how small the crowd is. The variety of categories and of course the wonderful track is a must not miss for me.

Here are a few pictures of some of the other races.


Porsche 962C at South Bank


A Caravelle running out of road at Druids.


March 707


The Practice for the F5000/F2 was very wet. Here Stuart Lush is at full chat at Pilgrims Drop. The last time I saw this same car race was at this circuit in 1972


A busy bunch at Druids led by Murray Sinclair's Lola T332 in the dry race conditions.

The F5000 marquee was a very friendly and busy part of the paddock and it was nice to be able to photograph all these wonderful cars. I'm sure they all survived the weekend intact.

David

[Andrew Kitson]

Great photos David. Thanks for sharing.
The McRae certainly brings back many memories - here in yellow, almost Iberia livery as Graham had in '73. Couldn't be at Brands but definitely cannot wait until Silverstone now!
Hope the F5000's were/will be running in proper open exhaust spec and not with silencers, as they have to at Snett, Thruxton etc!

[eldougo]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by David Lawson

Great to see G.L. old car (14) going around again . 1976 ? i guess was the last time i worked on that old girl Thanks David.


A busy bunch at Druids led by Murray Sinclair's Lola T332 in the dry race conditions.

[Gary C]

great photos, David! And you managed to get TWO Nike's in one shot (first piccy). Many thanks!

[David Lawson]

If you would indulge me a few more of my photographs of the New Zealand contingent in the F5000 race yesterday.




Noel Atley - Begg 018


Lindsay O'Donnell - Begg FM5


Stan Redmond - Lola T332


Kerry Anderson - Lola T142


Poul Christie's Lola T190


John Crawford - McRae GM1

David

[JSF]

Superb photo's David.

Do you have any of the March 717? This was the first race running of the car in it's 717 configuration since it was returned to 707 spec in the early 70's. We have some setup work to do now to make it work as well as we had it in the 707 configuration, next event is the Oldtimers GP weekend.

[Gary C]

lots of good pictures here : http://www.paulsands.org/

[Andrew Kitson]

I was not there unfortunately but some great photos in this thread to make up for it. The results here at MST also help.
http://www.msttiming...nttype=hsccclub

Hopefully the F5000 drivers will be watching their mirrors more closely at Silverstone following the scary incident in testing on Friday! Apparantly a car rejoined the circuit from the pits at high speed with his mechanic sitting on the rear wing! The mechanic thought he was getting a lift back to the paddock but jumped off before Paddock Hill Bend. It is being discussed over on 10/10.

[David Lawson]

JSF

I took a few of the March, here's an example.



David

[JSF]

magic, thanks! The others would be nice to see too.

[Vicuna]

Originally posted by David Lawson




The Practice for the F5000/F2 was very wet. Here Stuart Lush is at full chat at Pilgrims Drop. The last time I saw this same car race was at this circuit in 1972



David

Stuart Lush's GM1 is the last (long wheelbase) car - so probably it was 1973 when you last saw this particular car.

Eldougo - yes Graeme Lawrence last ran that T332 in the 1976 Tasman.

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by Vicuna
Eldougo - yes Graeme Lawrence last ran that T332 in the 1976 Tasman.

To be more accurate, there was no Tasman Series in 1976, and Lawrence last raced the T332 in Australia in 1977 ;)

[Mac Lark]

Quite right David - as can be seen in Wolfgang's latest F5000 book which is a must have for all us 5000 fans.

[Twin Window]

Some superb shots there, David!

I particularly like the shot of the Lush McRae in the rain, but any pic of an F5000 is good in my book!

Did you get any pics of the Sean Walker/Ian Flux Lotus Elan? Sean's youngest son Mackenzie said yesterday (at Donington!) that his favourite car was "the TicTac one". As your photo emphasises, it was indeed a great livery.

[ian senior]

Marvellous. The pictures of the Beggs were particularly welcome - we didn't see enough of them over here.

[David Lawson]

Sorry TW I was in the pit garages when the Elans were out and didn't photograph them.

I overlooked David Abbotts Lola T430 in my previous posts, here it is.



Looking at this car in the paddock the very neat and low chassis appeared very similar to the last of the Hill F1 cars - was there a connection? Sorry if this has been dealt with before on the forum.

David

[Vicuna]

I t would come as no surprise if the F1 Hill had a connection with the Lola it followed (T370?) which probably had a connection with the T430.

Top shots David.

Last Tasman series was 1975 - must remember that.

[Rob Semmeling]

Originally posted by JSF
Superb photo's David.

Do you have any of the March 717? This was the first race running of the car in it's 717 configuration since it was returned to 707 spec in the early 70's. We have some setup work to do now to make it work as well as we had it in the 707 configuration, next event is the Oldtimers GP weekend.

JSF, how did the new specification car's first proper race go? How different is it from the 707?

[philippe charuest]

Originally posted by Vicuna
I t would come as no surprise if the F1 Hill had a connection with the Lola it followed (T370?) which probably had a connection with the T430.

Top shots David.

Last Tasman series was 1975 - must remember that.

it was no secret ,it was well known that the Hill of 74-75 was just a modified lola t400 fit with a cosworth-hewland kit. but strangely in f5000 the t400 never made the cut so as the t430 . the t 300 line of car was use by most people until the end of the f5000 and even later as a base of the "new" 5 liters can-am

[JSF]

Hi Rob,

The changes are quite obvious regarding the bodywork and Aero alterations with the long nose replaced by the much shorter, more "normal" style of nose arangement, but under the bodywork there have been some pretty big changes that have altered the balance of the car. Aero wise it apears to behave as it did in 707 spec, suspension wise it apears to work slightly diferently. We now have to find a setup for that will work as well as when the car was running in 707 spec. We finished the car the day before Brands so havnt had time to do any serious setup work yet, so we ran the car in it's suspension configuration as it was at Monza and made a few changes between sessions.

Brands is quite a diferent type of circuit, so it's dificult to say at this stage what percentage of performance is down to the setup in general and the setup changes specific to Brands, but we now have time before the next race at Nurburg to understand the car better and make it work.

Frank drove a storming race in race2 because the changes we made to try and dial out some understeer post race1 made the car worse, so it wasnt going as well in that race, his last lap was terific making up two places to finish forth and 2nd in class. We learned what definately doesnt work which can be as helpful as going the right direction when setting up a new car. We believe the car should be quicker in 717 spec once we get to understand it better, time will tell if that belief is correct.

The main concern for the cars first running was if the cooling system would work, as we were moving the radiators from direct air at the front to air fed via NACA ducts in the rear pontoons. We were pleased to find the cooling system is working better than before right now, we couldnt get the oil and water temps as high as we liked, so we have plenty of cooling capacity in reserve for a very hot race and can work at finding the right airflow to help bring temps up on a cool day.

Nurburgring should be more representative of the changes in the car, it should be an interesting couple of weeks working through the setup.

[Mac Lark]

I have an arms-length involvement with the NZ F5000 Association.

I will make all the boys aware of these excellent pics - especially Stuart Lush.

BTW GM tells me it's not quite 'Iberian Airlines yellow'.

The quickest NZ F5000 over the past few years has been Roger Williams in an STP pink GM1.

I think that was the reason why Stuart chose yellow.

The Begg 018 runs in exactly the same livery it did when F5000 finished but I don't ever recall the PDL Begg FM5 running in the blue that it now does. I only ever recall it being a deep pink shade which has a particular name I can't think of.

[David McKinney]

Maybe the FM5 turned blue during its time in Australia?
It was pink when Allan McCully first ran it but I just can't remember its colour in Graham Baker's (PDL) time. For some reason I didn't think it was the same colour, but maybe it was...

[Mac Lark]

I recall the PDL Begg being the same deep pink (!) colour as the PDL Mustang and that it remained in those colours when Baker ran it.

Was it Chas Talbot that Baker did the Birrana swap with?

Perhaps Ray may recall its colour in Australia.

[Andrew Kitson]

The only Begg I remember seeing here was the 1973 FM5 of David Oxton, a sort of 'mustard' yellow colour. I seem to recall it had a huge airbox, the only car that could be seen in the distance thundering down the Norwich Straight at Snetterton from my vantage point in the Esses grandstand, as the airbox stood high above the infield corn field.

[Mac Lark]

Interesting story about that cars colour scheme.

Yellow was George Begg's favourite colour so his cars tended to be yellow.

After David Oxton's massive accident at Brands (?) they figured their luck with yellow had run out so they painted it patriotic black.

At some point it acquired pale blue pinstripping and it is that way it sits, looking a bit worse for wear (in 1997 at least) in the Southward Museum.

The airbox wasn't especially big - certainly not of Ligier JS5 or Lola T370 proportions. Maybe the yellow 'amplified' it.

[Rob Semmeling]

Thanks for elaborating JSF. It will be interesting to see how the car relates to Peter Schleifer's 707. Do you have the possibility to run the car in between races?

Edit: just noticed the results are up on the Orwell site. I must say I'm impressed already. Qualified third behind the McLarens in the car's first proper run, that shows its potential. Doing a great job, I'll say!

[Paul Rochdale]

I was at Brands during the Saturday afternoon. It was nice to be back after a break of a few years. The area behind the grandstands looked a bit bleak with all of those small buildings now removed. Where on earth were all the crowds?

My point in writing is that during at least two races, the safety car came onto the track. Now is it me (Our Tel) but surely the drivers should have bunched up so that they could all set off together once the safety car came into the pits. Instead the field got very spread out, with half the field bimbling along at 30mph, so that everyone was left behind. Even the second place man was 100yds behind the leader as they went through Clearways. And that happened a second time that afternoon.

[JSF]

Thanks Rob. We would like to give the car a test day prior to Nurburg, that will depend on when the next available noisy days are being held, as they are quite limited.

Peters' 707 is a great car, at Monza we had a 2s advantage at first but Peter clawed that back some over the weekend making the second race very close, at Brands i think the cars were fairly evenly matched for the first race but we made the car less able for the second, so Frank had to work very hard to finish ahead of the 707, his last lap was pretty awesome to watch when he overtook Glenn.

Hopefully you get to say hello at Nurburg.

cheers
john

[DN5]

The title of the thread seems appropriate.

I have a weekend ticket so hope to be there both days.

Anyone else going?

Geoff

[Cirrus]

I'll be there - if you've got enough stamina to last until the latter stages of Sunday's proceedings, look out for an inexpertly-driven yellow Lotus Elite in the Gentleman Drivers race.

Come and say hello!

[DN5]

Alan

I'll certainly try and find you in the paddock on Sunday to say hello.




The weather forecast looks very nice (certainly compared with last year!) ,and there are some nice cars running, so I can't believe just Allan and myself are the only ones going.

Geoff

[Cirrus]

For some reason, the meeting hasn't received much publicity, which is a shame considering the interesting races........

Group C
Pre-1966 GT
Sports Racing Masters
Pre-1966 Sports Racers
Orwell Supersports cup
European F2
XK Jaguars
Historic Saloons
BRDC 50s Sports Cars
Historic Sports 2000
Derek Bell Trophy

[DN5]

Just to say that Brands looks better than last year on my side of the fence and that is not just down to the splendid weather.

Review of the Day

Highlight for me was the Group C/GTP race: a good/quick lead battle with Dave Mercer coming out on top.

The surprise was finding the Amon F1 on show in the paddock!

And more to look forward to tomorrow.....

Geoff

PS Can someone explain to me why the Silverstone Classic is just so much bigger than this Brands event?

[johnwilliamdavies]

Here are few photographs from Saturday


March 707/717 + Mclaren M8F


Mclaren M8F


Trojan T101


Lotus 59


Toj F2

John William Davies.

------------------------
Welsh Motor Sport History

[David Lawson]

Saturday's racing was excellent and the combination of the Superprix in May and this Summer Festival make for some of the best classic racing you could wish for.

A few of my photographs of the day.


Roland Fischer in the Peter Hanson Trophy


Tony Trimmer/LolaT332


David Mercer acknowledging the applause on the slowing down lap.


The Derek Bell Trophy Race field.


There was a good dice between Bradley and Piper.


Giuseppe Bianchini/Tecno69


Don Bell/Lola T163


Chris Alford/March 762 in the European Formula 2 race